France's debt out of control

The Sunday Business Post ^ | 18 December 2005 | Thomas Hubert

[george76]

France's public debt is spiralling out of control, according to a report commissioned by the French government...

The debt stands at €1,117 billion, representing 66 per cent of France's GDP ...

The staggering figure encompasses the debt accumulated by the state and local authorities, as well as social and health insurance bodies, over the past few decades.

However, it does not include the upcoming time bomb of civil servants' pensions.

Over the past ten years, the French debt has increased its claim against GDP by over 10 percentage points.

France saw the worst debt evolution among the then 15 EU member states, while Ireland proved the best at reducing public debt.

The Pébereau report states that, if nothing changes, French debt will be four times the country's GDP by 2050.

French prime minister Dominique de Villepin, who received Pébereau's report last Wednesday...

said: “France spends too much ...

[RegulatorCountry]

One thousand, one hundred seventeen billion? LOL.

[Windcatcher]

The Death of Eurosocialism, about to happen before our eyes. Quick, get the marshmallows. This is going to be good.

[Sloth]

So what is that per capita, in US dollars?

[Marine_Uncle]

And to make things worse. France no longer has Saddam to sell reactors, and arms to in exchange for cheap oil. Poor widdle Chirac. His dreams all went up in smoke.

[JustAnotherOkie]

GBW needs to discuss this subject Sunday night.

[ncountylee]

Gee...that's too bad.

[Sloth]

Answering my own question -- about $22,000 per person; still a good bit less than ours.

[cmsgop]

That and a few other things and his approval would shoot into the 70's

[shield]

LOL...

Socialism Socialism Socialism

[BulletBobCo]

[george76]

"66 per cent of France's GDP..."

What is ours?

[Marine_Uncle]

"Gee...that's too bad."
heh heh. Yea. Perhaps they will wake up and see where their damn commie socialists have got them after all these years.

[RegulatorCountry]

"Answering my own question -- about $22,000 per person; still a good bit less than ours."

I don't think that question mark was a dollar sign. It's more likely to be Euros, trading at something on the order of $1.18 or so, I think, but am not certain.

[Dont_Tread_On_Me_888]

There are rumors that Standard and Poor's is about set to downgrade the debt of France.

[CheyennePress]

You're looking at 1,342 billion US dollars. France has about 60-million people. That's about $22,300 bucks per person.

Considering the French pay about 65% of their income in taxes (at least)...geez, that's a lot of dough.

Maybe it's a little off. Last I heard, France had a GDP per capita of about $25,000 dollars.

[RedBeaconNY]

Dona eis requiem... in muerte.

[Lancey Howard]

France's public debt is spiralling out of control, according to a report commissioned by the French government...

I can't even imagine how bad it must really be.

[Sloth]

Roughly 60% of GDP (~7 trillion / 11.75 trillion).

[CommandoFrank]

No wonder they didn't want to rid Iraq of Saddam. That cost them a zillion dollars...

[Lancey Howard]

However, it does not include the upcoming time bomb of civil servants' pensions.

Ah well.... they can always just raise taxes.
That's always been the answer of America's secular socialists, the Democrats.

[Sloth]

I don't think that question mark was a dollar sign.

Hmmm, it's not a question mark on my screen. Maybe your browser is set up w/ a font that doesn't have a Euro symbol?

[gathersnomoss]

"The debt stands at €1,117 billion, representing 66 per cent of France's GDP ... "

Whoa Nellie. Socialism ain't cheap. Eat that liberals.

[Reeses]

What is ours?

About the same. To put this in personal terms, a worker that makes $50,000 per year and has $33,0000 left on their mortgage would have a debt of 66% of their domestic product.

[Reeses]

$33,000 mortgage I meant.

[hermgem]

The French formula:
Accept new members into the European Community, keep new and poor members at their originally agreed upon annual deficit, but then spread total debt of all countries equally throughout Euroland.
France is not productive and grossly, grossly overspends without generating economic growth.
There is a reason why gold prices keep leapfrogging.
France is sucking oxygen out of the performing world's economies.

[oldbrowser]

The debt stands at €1,117 billion, representing 66 per cent of France's GDP ...

The USA debt in 2004 was 65% of GDP.

[Lancey Howard]

In his conclusions, Pébereau criticises successive governments - both right and leftwing

???
Excuse me? He's blaming Napoleon?

[beaver fever]

Sloth, your going to get in trouble for that one.

Debt is only bad when the bank says no.

My brother in law was over extended. He owned a house,an island lot and a boat.

He also quite his job to start up his own business which he borrowed money to get going.

The bank kept giving him credit until he sold the boat which the bank was not interested in foreclosing on since boat sales in his town were flat.

Once the boat was sold they foreclosed on everything and forced him into bankruptcy.

Banks and creditor nations foreclose when it's in their advantage not your convience.

[Personal Responsibility]

Why is this even news? Logic says it can't be any other way.

They don't produce anything, they hardly work. If the government is footing the bill for all of their programs, like that wonderful universal healthcare, it has to come from taxes, tariffs, aid etc... If those are not enough to cover the programs either some programs have to be cut or the government has to go into defecit spending.

Since there is more going out via programs and entitlements than there is coming in, it is restating the obvious to say their books are in the red.

Any other country that follows their model will also suffer their fate. It's inescapable.

[satchmodog9]

Look at what it costs here.

[CAWats]

It's so annoying that all the packages in the stores have french translations. Does anyone know how this got started? I mean how many people speak only french?

[beaver fever]

Sloth, your going to get in trouble for that one.

Debt is only bad when the bank says no.

My brother in law was over extended. He owned a house,an island lot and a boat.

He also quite his job to start up his own business which he borrowed money to get going.

The bank kept giving him credit until he sold the boat which the bank was not interested in foreclosing on since boat sales in his town were flat.

Once the boat was sold they foreclosed on everything and forced him into bankruptcy.

Banks and creditor nations foreclose when it's in their advantage not your convenience.

[Travis McGee]

Banks and creditor nations foreclose when it's in their advantage not your convience.

Thank God the Chinese love us, and will always indulge us.

[beaver fever]

Well as we all know love is a fickle thing.

BTW the Chinese and Japanese are converting their dollar reserves into gold which is driving the latest gold spike.

Unlike Banks, countries generally give you a heads up as to their intensions.

[F.J. Mitchell]

Not to worry. The US tax-payers will bail their prissy asses out. What are snubbed,disdained and pissed on old friends for, anyway?

[old republic]

Sounds like France has been as fiscally responsible as the US. We should be very concerned about the Chinese and Japanese turning their reserves into gold. It threatens to destabilize the dollar and it could be destructive to the US economy. Spikes in gold are often times an ominous sign.

[Rocky]

Love that graphic!

[Savage Beast]

"if nothing changes, French debt will be four times the country's GDP by 2050."

Prepare to pick up some bargains.

[Savage Beast]

“we must take the matter into our own hands.”

Uh...that's the problem, Dominique...you already did.

MESSAGE TO THE PEOPLE OF LA BELLE FRANCE: Try this for a solution: (1) Can Villepin, Chirac, et al. (2) Abandon Marxism. (3) Establish capitalism. (4) Follow the leadership of George W. Bush.

[beaver fever]

This particular spike is a bit opaque. Japanese dollar buying maybe just a signal for speculators to do some profit taking.

Hence the $17.00 fall back on the gold price. It will be interesting what gold does from now til February.

If Gold rebounds in the first quarter 2006 then you are looking at gold bull based on currency instability and supply side fundamentals. That is the indicator of a precious metals breakout that will be sustainable.

[beaver fever]

Sorry dollar buying should be gold buying.

Also Russia is icreasing it's gold reserves.

There seems to be a general flight from fiat currency not just the US dollar. Japanese gold buying could be a reaction the weakness in the Yen.

You know there is a problem when a country goes to gold when their own currency is devaluating.

The Rats are the first to leave a sinking ship.

[paristwelve]

Right on. The French are loathe to admit that their position towards Sadam was, "Hey, it fills the coffers".

[old republic]

Yeah, the US should probably look into seriosly getting gold to back its currency as in days of yore because of the increasing lack of faith in the dollar. Many countries are increasingly losing faith in the dollar. Earlier in the year China assessed the dollar as unstable. The increasing deficit doesn't help. The gigantic amount of US treasury bonds that is held by China and Japan may lead to a potentially dangerous situation. The US better brace itself for impact if its not careful.

[beaver fever]

There is not enough gold above or below ground to go back to the gold standard.

Too much fiat out there. But gold is becoming a hedge against currency fluctuation and equity over valuation.

Like I said on earlier threads, if you bought physical gold or gold equities four years ago you would have a nice buffer in your portfolio now.

There is still some serious upside in gold juniors with good advanced stage projects. The juniors are considerably undervalued.

[Caipirabob]

If france can no longer sell to terorists because the United States has destroyed the terrorist's underground economy, france is dead.

Let freedom ring...

[RedWhiteBlue]

It's so annoying that all the packages in the stores have french translations. Does anyone know how this got started? I mean how many people speak only french?

It's probably done that way so that the manufacturer can sell it into Canada without having to have two separate packages for the product (one for the US, another bilingual for Canada). Canada requires, by law, that all information on a package / label to be in English and French.

[RetiredArmy]

It dies there, but we are rapidly adopting it here. The socialist democrats and the nanny-to-grave liberals here want this. The refusal to work group here, give me my handout, government indoctrination school educated group want this. More play, less work, more benefits. Why work at all when the government taxes everyone into oblivion to get the handout money for these votes!

[Almondjoy]

All you will see is a falling dollar to make foreign made goods far more expensive. Thus eliminating the trade defceit and beginning a whole new expansion of factories springing back up in the US. China and Japan have alot to lose by no longer backing the US dollar. Their whole economies.

[GSlob]

Nothing new there. IIRC, French state debt has been out of control as early as the days of king Henry II, in 1550s. So here one is speaking about 450+ years of more or less continuous bankruptcy, financial, moral and otherwise. By now it must be a hallowed tradition.