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Skip to comments.Natalee Holloway - Case Discussion Extended Thread 14
Posted on 08/12/2005 10:38:31 AM PDT by TexKat
Star Staff Writer
SHELBY The flight attendants bracelet Faith, hope and prayer for Natalee caught her eye as Kelly Jones and her family headed to a tropical vacation in Aruba.
I asked him where he got it and he said Beth was in the front of the plane go ask her, Mrs. Jones said.
That was how she, her husband, Stephen, and his daughters, Natalie and Caroline, met Beth Holloway Twitty, mother of missing teen Natalee Holloway, who disappeared from the tiny island tourist spot on May 30.
The Shelby family flew to Aruba on Wednesday, Aug. 3, the same day Ms. Twitty and a close friend returned to the island from a respite at home in Birmingham, Ala.
We had been following the story, Mrs. Jones said. She was open to talk and responsive to our support. I asked for a bracelet and she gave us four. I asked if there was anything we could do to help and she said, Yes, you can put up posters.
Ms. Twitty said she needed more coverage in what she called the seedier areas of the island, away from the usual tourist sites.
Ms. Twitty, pursued by a CNN camera crew when she got off the plane, later waited at customs for the family, then agreed to meet them at their hotel, the Holiday Inn.
Meeting Natalie Jones, Ms. Twitty made a point of her name spelling, they said, asking, Are you an lee or an lie?
Ms. Twittys brother, Paul, Natalees uncle, who was also staying at the Holiday Inn, provided a supply of posters, which needed updating with higher reward amounts.
They were just a very normal family, just like you see her on TV, Mrs. Jones said.
She probably didnt share anything with us that you havent seen on the news, she said, adding, Things like this probably happen more often, but this mother has gotten in there and gotten the medias attention.
The search for Natalee Holloway started May 30, at the end of her high school senior trip to Aruba, an island in the West Indies just a short boat ride off the Venezuelan coast.
In her hotel room, Natalees bags were packed for the trip home but she was nowhere to be found.
The story made headlines and continues to get attention in papers and on television screens across the world.
But not in Aruba, Mrs. Jones said.
I looked at the paper there every day and not a thing in it, she said, and any local people were very protective of their turf.
Some people didnt want the posters up, Natalie said. They, like, brushed us off.
Mrs. Jones said they got friendly service at a small store where they bought tape for the posters. Then they asked to put one up. The clerk asked what it was for, and when they said, Natalee, the mood changed.
You people need to give it up. Shes back in the States, they were told.
With three scuba divers, the Jones clan likes tropical vacations, Mrs. Jones said. They chose Aruba this year because none of them had been there and because of low airfares.
Those fares might have been affected by the publicity about Natalee, she said.
After the negative response about Natalees disappearance from island residents, she said, I did have a little bit of guilt being there then seeing this family and what they were going through thinking that we were assisting in (Arubas) economy.
I rationalized the guilt by saying we may have done one little, tiny thing to be helpful.
I don't know when this picture of Beth was taken, but it is heartbreaking to see. Here's a link.
On Thursday a witness that declared earlier that he had seen Joran van der Sloot on the night of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway did not show up in the Aruban court to testify. The authorities assume that he has already left the island. According to various reports the witness, a Colombiaan that is/was staying illegally in Aruba, had been summoned to testify on Thursday under oath. He told the police that he saw Joran on May 30th around 2.30 in the morning with the two Surinamese brothers in the neighbourhood of the Marriott Hotel. The Colombian was considered an important witness, because Joran declared that at that moment he was already at home. According to a lawyer of the Holloway family, Vinda de Souza, the judge can allow the previous testimony that the man gave to the police to be used as a valid testimony.
Latest developments in Aruba (Thursday 11-August)
The local media of Aruba is reporting that if the authorities dont come up with something incriminating on Joran van der Sloot by September 4th , he will be released.. Meanwhile the defence lawyers have appealed the judge's ruling that Aruban authorities can share information with the FBI after a motion by the defence to prohibit file sharing with the American law enforcement agency was struck down last week. Former official suspect, Deepak Kalpoe, claims that the mother of Natalee, Beth Twitty, has been harassing him. This after Twitty confronted Kalpoe at the Internet cafe and asked him about her daughters disappearance.
That's gutwrenching. I'd like to put that picture on the wall of Joran's cell so he can look at it all day. Scumbag.
This reminds me of the Greenwich murder case. The mother was very persistent and level headed in getting it solved, and she did, with Mark Fuhrman's help.
The case stinks more and more each day. I have seen this institutional approach before, loud noises about doing something (Aruba authorities) while blocking every road to progress.
My take? The kid had a line of credit at one or more casinos, but he was not old enough to gamble. I think he is mobbed up and the Boys Downtown are helping him.
More of what Jug said in that interview is that Trappenberg snubbed them when they ran into him while doing interviews. He did not look at them, speak to them, or acknowledge them in any way. I think Trappenberg and Van der Straaten are two of a kind. I'd put both of them on the list of those involved in the cover up.
When Beth returned to Aruba, she told Greta that she had a free rental car from a limo company. She said it was given to her for a month. I don't know why they need free taxi rides too. It also sounds like Jug has upgraded from the old room to a much larger one to accomodate security. The old one was given to them free of charge.
The following excerpts are from the WorldJOURNIER web site. It seems that this site contains a listing of all the those involved...and a by date break-down of events. I have posted some of the paragraphs from this site that contained info. that I had never heard. For those who have been on this FR thread...just wondering if much of this is common knowledge...proven...or disproven.
On 6-30 JANSSEN stated to "CNN" that some days after NATALEE went missing Current Suspect P. SLOOT told the 3 boys that without a body police would have no case. http://edition.cnn.com/2005/LAW/06/30/aruba.missing/index.html , but also on 6-30 JANSSEN told "MSNBC", "They spoke about the situation that when there is no body you dont have a case, and that was already in the first day after the disappearance." http://www.allheadlinenews.com/cgi-bin/news/newsbrief.plx?id=2240305518&fa=1
After 7-4 hearing Current Suspect D. KALPOE and Current Suspect S. KALPOE were released. (allowed to go anywhere, including leave ARUBA)
While snorkeling on 7-6 about a half-mile from the Marriott off Arashi beach, FORNARO discovered one bone in the ocean that she found between 2 large rocks. FORNARO describes the bone as being 3.5 to 5.0 long, larger at one end that was rounded like a bone joint, gray in color, and still had a whitish tissue that was still meaty and flesh-like that was still attached to the bone. When asked if she thought it was a human bone, FORNARO said, yes, she thought it was a humans bone because the bone had not been cooked nor barbecued like an animal bone might have been if eaten as food. FORNARO wrapped the bone in paper, but even wrapped in paper she described its smell as so pungently bad and so strong that she had to put the wrapped bone in the trunk of her car while she and her mother transported the bone to the ARUBA police station in Noord. When she gave the bone to someone behind the reception desk at the ARUBA police Noord station, the person who accepted the bone told her that the police detectives will be contacting her. On 7-13 while lunching somewhere, FORNARO noticed a Texas EquuSearch team member also lunching. FORNARO told the Texas EquuSearch team member about her finding the bone near the Marriott Hotel, she described the bone, and FORNARO said she had taken the bone to the ARUBAN police station in Noord and turned it over to the police. The Texas EquuSearch team member asked FORNARO to show him exactly where she found the bone, and FORNARO did so. While at the discovery location they also found a pair of thong underwear and a yellow-colored hair scrunchie. The same day the Texas EquuSearch team member asked FORNARO if the police had contacted her. When FORNARO said the police have not contacted her, the Texas EquuSearch team member asked if she would mind going to the ARUBAN police station at Noord and checking on the bone. FORNARO agreed. When she went into the police station and asked to speak with a detective about the bone she turned in, the woman police officer asked FORNARO (paraphrasing), Oh, you mean the two bones? As of 7-17 FORNARO has still not been contacted by the ARUBAN police detectives.
(a Miami paper reported that Texas EquuSearch had located 3 ARUBAN construction companies with the equipment they needed, but, all 3 ARUBAN companies refused to help. One of them was related to the Current Suspects KALPOEs, and he told the other two companies not to cooperate with Texas EquuSearch team)
Reportedly, by 7-4 his mommy NADIRA had airline tickets already purchased to take the KALPOE brothers back to Suriname ((the judge did not confiscate the brothers passports)) Judge also ruled
Thanks TK!!! Nothing like the smell of a new thread.
Hi FR_addict. Good catch . . . do you have a link for that?
I may be wrong (and I'm usually wrong, har har), but I don't think they are complaining that Aruba isn't paying for everything. I think that what bothers them is that RT is making it seem that the Aruban gov. is picking up the tab, which is just not true.
IIRC, I don't think they said anything about their accomodations until RT brought it up. Of course, I could be wrong about that too . . .
Also, they have already been in Aruba for over 2 months, so 2 months of taxi rides would probably be pretty expensive? I think? Never taken a taxi in Aruba, so again, don't really know . . .
I don't want to go to tickle sites, but are they a popular thing with teens in the States? worldwide? Are they basically "Who I am" pages? Depending on the answer and the demographics of Aruba, I could see that used as PR.
Has anyone posted or have links to an accurate (or mostly accurate) compilation of the "facts" of the case and/or the 'players' ...ie a summary of all comments made by the 'players' / witnesses...not he said, she said stuff..... Also timeline of the evening/morning with only 'facts' from witness statements in the news, not hearsay. I would greatly appreciate being able to look at it in that format.
Glad to serve, TexKat . . . and THANK YOU! You keep this case going . . . It is much appreciated!
The topics of "no body, no crime", the bone discovery, and the tickets to take the KALPOE brothers back to Suriname have been discussed at various times, but the miami paper report about no help with the equipment might be new. I believe this is the first I have heard it.
Oh dear! This may be a difficult request! I think that stlnative had an excellent timeline. Other than that, the information is kindof scattered everywhere.
A couple of places I can direct you to are:
I'm sure others will have great ideas where to look too . . .
Here's another place to look too: http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewforum.php?f=8
And no, I don't know much about Tickle sites. Sorry . . .
07:00- 07:30 Things get heated Police ask H-T to leave.
general timeline 5/31
Check your mail for stlnative's timeline as posted on an earlier thread.
I agree. No one should have been released, including the father.
TK, I think your diligence is awesome and it's very much appreciated!
Now that you brought up about the bone found.
Did anyone ever hear the outcome of it.
Or is it still sitting at the police station.
Excellent time line link, RS!
I like how it links to the hourly time line for each day.
actually that was #2 from theophilusscribe above...
Then my thanks to Theo! Nice catch.
"One was a human bone several years old and the other was a donkey bone," she said.
Glad to serve, RGVTx!
rolling_stone, thank you for being so gracious!
Posted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 3:52 pm Post subject: MSNBC: New clue found in Aruba?
(Photos to follow)
"Aug 12 - MSNBC: New clue found in Aruba?"
- Belt found near lighthouse by search team and police with search dogs last night.
- Appears similar to belt seen in a picture of Joran.
- Witness missing.
- Another witness got thrown into psychiatric institution; some facts relayed by that witness match up with some facts given by LANDFILL WITNESS.
- Search at landfill continues.
Someone in aruba is sure doing a number on the witnesses, eh?
Posted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 3:57 pm
Scarborough Country, Aug 11th, Notes
Beth says she will abide by her atty's wishes and stay away from the internet cafe. But she says she can't imagine why that brief visit warranted this response from Deepak.
Jug says they do know where the gardener is.
Jug says, the govt has offered to help but they are not comping their rooms and no free cabs, they have discount on their rooms.
Jug says the LE took his statements 33 days later, and the other guys with him 19 days later--'it's like they don't want to find the truth'
Beth, FBI is only getting the audio and video tapes taken during interrogation.
Jug: everything is in Dutch, so it takes them a while to figure out what is being said.
Jug says he doesn't want a boycott of Aruba.
Beth: Jvs knew every single patron in CnC with that grip handshake.
Jug: All we want to do is get Natalee and go home, I don't care what they do down there afterwards. We just want Natalee.
Beth: I know it's way bigger than Natalee Holloway.
"VAN SUSTEREN: Charles, take me back to May 30th, which is several hours after Natalee missed her flight. How did you first get wind of the fact that Beth Holloway Twitty (search) was looking for her daughter?
CHARLES CROES, TALKED TO DUTCH SUSPECT: A major friend of mine called me up. He was working with Natalee's mom to help them find Natalee.
VAN SUSTEREN: Why would he call you? What is your occupation that would be a reason he would call you?
C. CROES: Well, I have a sail rental company. And there was apparently a phone call made. And he was calling me betting or hoping that the phone call was made from one of our phones, and so that's why he called me.
VAN SUSTEREN: About what time did he call you?
C. CROES: He called me at 11:30.
VAN SUSTEREN: What did he say to you?
C. CROES: He told me that he needed my help. And I asked him what it was about. And he told me that it had to do something with a cell phone. And I didn't relate it to anything but work at that point.And then he said, "There is a possibility that a phone call was made using one of our phones." And I said, "OK." And he said, "It's very, very important." I said, "Fine," and I asked him to go into further details, and he did. And then I made arrangements to go see him."
Am I the only one who sees a connection between CC saying: "There is a possibility that a phone call was made using one of our phones." and the cell phone call by Natalee to Beth at 3AM Aruba time?
Was the cell phone call to Beth traced to to a cell phone in CC business, that business being a sail rental company?.
This is the second time a Sail rental business comes up in a disappearance on Aruba: "Willard 'Bud' Larson, Last Known Location: June 9, 1999 Windsurf Village board shop, ARUBA. He was on Aruba to windsurf. He went missing after a public fight with the rental office where he was to get the windsurfing equipment. They did not have the equipment he had reserved so he got into an altercation with them and left. He disappeared somewhere between the rental office and his hotel..."
Could this be the same sail rental business is both disappearances?
Does anyone know if CC owns the Windsurf Village board shop?
Could there be someone (not CC) working for a sail rental business connected to both disappearances, or am I imagining this?
mispelled sail should be cell...
HOT BREAKING heads up from a network news source
Today the local language newspaper Diario (which is owned by frequent MSNBC guest Jossy Mansur) published what the newspaper says is a signed police interview (or "declaration") with Joran van der Sloot in which van der Sloot says Deepak Kalpoe raped, killed, and burried Natalee Holloway.
The Diario has been reporting on this document for some time but have been accused by competing local media for making it up. So, today they published verbatim what they say is the document.
Jossy Manur assures us that this is a direct copy of the police document, obtained through one of his sources. NBC News has NOT been able to independently varify this.
Translation of Declartion from Dutch:
The suspect J.A.P. (Joran) van der Sloot walked with us (the police) a little bit further on and he declared to have suspicions that the suspect D. Kalpoe did bury the girl there somewhere.
According to the suspect J.A.P. van der Sloot, the suspect D. Kalpoe had returned to the girl after having left her sleeping on the beach.
To our question to the suspect J.A.P. van der Sloot what he thought had happened between the girl Natalee Holloway and the suspect D. Kalpoe, he declared that he thought that the suspect D. Kalpoe raped and killed the girl.
Thus written by us, under oath made under our testimony, closed and signed in Oranjestad on June 13th, 2005.
The signature is obscured.
Posted by: Dan | August 12, 2005 03:59 PM
Then that means CC owns a cell rental business, not a sail rental business?
So that "one of our phones" would be a cell phone rented by CC to someone on Aruba?
Good afternoon all!
Were you able to watch the video? Currently I'm on a lousy dial-up connection and unable to download. Can you confirm the content, please?
yes and yes ....by the way Charles Croes is a hearthrob for some of the women freepers here....
No, I missed it. People on SM are saying that Jug said they know where the gardner is. Can't figure out who the other witness is. Maybe jossy will turn up later and say something. :)
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