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Lesbian to Seek Parental Rights in Washington
AP ^ | 11/3/2005

Posted on 11/03/2005 11:27:05 AM PST by kemathen7

OLYMPIA, Wash. — The Washington state Supreme Court on Thursday ruled that a woman who raised a child from birth to age 6 while in a relationship with the girl's biological mother can seek parental rights as a "de facto parent (search)," essentially creating a new class of parent in the state.

"Today we hold that our common law recognizes the status of de facto parents and places them in parity with biological and adoptive parents in our state," the court, led by Justice Bobbe J. Bridge, wrote in the 7-2 decision. "Neither the United States Supreme Court nor this court has ever held that 'family' or 'parents' are terms limited in their definition by a strict biological prerequisite."

Sue Ellen Carvin (search), who goes by "Mian," sued her former partner, Page Britain (search), in King County Superior Court in November 2002, alleging that Britain had unfairly cut off access to Britain's biological daughter, identified in court papers as L.B.

The two had been together for about six years when they decided to raise a child together. Britain was artificially inseminated and gave birth in 1995. For the next several years, Carvin stayed home to raise the girl, who called her "Mama" and Britain "Mommy."

But a year and a half ago, Britain and Carvin split. Britain married the sperm donor and subsequently barred Carvin from seeing L.B.

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Washington
KEYWORDS: butch; dyke; gay; homosexualagenda; lesbian; pervert

1 posted on 11/03/2005 11:27:06 AM PST by kemathen7
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To: kemathen7

britain married the sperm donor LOL. That is so funny. Must really gall the girlfriend.


2 posted on 11/03/2005 11:28:26 AM PST by yldstrk (My heros have always been cowboys-Reagan and Bush)
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To: kemathen7
Liberals have created a new class of family. Another triumph for judicial activism. gag>

(Denny Crane: "I Don't Want To Socialize With A Pinko Liberal Democrat Commie. Say What You Like About Republicans. We Stick To Our Convictions. Even When We're Know We're Dead Wrong.")

3 posted on 11/03/2005 11:29:11 AM PST by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives On In My Heart Forever)
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To: DirtyHarryY2K; little jeremiah; Coleus; kemathen7

ping


4 posted on 11/03/2005 11:29:20 AM PST by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: kemathen7

How tragic. They whole thing is so sad for that child.


5 posted on 11/03/2005 11:29:45 AM PST by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Righteousness exalts a nation, but sin is a disgrace to any people. Ps. 14:34)
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To: kemathen7
I hope she wins, she deserves to.

The "birth" mother is being a hypocritical bitch.

6 posted on 11/03/2005 11:30:43 AM PST by Michael.SF. ('That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together,' Cindy Sheehan")
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To: kemathen7

more insanity


7 posted on 11/03/2005 11:31:39 AM PST by kingattax
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To: kemathen7

If the Judge rules for the thrown out lesbo will the girl then have 2 mommies or 2 daddies?


8 posted on 11/03/2005 11:32:09 AM PST by Semper Paratus
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To: Michael.SF.

WTF? Your for the collapse of family values? And you post on the board because?


9 posted on 11/03/2005 11:33:35 AM PST by sasafras ("Licentiousness destroyes order, and when chaos ensues, the yearning for order will destroy freedom.)
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To: Michael.SF.

Seems to me that biological parents ought to have pretty much absolute control over who their child is permitted to associate with, without having others impose their will on them.

Even if it is unfair.


10 posted on 11/03/2005 11:35:34 AM PST by Ramius (Buy blades for war fighters: freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net --> 1000 knives and counting!)
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To: Calpernia

Thanks - will ping the list a little later...gotta run.


11 posted on 11/03/2005 11:40:05 AM PST by little jeremiah
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To: Michael.SF.

And you are totally whacked.

I'm guessing from your handle that you live in San Fagisco? Totally apt.


12 posted on 11/03/2005 11:43:43 AM PST by clee1 (We use 43 muscles to frown, 17 to smile, and 2 to pull a trigger. I'm lazy and I'm tired of smiling.)
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To: kemathen7

All that I can say is that it is insane. What is this judge thinking? What is this woman Carvin thinking? Pray for the daughter, because she's gonna need it.


13 posted on 11/03/2005 11:43:52 AM PST by younghoosier
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To: yldstrk

So...she was "born" that way...so much that she married the FATHER of the baby.

uhhhh...ok.


14 posted on 11/03/2005 11:44:31 AM PST by Adder (Can we bring back stoning again? Please?)
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To: sasafras
Your for the collapse of family values?

Don't jump to conclusions w/o facts.

1) I am opposed to people having these kinds of births. Lesbians and Gays via sperm donors. But that battle was already lost as pertains to this child. Correct?

2) The two women entered into an agreement. One was to have the child, one was to raise the child, as the stay at home 'mom'.

3) The birth mother now wants to dissolve the agreement against the wishes of her ex partner. Has she suddenly found family values? I doubt it.

Regardless of if we like their lifestyle or feel that the agreement to raise the child in a Lesbian household, is right or wrong, we have a situation where one partner is being denied the child she raised for several years.

That is also not right.

15 posted on 11/03/2005 11:45:33 AM PST by Michael.SF. ('That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together,' Cindy Sheehan")
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To: clee1
see my post below.

and save your insults.

16 posted on 11/03/2005 11:46:43 AM PST by Michael.SF. ('That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together,' Cindy Sheehan")
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To: kemathen7
If the court does try to force the little girl to have a relationship with a woman who is not blood against the wishes of the bio parents, the little girl will grow to hate the lesbian.

The lesbian is only compounding her pain by hanging on to any hope that she can have a mother relationship with this child.

If she wants to be a mother, she will need to adopt or give birth to a child herself.
17 posted on 11/03/2005 11:47:14 AM PST by after dark
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To: clee1

see my post # 15.


18 posted on 11/03/2005 11:48:18 AM PST by Michael.SF. ('That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together,' Cindy Sheehan")
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To: kemathen7

I'm torn on this. I hate the idea of 'homosexual partner' parental rights. On the other hand, this poor child has a close relationship with the woman. Such a sudden, forced separation has to be causing the child a lot of pain.


19 posted on 11/03/2005 11:48:53 AM PST by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: sasafras
Your for the collapse of family values?

Would you feel the same if the partner was a male who had raised this little girl for 6 years, then was denied a relationship with her because mom went out and married the turkey baster? Just curious if it is about homosexuality, or if it's something else.

20 posted on 11/03/2005 11:51:31 AM PST by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: kemathen7

I forget the case name, but not too long ago the SCOTUS
shot down Washingtons `grandparents visitation' statute,
so an appeal here is a certainty I'd think.


21 posted on 11/03/2005 11:54:22 AM PST by tumblindice
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To: Ramius
Thanks for a decent response, unlike those who simply chose to insult me.

Yours is a valid argument in favor of denying custody to the one partner. But, these lesbos who do this want it both ways. specifically:

A case in Sweden where they sued the sperm donor for child support. He lost.

Now this one. Sorry these people want to live their "lifestyle" without the responsibilities, then they hide behind or run to the courts when they change their minds. No. They made a decision, they should have to abide by the decision and not deny the woman who raised the child visitation.

22 posted on 11/03/2005 11:54:40 AM PST by Michael.SF. ('That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together,' Cindy Sheehan")
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To: after dark
If the court does try to force the little girl to have a relationship with a woman who is not blood against the wishes of the bio parents, the little girl will grow to hate the lesbian.

I doubt the little girl would be 'forced' to have a relationship with her. If the woman was good to her and treated her with love, the little girl probably loves her. If she grows to 'hate' the lesbian, it would be because of the attitude of the 'biological parents.' (Same dynamics as when hetero couples split and mom talks bad about the guy the kid thought of as dad all along.)

23 posted on 11/03/2005 11:55:23 AM PST by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: Michael.SF.

OK... I see your point.

My apologies.


24 posted on 11/03/2005 11:55:45 AM PST by clee1 (We use 43 muscles to frown, 17 to smile, and 2 to pull a trigger. I'm lazy and I'm tired of smiling.)
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To: MEGoody
with her because mom went out and married the turkey baster?

if you have a serious question I will be glad to address it.

25 posted on 11/03/2005 11:56:39 AM PST by Michael.SF. ('That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together,' Cindy Sheehan")
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To: clee1
OK... I see your point.

Thank you.

26 posted on 11/03/2005 11:58:27 AM PST by Michael.SF. ('That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together,' Cindy Sheehan")
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To: kemathen7

If gays want the same "rights", they should suffer the same legal consequences. Wanna get married? Then file taxes jointly (can anyone say marriage penalty?). Wanna split up? Then get a legal divorce, risk getting charged with bigamy, pay child support, split community property assets, be co-responsible for the other partner's debts, etc. etc. (No, I'm not advocating gay marriage.)


27 posted on 11/03/2005 11:59:12 AM PST by ironmaidenPR2717 (You wouldn't worry so much about what most people think of you if you'd realize they really don't.)
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To: Ramius
"Today we hold that our common law recognizes the status of de facto parents and places them in parity with biological and adoptive parents in our state," the court, led by Justice Bobbe J. Bridge, wrote in the 7-2 decision. "Neither the United States Supreme Court nor this court has ever held that 'family' or 'parents' are terms limited in their definition by a strict biological prerequisite."

Until now, you were right. Be afraid. Be very afraid.

28 posted on 11/03/2005 12:00:45 PM PST by Ukiapah Heep (Shoes for Industry!)
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To: yldstrk

Just auess, but I wonder if mommy was having an affair with the "sperm donor". It doesn't say anything about artificial insemination in here.


29 posted on 11/03/2005 12:02:15 PM PST by I still care (America is not the problem - it is the solution..)
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To: kemathen7
Barring the bio parents turning out to abusive thugs the non bio mom does not have much hope of winning.

Lesbians should take this case into account when planning to have children. The lesbian who is not giving birth should insist that the sperm come from her brother. This way she would at least be the bio aunt of the child.
30 posted on 11/03/2005 12:02:30 PM PST by after dark
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To: ironmaidenPR2717

I'm with you. They can't have it both ways. You wanna play the pipe, you have to pay the piper.


31 posted on 11/03/2005 12:18:09 PM PST by Michael.SF. ('That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together,' Cindy Sheehan")
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To: MEGoody
This girl is still young enough to be shaped . The bio parents will have power over her opinions. Many divorced non custodial parents have had their child's mind poisoned by the custodial parents. It's not as hard as you would imagine.
32 posted on 11/03/2005 12:20:42 PM PST by after dark
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To: kemathen7
Anecdotal "gays raising children" story. I dated a guy whose parents lived next door to a lesbian couple. They wanted to have a child, and so did a gay male couple they knew. One of the lesbians decided to be the biological mother, then both of the gay men had sex with her so no one would know who the biological father was.

9 months later, here came a little boy. My former boyfriend's mom did day care for him. I have no idea what they are up to today, but man. What an odd arrangement. The kid had 4 "parents". I honestly wondered what would happen to that poor kid if they had a falling out.
33 posted on 11/03/2005 12:40:08 PM PST by kemathen7
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To: after dark
Lesbians should take this case into account when planning to have children.

A drama very much like this unfolded at my work earlier this year. Lesbian "family" with the biological mother and her partner each being "mommy" and then they split (the pretend mommy works here). Talk about a soap opera.

34 posted on 11/03/2005 12:41:30 PM PST by mitchbert (Facts Are Stubborn Things .)
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To: sionnsar
Ping. Judge Bobbe Bridge. Who knew? ;-)
35 posted on 11/03/2005 12:43:45 PM PST by IslandJeff
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To: Michael.SF.
Regardless of if we like their lifestyle or feel that the agreement to raise the child in a Lesbian household, is right or wrong, we have a situation where one partner is being denied the child she raised for several years.

The point you are leaving out is that the one 'partner' has no relationship whatsoever to the child. She is now, and always has been, no more than a long term baby sitter.

Should nannies have rights to the children they supervise? I think not.

Secondly, the 'partner' practices a lifestyle that has been shown to be detrimental to children. Homosexuals have a higher incidence of also being child molesters and because of this, for the sake of our children, every homosexual must be considered a child molester. It would be evil to put this child in a sitiation where she will certainly be molested. If not by the 'partner' then by one or more of the 'partners' friends.

36 posted on 11/03/2005 12:47:57 PM PST by John O (God Save America (Please))
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Comment #37 Removed by Moderator

To: Michael.SF.

They should just do as a friend of mine did. She got 2 dogs, they call them "the boys". Much easier, plus it fulfills thier need to be powerful over something.


38 posted on 11/03/2005 12:53:27 PM PST by freebird5850
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To: kemathen7

Bobbe Bridge is a well known activist judge and irresponsible alcoholic.


39 posted on 11/03/2005 12:56:58 PM PST by PeoplesRepublicOfWashington (Dream Ticket: Cheney/Rice '08)
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To: MEGoody

Its absolutely about homosexuality. Homosexuals are perverts and I am not afraid to say it. Are you aware of any lesbians in the animal kingdom?

The child deserves and intact and normal family with a father and mother. Homosexuals should not be raising children or perhaps its ok with you that children be raised by satanists or drug addicts.


40 posted on 11/03/2005 1:02:07 PM PST by sasafras ("Licentiousness destroyes order, and when chaos ensues, the yearning for order will destroy freedom.)
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To: Michael.SF.

Your not aware of circumstantial evidence and neither am I. How do you know that the birth father was not involved the whole time? Perhaps she is very close to him. Perhaps the birth mother is aware of certain things that make her suspicious of this lesbian women. We dont know and for the sake of the child she should be provided the opportunity for intact normal (yes that means one man and one women) family.

Homos (not used derogatory, just short hand for homosexual) should not be given the opportunity to harm these children. Study after study indicates that homo behavoir begins after molestation or same parent neglect; all of the priests were not just pedophiles but mostly homo pedaphiles.


41 posted on 11/03/2005 1:09:02 PM PST by sasafras ("Licentiousness destroyes order, and when chaos ensues, the yearning for order will destroy freedom.)
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To: Michael.SF.

It is definitely "right"
The lesbo has no more "right" to this child than if she were the mom's sister or mother.

The fact that she was in the child's life is insufficient.
[Look at how many fathers are denied visitation and they were truly involved.]


42 posted on 11/03/2005 3:46:49 PM PST by Adder (Can we bring back stoning again? Please?)
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To: sasafras
That is a lot of 'perhaps'es you are making there. You are right, we do not know and it is for the court to decide (not a cut a dried case IMO).

Personally, I think the use of artificial insemination, sperm donation and turkey baster babies should all be illegal. That would hold true for both Gays and Heterosexuals.

If you cannot have a baby, adopt.

43 posted on 11/03/2005 4:25:11 PM PST by Michael.SF. ('That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together,' Cindy Sheehan")
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To: kemathen7; All
Further development on this subject:

Washington State Court Decision on Lesbian Partners

44 posted on 11/03/2005 5:36:14 PM PST by Michael.SF. ('That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together,' Cindy Sheehan")
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To: sasafras
Are you aware of any lesbians in the animal kingdom?

No, but I don't use the behavior of animals as a gage for how humans should act. Interesting that homosexuals claim that homosexuality occurs in animals, so that makes it okay. I always say to them that animals lick their behinds, throw feces and eat their own vomit, so I don't use them as a model of behavior.

The child deserves and intact and normal family with a father and mother.

Children do best with an intact family with a mom and dad. However, this child did not have that for 6 years. It is unfair to the child to suddenly eliminate the person who raised her for 6 years from her life.

By the way, do you have some information to show that both mom and dad have suddenly found Jesus or something? Because I doubt the family the girl is in right now is all that stable considering the history of mom and dad.

Homosexuals should not be raising children or perhaps its ok with you that children be raised by satanists or drug addicts.

Nothing like a little hysteria to show us all that you can't deal with the topic in an adult manner.

As I have already stated, a stable home with mom and dad is best for a child. It's is also best for a child not to suddenly eliminate from her life a person who has raised her and loved her for 6 years. The only reason that should be done is if the child is in imminent danger. Can you show that to be the case here?

45 posted on 11/04/2005 6:05:02 AM PST by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: after dark
Many divorced non custodial parents have had their child's mind poisoned by the custodial parents. It's not as hard as you would imagine.

Yes, that was my point in a previous post. "Ex" spouses or partners, no matter the gender of each party, can poison the mind of a child against that person they used to love and who used to (and still) loves the child.

46 posted on 11/04/2005 6:06:43 AM PST by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: Michael.SF.
if you have a serious question I will be glad to address it.

My question wasn't to you, so what was the point of your post to me? Is that a serious enough question for you?

47 posted on 11/04/2005 6:08:56 AM PST by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: MEGoody
so what was the point of your post to me?

I was responding to your post #20, in which you quote a question which was directed at me previously.

My mistake.

48 posted on 11/04/2005 7:14:46 AM PST by Michael.SF. ('That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together,' Cindy Sheehan")
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