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More Dieters Ditch Carb Counts (AP)
AP ^ | Aug 2, 2005 | AP staff

Posted on 08/03/2005 7:10:46 AM PDT by summer

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To: Shalom Israel

C'mon, you have to admit it was funny! The point is that any two words can be searched for; the number of hits proves nothing. Searching for "candle" and "truck" returns 999,000 hits.



Results 1 - 10 of about 7,560 for sully and smartass. (0.44 seconds)

Now that's funny!


151 posted on 08/03/2005 8:54:34 AM PDT by sully777 (The Religion Of Peace apparently kills!)
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To: summer
3 Dieters.


152 posted on 08/03/2005 8:54:59 AM PDT by Revolting cat! ("In the end, nothing explains anything!")
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To: sully777

Results 1 - 10 of about 7,560 for sully and smartass. (0.44 seconds)

Now that's funny!



...and true


153 posted on 08/03/2005 8:56:13 AM PDT by sully777 (The Religion Of Peace apparently kills!)
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To: Aquinasfan

I believe the diet works, I just don't believe one necessarily needs to follow some convoluted diet to lose weight.


154 posted on 08/03/2005 8:56:36 AM PDT by T.Smith
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To: summer
but it always amazed me how long the popularity of his diet lasted. It was so damaging to the body.

Yeah, it "damaged" 130+ pounds of fat off of mine.

155 posted on 08/03/2005 8:57:51 AM PDT by kevkrom (WARNING: If you're not sure whether or not it's sarcasm, it probably is.)
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To: Shalom Israel
Re your post #143 and my post #48 - No, my point was there are A LOT Of articles written by health professionals detailing the dangers of Atkins' Plan. Therefore, there's no need for me to rehash all that's already been written. THAT was my point.

Some posters on this thread are pretending I am the first person in the universe who's concluded Atkins is NOT ideal.

Otherwise - shalom! :)
156 posted on 08/03/2005 8:58:32 AM PDT by summer
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To: brytlea

Decaf coffee! WTF! Decaf is for schoolgirls.

I like the Venti Iced Coffee from Starbucks (with a redeye). My wife tried a sip once and made such a face. I still laugh thinking about it.


157 posted on 08/03/2005 8:59:03 AM PDT by exile (Exile - Helen Thomas tried to lure me into her Gingerbread House.)
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To: proudofthesouth
Or chocolate!

Chocolate is allowed on Atkins. Remember chocolate comes from a bean therefore it's a vegetable. ;)

158 posted on 08/03/2005 8:59:08 AM PDT by CajunConservative
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To: hispanarepublicana

"Any diet that doesn't allow satisfying amounts of wine or beer is doomed to failure."

http://www.drinkbeergetthindiet.com

http://www.lcbartender.com


159 posted on 08/03/2005 8:59:50 AM PDT by toddlintown (Your papers please.)
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To: dfwgator
It should be "moderate carbs" not "low carbs." Everything in moderation, the problem is the typical diet is extremely high in carbs. Just get carb intake down to a moderate level, but many took it as eliminating carbs altogether, which is ridiculous.

No matter what one thinks of a low-carb diet, eliminating as much refined sugars, corn starch, and corn syrup out of your diet as you can will do anyone a world of good.

160 posted on 08/03/2005 8:59:58 AM PDT by kevkrom (WARNING: If you're not sure whether or not it's sarcasm, it probably is.)
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To: clarissaexplainsitall

"It is only in the first two weeks of Atkins where one avoids all carbs."

Induction allows up to 20 carbs.


161 posted on 08/03/2005 9:01:08 AM PDT by toddlintown (Your papers please.)
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To: T.Smith; summer; Lazmataz; hispanarepublicana; Shalom Israel

I believe the diet works, I just don't believe one necessarily needs to follow some convoluted diet to lose weight.



You won't believe this following article from the tolerant people at an Atkins related site:

http://www.carbwire.com/2004/03/25/homer

D'Oh!


162 posted on 08/03/2005 9:01:22 AM PDT by sully777 (The Religion Of Peace apparently kills!)
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To: summer
I've seen a lot of folks bashing Atkins and I don't understand why anyone cares how another is losing weight or how they eat in general.

It's really no one's business. South Beach/Atkins/Weight Watchers/Jenny Craig/ etc - it's all about what works best for the individual - amazing that some people get so worked up over a diet

163 posted on 08/03/2005 9:04:02 AM PDT by WhyisaTexasgirlinPA (Prayers for healing and relief from pain for Cowboy...........)
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To: exile

Caffiene is a major source of nutritionless energy (not quite empty calories, but close) and cutting back or eliminating it is a key to any successful diet plan.


164 posted on 08/03/2005 9:04:28 AM PDT by discostu (When someone tries to kill you, you try to kill them right back)
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To: discostu

"Caffiene is a major source of nutritionless energy (not quite empty calories, but close) and cutting back or eliminating it is a key to any successful diet plan."

Noooooooooooo! (Rocking on the floor, holding myself). I've got 30 lbs to drop, and I've already given up smoking and drinking. The coroner will have to pry the coffee from my cold dead hands.


165 posted on 08/03/2005 9:06:28 AM PDT by exile (Exile - Helen Thomas tried to lure me into her Gingerbread House.)
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To: Cooter
Today, there is a plethora of carb conscious products out there and the Atkins stuff is on the expensive end of the scale.

Not to mention that most of it sucks. (I'll make an exception for the Advantage bars and shakes.) Ever try Atkins "pasta"? Yeeeeeechhhhhh!!! I'd rather eat the box it came in. On the other hand, now you can go with Dreamfields, which is made with real semolina flour, looks, acts, and tastes like real pasta, but is manufactured in such a way as to make most of the carbs non-digestable.

166 posted on 08/03/2005 9:08:04 AM PDT by kevkrom (WARNING: If you're not sure whether or not it's sarcasm, it probably is.)
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To: CajunConservative

I will. Thanks!


167 posted on 08/03/2005 9:09:59 AM PDT by Trust but Verify (Get over yourselves!)
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To: summer
No, my point was there are A LOT Of articles written by health professionals detailing the dangers of Atkins' Plan...

I know that was your point--it was the other guy's point that your argument is meaningless. Searching on "grave" and "subway" returns 400,000 hits. Searching on "rebel" and "cookie" returns 315,000 hits. The number of hits is perfectly meaningless.

As for "detailing the dangers", can you give one, not two but one, example of someone who started a low-carb diet with healthy kidneys and suffered any sort of kidney damage as a result? I didn't think so--because there hasn't been one. Doctors have stated why they think low-carb dieting is a horrible idea, but they have not produced clinical studies indicating any risks. If you want to make your case, you'll have to do more than count the hits.

168 posted on 08/03/2005 9:10:05 AM PDT by Shalom Israel (Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.)
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To: sully777
It's not worth the headache of telling them Doctor Carb was bloated and sickly when he mysteriously "fell to his death."

Um... no he wasn't. He was at about 180-190 pounds prior to slipping on ice and falling on his head -- the weight at death was caused by fluid retention in the hospital. Your assertions come straight out of a PETA front group press release, and have no basis in actual fact.

But that's ok... you can just lump me in as a "kool-aid drinker" because the facts are inconvenient to your assumptions and assertions.

169 posted on 08/03/2005 9:16:49 AM PDT by kevkrom (WARNING: If you're not sure whether or not it's sarcasm, it probably is.)
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To: exile

Quitting smoking probably isn't going to help your weight loss, though the ticker will appreciate it. Cutting back will still give you many benefits, I'm a soda junky myself so I know the need for caffiene, when I went on my diet last year I cut my soda intake by 50% (among other things), today I'm 55 pounds lighter than I was March of 04 (with a 6 month break from the excercise regimen, life got ugly and the weather went to crap). Of course if you drink your coffee without sugar it's not as big a problem as soda, but that caffiene still messes with your metabolism in ways that are not condussive to weight loss. Also caffiene is a serious diaretic and can lead to dehydration, cutting back on the coffee and replacing it with regular boring old water can have other nice health benefits.

I know the list of evil things when you're thinking about losing weight can be pretty scary, that's why I went for portion control, I eliminated nothing and cut back on everything (except the booze, I don't drink that much anyway), a lot easier to stick to and there's no punishment for wanting to improve myself.


170 posted on 08/03/2005 9:17:04 AM PDT by discostu (When someone tries to kill you, you try to kill them right back)
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To: dfwgator

Agreed. I fought with my weight for years (and lost every battle,miserably) until I discovered the South Beach Diet.I found that a diet consisting mainly of breads,pasta and potatoes was not the way to go. I also discovered an herbal supplement that's really helped me-Glucomannan(viable-herbal.net). Between that,and the lowering of carbs in my diet, I have lost 90 lbs since last June and joined a gym. I feel better at 48 than I ever did at 28.The abundance of junk carbs was enough to keep me from being successful all of my life-up until now.


171 posted on 08/03/2005 9:18:11 AM PDT by gimme1ibertee
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To: cinives
Atkins is a way of eating, not a product-based service like Jenny Craig.

That's my biggest problem with "programs" like Jenny Craig or Nutrisystem -- by using their pre-packed stuff, you never learn how to cook properly for yourself, so it becomes that much harder to maintain the weight loss when you go off-plan.

172 posted on 08/03/2005 9:19:12 AM PDT by kevkrom (WARNING: If you're not sure whether or not it's sarcasm, it probably is.)
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To: sully777

About the wine, bread in manna in the bible, well - you see now, these people did not have Albertsons, Tom Thumb and your local deli to serve them this stuff. They had to go gather the wheat, ground it up, and make their own bread. Everything that went into their mouth they prepared themselves and used up all the carbs they ate in the act of preparing the food. No corn syrups or refined sugar either. I bet if you stomped your own grapes you burn some fat too.

Get it?


173 posted on 08/03/2005 9:20:04 AM PDT by billygoatgruff
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To: afraidfortherepublic

South Beach is without question the healthiest diet out there. The basic theory revolves around good fats, bad fats, good carbs, bad carbs. Sugar is a big no no, but Splenda works fine.

I quickly dropped 25 lbs. over two years ago and have not gained a pound since. I'm 65, nearly 6 ft with a 33" waist. I'm fanatical about always following the South Beach principles of eating.

The Doc that developed the diet is a cardiologist that originally designed the plan as a healthy way of eating for his heart patients. But everyone that followed it lost weight and he took it from there.


174 posted on 08/03/2005 9:21:00 AM PDT by Oldhunk
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To: sully777
It's not worth the headache of telling them Doctor Carb was bloated and sickly when he mysteriously "fell to his death."

Lucky for you he's already dead, because this is one of the more blatant libels I've seen on FR in quite a while.

175 posted on 08/03/2005 9:23:25 AM PDT by Dont Mention the War (John Bolton for White House Press Secretary!)
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To: Lekker 1

Do people who belong to dieting organizations have secret handshakes, take blood oaths of eternal obedience, etc.

I know, they could tell but then they'd have to kill us.


176 posted on 08/03/2005 9:24:34 AM PDT by NaughtiusMaximus (Stop being a victim, resist social engineering.)
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To: CajunConservative
Chocolate is allowed on Atkins. Remember chocolate comes from a bean therefore it's a vegetable. ;)

Actually, chocolate is just fine... as long as it's not mixed with sugar. Mrs. kevkrom makes a very nice low-carb chili (about 7 net carbs/portion) and uses (unsweetened) baking chocolate as one of the ingredients...

177 posted on 08/03/2005 9:26:24 AM PDT by kevkrom (WARNING: If you're not sure whether or not it's sarcasm, it probably is.)
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To: exile

It's probably not indicative of everybody, but I was extremely successful doing the low-carb thing while ingesting lots of caffeine. Seems that Atkin's said no to caffeine, but we all have our little weaknesses. My wife discovered that aspartame would completely derail her.


178 posted on 08/03/2005 9:36:16 AM PDT by Lekker 1 ("Who the hell wants to hear actors talk?"- Harry M. Warner, Warner Bros., 1927)
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To: Shalom Israel
If you want to make your case, you'll have to do more than count the hits.

Yeah, I did. I provided you links to articles by health professionals detailling the dangers of Atkins.

It's you that is fixated on "counting" the hits.There's PLENTY of articles out there "making the case." And, again - that was my point. Geesh!
179 posted on 08/03/2005 9:37:20 AM PDT by summer
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To: summer

gee what a shock...not


180 posted on 08/03/2005 9:37:35 AM PDT by paltz
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To: WhyisaTexasgirlinPA
It's really no one's business.

Actually, I agree with you!
181 posted on 08/03/2005 9:38:09 AM PDT by summer
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To: billygoatgruff

All that walking around the wilderness burned off those manna carbs too.


182 posted on 08/03/2005 9:38:34 AM PDT by CajunConservative
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To: summer

Summer, from your posts on FR over the years I believe you are a passionate person who does a lot for the Conservative cause. Thank you.

But your ideas about low-carb diets may be based on erroneous information. If you are the reasonable and open-minded scholar I believe you are, I hope you will give what I say a fair consideration.

Quick background on the man:

I believe Atkins was not only a cardiologist, but a rigorous scientist who was persuaded by facts and proof alone. Despite this, his character was assassinated by an unprecedented Liberal media and academia assault. He was even maligned by a Democratic Congress, who accused him of being a quack.

In the original version of his book, he included a transcript summary of his curious inquisition by Congress. The story reads like the persecution of Jesus Christ.

Funny, all I remember in my foggy recollection as a youth at the time was that Atkins somehow advocated a 'bacon and eggs diet'. I dismissed him then. But as an adult now, taking the time to research my own facts and form my own opinion, this media spin was an outright distortion and lie.

I only wish I had pierced the veil of propaganda at the time, because I would have improved my life years and years ago.

In summary, the Atkins diet changes the way you need to think about calories. The traditional formula "Calories In = Calories Out" doesn't work. Does Atkins dispose of the laws of thermodynamics? Of course not. It looks at a macro picture of what is going on in the body, on the "Calories Out" side.

"Calories In" refers to caloric intake. "Calories Out", to most dieticians, exercise and the basal metabolic process.

But Atkins discovered that additional energy dynamics are significant when lower carbs are ingested, since the preferred energy source of the body, glucose, readily available via carbs, is now restricted.

The missing link to the formula is 'excreted', i.e. "Calories In = Traditional Calories Out PLUS Calories Excreted".

How are calories excreted? In the absence of available carb/sugar energy, the body will necessarily breakdown fat stores. The process is inefficient from an energy dynamics viewpoint, like a poorly-tuned automobile engine. This is good for weightloss! When your body is forced to use fat stores for energy, through bodily function and even sweat, your body is dumping energy from fat.

No matter how many high-priced Liberal profs refute it, the facts on the ground prove low-carb diets work to reduce weight on similar, or even higher, caloric intake diets when compared to the recommended Food Pyramid diet.

Why do dieticians reject Atkins? Simple. It doesn't follow the Food Pyramid that forms the paradigm and basis of their understanding of diet. Their education prevents acceptance of it.

Where did the Food Pyramid come from? A Democratic member of Congress, McGovern, sponsored originating legislation to help wheat-growing farmers. A 'Rat did it for votes! It has absolutely no basis in science. Only now, because Atkins exploded the myths, has the Food Pyramid been revised, albeit imperfectly.

Here's another interesting tidbit. Early in his career, Atkins was struck by a curious fact, which formed a part of his study on diet. People who were on hunger-strikes noted that after approximately 48 hours, they lost their hunger pangs.

Atkins later hypothesized that it was because they had depleted glucose/sugar/carb stores in their bloodstreams, and were now consuming body fat, an alternative pathway for energy. Anyone who has lived a low-carb diet knows that they start losing weight about 2 days (48 hours) after going back to a hardcore low-carb diet.

What Atkins discovered though, was the starvation effect, which is that by starving yourself, the basal metabolic rate lowered dramatically, self-defeating for weightloss.

But what Atkins significantly realized was that low-carb diets and frequent eating prevented this starvation effect.

Does Atkins recommend eating bacon and eggs? No! He recommends leafy salads, vegetables, etc., all the carbs you desire, as long as they don't exceed a threshold that is personal and individual, where body fat is stored.

So why are you supposed to go hardcore (Induction) with no carbs? Only to purge your body of blood glucose, and to provide a baseline to understand your own body mechanics. Once you are clearly burning fat (as much as 10 pounds in 14 days!!!), you reintroduce carbs (whichever ones you want) such that you continue to lose weight at the rate and level you desire. If you stop losing weight, you've found your personal carb threshold. Go forth, and do whatever you want - lose more weight, gain weight, whatever. Atkins simply provides you with the tools to understand your body and how it stores fat.

Summer, thank you for reading this.


183 posted on 08/03/2005 9:39:10 AM PDT by Enduring Freedom (Leftist Traitorous Weasels Are NOT 'Progressive' - they are Domestic Terrorists)
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To: summer
It's you that is fixated on "counting" the hits.There's PLENTY of articles out there "making the case." And, again - that was my point. Geesh!

Which link points to a single documented case of kidney damage resulting from avoiding sugar and starch? I missed it.

184 posted on 08/03/2005 9:42:31 AM PDT by Shalom Israel (Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.)
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To: Enduring Freedom
Thank you for your kinds words to me, and for taking the time to write all that information, Enduring Freedom. I did read it, and I appreciate and respect your point of view.

My experience, a long time ago, with Atkins, was not, as I said, "ideal." And, others I know had the same experience I did - including constant migraine headaches, irritability, fatigue, etc.

I do think eliminating flour and sugar is good, and cutting back on carbs is good. But Atkins was not for me. If others have lost weight with it, good for them.

:)
185 posted on 08/03/2005 9:46:01 AM PDT by summer
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To: Shalom Israel

Do your own research. I gave you a great start there in my post #48.


186 posted on 08/03/2005 9:46:35 AM PDT by summer
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To: summer
Do your own research. I gave you a great start there in my post #48.

That's called "shifting the burden of proof". But I understand why you had to do it: since there have never been cases of kidney damage from carb-restricted diets, you certainly couldn't just pony up the proof.

187 posted on 08/03/2005 9:48:22 AM PDT by Shalom Israel (Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.)
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To: summer

Problem with those articles is that the writers (and frequently the subjects of the articles) never got past the induction phase. Atkins isn't giving up carbs entirely, only for 2 weeks, after that the dieter is supposed to re-introduce a small controlled level of carbs into their diet. There is a danger in completely eliminating food groups for a prolonged period of time, but properly followed Atkins doesn't do that, some people (the quick fix junkies) do that but that's not the diet's fault that's their fault for not actually reading past chapter 1.


188 posted on 08/03/2005 9:54:02 AM PDT by discostu (When someone tries to kill you, you try to kill them right back)
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To: kevkrom

I agree - and Dreamfields is available at my local grocery store.


189 posted on 08/03/2005 9:55:56 AM PDT by Cooter
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To: summer

Sweet cheeks,
I've worked in nutrition for over 25 years...

I've seen fads come and go. NO fad has had the viscious following like Atkins...I've heard the most rabid called Atkinazis (so true!). It doesn't matter what data or research you site, doesn't matter what questions you ask ...it will either be labeled "Junk Science", agenda driven or the sky is really purple and you're just callin' it blue.

My attitude is that Atkins is in hell roasting and toasting nicely. I'm seeing gobs of folks saying "but I lost 50 pounds and gained back 60 because I didn't stay with the cult, er diet!!" They're not getting the hormonal triggering effects of 'diet'. Or that the best long term weight loss results are in low fat/reduced calorie diets with the low CHO diets showing the worst long term resluts (but that's because they didn't get the it right!!...erm, that says a lot in itself doesn't it).

Plus, even those who SWEAR they are only getting 40 gms of CHO a day kinda fall apart under the scrutiny of a diet/ meal history or calorie count (nope chucky, there are 15 gms of CHO in those pita pockets not 5 and so forth).... so even the most militant lowcarbers are shocked to find the are eating the dreaded recommendations of 45-55%! (OH MY!)

I'm still seeing good results with folks following a 45- 55% complex carb diet--- especially diabetics, who use 'controlled' or 'counted' carbs, not low. Those on pumps do even better. Which, gee, is what we've been telling folks all along ;) Ya know, a varied diet, all things in moderation etc.

Time is on your side sweetie...so don't waste your energy. ;)


190 posted on 08/03/2005 10:03:09 AM PDT by najida (Today AC--- Now I'm living for ice cubes and a phone.)
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To: summer

You're welcome!

A personal anecdote:

I tried for 15 years to understand how to lose my ever-expanding waistline, despite exercising intensely (weights/raquet sports, etc.) far more than the average person.

My diet was 'perfect', straight from the Food Pyramid.

Natural fruit juices for beverage, mostly vegetarian, lots of grains, pasta, vegetables, fruit and some dairy. I had the 'healthiest' diet of anyone I knew. No coffee. No smoking. 'Perfect'.

But I gained. And gained. And got frustrated. For 15 years.

One day, I read about that quack Atkins dying, and scanned the Liberal media reports which absolutely skewered him.

The same Liberal media that at the time was also skewering President Bush.

Because I learned to distrust the Liberal media, I did my own research, and what I discovered was a completely different set of conclusions than the one imprinted on my mind over the years by the MSM.

What a lesson! (Aside - now think about Nixon, Vietnam, Watergate, McCarthy, etc.)

I had nothing to lose but weight - and wow! The results were instantaneous, repeatable, logical and controllable. The mystery, from a practical perspective, is done.

Now many, many years later, I am at my college weight and waistline (30"), and can benchpress just under 300 lbs.

At least a dozen friends report spectacular results from Atkins. I encourage you to reconsider.

About the migraines: the only comment I have is that a friend who suffered them lifelong and constantly, actually stopped having them when she tried Atkins and stopped consuming carbs. But the migraines recur everytime she falls off the wagon and goes back to a heavy carb diet. She falls off a lot, unfortunately. For her wedding though, she dropped 15 pounds in less than a month on Atkins. She is trying to get the balance right.

Good luck, whatever your choices!


191 posted on 08/03/2005 10:05:02 AM PDT by Enduring Freedom (Leftist Traitorous Weasels Are NOT 'Progressive' - they are Domestic Terrorists)
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To: sully777

"Warren Piece" + Hunk = 27,200 hits!


192 posted on 08/03/2005 10:19:35 AM PDT by Warren_Piece (Large buttocks are pleasing to me, nor am I able to lie concerning this matter)
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To: T.Smith

The nice thing about a low carb diet is that it's not at all convoluted. It's quite simple and straightforward.
susie


193 posted on 08/03/2005 10:20:52 AM PDT by brytlea (All you need as ID to vote in FL is your Costco card...)
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To: summer

Health professionals have ALOT of time and *education* invested in the regular old food pyramid way of eating, low fat, etc. So, it is no surprise that some of them fight it tooth and nail.
susie


194 posted on 08/03/2005 10:22:20 AM PDT by brytlea (All you need as ID to vote in FL is your Costco card...)
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To: exile
Decaf coffee! WTF! Decaf is for schoolgirls.

Why thank you (I didn't think I still looked like a schoolgirl, but maybe you need new glasses! ) I find caffiene makes my blood sugar spike, so I have pretty much let it become a thing of the past. But, I LOVE a venti/decaff over ice from Starbucks. Of course, then I spike it with half and half and splenda. But....that's a dessert! :) susie
195 posted on 08/03/2005 10:24:41 AM PDT by brytlea (All you need as ID to vote in FL is your Costco card...)
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To: kevkrom

I actually read a pretty compelling article in Discover magazine once that postulated that corn was bad for you. If I recall correctly, the researcher had access to skeletons of native americans from one settlement that spanned from before to after corn was introduced into their diets. Before corn he didn't see the prevelence of diseases that he saw after (Im sorry, I can't remember exactly what diseases, but had to have been things like arthritis that shows up in bones). It was interesting. I like corn too....especially those candy ones! ;)
susie


196 posted on 08/03/2005 10:28:23 AM PDT by brytlea (All you need as ID to vote in FL is your Costco card...)
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To: rarestia

If the science is valid, it's not a short-term solution. :) I can go anywhere in the world, into any restaurant, and still stay low-carb from the regular menu.

What things do you lose that carbs give you ? Atkins includes carbs, just not a lot of them. What do more carbs give you ? A short burst of energy (insulin spike) followed by hunger, empty stomach feelings, and the temptation to eat more than you would have otherwise because of the excess insulin.

I agree - many people think Atkins is not "work", but anything done that's contrary to your eating habits of years is work until you change your mindset. It's like recovering from tobacco addiction. Yes, we now have to work to get the exercise that our ancestors got just by living every day, but then, our ancestors were not especially thin either. Think the Victorians.

I think Atkins Anti-Aging diet book is my favorite. It's more a long-term, complete plan than the regular diet book.


197 posted on 08/03/2005 10:29:46 AM PDT by cinives (On some planets what I do is considered normal.)
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To: WhyisaTexasgirlinPA
I've seen a lot of folks bashing Atkins and I don't understand why anyone cares how another is losing weight or how they eat in general.
That's what I always wonder. I don't care if others want to low carb. I just get tired of people telling me I'm ruining my kidneys and prophesizing doom. susie
198 posted on 08/03/2005 10:30:22 AM PDT by brytlea (All you need as ID to vote in FL is your Costco card...)
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To: kevkrom

But you know, if he ate more carbs, his head would have been softer and more able to absorb the blow from the cement....and he would be alive today.....
susie


199 posted on 08/03/2005 10:32:42 AM PDT by brytlea (All you need as ID to vote in FL is your Costco card...)
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To: kevkrom

Same - you have to be able to eat out at people's houses and at restaurants in order to be successful.


200 posted on 08/03/2005 10:33:42 AM PDT by cinives (On some planets what I do is considered normal.)
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