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6 Million Vietnam Veterans will defend this generation and restore their own honor
Self | 8/25/05 | Stephen Jelinek

Posted on 08/25/2005 12:29:15 PM PDT by troop_defender

Yes, we have their play book. Over 6 million Veterans served in Vietnam 58,000 of the names are on the black wall in D.C. Now is the time to restore the honor of the 6 million by correcting the wrongful depictions of our Vietnam Veterans. This will happen as we rally in defense of this generation of troops. Then we will go after the educrats who have perpetuated the 1971 Kerry lie. We will find all the text books that wrongfully depict our Vietnam hero's and replace them with the correct accounting of what happened. And then we will go after Hollywood that perpetuated the lie a couple dozen times one movie at a time. We will leave Mel Gibson alone because he was the only producer to get the story right with "We were Soldiers".

Yes we will defend the honor of this generation of troops while restoring the honor of our Vietnam era troops. And when we have met these objectives we will have one big welcome home party for this generation of troops and our Vietnam era troops.

God Bless all those who have ever worn the uniform of the United States Military. TD


TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: americangigolo; americantraitor; depp; ditheringidiot; gigolo; greatlurch; hasbeensflock2gether; hollywood; huntersthompson; ichabodcrane; kerry; lurch; lyingtraitor; terayzasboytoy; teresaspoodle; troops; vietnam; vietnamveterans; weweresoldiers
I think a party for our Vietnam Veterans is in order. Perhaps a place like Soldier Field would be appropriate.
1 posted on 08/25/2005 12:29:17 PM PDT by troop_defender
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To: troop_defender

Count me in.


2 posted on 08/25/2005 12:32:08 PM PDT by caisson71
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To: troop_defender
Over 6 million Veterans served in Vietnam.

I believe it was less than half that number.

3 posted on 08/25/2005 12:33:27 PM PDT by Mike Bates (Irish Alzheimer's victim: I only remember the grudges.)
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To: troop_defender
God Bless all those who have ever worn the uniform of the United States Military

There are many who have utterly discraced the uniform, Kerry being one of them.

4 posted on 08/25/2005 12:33:52 PM PDT by frogjerk
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To: troop_defender

Awesome. Blessings to you and for all our troops!


5 posted on 08/25/2005 12:35:33 PM PDT by jer33 3
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To: troop_defender
It has become my passion to keep this generation of troops from experiencing the same mistreatments of my Vietnam era older brothers. Favorite Movie "We Were Soldiers"....from troop_defender profile

Although I have never served, it has become my passion as well. I will not sit silent, as many did in the 60's and 70's, as our Troops are being denigrated or put in harms way by the ranting of the loons among us. I saw what it did to those who experienced such; one should never have to hide the fact, or not be proud, of wearing our countries flag on their uniform.

Thank you for serving...it is the least I owe to you, and all the others, who have kept this country safe...
6 posted on 08/25/2005 12:40:04 PM PDT by PigRigger (Send donations to http://www.AdoptAPlatoon.org)
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To: troop_defender

Right on! (As we said in the 60's.)


7 posted on 08/25/2005 12:40:10 PM PDT by Ciexyz (Let us always remember, the Lord is in control.)
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To: troop_defender

um....according to DOD stats, 2,709,965 served "in-country".


8 posted on 08/25/2005 12:41:19 PM PDT by stylin19a (In golf, some are long, I'm "Lama Long")
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To: Ciexyz

SLAP! (forehead) is was Right ON? not Right ARM ?
I suppose you're going to tell me it was "FAR out" ? not "FARM out" ?


9 posted on 08/25/2005 12:43:22 PM PDT by stylin19a (In golf, some are long, I'm "Lama Long")
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To: troop_defender

B.G. Burkett's "Stolen Valor" doesn't receive enough attention any more.

It debunks most of the so-called "conventional wisdom" about Vietnam-era veterans in a highly professional manner.


10 posted on 08/25/2005 12:44:35 PM PDT by George Smiley (This tagline deliberately targeted journalists.)
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To: troop_defender

God Bless all Veterans, but Korean & Vietnam Vets deserve not only his blessing , but also God's pat on the back.


11 posted on 08/25/2005 12:44:58 PM PDT by PatriotCJC
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To: troop_defender

You can count this son of the South in.
25th Inf Div '67-69


12 posted on 08/25/2005 12:45:18 PM PDT by jeffDavis1861
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To: troop_defender

Come to DC on September 11 to remember 9-11-01 or 24 September to counter A.N.S.W.E.R. You can party on then brother.


13 posted on 08/25/2005 12:45:25 PM PDT by Jimmy Valentine's brother ( We need a few more Marines like Lt. Gen. James Mattis)
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To: Mike Bates

Yes you are correct it was 3 million I do not know how I got the number 6 stuck in my brain. How do you make a correction?

TD


14 posted on 08/25/2005 12:46:46 PM PDT by troop_defender (Defender of those in harms way keeping us out of harms way.)
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To: stylin19a

um....according to DOD stats, 2,709,965 served "in-country".

and one of those is my very significant other.


15 posted on 08/25/2005 12:47:04 PM PDT by maxter
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To: frogjerk

Yes, I should have used a qualifier.

TD


16 posted on 08/25/2005 12:50:24 PM PDT by troop_defender (Defender of those in harms way keeping us out of harms way.)
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To: troop_defender



17 posted on 08/25/2005 12:52:47 PM PDT by Zacs Mom (Proud wife of a Marine! ... and purveyor of "rampant, unedited dialogue")
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To: troop_defender

This Leatherneck would like to punt the leftist scum, who disgraced themselves and this country, by their treatment of ALL Vets, especially VNVs, onto the sunny shores of commie Cuba. Right where the bastards belong.

VNV's, Welcome Home!


18 posted on 08/25/2005 12:54:29 PM PDT by highlymotivated (If American ever falls, a STINKING LIBERAL will be behind it.)
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To: troop_defender

HOORAH!


19 posted on 08/25/2005 12:55:17 PM PDT by Quinotto (On matters of style swim with the current,on matters of principle stand like a rock-Thomas Jefferson)
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To: stylin19a

"SLAP! (forehead) is was Right ON? not Right ARM ?
I suppose you're going to tell me it was "FAR out" ? not "FARM out" ?"

Outta State!! Power to the peep hole!

Count me in!! (USMC 0811 '69-'71)


20 posted on 08/25/2005 12:57:16 PM PDT by Howie66 ("America will never seek a permission slip to defend the security of our people.")
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To: troop_defender

Much like the Swifties the Vietnam vets might be something the MSM has not counted on with all of this Sheehan stupidity. I get the feeling they are just hovering below the radar right now but are getting ready to heard.


21 posted on 08/25/2005 12:58:01 PM PDT by sydbas
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To: troop_defender; Admin Moderator

Correction needed. See post 14, please.


22 posted on 08/25/2005 12:59:34 PM PDT by I'm ALL Right! (WWW.TEACH-YOUR-KIDS.COM)
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To: Mike Bates
You are correct - more likely 6 million served in the military as a whole during the Viet Nam war.
23 posted on 08/25/2005 1:03:49 PM PDT by Apercu ("Res ipsa loquitor")
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To: maxter
"....according to DOD stats, 2,709,965 served "in-country".

Hell, there were at least that many in front of me in line at the Conex-PX when they got in a shipment of Olympia!

24 posted on 08/25/2005 1:11:19 PM PDT by Snickersnee (Where are we going? And what's with this handbasket?)
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To: troop_defender
Why limit the party to Vietnam Veterans? Why not all veterans show the support to our troops.

I was asked what the "Support our Troops" stickers meant. This guy was a liberal veteran who just could not get the hang of Patriotism. Why not have a million veteran march to support the troops?
25 posted on 08/25/2005 1:12:10 PM PDT by mountainlyons
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To: Apercu

If memory serves correctly, there were about nine million Vietnam era vets. Most of us are still around.


26 posted on 08/25/2005 1:26:06 PM PDT by Mike Bates (Irish Alzheimer's victim: I only remember the grudges.)
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To: highlymotivated

I attended the "Vietnam and the Iraq War" presentation given at the University of Chicago Law School by Professor Geoffrey Stone 20 January 2005. As a veteran of the Vietnam War from August of 1969 to January of 1971, serving as an infantry squad leader in a mechanized infantry company, and with another unit as a tank commander on an M48A3 tank; I was keenly interested in the form that the lecture might take. After a cursory reading of Professor Stone's curriculum vitae, I suspected that Professor Stone's take on the South East Asian conflict might indicate a general disapproval of the United States war effort. My suspicions were proven correct. The lecture was an attempt to paint the American war effort in Vietnam as misguided at best and an imperialistic effort to establish SE Asian capitalistic hegemony at worst. The antiwar left was portrayed as being noble and idealistic rather than populated by a hard core that actively hoped and worked for a US defeat, the US government as destructive of basic civil liberties in its attempt to monitor their activities, and the North Vietnamese and Vietcong as nationalists who wished to preserve their unique culture against an imperialistic onslaught. He described the South Vietnamese government in terms that were heedless of the South Vietnamese government’s struggle to survive a relentlessly ruthless Communist assault while he stated the South Vietnamese government was engaged in an unwarranted assault on human rights. He neglected to mention ANY of the numerous genocidal atrocities of the Vietcong (VC) and North Vietnamese Army (NVA). He described the Tet Offensive as a surprise for the United States in which 1100 American soldiers died and 2300 ARVN soldiers, and not much more about it.

I challenged Professor Stone on the following. The reason that the United States opposed nationwide elections that were to be held in accordance with the 1954 Geneva accords was due to the murder and intimidation campaigns carried out by Ho Chi Minh. This fact is in Professor R. J. Runnel's book Death by Government, in which he cites a low estimate of 15,000 and a high figure of 500,000 people in the “murder by quota” campaign directed by the North Vietnamese Communist Party Politburo that would have made the election a corrupt mockery. This campaign stipulated that 5% of the people living in each village and hamlet had to be liquidated, preferably those identified as members of the "ruling class." All told says Runnel, between 1953 and 1956 it is likely that the Communists killed 195,000 to 865,000 North Vietnamese. These were non combatant men, women, and children, and hardly represent evidence of the moral high ground claimed by many in the antiwar movement. In 1956, high Communist official Nguyen Manh Tuong admitted that "while destroying the landowning class, we condemned numberless old people and children to a horrible death." The same genocidal pattern became the Communists’ standard operating procedure in the South too. This was unequivocally demonstrated by the Hue Massacre, which the press did a great deal to downplay in its reporting of the Tet Offensive of 1968.
I pointed out that the National Liberation Front was the creation of the North Vietnamese Third Party Congress of September 1960, completely directed from North Vietnam. I pointed out that the Tet Offensive of 1968 was a disastrous military defeat for the North Vietnamese and that the VC were almost wiped out by the fighting, and that it took the NVA until 1971 to reestablish a presence using North Vietnamese troops as local guerrillas. I pointed out how the North Vietnam military senior commanders repeatedly said that they counted on the U.S. antiwar movement to give them the confidence to persevere in the face of their staggering battlefield personnel losses and defeats. I pointed out the antiwar movement prevented the feckless President Lyndon Johnson from granting General Westmoreland's request to enter Laos and cut the Ho Chi Minh Trail or end his policies of publicly announced gradualist escalation. The North Vietnamese knew cutting this trail would severely damage their ability to prosecute the war. Since the North Vietnamese could continue to use the Ho Chi Minh Trail lifeline, the war was needlessly prolonged for the U.S. and contributed significantly to the collapse of South Vietnam. The casualties sustained by the NVA and VC were horrendous, (1.5 million dead) and accorded well with Gen. Ngyuen Giap’s publicly professed disdain for the lives of individuals sacrificed for the greater cause of Communist victory. To this day the anti-war movement as a whole refuses to acknowledge its part in the deaths of millions in Laos and Cambodia and in the subsequent exodus from South East Asia as people fled Communism, nor the imprisonment of thousands in Communist re-education camps and gulags.

When he tried to say that United States should have known it could not put down a local popular insurgency, I pointed out that the final victorious North Vietnamese offensive was a multidivisional, combined arms effort lavishly equipped with Soviet and Chinese supplied tanks, self-propelled artillery, and aircraft. I pointed out to him that it was the type of blitzkrieg that Panzer General Heinz Guederian would have easily recognized. I said how I didn't recall seeing any barefoot, pajama-clad guerrillas jumping out of those tanks in the newsreel footage that showed them crashing through the gates of the presidential palace in Saigon. This spectacle was prompted by the pusillanimous withdrawal of Congressional support for the South Vietnamese government in the wake of the Watergate scandal, which particularly undermined this aspect of President Nixon’s foreign policy. It should be noted that a similar Communist offensive in the spring of 1972 was smashed, largely by US air power; with relatively few US ground troops in place.

There were legions of half-truths and omissions that this professor spoke to in his extremely biased lecture. When I asked him why he left out so much that was favorable to the American effort in Vietnam, he airily dismissed my argument as being just another perspective, but tellingly he did not disagree with the essential truth of what I said.

Professor Stone struck me as just another liberal masquerading as an enlightened academic.

He was totally unable to relate how the situation in Iraq is comparable to the situation in Vietnam, so I volunteered a comparison for him. A seditious near traitorous core of anti-war protesters is trying to undermine U.S. efforts there with half-truths, lies, and distortions. I said that in that respect, the war in Iraq and the war in Vietnam are very similar. A significant difference is that thus far the current anti-war movement has not succeeded in manifesting contempt for the American military on the part of the general U.S. public as it did in the Vietnam era.
When I was in Vietnam, I recall many discussions with my fellow soldiers about the course of the war in Vietnam and their feelings about it. Many, if not most felt that "We Gotta Get Outta this Place," to cite a popular song of the time by Eric Burden and the Animals, but for the most part they felt we should do it by fighting the war in a manner calculated to win it. I do not recall anyone ever saying that they felt the North Vietnamese could possibly defeat us on the battlefield, but to a man they were mystified by the U.S. Government’s refusal to fight in a manner that would assure military victory. Even though there was much resentment for the antiwar movement, and some (resentment) toward career professional soldiers, I never saw anyone who did not do his basic duty and many did FAR MORE THAN THAT as a soldier. Nineteen of my friends have their names on the Vietnam War Memorial Wall in Washington DC. They deserve to have the full truth told about the effort for which they gave their young lives. The U.S. public is not well served by half-truths and lies by omission about such a significant period in our history, particularly with their relevance toward our present fight in Iraq and Afghanistan.


27 posted on 08/25/2005 5:36:39 PM PDT by DMZFrank
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To: stylin19a
um....according to DOD stats, 2,709,965 served "in-country".

I don't have any numbers but there were also quite a few of us who were members of the Tonkin Gulf Yacht Club. (Unless you're only considering in-country troops to be Vietnam veterans, as some people do.)

28 posted on 08/25/2005 5:43:47 PM PDT by Bob
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To: PigRigger

Code Pink being at Walter Reed Military Hospital was digusting with their black coffins. Two Iraqi Veterans were beaten to a pulp by thugs in Seattle. Who needs this!


29 posted on 08/25/2005 5:55:46 PM PDT by Milligan (Damn the torpedos! Full speed ahead!)
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To: mountainlyons
I said it is time that "we" welcome our Vietnam Veterans home. The "we" would be the other Veterans like myself USAF 11/75 thru 11/79. And of course the non Veteran troop supporters would through the party in recognition of the Vietnam era troops.
30 posted on 08/25/2005 6:13:49 PM PDT by troop_defender (Defender of those in harms way keeping us out of harms way.)
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To: Howie66

whoa.....Semper Fi
USMC 1969-1971
Stumps 69-70
RVN 70-71
0811 (RVN as a grunt)


31 posted on 08/25/2005 7:29:46 PM PDT by stylin19a (In golf, some are long, I'm "Lama Long")
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To: Howie66

whoa.....Semper Fi
USMC 1969-1971
Stumps 69-70
RVN 70-71
0811 (RVN as a grunt)


32 posted on 08/25/2005 7:35:00 PM PDT by stylin19a (In golf, some are long, I'm "Lama Long")
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To: troop_defender

Count me in! Oooraahhhh...get some!

Jarhead


33 posted on 08/25/2005 7:37:48 PM PDT by JarheadFromFlorida
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To: DMZFrank

Thank you for your service and welcome home.


34 posted on 08/25/2005 7:39:57 PM PDT by EverOnward
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To: stylin19a

SEMPER FI, Mack!

I read your profile and know just all to well what you mean.

Thank You & Welcome Home, Brother!

We can't let that crap happen again! Not now, not ever!


35 posted on 08/25/2005 7:39:59 PM PDT by Howie66 ("America will never seek a permission slip to defend the security of our people.")
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To: Bob
oops...sorry, that's why the quotes...I should have been clearer...those numbers include the "theater".
The RVN Service Medal citation has a good definition of the theater.

http://www.expresscitations.com/Cert_Vietnam%20Service%20Medal%20Official.htm
36 posted on 08/25/2005 7:42:15 PM PDT by stylin19a (In golf, some are long, I'm "Lama Long")
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To: troop_defender

"I think a party for our Vietnam Veterans is in order. Perhaps a place like Soldier Field would be appropriate."

Speaking for myself, no parties are necessary......we just need to make certain that our "Vietnam Experience" never, ever be repeated.

As a side note....is there anyone beside myself that just wishes that these vomit encrusted turds, pukes and maggots in the MSM were REQUIRED to wear visible ID indicating that they are part of the "Press Corps"?


37 posted on 08/25/2005 7:45:33 PM PDT by Howie66 ("America will never seek a permission slip to defend the security of our people.")
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To: troop_defender

Thank you sir for you service. A celebration for Viet Nam vets, and all veterans through today is overdue. Please add me to an organizational ping.


38 posted on 08/25/2005 7:48:26 PM PDT by ARealMothersSonForever (We shall never forget the atrocity of 11 Sept.)
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To: DMZFrank
thanks for sharing that. IMO, the Anti-war movement was really an anti-draft movement. When the draft went to a lottery, then was ended....the ferocity of the anti-war movement died.

Interesting about Giap's disdain for human life. The siege of Khe Sahn was the lead-in to the 68 Tet offensive.

Giap wanted the Viet Cong to do most of the heavy fighting and suffer heavy losses. A severely weakened VC would no longer be a rival to NV.

It was estimated that 35,000 VC were killed at Khe Sahn, rendering them a mostly rag-tag bunch from then on. The NVA suffered 15,000 KIA.

And yet the media(Walter Cronkite) portrayed 68 Tet as such:

"The Vietcong did not win by a knockout, but neither did we. The referees of history may make it a draw. Another standoff may be coming in the big battles expected south of the Demilitarized Zone. Khesanh could well fall, with a terrible loss in American lives, prestige and morale, and this is a tragedy of our stubbornness there;...

But it is increasingly clear to this reporter that the only rational way out then will be to negotiate, not as victors, but as an honorable people who lived up to their pledge to defend democracy, and did the best they could.


Cronkite was wrong about Khe Sahn and 68 TET was a devastating loss for NV, but nobody knew it.
39 posted on 08/25/2005 8:21:55 PM PDT by stylin19a (In golf, some are long, I'm "Lama Long")
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To: Jimmy Valentine's brother

I would love to go. Is there anyone near Asheville NC heading that way I can hitch a ride with? Email me please


40 posted on 08/26/2005 5:47:29 AM PDT by millimah
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To: DMZFrank
Was "Professor Stone" reduced to sniveling excrement after your rebuttal?

Well done

Thanks for your continued service.
41 posted on 08/26/2005 8:03:23 AM PDT by Jimmy Valentine's brother ( We need a few more Marines like Lt. Gen. James Mattis)
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