Skip to comments.What if we don't run out of oil?
Posted on 11/15/2005 7:05:19 AM PST by Dan Evans
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I'm not worried about what happens if we don't run out. I'm worried about what happens if we do run out.
If windmills and solar power were the only source of power we had, they would be under attack by the left because the left is empowered by denying the necessities of life to good people. It is the same tactic used by any extortionist thug.
We know it's naturally produced. The question is whether it's being produced fast enough for us to continue on as we are.
Personally, my theory is that it comes from outer space. The outer space idea and the deep-Earth idea may mean that if we drill deeper, we might find more, but who knows for sure? Unfortunately, we can't assume that everthing will work out, because if it does not, then there will be world wide famine. We can't feed this many people without oil.
Things have a way of working themselves out. We are pretty good at that.
At some point, though, the price may go up enough that it might as well be completely exhausted.
Honest advice for you; stop worrying, we won't be running out of oil for at least hundreds of years if ever. Go ahead and enjoy life.
Then we're NOT DOOMED ????!!!!
DOn't worry. Al Gore will save us from our oil dependency.
The world is not going to run out of oil, per the USGS.
America however is in danger by having to import foreign oil. A Startegy for Achieving Independence from Foreign Oil can be found at www.tsaugust.org
Where ya goin' in your car today? Tomorrow? YOU should "worry" MORE about that.....and surviving.
No way it's going to last "hundreds of years." I suspect 30, at most, before the price goes up so much that gasoline will be considered a luxury.
So why not do those things now? Because it will be much easier to do it with future technology than with current technology. This is one reason oil companies only explore enough to create a ten year supply of proven reserves.
No one knows exactly how oil is made, so it's a pretty dumb nut who bets the farm on the assumption that we will have oil forever, because it's being produced everyday. Remember that the Earth has been around for about 4 billion years. If it took 4 billion years to produce the oil we've consumed over the last 1-1/2 centuries, then it's going to be a long wait before new supplies become available.
"Hubbert's Peak" is a canard, and I'm frankly amazed to see so many otherwise intelligent people accept it as the gospel truth.
Then we're NOT DOOMED????!!!!
And it ISN'T Bush's fault?!?!?!
Oil=energy. If the supplies dwindle and costs rise, it will make alternative sources more attractive and economically feasible. We have been using oil for energy for less than 150 years. There is nothing to say that in the year 2100, we will still be wedded to its use.
Nevertheless, "Peak-Oil" makes more sense than the "Don't-worry-be-happy-the-oil-supply-is-infinite" crap that Corsi subjects us to while Big Oil continues to jack-up prices at the pump.
Because of taxes, Europeans pay about double for gasoline that Americans do, yet they continue to buy it. I suggest it is even easier for Americans to pay that much. If the price of gas were to be about five bucks a gallon, expect all kinds of new sources to be developed that aren't being touched today. And on the other side of the coin, expect a lot of innovation in energy conservation.
Oil = Freedom
A higher price will unlock motor fuels from other sources. Petroleum fuels might become scarce but liquid fuel will continue to be made. Too many people have a stake in continuing to sell the stuff.
I really don't think it matters which way this plays out. Think about it - If we are NOT running out of oil, things continue as-is, hopefully with continued improvements for economy and pollution...
If we ARE running out of oil, we will figure a way out of it, I'm confident. The Germans ran low on gasoline near the end of WWII, ground up chunks of pine trees with mechanisms on their trucks, and used the TURPENTINE to run them. Pine trees are definitely renewable.
Fuel from crops (corn/soybeans, etc.) is not a big industry now, but you know how people are - they cram for tests, fail to put stop signs in until someone is killed, don't fill the tank until it's empty, etc. If we are forced to cope - we'll cope.
OBTW - who will "own" the world's best fuel production facilities when we start using CROPS, Hmmmm? It won't be those desert countries, buddy boy. :-)
This is becoming the more and more reasoned theory. I have seen evidence of this theory in print now for over a decade. There is factual evidence of oil wells thought to be dry "filling up" with attainable oil again.
The problem with this, of course, is that if true - and I suspect it is - this would drive the environazis absolutely nuts!
"Things have a way of working themselves out."
I'm not sure what you mean when you say "working themselves out." I remember when gas was 25 cents a gallon. And I'm not all that old, either.
It's funny how things "worked themselves out" in that instance.
I don't think the problem is going to solve itself. I'm thinking the cost of gas will be in excess of $5 a gallon at the end of the next ten years, possibly in excess of $10 a gallon if the Chinese and Russians build cars as fast as we have.
It doesn't matter if we run out of oil.
We can convert to alcohol in a few years. E85 is already in motion.
In the long run, biomass seems like the most promising alternative to oil. But we're a LONG way from producing fuel from biomass that would rival what we're getting from oil today. If we have to go that way, then better figure on riding your bicycle to work. You won't be able to afford the fuel to drive your car.
We make assumptions all the time because we have to. We assume the sun will continue to shine and that rain will fall. But how smart would it be for you to waste a lot of money developing expensive alternatives to oil if it turns out that they will not compete with oil extraction?
Oh, I see. You were going to spend MY money.
What has been the inflation rate in the last 45 years?
Run the numbers yourself - from 1960 to now, at a rate of only 5%, the price from $.25 should be $2.25 now. Hey! I bought it for $2.17 last night! Not a bad deal!
Bought a loaf of bread for $.45 lately? No? Well, at that SAME 5%, it should be about $.45 now.
So, Frohickey and Adam Smith are both right. Things DO often have a way of working out.
Word-for-word exactly what various "experts" were saying, oh, 30 years ago...
No oil for democrats 8)
I remember when gas was 25 cents a gallon. And at that time you could buy a loaf of bread or a pack of cigarettes for 25 cents. In constant dollars gas isn't that much more expensive. I also remember filling my tank up 1998 for 99 cents a gallon.
Well, I don't know how much Engineering YOU have, but I'm a Mechanical Engineer, and I just happen to know a little bit about engines. There are many on the horizon that could be pretty happy running on soybeans. All we have to have is a reason to develop them, which, like I said, we don't have right now.
Retrofit my Monte Carlo SS with one of those, and I'm good to go.
I was going through some ancient copies of Scientific American and came across an article about coal resources. The experts said that our coal reserves would be exhausted in 100 years. The article was written about 1860.
The demise of the oil based economy does not depend on the specific conclusions of the peak oil theorists. The demand for oil is skyrocketing world wide.
Some people may think that new oil is being made every day. Personally, I don't. Most of the oil fields in Texas are nearing exhaustion. For some reason, nature has decided not to replace the oil we removed from those fields.
But irrespective, unless the world is making several million barrels every day, and putting it where we can get it, then the supply of available oil is going down. You can poo-poo it, but the fact is that it's oil that makes our economy go. Without it, we'd starve. And everytime the price goes up, our economic welfare goes down.
In general, the price is going up, not down. Even in the 90's, when oil was at about $15 a barrel, it was pretty clear that it was going to have to go up. Oil companies were losing their shirts. It was not sustainable. Now, it's sustainable for a while, but only at much greater cost.
There is a lot of oil in the world, but we are using it at a break-neck pace, and with globalization, it's a mistake to assume that there are vast new areas of exploration that we have not already tapped.
This repeatedly comes up on threads and has been repeatedly shot down by people that actually know what they're talking about; people have got it in their heads that oil fields all over the world are rapidly re-filling; this is not the case. There's a tiny handful of fields that may be re-filling that are connected to other fields that haven't been tapped. On the other hand, there are THOUSANDS of oil fields that are basically played out and are not refilling.
And there are very, very, very few petroleum geologists that do not believe oil is a fossil fuel; there are people on FR under the mis-impression that most geologists now accept Gold's theories about the abiotic generation of petroleum, and most completely dismiss it.
Sure, soybeans can produce a fuel. But it would be a whole lot more expensive than gasoline, even at current prices.
I am not that old, but I distincly remember buying Twinkies as a kid for 9 cents. The fruit pies were 13 cents. Not sure what you buy them for today, but I'd be willing to bet they exceed the inflation rate.
The critics of Peak Oil usually do not mention that the world peak has not yet arrived and there would be no effects of Peak Oil at this time. Sometime in the coming decade we will roll over the peak and then there will be effects. Some adherents of Peak Oil also do not mention that the peak is not yet here and seem to think that the effects are already being felt. Neither group seems to get the point.
Compared to the 99 cents a gallon in 1999, prices have gone up big time in constant value. The price index has not doubled since then, yet the price of gasoline has more than doubled.
The thing to keep in mind, though, is that the price of oil was unusually low in 1999. Oil companies were losing money. Anytime you have an industry losing money, you know that the price is ultimately going to go up. Companies in that industry are going to shut down capacity because it's not profitable, and as they do, the price will rise.
No, perhaps not rapidly refilling, but perhaps refilling nonetheless. As I said, it's a theory. It has been neither conclusively substantiated, nor conclusively disproved. Regardless, there are enough feasible energy alternatives. They WILL become cost effective either way. We ain't gonna be without electricity in 50, 100, or 200 years from now.
I've heard Corsi on Coast To Coast AM before, but I'd never associated him with the Swift Vets before. His explanations of this stuff sounds reasonable, and the evidence is there, as you said... Tapped out fields being 'recharged' somehow. Corsi doesn't argue that we shouldn't look at alternatives to oil for our energy needs, as there are obvious problems with burning too much oil, pollution concerns being the most obvious. Rather, he argues that we shouldn't be panicking because of fear-mongering related to "peak oil" theories.
If oil is, in fact a renewable abiotic resource, then much of the fear-mondering related to "peak oil" is nothing but yet another scam that is hurting our economy. Of course, since we don't fully understand the processes or time scales involved in abiotic oil generation, we will have to be careful not to extract more than the earth can produce and renew. We'll find a happy medium somewhere, between oil and alternative energy production that will allow things to continue longer than many people think. Cheap energy is a good thing IMO.
Yes, but that doesn't mean it's wrong. Just because we discovered vast amounts of oil before doesn't mean we'll find vast amounts of oil now.
Keep in mind how we found that oil. After the oil shock of the 70's, US oil companies went world wide in their search for oil that was not controlled by OPEC. They found it. However, now that that oil is already in the pipeline, where are they going to go next?
The only place that has not yet been explored is Antartica. From what I've read, it would take about $80 a barrel to justify that, if you could accomplish it at all from a political standpoint.
This is incorrect. The demand for Energy is skyrocketing world wide. It just happens that currently crude oil is the cheapest, most efficient form available.
Me too. But the mass of people prefer to keep their eyes closed.