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More women are asking for prenups
Sun Sentinel ^ | September 18, 2005 | Georgia East

Posted on 09/18/2005 3:05:48 AM PDT by Caipirabob

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To: DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet

It almost seems like this guy is saying such things just to get a rise out of everyone....or maybe he just is a total boob.


151 posted on 09/18/2005 11:33:04 AM PDT by Arpege92 ("I am happy, be it yourselves." - Pope John Paul II)
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To: najida; Age of Reason
But a woman has to follow a very narrow path to be worthy of above mentioned man?

~slaps najida~

Sorry, I had to do that, Najida.... you've bought into this A$$-clown's idea of his worth.

Those strong virgins are saving themselves because character and purity are important. They are not holding out for such a ~weak~ man.

152 posted on 09/18/2005 11:33:32 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/)
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To: TheSpottedOwl

Well,
I think baggage is fun.

I mean, you forget that old Samsonite down in the basement but one day you trip over it...so you open it up and WOW!

All these cool things you had forgotten about are there. Mebby they were bad when you packed them, but now they're just fun to pull out, laugh at and play with.

Sorta like Christmas in July.


153 posted on 09/18/2005 11:34:44 AM PDT by najida (So, I said to myself -Self, I really think shrimp heads in the flower pots as compost is a bit much!)
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To: HairOfTheDog

Hey!
That hurt! ;)

But I deserved it...

See my next post about just how inferior a woman has to be to be worthy of such snakebelly (and I was being really snarky, is there a snark emoticon?)


154 posted on 09/18/2005 11:37:01 AM PDT by najida (So, I said to myself -Self, I really think shrimp heads in the flower pots as compost is a bit much!)
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To: Capriole
Glad to hear it. You reasonable types tend to be quiet about your views, though.

That's because we are flabbergasted by what everyone else is writing (both male and female). It is so far from our perspective of life, love, virtue and marriage that we have no idea what to say in reply.
155 posted on 09/18/2005 11:41:02 AM PDT by fqued
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To: najida

Oh I wish it was like Christmas in July. No, this is the baggage that keeps on biting you in the ass.

OTOH, I did find a suitcase with all my pretty outfits when I was in pep squad. It was buried out in my folks garage. Some baggage is very cool : )


156 posted on 09/18/2005 11:44:17 AM PDT by TheSpottedOwl ("President Bush, start building that wall"!)
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To: HairOfTheDog
When two people get married, the Number One reason should be the other person. With a 23 year old single mother, the Number One reason could be easily be and very often is: ***"Now I have financial security for my child." ***"Now I can quit my job to stay home with my child." ***"I can't do this by myself any longer. I need help." ***"My child needs a father." The man is no longer a person but a child-raising tool..........Polybius

Those factors don't enter into any relationship as soon as children are born? Your simple and unencumbered young couple will soon also find that they are together because they both love and need each other. ..............HairOfTheDog

Exactly. The "young unencumbered couple" came together because they "LOVED EACH OTHER". "Each other" and "love" is what brought them together.........

.........Not the desire to have the financial ability to quit a job to stay home with an already existing child....Not a desire for the future financial security for an already existing child....Not a desire for help raising an already existing child.........

They came together because of "EACH OTHER".

Congratulations to the woman from your office. You never know, could be her husband is happy too.

Congratulations for declaring outright that she was bound and determined to marry a man ( who she had not even met yet!) within one year before she turned 30 and get pregnant a few months after that?

Congratulations for forcing the issue to fit her arbitrary timetable with a man she had just met over the Internet, who lived 100 miles away and who could only see her two days on weekends for a few months before she pressured him into giving her an engagement ring?

Congratulations for getting her stay-at-home Mom role within the totally arbitrary and rushed deadlines she set for herself and then not even bothering to mention her husband in phone conversation with her former co-workers?

Imagine how that courtship went:

Charlie: " I think I love you, Jane. But we have known each other only four months and it's too soon to get engaged. I think we should know each other better before we make a lifelong commitment."

Jane: "Sorry, Charlie. I have a one year self-imposed deadline to meet and that won't cut it. You just made me waste 4 months out of that year and now I only have 8 months left. You're outta here! Excuse, me, I have to call someone. Hello, Joe, this is Jane the one you asked out 3 months ago....Yeah, well guess what? My boyfriend and I just split up and I would love to go out with you to that place you told me about. Excuse me, for a moment.......So, Charlie? Why are you still here? I'm talking to my hopefully future husband here. Hit the road! "

That sure sounds like a "young couple that are together because they both love and need each other".

Oh, yeah. That sure sounds like True Love.

157 posted on 09/18/2005 11:45:44 AM PDT by Polybius
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To: Polybius
Any man who believes that once a woman has a child she can no longer honestly love a man, or be loved by one, because there is a child, should never get married. Whether the encumberance comes at the beginning, or interrupts them a few months later, is not the point.

RE your coworker: Imagine how that courtship went:

I imagine it was quite different than you assume.... Unless you think the man who fell in love with her was just a stupid victim, like you have assumed all men who suffer women. Don't make so many assumptions about the hearts of others. So she talked about the baby to former coworkers.... would you rather she talked about the great sex that made it happen?

I met my husband 'over the internet', right her on FReeRepublic as a sheer coincidence.

He lived 1400 miles away, and we only got to date in person a week before he decided to go home and pack. Of course, we knew each other quite well before we ever met. I assume this coworker of yours knows all about that. But you don't. ;~D

158 posted on 09/18/2005 11:57:53 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/)
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To: HairOfTheDog; najida
I guess once you have kids, whether you're married or not, you can no longer be a good companion and spouse for another person....

That depends on why the couple got married in the first place.

How did that old fashioned rhyme go?

"First comes love. Then comes marriage. Then comes the baby in the baby carriage."

.......it's all just about entrapment from there on out.

Sometimes it is, especially if the child was there before the marriage.

Preposterous.

Only "it's all just about this" or "it's always that" statements are preposterous.

The advice "Look very carefully before you jump" is not preposterous. It is common sense.

159 posted on 09/18/2005 12:03:28 PM PDT by Polybius
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To: MrNatural
This thread is going downhill too fast for me; think I'll go reread the " Woman in power is powerless when it comes to meeting men" thread. Much more interesting; full of posts by men and women really trying to understand the "other side's" reality. And make some sense out of what's happened to us all.
160 posted on 09/18/2005 12:03:29 PM PDT by MrNatural ("...You want the truth!?...")
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To: Caipirabob
I am a widow. I have 3 daughters and 8 grandchildren who will inherit. If I were to ever remarry, I would certainly have a pre-nup and would expect the person I marry to have one, as he would probably want one as well.. The reason I would have one is to protect my children's inheritance.

Also, I was about to marry a man who, it turned out later, was only interested in my money. He turned out to be a very skilled professional con artist. I had only been married to one man, for 33 years since I was 18, so I was very naive about such things. Thank heavens I realized I was about to make a big mistake!

Divorce is not the only reason to have a pre-nup. One could stay in a happy marriage until death. Then there might be problems with step-children and children of the deceased couple.
161 posted on 09/18/2005 12:03:47 PM PDT by Goodgirlinred ( GoodGirlInRed Four More Years!!!!!)
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To: spetznaz

You would not discuss such a serious subject over dinner. I would not even breach the subject until the man had asked me to marry him and I wanted to marry him.


162 posted on 09/18/2005 12:05:02 PM PDT by Goodgirlinred ( GoodGirlInRed Four More Years!!!!!)
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To: Polybius
The advice "Look very carefully before you jump" is not preposterous. It is common sense.

We agree. Look carefully to find out if the man who is calling drags his knuckles on the ground when he is comin' up the driveway. ;~D

163 posted on 09/18/2005 12:05:46 PM PDT by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/)
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To: Libloather
Not if she is the wealthy one at the time of the marriage. In this day and age, I don't think that it is unreasonable to have mutual prenups. That does not mean that the people don't truly love each other and plan on being married forever.
164 posted on 09/18/2005 12:09:47 PM PDT by Goodgirlinred ( GoodGirlInRed Four More Years!!!!!)
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To: Prophet in the wilderness

The same for women. This is not a feminist point of view, it is a realistic one. Many women have money or better jobs than the men when they marry. There are men who seek provisions for their lifestyles from their wives.


165 posted on 09/18/2005 12:12:50 PM PDT by Goodgirlinred ( GoodGirlInRed Four More Years!!!!!)
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To: Prophet in the wilderness

Amen. Gender is not restrictive in this matter.


166 posted on 09/18/2005 12:14:09 PM PDT by Goodgirlinred ( GoodGirlInRed Four More Years!!!!!)
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To: najida
Usually, good sarcasm is better without the emoticon. ;~D

And maddening as the most irritating people are on both sides of this issue, the troglodyte male ~created~ the need for feminism in the first place, way back when.... As soon as the last of the troglodytes die out, so will the inspiration to be a man-hating feminist, and everyone will be better off.
167 posted on 09/18/2005 12:14:42 PM PDT by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/)
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To: SouthernFreebird
In the first place ? Get your facts straight, the person I was talking about who said " I don't love him anymore " was not my mother, it was a woman from a couple I knew, and her husband never cheated on her, she just decided one day that she didn't love him anymore, but, she surely got have of everything he owns.
You make it sound like that it's ok for women to cheat on their husbands, but, Men are dogs and rats if they cheat on their wives. Just incredible.
I never said I think it was ok for my dad to cheat on my mom, I was just talking about her vindictiveness in how she treated him after wards, in when he gave the money to her that was ordered from the court.
He did his best to support us, but, the money seemed to never be there for us, in other words ? my mom misused the money.
Get your facts straight before you open your mouth in something you don't have any knowledge about, I was there, I know what happened, and you don't.
168 posted on 09/18/2005 12:17:19 PM PDT by Prophet in the wilderness (PSALM 53 : 1 The FOOL hath said in his heart , There is no GOD .)
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To: Polybius

I agree,
BOTH need to be careful before they jump.
Especially the one who has a child...

How many DBBF's kids(Death By Boyfriend) do we read about here in a week? And it could just as easily read DBGF too.

IMO, what is best for the child comes first. Period.


169 posted on 09/18/2005 12:18:10 PM PDT by najida (So, I said to myself -Self, I really think shrimp heads in the flower pots as compost is a bit much!)
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To: Prophet in the wilderness
I believe in the past the courts were protecting women whose husbands left them for younger women. The wives, never having worked outside the home or not since the children were born, should have some assistance while they develop the skills to support themselves.

Why are you all talking about feminism. That went by the wayside after the 60's, along with the flower children.
170 posted on 09/18/2005 12:18:25 PM PDT by Goodgirlinred ( GoodGirlInRed Four More Years!!!!!)
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To: Arpege92
" It works both ways in case you have forgotten. ......"
excuse me ? thats the VERY POINT I was trying to make here, it's just, you only want to hear , that YOU want to hear.
171 posted on 09/18/2005 12:20:54 PM PDT by Prophet in the wilderness (PSALM 53 : 1 The FOOL hath said in his heart , There is no GOD .)
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To: HairOfTheDog
Oh lord,
Can't you see it as a game show?
Troglodytes vs ManHaters, he he he...
Squaring off to see who can change diapers, chop wood, whine, bitch, moan and see who can subjugate the other the fastest.

They're two sides of the same coin aren't they?

I'd pay good money to see that.
172 posted on 09/18/2005 12:22:01 PM PDT by najida (So, I said to myself -Self, I really think shrimp heads in the flower pots as compost is a bit much!)
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To: Goodgirlinred
Feminism had it's best days during the 70's and 80's.
Feminism is diametrically opposed to God and God's word, and he rebellion against God.
173 posted on 09/18/2005 12:24:04 PM PDT by Prophet in the wilderness (PSALM 53 : 1 The FOOL hath said in his heart , There is no GOD .)
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To: najida
I'd pay good money to see that.

I'll bring the popcorn...

174 posted on 09/18/2005 12:24:47 PM PDT by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/)
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To: dakine
What do you mean by that ?
175 posted on 09/18/2005 12:25:32 PM PDT by Prophet in the wilderness (PSALM 53 : 1 The FOOL hath said in his heart , There is no GOD .)
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To: Prophet in the wilderness

Wrong again. I want to hear the truth, you want to hear the sound of your own voice. Big difference. Let's do one another a favor and ignore eachother before this gets out of hand.


176 posted on 09/18/2005 12:30:31 PM PDT by Arpege92 ("I am happy, be it yourselves." - Pope John Paul II)
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To: longtermmemmory

What are you talking about ?


177 posted on 09/18/2005 12:38:00 PM PDT by Prophet in the wilderness (PSALM 53 : 1 The FOOL hath said in his heart , There is no GOD .)
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To: Arpege92
So basically, you are saying that those women who cheat are justified, but, men who cheat are no good rats and dogs ?
178 posted on 09/18/2005 12:39:32 PM PDT by Prophet in the wilderness (PSALM 53 : 1 The FOOL hath said in his heart , There is no GOD .)
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To: HairOfTheDog
Any man who believes that once a woman has a child she can no longer honestly love a man, or be loved by one, because there is a child, should never get married.

That statement is a Strawman Argument of your own creation.

My original statement was that a young single man should consider at least five times why a woman without a child might not be a better choice for him than a single Mom who might be more interested in financial security considerations than in true love.

I imagine it was quite different than you assume.... Unless you think the man who fell in love with her was just a stupid victim, like you have assumed all men who suffer women.

There you go again. Another Strawmwn Argument.

If I advise caution under very specific circumstances, you claim that I think that all men who interact with women must be "stupid victims".

Any man that knowingly gets involved with a woman that has flat out said that she will be married within a year to a man that she has not even met yet is a "stupid victim".

I'm quite certain that that particular guy did not know that information as I doubt she ever discussed her self-imposed deadlines with him and she never brought him around work to meet the people who she bragged about her deadline too.

The guy was not "stupid". He was uninformed and, if he had been more cautious, he should have said, "What's the rush? Let's slow down and get to know each other better before we get married."

Don't make so many assumptions about the hearts of others. So she talked about the baby to former coworkers....

What assumptions?

It is a fact that she bragged that she would have that baby within a one year and a few months time period........now pay attention to this crucial point.......with a man she had not even met yet.

would you rather she talked about the great sex that made it happen?

Another Strawman Argument.

I would have rather if she had said how she was ready to settle down and start a family with a man that she truly loved. I would rather if she had said that she realized that finding such a man can take time but that she would give it as much time as was needed in order to be certain that it was True Love.

Instead, she focused on a self-imposed time deadline of marrying a man she had not even met yet within one year before she turned 30........And when she bragged about that, she had just turned 29!

I met my husband 'over the internet', right her on FReeRepublic as a sheer coincidence. He lived 1400 miles away, and we only got to date in person a week before he decided to go home and pack. Of course, we knew each other quite well before we ever met.

That is the point:

You knew each other well.

No arbitrary time deadlines were imposed by either one of you.

By the time you were married, it was true love.

The Internet part of it is a minor detail. Everybody has to meet somewhere.

There is a difference between meeting sombedody on the Internet and letting love develop as opposed to using the Internet as the most time-efficient way to meet people aand then rushing the relationship solely for the purpose of meeting a self-imposed one year dealine for meeting a total stranger and then marrying him in order to have children as soon as biologically possible after that.

179 posted on 09/18/2005 12:44:00 PM PDT by Polybius
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To: Goodgirlinred
I agree, if a woman makes more money than a man, she should also seek a prenup to protect her financial interest.
But, apart from that, society as a whole has declined were you can't trust no one on their word anymore, so thats why you need to seek legal and financial counsel when ever you are dealing with business deals, or any kind of finances in todays world.
180 posted on 09/18/2005 12:49:13 PM PDT by Prophet in the wilderness (PSALM 53 : 1 The FOOL hath said in his heart , There is no GOD .)
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To: Goodgirlinred
Not if she is the wealthy one at the time of the marriage. In this day and age, I don't think that it is unreasonable to have mutual prenups. That does not mean that the people don't truly love each other and plan on being married forever.

I think guys should keep their nups as long as they can. Once they're gone, they'll be doing the shopping, changing diapers, doing the laundry, dusting the fine china, cleaning the tub, and other assorted jobs.

Guys - HOLD ON TO YOUR NUPS - AND HOLD ON TIGHT!

181 posted on 09/18/2005 1:04:54 PM PDT by Libloather (Hillary, be a doll and give me back my FBI file...)
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To: Goodgirlinred
Also, I was about to marry a man who, it turned out later, was only interested in my money. He turned out to be a very skilled professional con artist. I had only been married to one man, for 33 years since I was 18, so I was very naive about such things. Thank heavens I realized I was about to make a big mistake!

Yikes! Thank God you found out before...

182 posted on 09/18/2005 1:13:43 PM PDT by Caipirabob (Democrats.. Socialists..Commies..Traitors...Who can tell the difference?)
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To: Prophet in the wilderness

Puttin' all your made up BS out here...that's what I mean...


183 posted on 09/18/2005 1:28:22 PM PDT by dakine
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To: Prophet in the wilderness

"So basically, you are saying that those women who cheat are justified, but, men who cheat are no good rats and dogs?"

Nope....that's just you pretending I said such a thing. Not once did I say that women who cheat are justified and men are dogs if they cheat.


184 posted on 09/18/2005 2:10:16 PM PDT by Arpege92 ("I am happy, be it yourselves." - Pope John Paul II)
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To: Vision

I'm quite, quite sure that nobody here is defending feminism or aggressive career women. We don't like female pit bulls any better than you do. The trouble is, Vision, that these days a young woman can't sit at home doing needlepoint until some suitable young man of good family comes a-courting. She has no choice but to get out into the world and support herself. And if she is intelligent, talented, and competent, chances are good that she will be offered one promotion after another through the years. If she doesn't find someone in college, she may find herself unmarried as she gets into her thirties. It seems that somehow a woman who had to support herself is automatically considered a bitch by some male Freepers, and we women are not clear on how it is that a woman who has the self-respect to support herself and do well at it is therefore a bitch. Because, honestly, we are criticized if we stay home and have children, too.


185 posted on 09/18/2005 2:39:48 PM PDT by Capriole (I don't have any problems that can't be solved by more chocolate or more ammunition.)
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To: Caipirabob

One never knows. People and circumstances change. If one partner has a lot more money than the other, a prenup is simply good planning, along with any other kind of planning.


186 posted on 09/18/2005 3:11:26 PM PDT by Torie
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To: jwalsh07

That's one of the advantages of marrying young and poor. :)


187 posted on 09/18/2005 3:12:18 PM PDT by Torie
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To: TheSpottedOwl

No idea how many marriages. The last I heard she had moved to New Orleans – on Bourbon Street. That was back in about 1974.


188 posted on 09/18/2005 3:15:43 PM PDT by R. Scott (Humanity i love you because when you're hard up you pawn your Intelligence to buy a drink.)
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To: HairOfTheDog

I don't agree with your conclusions of law. What becomes community property in community property state, is what is generated from your personal services after you are married. I don't know if that can be reversed by a prenuptial agreement.


189 posted on 09/18/2005 3:15:57 PM PDT by Torie
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To: Torie

Well, always best to actually ask a lawyer, but my understanding is that the more you mix it into the marriage, the more community it becomes :~D


190 posted on 09/18/2005 3:29:57 PM PDT by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/)
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To: Caipirabob
I remarried not too long ago. I did a prenup and it is very simple. If it is separate accounts/property, it stays with the given owner. Money earned separately or increased in value remains separate. If it is joint, 50/50.

I have a large amount of assets that I own and maybe over time, her name may get on them but the idea is to keep the division of assets simple.

On this subject, there are definite sides people take on this. There is no one in the middle. When my son gets married, I will advise him to do a prenup plus I will setup assets for him in such a way that his wife cannot get to them if he decides to skirt a prenup.
191 posted on 09/18/2005 3:35:05 PM PDT by CORedneck
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To: Junior
Exactly. When my wife and I were first married, neither of us had squat. Everything we've got now, we've gotten together.

Amen to that Junior.

192 posted on 09/18/2005 4:14:57 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: benjaminjjones; Torie
Ah, the good old days...

Yes indeedy. When my daughters were in their "stuck up" years I delighted in telling their friends, particularly their boy friends, how we lived in a slightly more upscale tent than the original for 6 months while raising some money to get better accomodations.

Supposedly I was "runing their life". LOL

193 posted on 09/18/2005 4:21:38 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: R. Scott

Bourbon Street? Good grief.


194 posted on 09/18/2005 4:35:27 PM PDT by TheSpottedOwl ("President Bush, start building that wall"!)
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To: Prophet in the wilderness



Back off puppy, I'm one of those independant b!tches that America is full of. I don't much care for a man to tell me when I can open my mouth and speak.


195 posted on 09/18/2005 4:37:35 PM PDT by SouthernFreebird
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To: Caipirabob

I agree- if I got married again and had anything (or if he did) I wouldn't fight signing a prenup. I never ever dreamed I'd get divorced but it was not just up to me. Sadly, the other person in the equation did not have the same feelings so I am divorced.


196 posted on 09/18/2005 4:41:01 PM PDT by lawgirl (Sure I believe in intelligent design. The best accident we've come up with is Mary in grilled cheese)
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To: TheSpottedOwl

That was a long time ago - but she (and I back then) did like fun.


197 posted on 09/18/2005 4:50:49 PM PDT by R. Scott (Humanity i love you because when you're hard up you pawn your Intelligence to buy a drink.)
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To: Arpege92
I guess you plan on being single for the rest of your life.

Why buy a cow when milk's free.

Anyway, this is long since past being a soceity where it's wise to get married.

As marriage is not something that happens between two people.

Marriage is something that happens between two people and society.

And modern society is a lousy partner for one's marriage.

198 posted on 09/18/2005 6:23:36 PM PDT by Age of Reason
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To: najida
'sides darlin, I think you just made our point better than we ever could've

I know you think you're being witty, but you're not.
199 posted on 09/18/2005 6:34:15 PM PDT by Vision (When Hillary Says She's Going To Put The Military On Our Borders...She Becomes Our Next President)
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To: Sally'sConcerns
Project much?

Nope
200 posted on 09/18/2005 6:36:26 PM PDT by Vision (When Hillary Says She's Going To Put The Military On Our Borders...She Becomes Our Next President)
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