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Gaza Disengagement/Expulsion Live Thread
FR live thread | 7/14/2005 | none

Posted on 08/14/2005 1:25:44 PM PDT by adam_az

Edited on 08/14/2005 1:28:27 PM PDT by Sidebar Moderator. [history]

Live thread for posting breaking news about the Gaza Explulsion which is set to begin within the hour...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Foreign Affairs; Israel
KEYWORDS: appeasement; arabs; deportation; disengagement; gaza; gushkatif; israel; judenrein; pullout; retreat; squatterremoval; suicide; terrorismpays
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'We believe and we are staying'



More than a quarter million people attended a massive prayer rally at the Western Wall Wednesday to beg their Heavenly Father to have mercy and annul the expulsion decree.


1 posted on 08/14/2005 1:25:44 PM PDT by adam_az
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To: Admin Moderator

oops, somehow the text "the Western Wall Wednesday to beg their Heavenly Father to have mercy and annul the expulsion decree." snuck into the post - please remove!


2 posted on 08/14/2005 1:26:30 PM PDT by adam_az (It's the border, stupid!)
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To: adam_az

And when does the pullout from Jerusalem start?


3 posted on 08/14/2005 1:27:48 PM PDT by OpusatFR (Try permaculture and get back to the Founders intent. Mr. Jefferson lives!)
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To: adam_az

"Explulsion", eh?


4 posted on 08/14/2005 1:28:43 PM PDT by Diddle E. Squat
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To: Diddle E. Squat

"Explulsion", eh?"

If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck...

A number of Israelis have said they would stay if they could live under Palestinian rule. The Palestinians didn't reject them... Sharon did.

What else would you call it?


5 posted on 08/14/2005 1:30:23 PM PDT by adam_az (It's the border, stupid!)
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Yehuda; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; ...
If you'd like to be on this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.

..........................................

6 posted on 08/14/2005 1:34:12 PM PDT by SJackson (America...thru dissent and protest lost the ability to mobilize a will to win, Col Bui Tin, PAVN)
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To: adam_az

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1123986008489

Halutz: 5,000 activists infiltrated Gaza

Just hours before Israel was set to go ahead with the much-anticipated Gaza withdrawal, IDF Chief of Staff Lt.Gen. Dan Halutz calmly addressed hundreds of police and army officers Sunday afternoon, stressing that, "We're not going out to battle; There's no battle here and no war."

Halutz was speaking at the Negev kibbutz of Ein Hashlosha, not far from the Gaza Strip to an audience of about 150 battalion and brigade commanders and their police counterparts, as well as reporters and TV cameras.

At midnight Sunday night, police and army forces are shutting down the Gaza Strip completely, rendering presence in the area illegal for all Israelis. Operation "Lend a Hand" is set to be launched on Monday morning, when disengagement forces will go door to door throughout settlements slated for evacuation informing families that they have two days to leave, and offering help to pack and move.

In his speech, Halutz highlighted the problems that might arise in the operation and gave guidelines for their resolution. "You'll be required to look settlers in the eyes, feel their pain, shed a tear and show them you love them," he told the commanders.

"On Tuesday, at the end of the operation, you'll be required to transfer to a different state of mind from a state of sensitivity to one of determination."

Halutz spoke in a subdued tone to a crowd gathered under a shaded tent between two eucalyptus trees. His talk was held by the IDF Spokesperson's Office, and was open to the media.

"I expect commanders to lead the forces, to be at their forefront, to display your leadership qualities and to be there to douse water under the hot southern sun.

"Success is the implementation of this mission without casualties," Halutz said.

According to IDF estimates, at least 5,000 right-wing activists have succeeded in infiltrating into Gush Katif in recent weeks, hoping to block the disengagement.

At this point the infiltrators - most of whom are teenagers - do not pose a threat, Halutz said. He also noted that leaders of the Council of Jewish Communities in Judea, Samaria and the Gaza Strip (Yesha) were expected to keep them under control and discourage confrontations between the activists and disengagement forces.

When asked about settlers' plans to shut soldiers out of their communities on Monday when forces come by to issue evacuation order and offer relocation help, Halutz responded: "We are offering our hand, not forcing it. Those who want to take our hand and receive our assistance are welcome to do so."

He once again stressed that the order in which the settlements will be evacuated will be decided on Tuesday night and not any sooner, and four West Bank settlements would not be evacuated until the Gaza withdrawal was complete. The evaluation of certain settlements as "problematic" would not influence the sequence of their evacuation, Halutz noted, but estimated that 50 percent of settlers would leave voluntarily by the deadline date of August 17. After August 17, settlers will be forcefully removed and will get a cut in their compensation.

As for Palestinian violence during the withdrawal, Halutz said: "We hope that the Palestinian Authority will carry out what they have promised." Palestinian forces were expected to complete deployment around the strip by Monday.

Recent statements by Hamas declaring attacks against Israel would continue even after withdrawal are nothing new, Halutz said, noting that such threats have been voiced nearly daily over past year.

Referring to the opinions and emotions of the soldiers themselves, Halutz said, "It is no secret that in the past month a deep public disagreement has arisen.

"This disagreement has entered the IDF. It threatened and still threatens to create fractures in our hierarchy. The army is the face of the nation. We will have to fix some fractures that opened. Not to hide them, but to fix them," he emphasized.


7 posted on 08/14/2005 1:35:36 PM PDT by adam_az (It's the border, stupid!)
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To: adam_az

Though apparently some do(!), I wouldn't call it an "Explusion" either.


8 posted on 08/14/2005 1:35:51 PM PDT by Diddle E. Squat
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To: adam_az

PA begins pullout deployment

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1123986006014

Thousands of Palestinian Authority policemen, waving flags and brandishing AK-47 rifles, were deployed near Gaza Strip settlements on Sunday as part of a major security operation designed to prevent Palestinian militants from disrupting the disengagement.

It was the first time Palestinian security forces had been allowed to come so close to the settlements.

PA security officials said 15,000 policemen had been recruited for the mission – the largest force amassed since the PA was established more than a decade ago. The policemen will create a protective barrier around the settlements to prevent Palestinians from rushing toward them during and after the disengagement, the officials said.

"We are here to protect our people," said Maj. Hussein Abu Adrah of the PA's National Security Force. "We won't allow anyone to come near the settlements because the Israeli army is still there. We are hoping that the withdrawal will be conducted in a smooth manner."

He said the forces would remain at least 300 meters away from the settlements until the withdrawal is complete. The PA forces would then enter the settlements to check for land mines or other kinds of explosives, he added.

PA Interior Ministry spokesman Tawkif Abu Khoussa urged Palestinians to stay away from the settlements, noting that the IDF and many settlers were still in the Gaza Strip. Abu Khousa's appeal came after Al Jazeera and other Arab satellite stations reporting live from the Kissufim checkpoint claimed that the settlers and the IDF had begun the pullout.

Dozens of Egyptian security officers are in the Gaza Strip to help the PA security forces impose law and order

(excerpt)


9 posted on 08/14/2005 1:37:10 PM PDT by adam_az (It's the border, stupid!)
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To: 1st-P-In-The-Pod; A Jovial Cad; A_Conservative_in_Cambridge; adam_az; af_vet_rr; agrace; ahayes; ...
FRmail me to be added or removed from this Judaic/pro-Israel/Russian Jewry ping list.

Warning! This is a high-volume ping list.

10 posted on 08/14/2005 1:37:15 PM PDT by Alouette (My son joined the IDF to protect Jews, not Ariel Sharon.)
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To: adam_az

Those who give up land for peace shall ultimately have neither.


11 posted on 08/14/2005 1:38:54 PM PDT by Prime Choice (E=mc^3. Don't drink and derive.)
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bttt


12 posted on 08/14/2005 1:39:56 PM PDT by Dark Skies (The storm is coming!)
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To: SJackson

Israel is in my thoughts and prayers today. my best friend from work is there on vacation with his wife and 9 yo son, just in time for this.


13 posted on 08/14/2005 1:41:53 PM PDT by xsmommy
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To: adam_az
Why do you want to remove the photo caption?

That's what they did - they got together en masse and cried out to God.

The Wall now -

Live still shots

Streaming video link

14 posted on 08/14/2005 1:43:08 PM PDT by agrace (Where were you when I founded the earth? Tell me if you know so much. Job 38:4)
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To: adam_az
What else would you call it?

I like the honesty of calling it the Expulsion Plan. But then, the Deportation Plan sounds correct also. Aw, heck let us call it for what it really is:

The Sharon/Peres RETREAT PLAN!

15 posted on 08/14/2005 1:45:31 PM PDT by Reborn
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To: Reborn

How about the Beilin Plan?

Or the Mitzna plan?

This is EXACTLY what Sharon campaigned against in the last election.

I am utterly ashamed of him doing this... there is no going back once they are out.


16 posted on 08/14/2005 1:47:56 PM PDT by adam_az (It's the border, stupid!)
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To: adam_az
According to IDF estimates, at least 5,000 right-wing activists have succeeded in infiltrating into Gush Katif in recent weeks, hoping to block the disengagement.
Hopefully they get treated like we'd treat MoveOn crazies who infiltrate a military base to try to block a deployment to Iraq.

-Eric

17 posted on 08/14/2005 1:50:46 PM PDT by E Rocc (If we're all God's Children, what does that say about marriage?)
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To: agrace
It's Tisha B'Av today.
18 posted on 08/14/2005 1:52:44 PM PDT by Alouette (My son joined the IDF to protect Jews, not Ariel Sharon.)
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To: adam_az

I can't believe this is even happening. It's like a bad dream.
It could also be the most outstanding example of political suicide ever. Sharon's support is, where? What am I missing? How could he even propose this and not be hauled away in a straitjacket?


19 posted on 08/14/2005 1:54:46 PM PDT by Graymatter
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To: adam_az
Hamas Vows to Continue Fight After Gaza Pullout
20 posted on 08/14/2005 1:55:08 PM PDT by Types_with_Fist (I'm on FReep so often that when I read an article at another site I scroll down for the comments.)
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To: E Rocc

" Hopefully they get treated like we'd treat MoveOn crazies who infiltrate a military base to try to block a deployment to Iraq."

Care to elaborate on that comparison?


21 posted on 08/14/2005 1:55:17 PM PDT by adam_az (It's the border, stupid!)
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To: Reborn
Aaron Klein and Mr. Batchelor were saying this was going to turn into a nasty seige. I was listening to A7 earlier and there are increasing numbers of IDF AWOL's there who don't wanna expel their fellow Jews, but fear an attack by the Palis so they are heading to Gaza to help the Settlers. Don't know how many. Also, don't forget that Druze General who let the busload of Americans into Gaza. He told those folks that the Druze soldiers want NO part of this mess.

I wonder how many soldiers are going to be able to do this when it comes down to crunch time? Also, I wonder how the terrorists will be able to keep their ever-bloody hands off of their Qassams during this time? I think they may try to hold off at first, but IF too many soldiers say that can't do it, or if it isn't going fast enough for the terrorists, then the bullets may begin to fly.

*******************************************************

More Elite IDF Combat Soldiers Refuse Expulsion Orders
21:29 Aug 14, '05 / 9 Av 5765

(IsraelNN.com) Two IDF soldiers in the Palsar Givati elite combat unit refused to take part in the Disengagement Plan Sunday.

One of the soldiers decided not to report to his base Sunday morning so that he could not be pressured to take part. His friend, Pinchas Jacobson, the son of the head of the Sha'alvim Yeshiva, reported to the base after informing his commanders that he would not lend a hand to the expulsion. Jacobson is now being taken to a military court.

During the protest at Kfar Maimon, three Palsar Givati soldiers refused to take part in blockading the protesters, but their commander chose to look the other way and not address the refusal.

The Lev Yehudi ("Jewish Heart") hot line, which helps advise soldiers on how to go about refusing expulsion orders, has reported a sharp spike in inquiries with the onset of the Tisha B'Av fast.

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/news.php3?id=87711

22 posted on 08/14/2005 1:55:52 PM PDT by Reborn
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To: adam_az

To Israelis: Bush will like you even more when you start selling bullets to the Palestinians.


23 posted on 08/14/2005 1:56:02 PM PDT by TomGuy
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To: OpusatFR

When the Arabs will leave Jerusalem?
Pretty soon, I hope.


24 posted on 08/14/2005 1:57:23 PM PDT by Marguerite (When I'm good, I am very, very good. But! When I'm bad, I'm even better)
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To: agrace

they got together en masse and cried out to God.

G-d will answer their cries, although perhaps not in
the way they expect.


25 posted on 08/14/2005 1:58:02 PM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: Alouette

"It's Tisha B'Av today."

Yes, a bitter irony.

It's odd that they PICKED today as the day.


26 posted on 08/14/2005 1:58:12 PM PDT by adam_az (It's the border, stupid!)
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To: Prime Choice

This isn't land for peace. No one on the other side is offering peace.

This is not disengagement. Israel and the barbarians are still intertwined.

This is delusion. This is surrender.

This is a win for terror.

This is a preview of the US in Iraq.

This is where you can start counting down to a war- in one year or ten- that will be devastating to all.


27 posted on 08/14/2005 1:58:23 PM PDT by Sabramerican (Islam is to Peace as Rape is to Love)
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To: Prime Choice

This isn't land for peace. No one on the other side is offering peace.

This is not disengagement. Israel and the barbarians are still intertwined.

This is delusion. This is surrender.

This is a win for terror.

This is a preview of the US in Iraq.

This is where you can start counting down to a war- in one year or ten- that will be devastating to all.


28 posted on 08/14/2005 1:58:30 PM PDT by Sabramerican (Islam is to Peace as Rape is to Love)
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To: Alouette

I know. Makes it all the more unbelievable that the powers that be picked tonight to officially start the expulsion.


29 posted on 08/14/2005 1:58:30 PM PDT by agrace (Where were you when I founded the earth? Tell me if you know so much. Job 38:4)
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To: adam_az
I am utterly ashamed of him doing this... there is no going back once they are out.

That's what Klein and Batchelor said the other night. They said IRAN would go in there via 'local favorite terrorist group' and once in, Israel wouldn't be able to get them out without the whole thing blowing up. I saw in the news that Lebanon's thugs are planning on moving into Gaza too. What a mess.

30 posted on 08/14/2005 2:00:12 PM PDT by Reborn
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To: adam_az

FNC showing pictures, finally...


31 posted on 08/14/2005 2:01:49 PM PDT by Peach
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To: adam_az

Haaretz News Flashes
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/ShTickers.html

23:37 Two IDF soldiers caught looting evacuated house in Gaza Strip settlement (Haaretz)
23:29 IDF, settlers clash in northern W. Bank; officer evacuated with broken hand (Haaretz)
23:20 Explosions near Ganei Tal believed to be mortar shells (Haaretz)
23:14 Two large explosions heard near Gush Katif settlement of Ganei Tal (Haaretz)
23:00 Jerusalem district commander allows Yesha to hold disputed rally (Israel Radio)
22:46 Thousands from opposition groups block Cairo streets to protest Mubarak (Reuters)
22:21 Shots fired at IDF troops near West Bank village of Shweike; no injuries reported (Itim)
22:14 Kfar Yam resident announces establishment of Jewish Authority in Gaza (Israel Radio)
21:41 Bag with mobile phone, wires, anti-pullout material found in J`lem bus stop (Haaretz)
21:29 Deputy PM Ehud Olmert: Netanyahu is not fit to be prime minister (Channel 1)
21:08 Police: Yesha protest near PM`s office possible only if traffic is not disrupted (Haaretz)
21:02 Syria and Lebanon discuss implementing bilateral energy agreement (DPA)
20:52 Sharon says pullout will not be delayed, `even by one day` (Israel Radio)
20:31 Anti-pullout legal forum to High Court: Cancel ban on entry into Gaza (Israel Radio)
20:10 Police refuse to authorize rally pullout foes planning outside PM`s office (Army Radio)
20:05 PM meets IDF Chief, Mofaz, Herzog, police chief for pullout consultations (Haaretz)
18:45 Iran calls for talks with EU on uranium enrichment, says won`t stop conversion (AP)
18:25 PM meets with team of 5 rabbis calling for the cancellation of pullout (Israel Radio)
17:55 Israel cuts off bus service to Gush Katif for first time in decades (AP)


32 posted on 08/14/2005 2:03:19 PM PDT by adam_az (It's the border, stupid!)
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To: adam_az

Kinda wierd that this is launched on the 9th of Av, no?


33 posted on 08/14/2005 2:03:38 PM PDT by cookcounty (Army Vet, Army Dad.)
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To: adam_az

Holding my breath over this. Prayers for all of Israel.


34 posted on 08/14/2005 2:03:58 PM PDT by hershey
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To: Sabramerican

"This is delusion. This is surrender.
This is a win for terror."

Let's not exaggerate. As much as I dislike the way it's done, Israel has no interest in the garbage dump called Gaza. Moving 8000 is no big deal, even if I sympathise with their ordeal.
Judea and Samaria is another story.


35 posted on 08/14/2005 2:05:20 PM PDT by Marguerite (When I'm good, I am very, very good. But! When I'm bad, I'm even better)
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To: Reborn
John Batchelor and his crew understand the enormous consequences of this pullout, as well as the unreported rumblings with Iran. I encourage others to listen to his great show on the net (WABC radio NY 10PM EDT) or on Satellite radio (9PM EDT), as I believe he's only on in NY, Boston, and DC stations.
36 posted on 08/14/2005 2:05:23 PM PDT by Shqipo (Doing what I can to turn Maine back to Red.)
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To: adam_az

After this, the pressure will be to yield the West Bank. Inch by inch, by inch....


37 posted on 08/14/2005 2:05:46 PM PDT by hershey
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To: Alouette

When exactly did Tisha B'Av begin? Was it at sundown tonight in Israel?


38 posted on 08/14/2005 2:06:13 PM PDT by Hischild
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To: Diddle E. Squat

"Though apparently some do(!), I wouldn't call it an "Explusion" either."

And right you are. An expulsion it is not. Their stay on Gaza and the West Bank was a temporary stay since it never was their lands. A better way of putting it would be a "transfer of population" or an even better one, "rectification of frontiers."


39 posted on 08/14/2005 2:07:03 PM PDT by TAquinas (Demographics has consequences.)
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To: adam_az

Should be titled: "Giving in to terrorism."


40 posted on 08/14/2005 2:07:08 PM PDT by Excuse_My_Bellicosity ("A litany of complaints is not a plan." -- G.W. Bush, regarding Sen. Kerry's lack of vision)
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To: Hischild

Tisha B'Av began last night as Sabbath ended.


41 posted on 08/14/2005 2:07:19 PM PDT by Alouette (My son joined the IDF to protect Jews, not Ariel Sharon.)
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To: adam_az
Arutz Sheva news ticker
23:54 Aug-14-05
Kfar Darom Residents Hang Signs on Doors: "We Will Never Move From Here!"
22:37 Aug-14-05
Northern Samaria to be Blockaded and Sealed Midnight Sunday
22:11 Aug-14-05
Two Firebombs Hurled at Israeli Vehicle in Gush Etzion, No Injuries
21:57 Aug-14-05
Phony Bomb With Anti-Expulsion Notes Found in Jerusalem
21:40 Aug-14-05
Supreme Court Rejects Residents' Petition Against Use of Cages in Expulsion
21:29 Aug-14-05
More Elite IDF Combat Soldiers Refuse Expulsion Orders
21:01 Aug-14-05
Police Refuse to Authorize Protest Outside PM's Office, But Will Not Act to Prevent It
20:49 Aug-14-05
IDF Chief of Staff: At Least 5,000 Activists Have Made it Into Gush Katif

42 posted on 08/14/2005 2:07:19 PM PDT by adam_az (It's the border, stupid!)
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To: hershey

Hopefully.


43 posted on 08/14/2005 2:08:20 PM PDT by TAquinas (Demographics has consequences.)
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To: Hischild

This is so pathetic......Arabs live in Israel and don't have to leave(or get blown up by bombers)...


44 posted on 08/14/2005 2:08:37 PM PDT by janetjanet998
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To: Hischild

Tisha B'Av began on Saturday night. The expulsion is starting at midnight in Israel on the day after the 9th of the month of Av.


45 posted on 08/14/2005 2:09:18 PM PDT by bvw
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To: Prime Choice

"Those who give up land for peace shall have neither"

IMHO, the pullout from Gaza has given terrorists around the world the increased motivation that has resulted in the increase in the number and frequency of homicide attacks in recent weeks, in both Europe and Asia.

Today Gaza, tomorrow Jerusalem, next week New York.

I just do NOT get it.


46 posted on 08/14/2005 2:09:47 PM PDT by HonestConservative (Bless our Servicemen!)
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To: Alouette

So technically they launched this the day after Tisha B'Av, is that right? (Not that it makes it any better - just trying to nail down the timing. I consider these things very significant.) Thanks for your patience with my ignorance!


47 posted on 08/14/2005 2:09:53 PM PDT by Hischild
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To: adam_az
Anyone good with maps please post 'em! :-)

***************************
Northern Samaria to be Blockaded and Sealed Midnight Sunday
22:37 Aug 14, '05 / 9 Av 5765

(IsraelNN.com) IDF Central Commander Yair Naveh instructed the IDF to forbid the entrance of Israeli non-residents to northern Samaria starting Monday.

Beginning at 12:01 AM, northern Samaria will be hermetically sealed and only exit from the region will be allowed.

Residents are calling upon activists to make their way toward the communities of Homesh and Sa-Nur before the blockade is placed, although a previous IDF attempt to set up a checkpoint in the region was thwarted by determined residents.

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/news.php3?id=87715

*******************************************************************

Kfar Darom Residents Hang Signs on Doors: "We Will Never Move From Here!"
23:54 Aug 14, '05 / 9 Av 5765

(IsraelNN.com) Residents of the Gaza community of Kfar Darom, first settled 60 years ago, hanged signs on their doors Sunday declaring their determination to stay where they are.

"Soldier/Officer, stop," the signs read. "The moment you knock on this door you will become a direct part of the most dreadful crime in the generations of the nation of Israel. We will not be expelled from our homes. We Will Never Move From Here!"

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/news.php3?id=87716

48 posted on 08/14/2005 2:10:02 PM PDT by Reborn
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To: agrace

En masse?

All I see in that picture is a few hundred people at best.


49 posted on 08/14/2005 2:10:07 PM PDT by TAquinas (Demographics has consequences.)
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To: adam_az
within the hour?

CNN says forced withdrawal begins on Wednesday. FOX reporter says one Israli has already torched his house and there are fears that many will commit suicide.

50 posted on 08/14/2005 2:10:53 PM PDT by Carolinamom (Life is a journey, not a destination.)
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