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Florida School Board Sued for Unequal Education
www.foxnews.com ^ | 11/18/2005

Posted on 11/20/2005 7:05:53 AM PST by pleikumud

Florida School Board Sued for Unequal Education Friday, November 18, 2005

PINELLAS COUNTY, Fla. — A first-of-its-kind class-action lawsuit in Pinellas County, Fla., could force the local school board to reveal how it teaches and disciplines its 20,000 black students, who struggle academically in disproportionate numbers to students of other races.

"Public education, to me personally, is specifically set up to dumb us down," said William Crowley, who filed the lawsuit.

Click in the video box to the right to watch a report by FOX News' Orlando Salinas.

Crowley said the white-run school system allowed his son to fall behind. His remedy doesn't call for monetary remuneration. Instead, he said he wants the system fixed.

"The facts are overwhelming and not just in Pinellas County, but nationwide, there is a high failure rate of black students across this country," Crowley said.

The lawsuit cites a consistent gap between black and white high-school graduates in Pinellas County. The class failure rate is more than twice as high among blacks. Discipline problems are 39 percent more frequent than with white students.

School board Superintendent Clayton Wilcox says the explanation is simple: More black students break the rules. He says his teachers can't be held accountable for life lessons some students never learned at home.

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: blacks; board; education; florida; private; pspl; school; sued; unequal; urbanbarbarians
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The solution is to eliminate public, government-run schools at all levels, K-12 and up. Get the Federal, State and local governments out of the education business. This eliminates about 50-60% of local and state taxes, reduces taxes on all real estate, including apartment buildings, and puts money in the pockets of education consumers to purchase education. Complete freedom of choice. If you don't like XYZ Education Co., send the kid to a different school. Truly competitive, shop for price, quality and content.
1 posted on 11/20/2005 7:05:55 AM PST by pleikumud
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To: pleikumud

Whitey's fault


2 posted on 11/20/2005 7:09:42 AM PST by Sterco
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To: pleikumud

"The lawsuit cites a consistent gap between black and white high-school graduates in Pinellas County. The class failure rate is more than twice as high among blacks. Discipline problems are 39 percent more frequent than with white students. "

Well when you have 70% of black children born out of wedlock, no one home to supervise what's going on and that included NO discipline, is it ANY wonder there is a problem?


3 posted on 11/20/2005 7:10:55 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people believe in Intelligent Design (God).)
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To: pleikumud
"Crowley said the white-run school system allowed his son to fall behind."

He has a good point. After all, blacks do so very well in those black-run educational systems in the big cities. The youths just need those role models, you see.
4 posted on 11/20/2005 7:12:22 AM PST by Ninian Dryhope
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To: pleikumud

"Public education, to me personally, is specifically set up to dumb us down," said William Crowley, who filed the lawsuit.

** Well sir if you had any imagination, you'd homeschool your child if that's how you feel. There are lots of parents doing this right now.


5 posted on 11/20/2005 7:12:39 AM PST by cyborg (I'm on the 24 plan having the best day ever.)
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To: pleikumud
I'd LOVE to see that!

In this particular situation, I'd say it's more about the breaking down of the family and this race trying to blame others for the results of the family disintegration. 70% of all black births are out of wedlock ... guys don't hang around ... so that leaves mom ... working and not being around. This scenario is not reserved for blacks. It knows no race although blacks have the highest percentage of this problem.
6 posted on 11/20/2005 7:14:35 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people believe in Intelligent Design (God).)
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To: nmh

It is also impossible to teach children who insist on being discipline problems.


7 posted on 11/20/2005 7:14:37 AM PST by BenLurkin (O beautiful for patriot dream - that sees beyond the years)
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To: pleikumud
""The facts are overwhelming and not just in Pinellas County, but nationwide, there is a high failure rate of black students across this country," Crowley said."

And not just across this country, either, but across the world, since blacks do less well academically in countries as socially advanced as France, Britain, and Canada as well. Need to use Occam's razor on this one.
8 posted on 11/20/2005 7:15:14 AM PST by Ninian Dryhope
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To: BenLurkin
I agree!

Where my daughter goes it's a private school. A demerit is given out for being naughty. Depending on what grade you are in, and you have a certain amount, you are asked to leave. NO exceptions. That's it.
9 posted on 11/20/2005 7:16:31 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people believe in Intelligent Design (God).)
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To: nmh

"It knows no race although blacks have the highest percentage of this problem."

So true!


10 posted on 11/20/2005 7:16:42 AM PST by Ninian Dryhope
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To: Ninian Dryhope

"The youths just need those role models, you see."

Yeah, like Marian Barry in DC and I forget the one in Philadelphia. Yeah great examples.


11 posted on 11/20/2005 7:17:52 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people believe in Intelligent Design (God).)
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To: cyborg
"Public education, to me personally, is specifically set up to dumb us down,"

Do you vote for the plantation masters?

12 posted on 11/20/2005 7:18:32 AM PST by ncountylee (Dead terrorists smell like victory)
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To: cyborg
"Well sir if you had any imagination, you'd homeschool your child if that's how you feel."

Absolutely! There is no substitute for parental involvement. Whether one home schools one's children, sends them to a private school, or to a public school, it is the attention and concern and effort of the parents in the educational process that is most important. The schools cannot do it all by themselves.
13 posted on 11/20/2005 7:19:04 AM PST by Ninian Dryhope
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To: pleikumud; mhking; rdb3

Public schools as they stand today are pure poison for young black children. People on both sides have stereotypes of black children that will hamper them. One side thinks they need their help and the other side believes they're too stupid to educate.


14 posted on 11/20/2005 7:19:22 AM PST by cyborg (I'm on the 24 plan having the best day ever.)
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To: pleikumud

This is going to open up a real can of worms, and snakes!! I do not blame the man for wanting a really decent education for his children, nor should anyone stand in their way trying to achieve this. That being said, the problems foisted on public education by governments tying to be "nannies" is staggering. In the black community we have rampant drug cultures, out-of-wedlock births,high unemployment, crappy schools, no parental involement, high crime rates, and a welfare state that has fostered most of this. We have the same thing in the white community too, just not the same percentages. Until we grab hold of the problems involved, and find mutually acceptable solutions and standards, we will continue to bastardize our educational system and continue to fail our people.


15 posted on 11/20/2005 7:19:44 AM PST by geezerwheezer (get up boys, we're burnin' daylight!!!)
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To: pleikumud

[["The facts are overwhelming and not just in Pinellas County, but nationwide, there is a high failure rate of black students across this country," Crowley said]]

Is it maybe because they are too busy glorifying gangstas like fiddy cent, snoop dog, and trying to live the gangsta lifestyle rather than hit the books and studying? You can only blame so much on whitey.


16 posted on 11/20/2005 7:20:07 AM PST by Buffettfan
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To: ncountylee

If he does, then he should not complain.


17 posted on 11/20/2005 7:20:13 AM PST by cyborg (I'm on the 24 plan having the best day ever.)
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To: pleikumud

One critic argues it's not the school's fault that black students are not learning.

"To suggest that the school district can somehow uniquely single out black kids and give them inferior educations while giving other kids a better education is kind of ludicrous," said Ward Connerly, head of the American Civil Rights Institute.




Ah, someone sane involved with this. I LOVE Ward Connerly. He tells it like it is. BTW, he's .... dare I say it ... black!


18 posted on 11/20/2005 7:20:49 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people believe in Intelligent Design (God).)
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To: pleikumud
"Public education, to me personally, is specifically set up to dumb us down," said William Crowley

Actually, it's set up to dumb EVERYONE down!

Vouchers, vouchers, vouchers.

19 posted on 11/20/2005 7:21:00 AM PST by Republic If You Can Keep It
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To: geezerwheezer

That's the ugly secret about liberalism. They refuse, absolutely REFUSE to be responsible people. The elites get off on playing god and the peons get relieved of ALL responsibility and blame. And the cycle goes on and on.


20 posted on 11/20/2005 7:22:58 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people believe in Intelligent Design (God).)
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To: Republic If You Can Keep It

I can't believe that the teachers are not held responsible for these failures. I think it is sad that Black students are not getting good educations and they are going to "Majority White School" that have the majority of tax money. There is something wrong and it needs to be investigated. I hope the kid gets every dime he sues for. This has been going on far too long and is not needed in 2005.


21 posted on 11/20/2005 7:24:17 AM PST by napscoordinator
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To: BenLurkin

And so, this past week, when the news showed arrests of 9 or 10 girls from a fight erupted that erupted in a school run by Blacks under a Black public school administration, your point is demonstrated. It was at this same school last year that 4 "children" kicked and beat a fellow student so hard on the ground during lunch that his jaw was broken while he was on the phone with his mother crying for help.

There's also another story of another 4 girls being arrested, too. It goes on and on.

http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5346492/detail.html

http://www.nbc4i.com/news/4225883/detail.html

http://www.nbc4i.com/news/5297134/detail.html


22 posted on 11/20/2005 7:25:34 AM PST by combat_boots (Dug in and not budging an inch. NOT to be schiavoed, greered, or felosed as a patient)
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To: pleikumud

Is William Crowley on the School Advisory Council at his child's school? Does he even have a child in school? Is he on the PTSO? Is he a registered volunteer? Has he volunteered to mentor a child? Did Willie look at the home situation of the children he feels are being failed? He could get a pretty good first order impression from how they were dressed for school. Ask them to show you their homework, Willie. Or is Willie just looking at some statistics, came up with "whitey's fault" all on his own and filed the suit?


23 posted on 11/20/2005 7:25:48 AM PST by NonValueAdded ("To the terrorists, the media is a vital force multiplier" Brig. Gen. Donald Alston (USAF) 10/31/05)
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To: cyborg

There is also the stigma hoisted on black males, by other black males, that to be studious and smart is being a sellout. An Uncle Tom, acting white, etc. I,ve seen it far too often. It's just like black on black crime.


24 posted on 11/20/2005 7:27:15 AM PST by Ron in Acreage (It's the borders stupid! "ALLEN IN 08")
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To: Ron in Acreage

I agree.


25 posted on 11/20/2005 7:28:02 AM PST by cyborg (I'm on the 24 plan having the best day ever.)
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To: pleikumud
The class failure rate is more than twice as high among blacks. Discipline problems are 39 percent more frequent than with white students.

Given this set of facts, how many different (and specious) conclusions can different groups of people come up with?

Furthermore, how incompetent is the judge who gives such specious conclusions any judicial weight?

26 posted on 11/20/2005 7:28:03 AM PST by IronJack
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To: Born Conservative

School ping


27 posted on 11/20/2005 7:29:38 AM PST by NonValueAdded ("To the terrorists, the media is a vital force multiplier" Brig. Gen. Donald Alston (USAF) 10/31/05)
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To: napscoordinator
I can't believe that the teachers are not held responsible for these failures. I think it is sad that Black students are not getting good educations and they are going to "Majority White School" that have the majority of tax money. There is something wrong and it needs to be investigated. I hope the kid gets every dime he sues for.

Do you really think the schools are giving black students a worse education than white students? Or are black students just, on average, putting less into school, and consequently getting less out of it?

28 posted on 11/20/2005 7:30:52 AM PST by Young Scholar
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To: geezerwheezer

People need to accept individual responsibility for education, health, etc. Government collectivism creates dependency, lack of accountability, and irresponsible behavior. Private enterprise generates solutions, not excuses, reckless spending and economy-killing taxes. Education spending by government should be eliminated. The people who founded the United States, who wrote the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, were mostly self-educated, or attended small private schools.


29 posted on 11/20/2005 7:34:53 AM PST by pleikumud
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To: geezerwheezer

Before I get behind this guy, I'd like to get more information. Who's backing him in this lawsuit? Maybe I'm just cynical, but I'll bet my next paycheck that it's the very same people who have made sure his son will fail in the public education system; the teacher's unions, the race hustlers, the "we must protect their self esteem above all else" crowd and the professional educrats. And if that's the case, that means this suit is just a scam, it's nothing more than another way to shake the government down for more money and to blame Jeb and George Bush for the problems in the schools.


30 posted on 11/20/2005 7:36:02 AM PST by CFC__VRWC ("Anytime a liberal squeals in outrage, an angel gets its wings!" - gidget7)
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To: nmh
Where my daughter goes it's a private school.

I absolutely love the school my sons attend(ed). It is a Christian School that is just bear bones teaching.

We asked the boys whether they wanted a school where there was football, band, etc or whether they wanted to go to this school that has no extra activities. They chose this school and the results have been dramatic.

My oldest entered in in the 10th grade and the other in the 9th. They had been attending public school and had grade point averages that looked like Baseball batting averages (LOL) and were marked as discipline problems (ONe son brought cold medicine to school, and the other had sharp scissors with him one day).

The oldest just graduated with a 3.7 GPA and the youngest has been getting straight A's since we changed schools.

They go from 8 to 1230, then both have jobs in the afternoons -- What is not to love, good grades, they have thier own spending money, and both have matured and become very well behaved responsible young men in the last couple years.

31 posted on 11/20/2005 7:36:51 AM PST by commish ((Montgomery, AL) Freedom Tastes Sweetest to Those Who Have Fought to Preserve It)
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To: pleikumud

I agree with the free market solution. On a lot of levels.

I happen also to agree with Crowley the the system is designed to dumb down the students. Does the article say what his suit wants done to "fix" the system?

When my kids were in public school in Florida, one thing that stood out between black and white students is that on back to school nights (meet the teacher nights), there was a lot more participation by white parents than by black parents.


32 posted on 11/20/2005 7:38:27 AM PST by Sam Cree (absolute reality - "Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one." Albert Einstein)
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To: napscoordinator

You are way off base. How is it that a black child sitting in a desk, next to a white child, in the same exact classroom, with the same exact teacher, of any race, not get the same education as the white child? The answer lies at home, and not with scapegoating the teacher. Every student gets the same amount of instruction, classwork, and homework. You cannot blame the teacher for what happens once that student leaves the classroom.


33 posted on 11/20/2005 7:39:47 AM PST by Ron in Acreage (It's the borders stupid! "ALLEN IN 08")
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To: Ninian Dryhope
I teach in an inner city middle school where 53% of the student body are black adolescents. Some are discipline problems, others are some of the best and brightest, most pleasant natured young people I have ever met. I have yet to teach any that I honestly have not liked. You can build relationships that make a difference. Love and compassion, kindness, with consistent standards over time. That is the key, no matter what the race may be. One thing I have learned; a student can smell a phony a mile away.
34 posted on 11/20/2005 7:41:22 AM PST by Thaddeus
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To: commish
That's the hope I have for my daughter.

It's a Christian school also. Standards are high. Very high.

Grading is the old fashioned way:

A+ 100
A 96-99
A- 94-95
B+ 92-93
B 88-91
B- 86-87

and so on.

It claims to be nondenominational but if I had to pick one, I'd say it's Baptist. Totally Bible based.

From a secular standpoint, it's not unusual for kids to get a perfect SAT score. Sarah is in first grade. Her cum is a 95. Until third grade there is no honor system or high honor system. In kindergarten they didn't have numeric grades. Now she is becoming very conscious of grades. She wants 2nd quarter cumulative cum to be 100. She just may do it. She's strong willed and competitive. I hope between the school and I we can harness that will for what is right. Mold the will but don't break the spirit is the way we both see it.

The kids are well behaved and happy. You can say Merry Christmas, Christmas break and Happy Easter etc.. We love it. I especially like them wearing uniforms. I just hope we can continue to send here there from K-12. It gets expensive for high school but it is worth it. I really don't want her around public school kids. Their behavior and mouth is something to behold. We want no parts of that.
35 posted on 11/20/2005 7:48:11 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people believe in Intelligent Design (God).)
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To: pleikumud
A little off topic, but I've been meaning to ask about this for awhile.
I've been considering a lawsuit against my kids' school. I believe they should be provided with a bilingual education.
Why are my children, who only speak English, not being provided with the opportunity to learn Spanish? The kids who are bilingual will end up with more job opportunities.
Think we'd have a case?
36 posted on 11/20/2005 7:48:55 AM PST by RoseyT
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To: pleikumud
The solution is to eliminate public, government-run schools at all levels, K-12 and up. Get the Federal, State and local governments out of the education business. This eliminates about 50-60% of local and state taxes, reduces taxes on all real estate, including apartment buildings, and puts money in the pockets of education consumers to purchase education.

Government does not shrink.

Eliminating the excuse for the taxes will not eliminate the taxes. It will free up the money so governments can address "unmet needs" (anything which aids in reelecting politicians). We are stuck with this education mess.

37 posted on 11/20/2005 7:51:15 AM PST by Nomorjer Kinov
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To: Thaddeus
I believe your formula is what all kids want. It's not a race issue per se. Would you agree that the family breakdown has affected more black families than white families?

If yes, I see this as a temporary thing. Others are abandoning their kids for money also and not around. Kids do want their parents involved in what they're doing - not chasing the dollar and oodles of good encouragement.
38 posted on 11/20/2005 7:51:32 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people believe in Intelligent Design (God).)
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To: nmh

Good observation. I agree.


39 posted on 11/20/2005 7:59:09 AM PST by Thaddeus
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To: commish



Well my daughter is graduating from public school with a GPA of 4.5. She took weighted classes. She was just accepted into a private college. You get what you look for in public schools. She went for an education and that's what she got. Along with sports and extra activities.


40 posted on 11/20/2005 8:00:15 AM PST by SouthernFreebird
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To: pleikumud
So long as the black community disdainfully looks on good comportment and studiousness as "acting too white," this problem will never be solved.
41 posted on 11/20/2005 8:02:12 AM PST by Roccus
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To: nmh

Agree with the expense part. Ours was $5000 a year per child, but the expense was well worth the result. I was much happier with the return on that money over what Uncle Sam and the state take. Now if I could just get the tax part back and quit subsidizing substandard education for everyone else.


42 posted on 11/20/2005 8:03:10 AM PST by commish ((Montgomery, AL) Freedom Tastes Sweetest to Those Who Have Fought to Preserve It)
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To: pleikumud
My daughter goes to a 'fundamental' public school in the heart of St. Petersburg (Pinellas County) where the riots were a few years ago.

What is the difference with a 'fundamental' school to a regular public school? Required mandatory parental involvement and student behavior standards. This system has been used to attract the rich kids to the poor neighborhoods. There is a lottery, though if the child is a minority, the waiting list is shorter.

Here is the only difference between a fundamental public school and a regular public school:

* Parents must attend monthly PTA meetings

* Parents must sign homework each night. There is homework M-Th as well as some weekends

* Discipline rules for the kids

* Dress code for the kids

* Cannot be late to school

There are no exceptions to these rules. The elementary and middle schools she attended are in the top 10% of all Florida schools. Now the parent in this suit may have a leg on his arguement because the better teachers sign up for these schools since they don't have to deal with discipline problems and are attracted to parents who are required to be involved.

However minorities have no problem getting into these schools and benefiting from the excellent education.

43 posted on 11/20/2005 8:03:45 AM PST by nicolezmomma
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To: commish
Tell me about it!

We get this measly $700. for mileage, if you qualify for their radius (20 miles) since there is no bus service. I'd love to see vouchers. Our state spends 12K per student and the results are not there.
44 posted on 11/20/2005 8:09:26 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people believe in Intelligent Design (God).)
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To: SouthernFreebird
Having had Experience with the NC school systems I can see your daughter's success. Down here in Alabama public schools are a disgrace. THe straw that broke the camel's back for me was a letter from my Son's 9th grade english teacher -- the letter had 4 grammer error's and 11 mispellings in 4 paragraphs from someonewho was TEACHING High School English.

It was not a pretty sight when I sent the Letter back with RED PEN correction's (along with a copy to the school prinicipal).

45 posted on 11/20/2005 8:09:41 AM PST by commish ((Montgomery, AL) Freedom Tastes Sweetest to Those Who Have Fought to Preserve It)
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To: nicolezmomma
There are no exceptions to these rules

Why aren't the rules district wide?

46 posted on 11/20/2005 8:11:27 AM PST by EVO X
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To: pleikumud
The solution, which the left-wing democrats are fighting is to give them vouchers so they can go the school of their choice.

It has been the policy of the democrat party to keep people uneducated and poor so they can buy their votes. So far it has worked, but I believe that people want to be free and educated and make their own decisions in life. To do this they need education, and not for the government run schools which cannot do their job.
47 posted on 11/20/2005 8:17:51 AM PST by YOUGOTIT
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To: commish
It was not a pretty sight when I sent the Letter back with RED PEN correction's (along with a copy to the school prinicipal).

Anyone who dares to correct the teacher would have to pull their kid out from school after that. LOL

48 posted on 11/20/2005 8:18:00 AM PST by SouthernFreebird
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To: Black Birch
This question has been asked before. I don't know the answer. My guess is because most parents can't live with the rules or are willing to enforce them with their children. They seem like pretty simple, common-sense rules. However, lots of kids get kicked out due to either their laziness or their parents'. Also, where do you put the kids that get kicked out for not following the rules if all schools have to follow the rules? Right now if a kid gets kicked out of a fundamental school, they go to a regular non-fundamental public school. Children in the non-fundamental school system can go to a school of their choice in their zone. Based upon the FCAT scores and other criteria, all schools are graded so parents understand how a school is performing and this can influence their decision on where to put their child. The truth is, most parent don't really care.
49 posted on 11/20/2005 8:24:54 AM PST by nicolezmomma
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To: combat_boots
"They believe it was an ongoing neighborhood issue that started the fight."

Here in Southern Cali, we call that "gang related".

50 posted on 11/20/2005 8:36:02 AM PST by BenLurkin (O beautiful for patriot dream - that sees beyond the years)
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