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ACLJ to Defend Two Pharmacists Fired for Refusing to Provide Abortifacients (Where's the ACLU???)
LifeSiteNews ^ | 23 December 2005

Posted on 12/22/2005 3:02:47 PM PST by Aussie Dasher

The American Center for Law and Justice (ACLJ) announced today that legal action is underway in defense of two pharmacists who were fired for refusing to hand out abortifacient drugs.

“These Conscience Clause cases are significant and represent the cutting edge of the abortion debate in our country right now;” ACLJ said in a statement to the press. “Doctors, nurses and pharmacists should not be compelled to violate their conscience and participate in an abortion procedure. We have already had success in a number of cases around the country, and we are confident that we will succeed in Illinois as well.”


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; News/Current Events; Philosophy; US: Illinois
KEYWORDS: abortifacients; abortion; aclj; conscience; conscienceclausel; lawsuit; morningafterpill; pharmacists; pharmacy; ru486
Where are those champions of civil rights, the ACLU, in this case? (sarc off)
1 posted on 12/22/2005 3:02:49 PM PST by Aussie Dasher
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To: Aussie Dasher

Enormous respect for these guys that refuse to kill babies and take a stand.


2 posted on 12/22/2005 3:19:16 PM PST by Joe Boucher (an enemy of islam)
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To: Joe Boucher

They are modern-day heroes and will be recognised as such in generations to come.


3 posted on 12/22/2005 3:22:00 PM PST by Aussie Dasher (The Great Ronald Reagan & John Paul II - Heaven's Dream Team!)
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To: Aussie Dasher
Where's the ACLU???

Hey, they are "the cavalary" that usually only rides to the rescue of
Communists, pedophiles and Jerry Springer freak show types.
4 posted on 12/22/2005 3:24:07 PM PST by VOA
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To: Aussie Dasher
Doctors, nurses and pharmacists should not be compelled to violate their conscience and participate in an abortion procedure.

Absolutely NOT.

Their job also doesn't compel them to drop the guillotine OR pull the switch on the electric chair -- which is even a lesser equivalent.

5 posted on 12/22/2005 3:28:50 PM PST by F16Fighter
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To: Aussie Dasher

First, I am not prolife and I only mention this because I agree that the pharmacists have the right to sell or not sell whatever they want (assuming it is legal) based on whatever reasoning they choose.


6 posted on 12/22/2005 3:33:41 PM PST by ndt
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To: Aussie Dasher
..defense of two pharmacists who were fired for refusing to hand out abortifacient drugs.

What crime are the pharmacists charged with?

I thought they had simply been terminated for not performing their jobs, not for committing a crime.

7 posted on 12/22/2005 3:36:49 PM PST by evad
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To: evad
"I thought they had simply been terminated for not performing their jobs, not for committing a crime."

Ahhh.. you're right, I missed the "fired" part. Note to self read the dang article before posting.

Let me restate my previous post with the new facts in mind.

I agree that the pharmacists pharmacies have the right to sell or not sell whatever they want (assuming it is legal) based on whatever reasoning they choose. They also have the right to fire the pharmacists if he refuses to do his/her job. The pharmacists have the right to look for another pharmacy to work at that shares common points of view.
8 posted on 12/22/2005 3:48:46 PM PST by ndt
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To: ndt

ditto!!!!!!!!


9 posted on 12/22/2005 3:59:47 PM PST by evad
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To: Aussie Dasher

The ACLU is supporting terrorist, and trying to kill Christmas - that is where they are.


10 posted on 12/22/2005 4:20:59 PM PST by YOUGOTIT
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To: ndt
Hmmm ~ how about adding "within the bounds of morality, and with violation of freedom of conscience, speech or association".

I know you don't believe in freedom of conscience, but just about everybody else does.

11 posted on 12/22/2005 5:12:14 PM PST by muawiyah (-)
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To: muawiyah
"I know you don't believe in freedom of conscience, but just about everybody else does."

They are fee to express their conscience by associating with a Pharmacy that does not provide abortifacient drugs.

As a pharmacist they damn well know what they sell at a pharmacy. If they had a problem with it they need to make that known when they are interviewing. If they refuse to do their job, yes fire them.

Here are some other Words of Wisdom© for those looking for a job.

Vegans, especially those affiliated with Peta should not apply for a job flipping burgers at McDonald's.

White supremacist should not apply for a job to sell bread at at the Black Muslim Bakery.

Homosexuals should not try to become Catholic priests.

Those uncomfortable with having their breasts on display should not work at a place called Hooters.

There is nothing preventing these people from successfully executing the demands of their jobs (I'm sure there is a Catholic soon to reply), but if they refuse to do what their bosses tell them to do they may be summarily dismissed.
12 posted on 12/22/2005 5:32:07 PM PST by ndt
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To: ndt
The rules were changed after they were hired. On the other hand, the rules really weren't changed since Illinois law still prohibits what happened. The Governor of Illinois issued an executive order that requires pharmacies to violate the law.

I am sure this will all be worked out in court.

The lesson is that people in Illinois don't know how to vote or this Governor would have been left to his own devices running the slots or something.

13 posted on 12/22/2005 5:35:59 PM PST by muawiyah (-)
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To: muawiyah
"The rules were changed after they were hired. "

I'm not sure what you are referring to, the guy in Texas said:

"In my mind if I agree to work for someone knowing that that's their policy, then I should submit to that policy. But I didn't even know about it,"

That is just a plea of ignorance.

"The Governor of Illinois issued an executive order that requires pharmacies to violate the law."

I don't see that mentioned in the article and I'm not up on Illinois politics so I will refrain on commenting. If you have information that you think would change my mind and you have the desire to do so feel free to post and I'll give it a fair hearing.
14 posted on 12/22/2005 5:50:39 PM PST by ndt
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To: muawiyah
Illinois law still prohibits what happened.

What law would that be?

15 posted on 12/22/2005 6:13:00 PM PST by evad
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To: ndt
Only one thing is certain - abortion and the use of abortificient contraceptives is plain murder.
16 posted on 12/22/2005 6:49:47 PM PST by Irish_Thatcherite (~~~A vote for Bertie Ahern is a vote for Gerry Adams!~~~)
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To: Irish_Thatcherite

"Only one thing is certain - abortion and the use of abortificient contraceptives is plain murder."

Not as defined by the laws of the nation.


17 posted on 12/22/2005 6:51:02 PM PST by ndt
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To: ndt
Does anyone take the oath to do no harm anymore? Even physicians?
18 posted on 12/22/2005 6:52:24 PM PST by Libertina
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To: ndt

Unborn children are getting murdered irrespective of how the law defines it.


19 posted on 12/22/2005 6:55:06 PM PST by Irish_Thatcherite (~~~A vote for Bertie Ahern is a vote for Gerry Adams!~~~)
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To: Libertina
Good question, I wonder if there is a form of Hippocratic Oath for pharmacists?
20 posted on 12/22/2005 6:57:14 PM PST by Irish_Thatcherite (~~~A vote for Bertie Ahern is a vote for Gerry Adams!~~~)
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To: Libertina
"Does anyone take the oath to do no harm anymore? Even physicians?"

I'm not a doctor nor have I ever played one on TV but I'm pretty sure they do have to recite the Hippocratic oath or maybe thats just an urban legend, I would have to look it up.
21 posted on 12/22/2005 6:58:59 PM PST by ndt
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To: Irish_Thatcherite
"Unborn children are getting murdered irrespective of how the law defines it."

Well for good or bad we are a nation of laws. Leaving 3 options.

1) change the law
2) change the minds of the people so that they agree and voluntarily comply
3) overthrow the nation (highly not recommended)
22 posted on 12/22/2005 7:04:01 PM PST by ndt
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To: ndt
1) change the law

I hope that will happen.

2) change the minds of the people so that they agree and voluntarily comply

There is no voluntarily about it, what they are doing is wrong.

3) overthrow the nation (highly not recommended)

Not necessary.

23 posted on 12/22/2005 7:12:17 PM PST by Irish_Thatcherite (~~~A vote for Bertie Ahern is a vote for Gerry Adams!~~~)
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To: Irish_Thatcherite
"There is no voluntarily about it, what they are doing is wrong."

My point was educating them and changing their hearts so to speak. To be cliche, you will catch more flys with honey than with vinegar. Not suggesting your using vinegar now :)
24 posted on 12/22/2005 7:21:04 PM PST by ndt
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To: ndt

I support educating people on the wrongs of abortion.


25 posted on 12/22/2005 7:26:35 PM PST by Irish_Thatcherite (~~~A vote for Bertie Ahern is a vote for Gerry Adams!~~~)
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To: Joe Boucher

"Enormous respect for these guys that refuse to kill babies and take a stand."

Kill babies? You're implying that these pharmacies are asking their pharmacists to yank kids out of strollers and kill them, stab and maim babies in-utero, and basically murder living, breathing human infants. Huh?

Well, these non-baby killers better not work at any pharmacy that sells monophasal birth control pills because monophasals do the same thing as the morning after pill (and essentially are the same thing.) Why not take it a step further and not work at any drug store that sells vitamin C or the herb black cohosh, since both in high doses at timed intervals, cause intentional abortions? Wait. You know, some prescription meds for unrelated illnesses can cause abortions, too. Better not work at those establishments, either. /s

The morning after pill is technically not an abortifacient and in my opinion, LifeSite is a biased, inaccurate website. Plan B prevents ovulation to prevent conception. It also thickens cervical mucous to barricade sperm from entering the uterus and meeting up with an egg in the fallopian tube. It also "forces" a menstrual period, not allowing sperm and egg to meet, or to flush out a zygote. It does NOT work if the woman is already pregnant and the blastocyst has implanted in the uterus.

That said, since it must be used within 72 hours of unprotected sex, chances are, there's no "abortion" in the first place for (if you consider life beginning at conception. I consider life beginning at implantation since so very many zygotes are flushed out naturally. That's my opinion.)

Anyway, I'd much rather have Plan B (morning after pill) available, and restrict abortion to almost nil, than to ban Plan B and continue having embryos and fetuses aborted at will. If these guys don't want to sell it, fine. But they need to find a pharmacy that doesn't sell a whole slew of other "abortifacients" as well.

My two cents, respectfully.


26 posted on 12/22/2005 7:36:15 PM PST by coop71 (Being a redhead means never having to say you're sorry...)
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To: coop71

Abortion is horrible whenever it occurs. Obviously the sooner it were to occur the better mostly for the mothers psyche.
Third trimester partial birth is just flat wrong.
But what i think is that if you are a pharmacist you shouldn't be fired if you have moral problems with dispensing pills that cause essential abortion.
Same problem I'd have if they were forced to dispense pills for the cause of suicide.


27 posted on 12/23/2005 3:48:08 AM PST by Joe Boucher (an enemy of islam)
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To: Joe Boucher

Oh yeah, nice talking to you civily there coop.
Have a great day.


28 posted on 12/23/2005 3:49:06 AM PST by Joe Boucher (an enemy of islam)
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To: Joe Boucher

The suicide aspect is interesting and you know, both are slippery slopes since many drugs cause death, even though that isn't the purpose of the drug.

I just jumped at your first comment re: baby killers and wanted to clarify some things about this pill in question. Thanks for hearing me out.

Regards-coop71


29 posted on 12/23/2005 7:16:42 AM PST by coop71 (Being a redhead means never having to say you're sorry...)
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To: Joe Boucher
coop71 wrote
But what i think is that if you are a pharmacist you shouldn't be fired if you have moral problems with dispensing pills that cause essential abortion.
Plan-B is a legal product, carried by their employer. I think that a pharmacist should be fired preemptively if they have a moral problem with doing the duties of their job.

Illinois is an "at will" employment state; your employer can fire anybody for just about any reason.

30 posted on 12/24/2005 12:32:50 AM PST by Nonesuch
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