The Failed War On Pot Users

San Francisco Chronicle ^ | 10/20/2005 | Debra J. Saunders

[cryptical]

IN 2004, law enforcement officials arrested 771,605 people for marijuana violations, according to federal statistics. Bruce Mirken of the Marijuana Policy Project was so alarmed he sent out a press release noting that there were more arrests for marijuana charges than all violent crimes combined. The number of arrests for possession alone was 684,319.

Said Mirken of the 771,605 statistic: "This is, in fact, an all-time record. This number of arrests is the equivalent of arresting every man, woman and child in San Francisco." Some 40 percent of Americans say they have used marijuana or hashish in their lifetime, and 34 percent of high-school seniors say they have used marijuana in the last year -- even though the last decade has seen a huge spike in marijuana arrests, according to federal research. When the number of marijuana arrests exceeds the population of some states, the country should be asking: Does it make sense to keep millions of otherwise-law-abiding citizens on the dark side of the law?

[cryptical]

If we just doubled the arrests and doubled the tax dollars spent, we can make a dent in the drug trade. Just because it's never worked before doesn't mean it won't work now.

[rhombus]

"Marijuana is a much more serious drug than most Americans realize. It's a more potent drug than it was in the past."

This is a pure BS talking point.

[proxy_user]

"This number of arrests is the equivalent of arresting every man, woman and child in San Francisco.

While this might appeal to some Freepers, I would suggest not giving them any more ideas...

[Bigh4u2]

"When the number of marijuana arrests exceeds the population of some states"

What states only have 771,605 people??

Wyoming? Montana?

[proxy_user]

If I may put on my serious hat for a moment, let me reply to that.

Whisky is much stronger than beer. However, it is customary to drink whisky out of tiny shot glasses, while beer is consumed in giant mugs.

Moreover, drugs like marijuana and hash are self-limiting compared to alcohol. No matter if the stuff is weak or strong, at a certain point the user loses interest in having any more, and becomes distracted by other pursuits (or falls asleep on the floor).

[cryptical]

What states only have 771,605 people??

Alaska, Delaware, North Dakota, South Dakota, Vermont, Wyoming.

[zek157]

Hmmmm What an original idea. Would you say the same thing about those people that indulge in alcohol? If not what is the difference?

[William Terrell]

The power of a national government in a nation of law abiding citizens is minimum. The power of a national government in a nation of criminals is maximum.

[Names Ash Housewares]

Raising drug free kids should be the goal, then demand will drop. We are failing to teach children to NOT do drugs, to NOT drink. They know their parents did or do, they see their friends doing it. It is smiled upon and winked at all through society. There is a lot of money to be made these days. These things have been with humanity a long time. I suspect little will every change.

[Enterprise]

Wyoming - 506,529

link

Montana - 926,865

link

[Moonman62]

What states only have 771,605 people?? Alaska, Delaware, North Dakota, South Dakota, Vermont, Wyoming.

Hew Haw salute!

[Wolfie]

ping

[Names Ash Housewares]

every=ever

Should read.......

I suspect little will ever change.

[gamarob1]

The number of arrests for possession alone was 684,319

That's a lot of Rastafarians

[GunnyHartman]

What states only have 771,605 people?? Wyoming? Montana?

Hey, we just broke 900,000 here in Montana. Unfortunately I think most of the increase comes from immigrants from the People's Republik of Kalipornia and assorted other hippies.

[Bigh4u2]

Thanks.

Guess I should have payed more attention in geography class in school.

(blushing)

[Moonman62]

I read the entire article. It's one big whine that should be accompanied by violin music, full of the same slogans that can be read on any one of the thousands of pot threads on FR.

[Enterprise]

The question was a good one though. I was surprised too that some of the States are so sparsely populated. Here in central Kaleefornia, Fresno County has more people than the whole State of Wyoming!

[StJacques]

The biggest problem we have with considering the question of what to do about marijuana is that the lobbying and policy groups promoting its decriminalization or legalization are some of the freakiest circus-act-refugees-masquerading-as-policy-wonks on the planet. There does need to be a serious discussion about it but how far can we really go when we're also told by the advocates for marijuana law reform that we can't wear leather, that ginseng should be served in school cafeterias, that cosmic rays from meteor showers are altering the human genome, and more?

I paid my way through college working in the restaurant business and that experience convinced me that hard liquor is an extremely dangerous substance, much more so than marijuana. I know someone will probably ping me with a link that says otherwise, but I've seen the ill effects of hard drinking up close and I don't chew twigs and berries.

[mysterio]

You'll like my idea. Video cameras in every home, watched 24/7 by government agents. And random house searches. You never know when it's coming. And if you're not doing anything wrong, you have nothing to worry about.

You see, we have to catch people who are getting high. Because that's the most important issue in the world. Someone is getting high right now, and if we had cameras in every house, we would catch him and put him in jail.

We also need to build more jails. Big ones. And we need to put everyone in who has ever used drugs. Drug users should be made to register after being released from prison so the police and military can drop by occasionally to make sure they are not high.

We can do this. It's going to take a lot of money and most of our liberty, but if it keeps one person from getting high, it's worth it.

[rhombus]

Moreover, drugs like marijuana and hash are self-limiting compared to alcohol. No matter if the stuff is weak or strong, at a certain point the user loses interest in having any more, and becomes distracted by other pursuits (or falls asleep on the floor).

I've known very few pot smokers who fell asleep on the floor. Whiskey drinkers - absolutely. Beer drinkers - positively. Most pot users do manage to make it to bed - either their own or someone elses.

[gamarob1]

Unfortunately I think most of the increase comes from immigrants from the People's Republik of Kalipornia and assorted other hippies.

Yeah, why would our people want to live in a place where your spit freezes a split second after it leaves your mouth? ;)

[rhombus]

The biggest problem we have with considering the question of what to do about marijuana is that the lobbying and policy groups promoting its decriminalization or legalization are some of the freakiest circus-act-refugees-masquerading-as-policy-wonks on the planet.

Boy have you got that right and of course better role models have so much to lose. I've totally given up hope. If a slime like Mr. "I never inhaled" didn't do one damn thing, nobody will.

[Join Or Die]

Yeah, remember alcohol? Good thing we banned that!

[Lexington Green]

Welcome to America - where there are enough laws to ensure that everyone is a criminal.

[GunnyHartman]

Yeah, why would our people want to live in a place where your spit freezes a split second after it leaves your mouth? ;)

Ouch! I figured your gigantic butt cowboy population would want to keep every single ounce of spit in their respective mouths. For lubrication and such.

[Triggerhippie]

Mirken: "...the country should be asking: Does it make sense to keep millions of otherwise-law-abiding citizens on the dark side of the law?"

Mirken's logic is "interesting." (It took me a B.A. and eleven years to learn to say "interesting" rather than bullsh!t.)

The law is the law. Should we legalize jay-walking to keep otherwise-law-abiding citizens from wrongdoing? Should we legalize tax evasion to keep otherwise-law-abiding citizens from wrongdoing? Should we legalize murder for the same reason?

[headsonpikes]

If we just doubled the arrests and doubled the tax dollars spent, we can make a dent in the drug trade. Just because it's never worked before doesn't mean it won't work now.

I guess it still takes a village ...

One small question, however ...

_{Why does the village idiot always seem to be in charge?}

[Ecliptic]

It's not about keeping someone from getting high..that deflects from the real reasons: some of those are--drug users steal your stuff, attack you and make your free enjoyment of life difficult; do you want the chief of police high every day? Do you want your kid's teachers high every day? Do you want lots of people roaming around our highways high?

Even if you make it legal, people would still steal to pay for it, and not just do it at home on thier on time..

"Man, I can drive this forklift between hits!!! Besides, it's legal, man!!" or "Now today , children, we will study colors..do any of you see the colors in this white wall?? Yes, Johnny, you see them, are you using Columbian or South East Asian stuff???"

YEs more kids would be doing drugs if their parents are and it is legal..

[fr_freak]

The biggest problem we have with considering the question of what to do about marijuana is that the lobbying and policy groups promoting its decriminalization or legalization are some of the freakiest circus-act-refugees-masquerading-as-policy-wonks on the planet.

There are essentially two kinds of people who are against the WoD: 1) circus freaks who just want to get stoned, 2) people who are horrified by federal government's overstepping of its Constitutional authority or the heavy-handedness with the government (federal and state) enforce laws which essentially outlaw a common weed, tromping on civil liberties in the process.

The advocates for the WoD, perhaps purposefully, tend to lump every opponent into the first category so that they can dismiss them outright, without having to consider Constitutional arguments.

[proxy_user]

I think it would be better to teach them to drink properly.

I would try putting teenagers wearing suits at a table with a white linen tablecloth, and have them drink a couple glasses of red wine out of an expensive crystal goblet. Then they'd have to play bridge with a bunch of adults without insulting anyone or losing track of the cards.

[StJacques]

". . . The advocates for the WoD, perhaps purposefully, tend to lump every opponent into the first category so that they can dismiss them outright, without having to consider Constitutional arguments."

Exactly fr_freak; I've always thought being a true conservative meant that you fear giving away too much power to the government, and especially where individual liberty is at stake.

[Joe Beerman]

These things have been with humanity a long time

Humans like to get high. Beer is the foundation of civilization. Every civilization in history that has tried to prohibit intoxication has collapsed in tyranny.
Pot passes the beer test. It should be legal.
.

[april15Bendovr]

"Marijuana is a much more serious drug than most Americans realize. It's a more potent drug than it was in the past."

"This is a pure BS talking point." Only for the ignorant.

[rhombus]

"Marijuana is a much more serious drug than most Americans realize. It's a more potent drug than it was in the past." "This is a pure BS talking point." Only for the ignorant.

Absolutely. And it's a nice tactic to scare parents who perhaps used to smoke when they were younger.

[bassmaner]

Your Drug Warrior attitude about a comparatively harmless weed is in direct contradiction to the snarky attitude towards federal power expressed in your tagline.

It's been said many times on FR before, but I'll repeat it for your edification:

The greatest danger any American faces from marijuana is getting ARRESTED and possibly JAILED.

The statistic cited in the article (700,000+ arrests; the large majority of them being for possession, not dealing) is proof-positive.

[Ribeye]

Hey, we just broke 900,000 here in Montana. Unfortunately I think most of the increase comes from immigrants from the People's Republik of Kalipornia and assorted other hippies.

---

So because my parents move to California that makes me a commie hippie? Ever been to central California and talk to the farmers that live there? What percentage of the populace do you assume are liberals? While they ARE the majority, it's not as high as you likely assume.

And even though I'm an educated conservative, I suppose that I should be discouraged from moving to the home I just bought in Idaho because I'm from California?

Good thing it wasn't Montana I guess...
God forbid an American move about the country freely without being branded a commie hippie because they spent time in California.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

This is a pure BS talking point.

Yep. Typical knee-jerk, irrational statement from a chair-warmer who otherwise couldn't get a job cleaning toilets in some cheap motel.

The office of drug policy or drug czar or whatever it's called should be abolished immediately. Nothing but a waste of taxpayers dollars.

[Lazamataz]

So because my parents move to California that makes me a commie hippie?

Yes. You are a commie hippie.

And hippies piss me off.

[april15Bendovr]

Even the most derelict scientists that advocate for the use of marijuana understand that marijuana's THC level is higher now than in the past. What we considered short term side effects are now looked at as long term side effects.

All you have to do is a little research on these web sites to find out. NIDA, DEA, Hazelden, Marijuana Anonymous and the The White House web site.

Something tells me you may not want the truth because its not fitting to your agenda. I hope I am wrong.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

It's one big whine that should be accompanied by violin music, full of the same slogans that can be read on any one of the thousands of pot threads on FR.

Nobody forced you to click on the thread, Moonbat.

Or do you enjoy hearing yourself pontificating over the rest of us sheeple who need gov't to hold our hands?

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

The law is the law. Should we legalize jay-walking to keep otherwise-law-abiding citizens from wrongdoing? Should we legalize tax evasion to keep otherwise-law-abiding citizens from wrongdoing? Should we legalize murder for the same reason?

Strawman arguments....

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

Even the most derelict scientists that advocate for the use of marijuana understand that marijuana's THC level is higher now than in the past.

But why is that? Couldn't be because of prohibition, can it?

Nah....

[md2576]

The law is the law. Should we legalize jay-walking to keep otherwise-law-abiding citizens from wrongdoing? Should we legalize tax evasion to keep otherwise-law-abiding citizens from wrongdoing? Should we legalize murder for the same reason?

Barf Alert!

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

Do you want your kid's teachers high every day? Do you want lots of people roaming around our highways high?

Honestly, do you think those who never done marijuana before would all of a sudden use it if it became legal?

[april15Bendovr]

That is a retarded argument.

You and I know that if the government legalized pot they would put a filter on the cigarette and lower the THC lever well beyond the tolerance level that most pot heads need for their high in todays world.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

All you have to do is a little research on these web sites to find out. NIDA, DEA, Hazelden, Marijuana Anonymous and the The White House web site.

Those websites are about as objective as CNN.com.

[PA28 Pilot]

"It's not about keeping someone from getting high..that deflects from the real reasons: some of those are--drug users steal your stuff, attack you and make your free enjoyment of life difficult; do you want the chief of police high every day? Do you want your kid's teachers high every day? Do you want lots of people roaming around our highways high?"

What a load of crap. If someone wanted to grow a little weed to smoke instead of having evening cocktails, why is this going to make them steal form someone. If the chief of police wants to have a couple tokes after work, that's OK with me. Do you really think that everyone who drinks alcohol goes to work wasted every day?

[md2576]

Even the most derelict scientists that advocate for the use of marijuana understand that marijuana's THC level is higher now than in the past. What we considered short term side effects are now looked at as long term side effects.

All you have to do is a little research on these web sites to find out. NIDA, DEA, Hazelden, Marijuana Anonymous and the The White House web site.

Something tells me you may not want the truth because its not fitting to your agenda. I hope I am wrong.

 

Granted they have been able to make weed "stronger" than it used to be. But, that weed is not what most are smoking. Most people get the cheap weed from Mexico that is no stronger than it used to be.

[headsonpikes]

Strawman arguments....

You are being kind, indeed, with this poster's hysterical bullsh*t.