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Unwarranted Outrage (The Times blew our cover)
National Review Online ^ | 12/19/05 | James S. Robbins

Posted on 12/19/2005 12:01:30 PM PST by frankjr

I have no doubt that revelations in the New York Times that the NSA has been conducting selective and limited surveillance of terrorist communications crossing into or out of the United States will be immensely valuable to our enemies. I also have no doubt that these and similar actions can be legal, even when conducted without warrants.

How could that be? From the sound and fury of the last few days from politicians and pundits, you would think this is a development as scandalous as Attorney General Robert F. Kennedy's authorization to wiretap Martin Luther King Jr. But the legality of the acts can be demonstrated with a look through the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA). For example, check out section 1802, "Electronic Surveillance Authorization Without Court Order." It is most instructive. There you will learn that "Notwithstanding any other law, the President, through the Attorney General, may authorize electronic surveillance without a court order under this subchapter to acquire foreign intelligence information for periods of up to one year" (emphasis mine).

Naturally, there are conditions. For example, the surveillance must be aimed at "the acquisition of the contents of communications transmitted by means of communications used exclusively between or among foreign powers." Wait, is a terrorist group considered a foreign power? Yes, as defined in section 1801, subsection (a), "foreign power" can mean "a group engaged in international terrorism or activities in preparation therefore," though the statue language would explicitly apply to "a faction of a foreign nation or nations."

But isn't international terrorism that which takes place abroad, as opposed to homegrown domestic terrorism? Not exactly: Section 1801 subsection (c) defines international terrorism as, among other things, terrorist actions that "occur totally outside the United States, or transcend national boundaries in terms of the means by which they are accomplished, the persons they appear intended to coerce or intimidate, or the locale in which their perpetrators operate or seek asylum." So if you are hiding, making plans, facilitating, attacking, or intending to spread fear inside the US, and have a link abroad, you are an international terrorist. Quite sensible.

O.K. fine, but what about the condition that there be "no substantial likelihood that the surveillance will acquire the contents of any communication to which a United States person is a party?" Doesn't that necessarily cut out any and all communication that is domestic in origin or destination? Well, not quite. Return to section 1801, subsection (i): "United States person," which includes citizens, legal aliens, and businesses, explicitly "does not include a corporation or an association which is a foreign power."

Well sure, but does that mean that even if you are a citizen you cash in your abovementioned rights by collaborating with terrorists? Yes you do. You have then become an "Agent of a foreign power" as defined under subsection (b)(2)(C). Such agents include anyone who "knowingly engages in sabotage or international terrorism, or activities that are in preparation therefor, for or on behalf of a foreign power," and even includes those who aid and abet or knowingly conspire with those engaged in such behavior.

Wait, that includes anyone, even citizens? Yes — subsection (b)(1) is the part that applies to foreigners; (b)(2) covers everybody. And the whole point of the act is to collect "foreign intelligence information," which is defined under section 1801 subsection (e)(1)(B) as "information that relates to, and if concerning a United States person is necessary to, the ability of the United States to protect against sabotage or international terrorism by a foreign power or an agent of a foreign power."

Whoa, you say, that is way too much power for the president to wield without checks and balances! Well, true, and since Congress wrote this law, they included reporting requirements. The attorney general must report to the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence and the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence 30 days prior to the surveillance, except in cases of emergency, when he must report immediately. He must furthermore "fully inform" those committees on a semiannual basis thereafter, per section 1808 subsection (a). He must also send a copy of the surveillance authorization under seal to the so-called FISA Court as established in section 1803; not for a warrant, but to remain under seal unless certification is necessary under future court actions from aggrieved parties under section 1806 (f).

This is significant, because it means that some of the same politicians who have been charging abuse of power may also have been briefed on what was going on long ago. The White House should get ahead of the story by noting which congressmen were informed of these activities, instead of allowing them to grandstand so shamelessly. It would also help if the White House released some information on how the surveillance has helped keep the country safe. What attacks were disrupted, what terrorists were taken down, how many people saved? A few declassified examples would be very useful to ground the discussion in reality rather than rhetoric.

So how do the revelations in the Times help the terrorists? Think it through — if you were a terrorist and you believed (as most people seem to) that the NSA would ignore your communications if they crossed U.S. borders, your best move would be to set up communications relay stations inside the U.S. Terrorists are well known for their ability to find and exploit loopholes in our laws, and this would be a natural. For all we know our intelligence agencies have been exploiting these types of communications for years without the terrorists knowing it. Now they will fall silent, because now the bad guys know better. So New York Times writer James Risen will sell his book, the Times will increase circulation, politicians will beat their breasts and send out fundraising letters, and who will pay in the end?

You can answer that one.


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: fisa; homelandsecurity; jamesrisen; jamesrisengay; nsa; nyt; patriotleak; phonyoutrage; spying
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To: frankjr
You can now be classified as begging to have your rights taken away.

good luck with that.

21 posted on 12/19/2005 12:50:59 PM PST by Vladiator
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To: r9etb

Just like Sandy Berger!


22 posted on 12/19/2005 1:02:20 PM PST by Tannerone
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To: Howlin; Marine_Uncle; Grampa Dave; NormsRevenge; SierraWasp; Coop; Mo1; Peach
ROFL!!!

What a useful graphic....you would find me posting that Graphic at least Forty times a day recently....

Pinging some others just in case they hadn't got a ping as yet!

23 posted on 12/19/2005 1:05:10 PM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Maceman

Hey, Hey! Enough of that talk.

We don't need to be giving out information like that.


24 posted on 12/19/2005 1:10:38 PM PST by gogogodzilla (Raaargh! Raaargh! Crush, Stomp!)
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To: frankjr
The NSA has been using this technology long before Bush was ever President and they're not likely to quit using it in the near term.
25 posted on 12/19/2005 1:12:28 PM PST by wolfcreek
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To: All
Some links on this thread:

“Bush Spying Story” Is Four Years Old

26 posted on 12/19/2005 1:13:34 PM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

LOL. I'd hate to see my brainwaves today. At least they are moving though, as opposed to the day after Thanksgiving when I was virtually comotose.


27 posted on 12/19/2005 1:14:54 PM PST by Peach (The Clintons pardoned more terrorists than they ever captured or killed.)
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To: Cap Huff

fyi


28 posted on 12/19/2005 1:14:56 PM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: sauropod

rl


29 posted on 12/19/2005 1:16:33 PM PST by sauropod ("The love that dare not speak its' name has now become the love that won't shut the hell up.")
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To: frankjr
Make no mistake about it--it isn't just the Left that will be dancing in the streets about this bit of ammunition to use against the administration. The JBS/"palaeo" Right is doing the exact same thing. Like the Left, they admire foreign dictators but but will cut their own government to ribbons for actions about one sixtieth as onerous.

Back when I was a JBS member I wrote them to express my belief that a military draft was unconstitutional, since no such thing is explicitly mentioned in the Constitution (they do adhere to the Jeffersonian theory of interpretation, after all). They wrote back to explain just why a military draft was constitutional and informed me that my anti-draft belief was libertarian rather than conservative. Well guess what? Now that we are fighting moslems rather than Communists (and Jews are perceived as benefiting) they have suddenly discovered that a military draft is totalitarian and statist (just like during World War II!), and William Norman Grigg (editor of their magazine) has been writing on LewRockwell.com attacking the draft much more than I did in my once-upon-a-time letter to them.

The utter hypocrisy of the JBS and the other "palaeos," just like that of the Left, never fails to sicken me.

30 posted on 12/19/2005 1:21:10 PM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Liberal Jews and conservative chr*stians should switch religions.)
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To: frankjr
Attorney General Robert F. Kennedy's authorization to wiretap Martin Luther King Jr.

Just felt like repeating that...

31 posted on 12/19/2005 1:25:07 PM PST by T. Buzzard Trueblood (left unchecked, Saddam Hussein...will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons." Sen. Hillary Clinton)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
"What a useful graphic....you would find me posting that Graphic at least Forty times a day recently...."
Sometimes I wonder why I spend so much time at this site. This stuff could drive one nuts after a while. But alas.... one must attempt to stay balanced. Heh heh whatever that really means.
32 posted on 12/19/2005 1:35:04 PM PST by Marine_Uncle (Honor must be earned)
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To: Marine_Uncle
LOL!

I have to restrict my time here since I started taking medication for high blood pressure.....this stuff totally overwhelms it.....have to be content watching sport shows on the TV also.
33 posted on 12/19/2005 1:38:34 PM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
"I have to restrict my time here since I started taking medication for high blood pressure.....this stuff totally overwhelms it.....have to be content watching sport shows on the TV also."
I should get my blood pressure checked some day. Not having insurance sort of is a bumber. Don't knock yourself out. Life is to preciouse to let the "goons of the world" make one miserable.
34 posted on 12/19/2005 1:46:42 PM PST by Marine_Uncle (Honor must be earned)
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To: finnman69

Maybe the citizens of this country should take it from here. Perhaps we should file a class action law suit against the NYT and their shareholders for endangering our lives and the lives of our families.


35 posted on 12/19/2005 1:55:14 PM PST by McGavin999 (If Intelligence Agencies can't find leakers, how can we expect them to find terrorists?)
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To: McGavin999

BTTT


36 posted on 12/19/2005 2:00:19 PM PST by shield (The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instructions.Pr 1:7)
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To: msnimje
How can the "he told us a dozen times but we don't know what he is talking about" mantra be considered a good political tactic?

Because the American public doesn't care enough to follow issues that take more than 1 day to develop, and with the guidance of our wonderful media sources, they'll never put two and two together.

How long did it take until a FReeper had to inform the LSM that Cindy Sheehan had already been interviewed a year earlier? Americans don't connect the dots unless its laid out in front of them - as this article does.

37 posted on 12/19/2005 2:00:31 PM PST by BostonianRightist ("Moderation in pursuit of justice is no virtue." ~ Senator Goldwater)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

Bummer Ernest....get that BP under control so you can get back here fast.


38 posted on 12/19/2005 2:02:24 PM PST by Dog
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To: Marine_Uncle

That was a good read. Final nays and no shows on the bill

NAYS--4

Byrd
Durbin
Feingold
Harkin

NOT VOTING--6

Biden
Graham (FL)
Kennedy
Kerry
Lieberman
Murkowski


39 posted on 12/19/2005 2:10:53 PM PST by penelopesire
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To: penelopesire
"That was a good read. Final nays and no shows on the bill."
Glad you found it of some use. I found Chuck Schumer's remarks a bit interesting.
40 posted on 12/19/2005 2:38:15 PM PST by Marine_Uncle (Honor must be earned)
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