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Is Islam to Blame?(DUH? Well, yeaaaaa.)
The Los Angeles Times ^ | July 22, 2005 | Irshad Manji

Posted on 07/23/2005 7:04:28 AM PDT by kellynla

I believe thursday's bombings in London, combined with the first wave of explosions two weeks ago, are changing something for the better. Never before have I heard Muslims so sincerely denounce terrorism committed in our name as I did on my visit to Britain a few days ago. We're finally waking up.

Except on one front: the possible role of religion itself in these crimes.

Even now, the Muslim Council of Britain adamantly insists that Islam has nothing to do with the London attacks. It cites other motives — "segregation" and "alienation," for instance. Although I don't deny that living on the margins can make a vulnerable lad gravitate to radical messages of instant belonging, it takes more than that to make him detonate himself and innocent others. To blow yourself up, you need conviction. Secular society doesn't compete well on this score. Who gets deathly passionate over tuition subsidies and a summer job?

Which is why I don't understand how moderate Muslim leaders can reject, flat-out, the notion that religion may also play a part in these bombings. What makes them so sure that Islam is an innocent bystander?

(Excerpt) Read more at latimes.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial
KEYWORDS: afghanistan; iraq; islam; islamophobes; isthepopecatholic; istheskyblue; muslims; pharisee; religionofhate; religionofpeace; terrorists; war
Is a 21st Century Crusades in our future?
1 posted on 07/23/2005 7:04:30 AM PDT by kellynla
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To: kellynla

Absolutely! But only when people realize who they are dealing with. These people cannot be reasoned with, and any gesture of "peace" we may make toward them registers as weakness in their puny primitive minds.


2 posted on 07/23/2005 7:11:58 AM PDT by PAMadMax (Islam is the enemy of ALL mankind.....)
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To: kellynla
(Attacks on UK will continue, radical cleric says)

I've no doubt that London will answer him shortly - YES, Islam is the problem and these Mullahs and their hate speak are going to be removed...............

3 posted on 07/23/2005 7:16:40 AM PDT by yoe
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To: kellynla
Why do we Muslims hang on to the mantra that the Koran — and Islam — are pristine? God may very well be perfect, but God transcends a book, a prophet and a belief system. That means we're free to question without fear that the Almighty will feel threatened by our reasoning, speculating or doubting.

Before reading this, I had concluded that Muslims were incapable of rational thought. This guy will either get Muslims thinking or he will be killed. Probably the latter.

4 posted on 07/23/2005 7:17:55 AM PDT by Dark Skies ("A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants." -- Churchill)
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To: kellynla

The author of this piece is a Canadian Muslim who needs 24/7 protection because of Islamist death threats.

Such is life for a Muslim who dencouces terror.


5 posted on 07/23/2005 7:18:55 AM PDT by johnnyBbad
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To: PAMadMax
All I can say is, one more 9/11 type terrorist attack in America and every one of these Muslim swinging dicks and his family will have to pack up their Korans, families and baggage and go back to whatever hellhole they originated from.

Our ancestors didn't spend the last 200 years putting their lives on the line to make a better place for their families just so a bunch of camel jockeys could come here and terrorize our women and children and make hamburger out of our families.

To hell with the ACLU and "political correctness!"

Either the Muslims "take out their own trash" or we will.

Are you listening President Bush?

Semper Fi,
Kelly
6 posted on 07/23/2005 7:20:36 AM PDT by kellynla (U.S.M.C. 1st Battalion,5th Marine Regiment, 1st Marine Div. Viet Nam 69&70 Semper Fi)
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To: kellynla
Even now, the Muslim Council of Britain adamantly insists that Islam has nothing to do with the London attacks. It cites other motives — "segregation" and "alienation," for instance.

Look at the members of another religion--the Jews--and observe how they handled "segregation" and "alienation." Most of the Ellis Island immigrants of that religion lived in a totally segregated ghetto on Manhattan's Lower East Side. Did they kill people? Did they blow stuff up? No--they studied hard, worked long hours, started their own businesses and eventually reahed the pinnacle of success in law, medicine, science, business, and the arts. Of course, the rabbis weren't telling their congregations that their failures were someone else's fault, and that a "jihad" was their best bet to improve their lives. Those "hasidic" Jews who wished to keep their ancient traditions and way of life have been able to do so with minimal conflict with the more moderate believers of their own faith, or other faiths.

7 posted on 07/23/2005 7:22:21 AM PDT by TruthShallSetYouFree (Abortion is to family planning what bankruptcy is to financial planning.)
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To: TruthShallSetYouFree
Look at the members of another religion--the Jews--and observe how they handled "segregation" and "alienation." Most of the Ellis Island immigrants of that religion lived in a totally segregated ghetto on Manhattan's Lower East Side. Did they kill people? Did they blow stuff up? No--they studied hard, worked long hours, started their own businesses and eventually reahed the pinnacle of success in law, medicine, science, business, and the arts.
The Arabs (and Indians and Koreans) in America are following the same basic pattern. For the most part they are at the "starting businesses" stage.

-Eric

8 posted on 07/23/2005 7:28:05 AM PDT by E Rocc (Anyone who thinks Bush-bashing is banned on FR has never read a Middle East thread >:))
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To: TruthShallSetYouFree

BRAVO !!


9 posted on 07/23/2005 7:29:54 AM PDT by COUNTrecount
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To: E Rocc

BRAVO !!!


10 posted on 07/23/2005 7:30:33 AM PDT by COUNTrecount
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To: kellynla

Let's face it--you don't see any Methodists, Baptists, Catholics or Jews blowing themselves up, do you?


11 posted on 07/23/2005 7:31:14 AM PDT by Ikemeister
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To: TruthShallSetYouFree
Those "hasidic" Jews who wished to keep their ancient traditions and way of life have been able to do so with minimal conflict with the more moderate believers of their own faith, or other faiths.
In America, that is. In Israel, there are some conflicts, largely over their efforts to legally enforce the Sabbath and other aspects of observance.

American Muslims, similarly, may be devout but are rarely fanatical. For the most part they seem to understand that in America we've reached a covenant of sorts: You may practice your faith freely, but may not interfere with that of others or even ask the government to endorse it.

This covenant has made America the safest place in the world to practice any faith, including none at all. It irks me when some try to mess with it.

-Eric

12 posted on 07/23/2005 7:37:42 AM PDT by E Rocc (Anyone who thinks Bush-bashing is banned on FR has never read a Middle East thread >:))
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To: TruthShallSetYouFree
Even now, the Muslim Council of Britain adamantly insists that Islam has nothing to do with the London attacks. It cites other motives — "segregation" and "alienation," for instance.

To me, this "Mu-slime CELL of Britain" is speaking in code. They can easily twist this by saying that since Islam had nothing to do with these terrorist acts, it's merely a criminal act. Liberal apologists and America-haters can easily spin this for every act of terror (even 9/11) by distorting it into a religious-free act of murder. And before you know it we're back to the Sept. 10th / Bill Clinton way of looking at terrorism.

Also, this business of "segregation & alienation" is total b.s. Throughout modern history, various ethnic & religious groups have been segregated before (although typically not by their choice) and teenagers have been alienated before (usually by their choice).

But it wasn't until Muslims came along with this insufferable, crybaby, obnoxious chip on their collective shoulders have we seen segregation and alienation turn deadly on such a large scale, and on civilians who are merely minding their own business.

So go ahead, Muslims everywhere, denounce all you want. But actions speaker louder than your emotional chanting. Start turning in or better yet, killing your own radical hate-mongers, and I might just believe you're sincere...

13 posted on 07/23/2005 7:43:45 AM PDT by kromike
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To: kellynla
Criticize the Koran (pig poop be upon it) and receive 1.2 Billion death sentences!
14 posted on 07/23/2005 7:44:06 AM PDT by ncountylee (Dead terrorists smell like victory)
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To: kellynla
Is a 21st Century Crusades in our future?

the 21st century Crusades is here now and has been for years. This is a religious war by a cult sect on the entire world that are also not members of the cult sect. We are infidels to them and their perverted version of religion justifies their actions.

15 posted on 07/23/2005 7:44:11 AM PDT by libill (The first casualty of War is Truth-disputed origin)
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To: kellynla
Never before have I heard Muslims so sincerely denounce terrorism committed in our name as I did on my visit to Britain a few days ago. We're finally waking up.

Don't believe it, seems to me that while there may indeed be a few "moderate" muslims, whatever that means, it isn't until the heat is being turned up that they "come out" against violence against innocent civilians. This no doubt will give them the continued support of the progressive leftist's that they need to continue their battle. Sorry, until I hear in Arabic that civilians are innocent and not infidels, that Jews are not pigs or whatever they claim them to be, until I see real action I don't in any way shape or form believe their condemnations to be anything more than strategy. Oh yea and I want an apology for them destroying the greatest collection of written works ever assembled at the Great Library at Alexandria

16 posted on 07/23/2005 7:51:39 AM PDT by Archon of the East ("universal executive power of the law of nature")
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To: kromike
So go ahead, Muslims everywhere, denounce all you want. But actions speaker louder than your emotional chanting. Start turning in or better yet, killing your own radical hate-mongers, and I might just believe you're sincere...
Even some of the rebel groups in Iraq have been killing the Al Qaeda nuts there, and the Lackawanna, NY Al Qaeda cell was rolled up largely due to help from the local Islamic community.

-Eric

17 posted on 07/23/2005 8:00:30 AM PDT by E Rocc (Anyone who thinks Bush-bashing is banned on FR has never read a Middle East thread >:))
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To: Ikemeister
"Let's face it--you don't see any Methodists, Baptists, Catholics or Jews blowing themselves up, do you?"

Occaisionally it does happen, but it's usually accidental.

18 posted on 07/23/2005 8:03:02 AM PDT by Hoof Hearted
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To: kellynla

We need to quit playing mind games. It keeps us focussed on issues behind the power curve.


19 posted on 07/23/2005 8:14:13 AM PDT by combat_boots (Dug in and not budging an inch. NOT to be schiavoed, greered, or felosed as a patient)
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Comment #20 Removed by Moderator

To: Archon of the East
until I hear in Arabic that civilians are innocent and not infidels, that Jews are not pigs or whatever they claim them to be, until I see real action I don't in any way shape or form believe their condemnations to be anything more than strategy

The watershed event would be when terrorists are declared apostates of Islam. I doubt it will happen before some catastrophic event wrenches it out of the Imams. Last week, in Jordan, their leaders declared that anyone who does not go against the laws of Islam is not apostate -- and that includes suicide bombers giving their all to Allah.

With that mindset, there's not much hope -- nor time -- for anything resembling a peaceful reformation.

21 posted on 07/23/2005 8:29:01 AM PDT by browardchad
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To: johnnyBbad
Such is life for a Muslim who dencouces terror

That this is a FACT, in itself is the answer to the question posed.

22 posted on 07/23/2005 8:29:02 AM PDT by Fudd Fan (fiat voluntas Tua)
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Comment #23 Removed by Moderator

To: kellynla


24 posted on 07/23/2005 9:13:17 AM PDT by Travis McGee (--- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com ---)
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To: kellynla

believe me, another 9/11 and the enemy within aka socialists/communists/ACLU etc will be purged from this nation.....

they will get their come uppance.


25 posted on 07/23/2005 9:15:27 AM PDT by Stellar Dendrite (islamofascism, like socialism must be eradicated from the face of this earth)
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To: kellynla

Since Islam is not a religion, but a murderous Charles Manson-type cult, it should be banned in this country. All mosques in the US should be closed. If Islamists don't like that, they can go to the Middle East to pray.


26 posted on 07/23/2005 9:29:40 AM PDT by abclily
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To: kellynla
How about joining with the moderates of Judaism and Christianity in confessing some "sins of Scripture," as Episcopal Bishop John Shelby Spong has said of the Bible? Anything less leaves me with another question: Why is it that in diverse societies, those who oppose diversity of thought often feel more comfortable getting vocal than those who embrace it?

Excellent point! It shows the how inconsistent, dictatorial and hypocritical PC and multiculturalism are.

27 posted on 07/23/2005 10:01:49 AM PDT by aquila48
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To: kellynla
It cites other motives — "segregation" and "alienation," for instance. Although I don't deny that living on the margins can make a vulnerable lad gravitate to radical messages of instant belonging, it takes more than that to make him detonate himself and innocent others.

I'm getting SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO tired of hearing this poor abused immigrant propaganda.

These muslims have the same opportunities, even better thanks to multi-culti, that millions and tens of millions and HUNDREDS of millions of other immigrants have had over the past several hundred years to all points in the Western world. They get welfare and medical care at no cost to allow them to acclimate in their new situation and buy them some time to assimilate while they learn the new customs and language. Most other immigrants haven't had these advantages and assimilated quite well.

THEY chose not to take advantage of these opportunities and that's not the host country's fault. That's the muslim immigrant's fault.

I've lost all sympathy with the Mea Culpa's of the muslim immigrant and their liberal handlers. I JUST DON'T CARE ANYMORE!

THEY DON'T LIKE IT, THEY CAN GO BACK TO THE **ITHOLE THEY CAME FROM INSTEAD OF MAKING THEIR NEW COUNTRY A **ITHOLE TOO!!!!

28 posted on 07/23/2005 1:10:35 PM PDT by America's Resolve (Liberal Democrats are liars, cheats and thieves with no morals, scruples, ethics or honor!)
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To: johnnyBbad; Leapfrog; Critical Bill; backhoe; Stopislamnow; Fred Nerks; canalabamian; ...
"The author of this piece is a Canadian Muslim who needs 24/7 protection because of Islamist death threats."

.....and that is the reality of this vicious cult. The entire cult must be destroyed......ERADICATED, once and for all. This generation of Americans (and possibly the next one, too) will have to finally end this 1,400 year old scourge to all humanity.

It is long past due. This ferocious blood and death cult which arose out of a harsh, unforgiving desert environment, concocted by an illiterate pedophile brigand-bandit, should have gone through its death throes at the very latest sometime around 1492 when Los Reyes Catolicos threw the last of the Moors out of the Iberian peninsula.

Now, finally, 500+ years later, it falls to this great nation to spearhead the movement to rid this planet of Islam. I pray that we will have leaders who are sufficiently enlightened to understand that this isn't an ideology which can be persuaded by "reason." It must be thoroughly crushed once and forever.

Thanks for this post and for your comments.

Char

29 posted on 07/23/2005 9:44:44 PM PDT by CHARLITE (I propose a co-Clinton team as permanent reps to Pyonyang, w/out possibility of repatriation....)
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To: kellynla; All; CHARLITE
To put it very bluntly--

I have long ceased having a care about what these creatures ( Muslims ) think, or feel, or fear, or even care about anymore:

Islam, The Alleged Religion of Peace® ( TARP™ )? Click this picture:

No, I am not exaggerating.
I am not joking-
-this is life versus death, freedom versus slavery that we are talking about.
Click the picture, go to the "last," and read backwards.
If you are not informed about this stuff, you will be made sick. If you are informed, you will be made mad, all over again.


...and then, there's this little matter still on the books, waiting to be accounted for:

Where It's 9-11 All the Time...

Click the picture...

"Where it's nine-eleven all the time
and no Sun sets, and no clocks chime
where no voice speaks and no bird trills
the Moon hangs frozen o'er the hills
The winds are still, they seem to say,
Reflect, remember, stop to pray..."


"Imam's fiery message speaks to radical British Muslims"

I wrote this some time ago, and while I wish I could change what is said, I cannot, nor will I, retract a single word of it:


From my file, "Fire and Blood and Iron:"


The entire West ( dare I say "the civilized World?" ) is locked in a fight to the death with militant Islam.

There will be no second-place winner, no "third way" solution-- it is March or Die time, folks.

It is Us versus an eighth-century "culture" of plunder & pillage, forced religious "conversions," and the mistreatment of women.

The sooner we face up to this fact realistically and quit dancing around PC talking-point nonsense about diversity and tolerance, the better off we'll all be.

We did not pick this fight- which really has roots in Jimmy Carter's appeasement in 1979 of militants- but we had damned well better see it for what it is, and be prepared to face it and finish it.

I'll put it in raw, personal terms-- I don't want Sharia law visited upon my women, and I don't want a goat-roper "culture" infesting my land.

I don't want their vile, nasty, loathsome weapons of mass destruction loosed upon my fair country, either.

They picked the fight, and now it is up to us to finish it- balls to the wall, hammer and anvil, fire and blood and iron... freedom is never, ever free, and the coin you pay it in is men's lives and tears and blood.

What we saw during Gulf War I was our military doctrine ( high tech ) versus Soviet doctrine ( throw a lot of low tech iron at the problem )-- and we all know how that turned out.

What we saw in the 3-Week War is Information-Tech,
( What some are calling it Hyperwarfare... )
or 21st Century warfare versus 20th Century...

What I would suggest, and call your attention to, is the fact that we, and Israel, are capable of waging 21st Century warfare, and the entire Arab world is not.

Proven fact, by recent events.

One more thing- this will be a war where we are all called to be warriors- so I very strongly suggest to you that the time has come to get hard, and stay hard... it really is the time for Fire and Blood and Iron...

30 posted on 07/24/2005 1:26:03 AM PDT by backhoe (Just an old Cold Warrior, draggin' his BAR into the Sunset...)
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