Jimmy Carter Assumed Same Spy Power As Bush

Sweetness & Light ^ | December 19, 2005 | N/A

[Sam Hill]

Almost immediately after the enactment of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978, President Jimmy "the Saint" Carter issued Executive Order #12139:

Foreign Intelligence Electronic Surveillance

By the authority vested in me as President by Sections 102 and 104 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 (50 U.S.C. 1802 and 1804), in order to provide as set forth in that Act for the authorization of electronic surveillance for foreign intelligence purposes, it is hereby ordered as follows:

1-101. Pursuant to Section 102(a)(1) of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 (50 U.S.C. 1802(a)), the Attorney General is authorized to approve electronic surveillance to acquire foreign intelligence information without a court order, but only if the Attorney General makes the certifications required by that Section.

1-102. Pursuant to Section 102(b) of the Foreign Intelligence Act of 1978 (50 U.S.C. 1802(b)), the Attorney General is authorized to approve applications to the court having jurisdiction under Section 103 of that Act to obtain orders for electronic surveillance for the purpose of obtaining foreign intelligence information.

1-103. Pursuant to Section 104(a)(7) of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 (50 U.S.C. 1804(a)(7)), the following officials, each of whom is employed in the area of national security or defense, is designated to make the certifications required by Section 104(a)(7) of the Act in support of applications to conduct electronic surveillance:
(a) Secretary of State.
(b) Secretary of Defense.
(c) Director of Central Intelligence.
(d) Director of the Federal Bureau of Investigation.
(e) Deputy Secretary of State.
(f) Deputy Secretary of Defense.
(g) Deputy Director of Central Intelligence.
None of the above officials, nor anyone officially acting in that capacity, may exercise the authority to make the above certifications, unless that official has been appointed by the President with the advice and consent of the Senate.

1-104. [Deleted]

1-105. [Deleted]

[Secs. 1-104 and 1-105 amended Executive Order 12036 of Jan. 24, 1978, which was revoked by Executive Order 12333 of Dec. 4, 1981.]

Jimmy Carter
1978

Once more, with feeling:

[T]he Attorney General is authorized to approve electronic surveillance to acquire foreign intelligence information without a court order, but only if the Attorney General makes the certifications required by that Section.

Again, none of this is news, except to the New York Times. And we all know why they are pretending it's new to them.

[Sam Hill]

But that was then, this is now.

[WorkingClassFilth]

Nice work, Sam. I'm sure Ham Jordan is spinning in his grave just imagining the implications.

[satchmodog9]

If Jimmy said it was OK then it must be fine.

[Fiddlstix]

BTTT

[digger48]

Yeah, but Jimmah was only worried about aliens, not communists or terrorists.

[frankjr]

Well Jimmy is in good company...with Clinton his Echelon program:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1543318/posts

[stocksthatgoup]

Great Find.... Sam Hill (a name to be proud of)

[wagglebee]

Of course it never once entered the pathetic traitor's mind to ACT on any of this intelligence.

[msnimje]

On the Democrat Coat of Arms:

Do as we say, not as we do.

[Pikachu_Dad]

Jimmah was worried about rabbits too. never forget the rabbit.

[fhlh]

He is a democRAT... when democRAT Presidents use their 'executive powers' in such a way, the media turns a blind eye.... It's rather sickening, actually.

[neodad]

Yeah, but Jimmah was only worried about aliens, not communists or terrorists

And rabbits.

[neodad]

Thundershock Picachu. Beat me by 21 seconds.

[USS Alaska]

I'll bet that every President, including Reagan, Bush41 and lewinski's sperm donor have used that same act in the same way. Well, bj may have extended it to include political enemies and we know that he didn't want osama.

[Puppage]

Nice work, Sam. I'm sure Ham Jordan is spinning in his grave just imagining the implications

If he's spinning in his grave, it's because he's STILL alive.

[eyespysomething]

Well, aliens and killer wabbits.

[MizSterious]

Good work, Sam Hill. Did you by any chance hear Jonathan Turley on O'Reilly this evening saying that the President had committed an impeachable offense? The libs are absolutely salivating. Some are just stupid; others know better and hope to make enough noise to cause trouble. I think Turley belongs to the second group.

[Fresh Wind]

Yeah, but Jimmah was only worried about aliens, not communists or terrorists.

Really? We were able to intercept communications between flying saucers and the mother ship back then?

[mystery-ak]

You have forgotten there is no history before Jan 2001....

[oceanview]

its not just Turley, I listened to both ABC and CBS national news radio tonight - they are both on an "impeachment footing" over this, led by the Feingold statement today.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

Jimmah did this? Was disco music playing in the background?

[Carolinamom]

Ping to Carter Use of electronic surveillance

[woofie]

I think a little rabbit told him to do it

[Carolinamom]

Sorry Sam...I meant to ping someone else to your excellent post.

[Texasforever]

This is why I don't put much stock in those on FR that bring up the fact that Bush cannot do certain things because that would set the precedent for democrats to do it too. The democrats have ALWAYS spied on Americans. The democrats will do what they want if and when they regain power. Bush cannot tie his own hands for fear of what democrats will do in the future anyway.

[digger48]

We were able to intercept communications between flying saucers and the mother ship back then?

Farrakan did.

[satchmodog9]

Here is a lib holding the actual coat of arms

[Carolinamom]

Ping....Carter used electronic surveillance w/out a warrent.

[satchmodog9]

Sorry, not a lib on this photo. That was another from my collection.

[Fresh Wind]

Farrakan did.

That doesn't count 'cause he's one of them.

[Chicos_Bail_Bonds]

ping

[princess leah]

Maybe it's time Bush called in Clinton's poker chips and give him a chance to "pay the piper" by writing an op-ed for the NYT stating how he also used executive orders and he wasn't a war president. Although Bush WAS only trying to rehab that reprobate by putting him and his own dad in charge of the tsunami and Katrina disaster funding groups, this might not be a bad time to ask for that favor to be returned! The least he could do is call off the attack dogs in his own party...

[MizSterious]

I've been out and about most of the day, so I missed a lot I'm sure. It doesn't surprise me that this is being brought up; they've been wanting revenge for Clinton's impeachment for a long time. Evil bunch, all of them.

[Peach]

So the great Jimmy Carter used the same powers as Bush and that was okay.

The great Bill Clinton used the same powers as Bush and that was okay.

Bush uses those same powers, post 9/11, with the approval and knowledge of Congress, and the left is talking impeachment.

Okey doke. If Republican Congressmen don't read this site, they had darned better start doing so immediately. Because I am going to be one ticked off freeper if I hear a bunch of lousy Republicans not knowing the facts. Again.

[woofie]

It was different back then ... A Democrat was in office

[silentknight]

Thank god...so that makes it okay?

I think not. Trampling on our rights...is always wrong. There is no excuse for this.

[Psycho_Bunny]

[bnelson44]

What right? They are only going after those who are calling al-Qaeda linked people. You calling people we all should know about?

[CarolinaGuitarman]

But Jimmah wasn't no fascist chimp Republican, so it was just dandy.


/sarc off

[BallyBill]

This whole "spying" dust up must be a Rove plot. I was angry, but I guess it is just another plot to get the Dems on the record as opposing the safety of the American people.

[God luvs America]

but they will come back and claim it does not state "spying on Americans"..

[Deathmonger]

You are misrepresenting this executive order. Carter did not assert that the Attorney General could authorize wiretaps without notifying the FISA court--indeed it says that he must certify that the taps will not violate FISA and then he is to approve applications to the FISA court.

This executive order merely makes the Attorney General the central approver within the executive branch bureaucracy. He still has to go get approval (before or after the fact) from the FISA court.

Sorry. Read it, it doesn't say what you are claiming it says.

[gondramB]

This doesn't say that it was authorized to be done to U.S. citizens while they were in the country....

[processing please hold]

So this started with Carter? lolololol I can't wait to spread the word to a few liberals.

[BohDaThone]

I don't think that Bush's actions were under the same authority cited here. A quick Google comes up with this text of the relevant statute, 50 USC 1802(a):

(a) (1) Notwithstanding any other law, the President, through the Attorney General, may authorize electronic surveillance without a court order under this subchapter to acquire foreign intelligence information for periods of up to one year if the Attorney General certifies in writing under oath that—

(A) the electronic surveillance is solely directed at— (i) the acquisition of the contents of communications transmitted by means of communications used exclusively between or among foreign powers, as defined in section 1801 (a)(1), (2), or (3) of this title; or (ii) the acquisition of technical intelligence, other than the spoken communications of individuals, from property or premises under the open and exclusive control of a foreign power, as defined in section 1801 (a)(1), (2), or (3) of this title;

(B) there is no substantial likelihood that the surveillance will acquire the contents of any communication to which a United States person is a party; and

(C) the proposed minimization procedures with respect to such surveillance meet the definition of minimization procedures under section 1801 (h) of this title; and if the Attorney General reports such minimization procedures and any changes thereto to the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence and the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence at least thirty days prior to their effective date, unless the Attorney General determines immediate action is required and notifies the committees immediately of such minimization procedures and the reason for their becoming effective immediately. (2) An electronic surveillance authorized by this subsection may be conducted only in accordance with the Attorney General’s certification and the minimization procedures adopted by him. The Attorney General shall assess compliance with such procedures and shall report such assessments to the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence and the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence under the provisions of section 1808 (a) of this title.

I haven't heard anything about such certifications having been made, or that the surveillance was limited to conversations among foreign powers, as required in (A) or not likely to hear conversations of a "US party" as required in (B).

Not saying whether Bush was right or wrong, but I don't think he acted pursuant to this statute, which apparently Carter did, at least from the cited EO.

[demitall]

ping to follow up

[oceanview]

it was legal in all cases - Carter, Clinton, Bush. we might see a "revelation" that Reagan used it too - good gosh, there are so many americans in gulags over this abuse of executive power, what are we to do!

[processing please hold]

Are you sure about the guy being a lib? I remember seeing the picture way back and I believe he is a good guy.

[WorkingClassFilth]

Actually, that's not a bad thought...

[processing please hold]

Never mind. I saw you corrected as I went down the post.