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If Life Sentence is Worse than Death Penalty, Why do Tookie's Fans Seek it for Him? [Vanity]
governsleastgovernsbest

Posted on 11/27/2005 5:22:21 AM PST by governsleastgovernsbest

It is fashionable among death-penalty opponents to claim that life in prison without the possibility of parole amounts to worse punishment than the death penalty.

For example, Bill Kurtis, host of A&E's "Investigative Reports" who has written a book advocating abolition of the death penalty, asserts that:

"Life without parole is bad. Worse than [executing] somebody."

If death-penalty opponents truly believe this, then why would the supporters of Tookie Williams be so avidly advocating the commutation of his death sentence to life without parole? It's hard to believe they wish to inflict harsher punishment on Williams.

Isn't this proof that, despite their protestations, opponents of the death penalty recognize that it remains the supreme sanction?


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: California; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: criminaljustice; deathpenalty; lifewithoutparole; tookiewilliams

1 posted on 11/27/2005 5:22:23 AM PST by governsleastgovernsbest
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

Because the next step will be to demand he be freed.


2 posted on 11/27/2005 5:28:32 AM PST by KateatRFM
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

Liberals and Democrats: The supporters of abortion and euthanasia. Your headline captures it perfectly. The "Death" Party. Being alive=a fate worse than death.


3 posted on 11/27/2005 5:29:28 AM PST by Alia
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

Once they get the death penalty overturned, they will start pressing the Courts to find life without parole to be cruel and unusual punishment. The NYT has already started "editorializing" this view in several news stories.


4 posted on 11/27/2005 5:29:39 AM PST by writmeister
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

I totally agree. It might not be the life he wanted, but I'm sure he has made the best of a bad situation and has created a life for himself in prison that satisfies many of his wants, needs and desires and likely allows him to maintain his "business" outside. Why is he still breathing?


5 posted on 11/27/2005 5:31:11 AM PST by GBA (I believe Congressman Weldon! MSM do your job.)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

I think it is nice that the Leftist's will award him the Peace Prize.

CA should wait to see if he wins it then excute him.

That will show how much we care about that stupid, worthless, meaningless prize.

Didn't Yassar Arafat win it before too?


6 posted on 11/27/2005 5:32:45 AM PST by stockpirate (John Kerry & FBI files ==> http://www.freerepublic.com/~stockpirate/)
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To: All

On a related note, Fox & Friends Weekend just completed a segment trying to answer the question as to why there have been so many prison escapes recently.

The guest was a female federal prison consultant.

Her solution? Don't put so many people in prison. As is so typical, she wrung her hands over the number of 'non-violent' people in prison. Does she really want to release a flood of drug dealers back into society? Does she really believe they are 'non-violent'?

Hosts Julian Phillips and Alisyn Camerota were totally on board. They heartily agreed that "Martha Stewart is not a threat to society", etc. If I heard correctly, Julian said he was a big Martha fan.


7 posted on 11/27/2005 5:33:49 AM PST by governsleastgovernsbest (Watching the Today Show since 2002 so you don't have to.)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

A side note. In preparing this thread, I did an internet search for death penalty opponents who assert that life without parole is actually worse than death.

That's how I came across Kurtis' statement. However, you'll note that I used a parenthetical in the quote in which I inserted [executing]. Kurtis actually used the word, speaking of the death penalty, "killing." In other words, he wants to strip the death penalty of any cover of legitimacy.


8 posted on 11/27/2005 5:36:46 AM PST by governsleastgovernsbest (Watching the Today Show since 2002 so you don't have to.)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

Yes.


9 posted on 11/27/2005 5:44:29 AM PST by Ninian Dryhope
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To: Ninian Dryhope

Can't quite follow what the 'yes' refers to.


10 posted on 11/27/2005 5:48:33 AM PST by governsleastgovernsbest (Watching the Today Show since 2002 so you don't have to.)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

Because Tookie is running the Crips gang from prison and his minions will try and get him out of jail..


11 posted on 11/27/2005 5:56:33 AM PST by sheik yerbouty ( Make America and the world a jihad free zone!)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

Isn't this proof that, despite their protestations, opponents of the death penalty recognize that it remains the supreme sanction?


12 posted on 11/27/2005 5:59:44 AM PST by Ninian Dryhope
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To: KateatRFM

He'll need to be freed so he can have a good cry on a Barbara Walters special. Seriously, once he's on a life sentence, his mutant supporters will start yapping that he should be freed.


13 posted on 11/27/2005 6:03:40 AM PST by Sociopathocracy (Real martinis do not contain vodka, fruit juice or umbrellas.)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest
As is so typical, she wrung her hands over the number of 'non-violent' people in prison.

Like the Enron boys? She's probably want them to get death.

What qualifies one to be a prison consultant?

14 posted on 11/27/2005 6:06:15 AM PST by Sociopathocracy (Real martinis do not contain vodka, fruit juice or umbrellas.)
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To: GBA
I totally agree. It might not be the life he wanted, but I'm sure he has made the best of a bad situation and has created a life for himself in prison that satisfies many of his wants, needs and desires and likely allows him to maintain his "business" outside. Why is he still breathing?

Good question.

This is one area where O'Rielly makes some sense. We should go deep into Alaska and create a prison for the lifers from all 50 states. In order for them to survive, they have to grow their own food. Escape? Not likely, but if you do either the cold, the bears or the 'skeeters will get you. No Posse needed....

15 posted on 11/27/2005 6:07:15 AM PST by Thermalseeker
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To: Ninian Dryhope

Thanks for the clarification - I see we're on the same page.


16 posted on 11/27/2005 6:08:00 AM PST by governsleastgovernsbest (Watching the Today Show since 2002 so you don't have to.)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest
The only reason that this murderer and his ilk (like Mumia sp?) have such a leftist following is their ability to influence others. As soon as they pay the ultimate price, their ongiong influence ends.

In the meantime, they are able to write their drivel and perform on their closed circuit circuses to indoctrinate others to their cause.

If they were semi-literate petty criminals the Mike Farrells of the world wouldn't waste their time.

17 posted on 11/27/2005 6:15:52 AM PST by par4 (If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest
Beware anytime Hollywood celebrities select a pet cause.

Where is Ted Danson 15 years after his "expertise" warned of the oceans' demise in 10 years.

Norman Mailer helped a convicted murderer get out of jail because he had a way with words.

That guy killed again....for no apparent reason...... and is back in the slammer.

Where are all the Hollywood elite who threatened to move to France if Bush won the presidency in 2000?

Why is Johnny Depp disgusted with France?

18 posted on 11/27/2005 6:17:29 AM PST by CROSSHIGHWAYMAN (m)
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To: Sociopathocracy
What qualifies one to be a prison consultant?

Membership in the ACLU? ;-)

19 posted on 11/27/2005 6:19:00 AM PST by governsleastgovernsbest (Watching the Today Show since 2002 so you don't have to.)
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To: stockpirate
Didn't Yassar Arafat win it before too?

And Jimmy Carter.

Maybe before he croaks, Fidel Castro will get a token prize.

20 posted on 11/27/2005 6:21:00 AM PST by CROSSHIGHWAYMAN (m)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest
Good Sunday morning, my friend...a few disjointed observations..

1. How can this guy ask for clemency while still processing his innocence? If he has indeed turned his life around, the first step would be admitting what he did.

2. Death row inmates in California, where it talks what, 20-30 years, if ever, to get executed, have far better conditions and privileges than lifers who are in the general prison population.

3. Instead of wasting years, and millions of taxpayers' $$$$ on these endless appeals, I would rather support life without parole, and give the $$ to the victims' families.

4. Anyone remember Karla Fay Tucker?

21 posted on 11/27/2005 6:26:53 AM PST by ken5050 (Ann Coulter needs to have children ASAP to pass on her gene pool....any volunteers?)
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To: Thermalseeker
This is one area where O'Rielly makes some sense. We should go deep into Alaska and create a prison for the lifers from all 50 states. In order for them to survive, they have to grow their own food. Escape? Not likely, but if you do either the cold, the bears or the 'skeeters will get you. No Posse needed

Great idea. better yet, to defray costs We should sell t.v. rights and start "penal colony survivor: Alaska"

Just kidding about the tv thing, but what would be wrong with a penal colony, one that is self sustaining (you know, like most prisons used to be)

CC

22 posted on 11/27/2005 6:30:27 AM PST by Celtic Conservative (Billy Tauzin about Louisiana: "half the state is under water, the other half is under indictment")
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To: ken5050
How can this guy ask for clemency while still processing his innocence?

Good point.

As to the cost and time involved in implementing the death penalty, wouldn't another solution be to streamline the process?

In fact, though, I'm not a huge death penalty fan. But I certainly believe our society has a right to impose it if that's what the people, via their elected representatives, want.

23 posted on 11/27/2005 6:30:55 AM PST by governsleastgovernsbest (Watching the Today Show since 2002 so you don't have to.)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

But if the elected reps circumvent the will of the people, then the argument will of course be made in other states that the death penalty is being applied capriciously...IOW, all things being equal..the same crime that gets you killed in Texas does not get you executed in Cal..


24 posted on 11/27/2005 6:33:55 AM PST by ken5050 (Ann Coulter needs to have children ASAP to pass on her gene pool....any volunteers?)
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To: KateatRFM
Because the next step will be to demand he be freed.

Bingo. First the death penalty is "too cruel." Then life in prison is "too cruel," etc. The left's dream is to destabilize society by having violent criminals be given a few months of "counselling" and then let loose on society.

25 posted on 11/27/2005 6:34:12 AM PST by Wilhelm Tell (True or False? This is not a tag line.)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

Also he can continue to rape weaker inmates and assault
more guards...


26 posted on 11/27/2005 6:37:45 AM PST by joesnuffy (A camel once bit my sister...necessitating her untimely death..-Mullet Omar)
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To: governsleastgovernsbest
Short answer? The Left is enamored of death. Their values are twisted. That's why they can champion life for a mass murderer while yawning as an innocent woman is starved to death. Go figure.

(Denny Crane: "I Don't Want To Socialize With A Pinko Liberal Democrat Commie.Say What You Like About Republicans. We Stick To Our Convictions. Even When We Know We're Dead Wrong.")

27 posted on 11/27/2005 6:57:30 AM PST by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives On In My Heart Forever)
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To: goldstategop

Well put!


28 posted on 11/27/2005 6:59:19 AM PST by governsleastgovernsbest (Watching the Today Show since 2002 so you don't have to.)
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To: Sociopathocracy

not to mention his security level will be reduced


29 posted on 11/27/2005 7:04:10 AM PST by bdfromlv (Leavenworth hard time)
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To: CROSSHIGHWAYMAN

that guy committed suicide and got his due.


30 posted on 11/27/2005 7:06:21 AM PST by bdfromlv (Leavenworth hard time)
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To: ken5050

that would be a good one, give the money that automatic appeals for a death penalty generate for lawyers to the victims families and put the felon in general population for the rest of is life.


31 posted on 11/27/2005 7:09:14 AM PST by bdfromlv (Leavenworth hard time)
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To: Sociopathocracy
What qualifies one to be a prison consultant?

Reading a couple of books, going to a couple of lectures, maybe taking a tour of a prison or two, going to the right cocktail parties.

32 posted on 11/27/2005 8:10:48 AM PST by yankeedame ("Oh, I can take it but I'd much rather dish it out.")
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To: governsleastgovernsbest

Because then they can lobby for Tookie and other criminals to be released when they're old and sick -- there's a thread on this today, about how it's "uncompassionate" to keep prisoners in jail for life, and costs too much money.


33 posted on 11/27/2005 4:57:56 PM PST by NYCVirago
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A free society can't remain free unless it executes its worse offenders. Execution solves several problems that would otherwise cause the disintegration of society.

1. Witnesses no longer have to fear for their lives.
2. Killers can't escape and kill again.
3. Killers can't control other inmates.
4. Killers can't control people on the outside.
5. Killers are less apt to become popular icons.
34 posted on 11/27/2005 8:27:29 PM PST by webboy45
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