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Secret court modified wiretap requests
Seattle Post-Intelligencer ^ | 12/24/05 | Stewart M. Powell

Posted on 12/27/2005 7:17:53 AM PST by B Knotts

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To: K-oneTexas
If they are a US Citizen when the evidence is compiled charged will be brought in a criminal court. For what ever crime or treason, at this time they get a lawyer.

Imagine yourself as one of these super cleared attorneys who can actually SEE the charge. OK you say the accused American stole such and such a document from such and such a location at such and such a time. Oh, I can't ask him if he has a time or place alibi for that? That would reveal a national secret?

61 posted on 12/27/2005 10:01:45 AM PST by The Red Zone
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To: The Red Zone

I agree. Why investigate the operation but not the leak of top secret information?

Something just ain't right here.


62 posted on 12/27/2005 10:01:48 AM PST by airborne (If being a Christian was a crime, would there be enough evidence to convict you?)
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To: K-oneTexas

The Constitution as engineered ultimately is what the Court says. Put in a Bork amendment (Congress can overrule any court with a supermajority) if you want a counterbalance. Till then, it's the Nine Lawyers Rule.


63 posted on 12/27/2005 10:02:44 AM PST by The Red Zone
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To: The Red Zone
The methods of collection are what is encompassed in the nation security interest and this has with stood court test. Traitors and such have been caught, tried and placed in jail for your exact example, selling secret documents.

Wiretaps/eavesdropping were used but other physical evidence also exists and is brought forward at trial. Our legal systems has many stops along the to incarceration or death.
64 posted on 12/27/2005 10:08:11 AM PST by K-oneTexas (I'm not a judge and there ain't enough of me to be a jury. (Zell Miller, A National Party No More))
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To: K-oneTexas
Our legal systems has many stops along the to incarceration or death.

If the accused's attorney cannot mount a challenge to any fact claimed by the Government because any attempted investigation into their truth or falsity would reveal the details of the charges, well we have Kafka alive and well.

65 posted on 12/27/2005 10:11:28 AM PST by The Red Zone
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To: The Red Zone; eyespysomething
LOL! Does every thread have to be about illegal immigration?!?!
66 posted on 12/27/2005 10:23:24 AM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: The Red Zone
Nothing stops the accused's attorney from mount a challenge to any fact presented by the prosecutor. That is why the police and others (co-conspirators, witnesses) are brought to the stand and any evidence can be questioned. The questions can concern the motives and determinations behind seeking the warrant and well as the fruits of it, transcriptions of the cell phone conversations. Just not the collection mechanism.
67 posted on 12/27/2005 10:26:52 AM PST by K-oneTexas (I'm not a judge and there ain't enough of me to be a jury. (Zell Miller, A National Party No More))
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To: The Red Zone
OK, who leaked these. What, they're unclassified?

These are Justice Department reports to Congress and would be unclassified. None of this would include actual intelligence, probably just numbers ... "This is how many times we went before FISA, this is how many times FISA modified/denied/approved requests."

I believe this information would be an open record and is not secret intelligence.

68 posted on 12/27/2005 10:27:03 AM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: SittinYonder
Did I miss something? This thread has nothing to do with illegal immigration.
69 posted on 12/27/2005 10:28:01 AM PST by K-oneTexas (I'm not a judge and there ain't enough of me to be a jury. (Zell Miller, A National Party No More))
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To: K-oneTexas; The Red Zone
This thread has nothing to do with illegal immigration.

My point exactly (although I'm only kidding. It suits me fine if every thread is about illegal immigration).

70 posted on 12/27/2005 10:31:04 AM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: The Red Zone
The fact that Rathergate was a total FRAUD is telling.

The fact that the 9-11 commission SELECTIVELY EXCLUDED Able Danger data along with promoting Clark's book at the hearings is telling.

The fact that Joe Wilson has more or less disappeared, that Valerie Plame has resigned and Fitzgerald is silent is telling.

The fact that we didn't EVEN KNOW about the Berger burglaries until it was leaked almost a year later is telling. The fact that Berger and Wilson were "fired" by Kerry withing days of each other is VERY TELLING.

The fact that this (Clinton loving) judge resigned from the FISA in silence is telling.

Not for nothing, but these folks are all Dem Operatives. Since all Positive Dem Results flow to one person, HILLARY, I bet she and Bubba can be connected to starting each of these FRAUDS.

One of the OUTSTANDING facts is that Matt Cooper, the reporter who "involved" Rove and Libby, is married to Mandy Grunwald who is Hillary's best friend, media advisor and Bubba's former CAMPAIGN MANAGER.

The second outstanding fact is a statement by Bubba saying that if they could get rid of Rove, they could win back the Whitehouse.

As far as I can see, Hillary has said nothing about all these FRAUDS. It's very telling.

71 posted on 12/27/2005 10:43:02 AM PST by Sacajaweau (God Bless Our Troops!!)
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To: HiTech RedNeck
quite possible the bushes have ordered it leaked.

Yeah, what a brilliant plan. Let's leak lies to the media and get the moonbats riled up and shrieking, impeachment! Then, we can send out Republicans from the House and Senate to correct the record and the media will look stupid.

Or not.

72 posted on 12/27/2005 11:11:00 AM PST by jess35
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To: B Knotts

The FISA ruled against the ACLU in favor of the Bush administration. This article is bunk.


73 posted on 12/27/2005 11:25:32 AM PST by cake_crumb (Leftist Credo: One Wing to Rule them All and to the Darkside Bind them)
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To: lexington minuteman 1775
The FISA court was set up under old technology, and probably has not kept up with the times of internet, cell phones, sattelite phones and encrypted messages.

The FISA court is set up on the simple ability to intercept communications. All the modern tech has done is change the means of the communications, but the basic idea hasn't changed -- an expedited means of authorization for interception with relaxed standards.

In the practical desire to have Bush be able to circumvent FISA, people forget that FISA exists solely because of previous abuses of the executive's ability to intercept communications without judicial oversight. Anyone who thinks this ability regained will not be abused needs to do a bit of history reading, mainly operations Shamrock, Minaret, CHAOS and COINTELPRO.

74 posted on 12/27/2005 11:29:38 AM PST by antiRepublicrat
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To: piasa
Bamford watch ping.

"They wanted to expand the number of people they were eavesdropping on, and they didn't think they could get the warrants they needed from the court to monitor those people," said Bamford, author of "Body of Secrets: Anatomy of the Ultra-Secret National Security Agency" and "The Puzzle Palace: Inside America's Most Secret Intelligence Organization." "The FISA court has shown its displeasure by tinkering with these applications by the Bush administration."

75 posted on 12/27/2005 11:56:33 AM PST by Fedora
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To: mlc9852
I sure hope they find out who leaked this and try him for treason.

Much to many folks dismay it now appears TREASON is no longer a crime. The gray old lady and WaPo have proved that. The MSM has a right, even an obligation, to keep the American public "Informed" of all secrets the US Government has hidden away. Apparently we need our enemies to meet us on a level playing field according to the MSM and the DEMONRATS.

76 posted on 12/27/2005 4:05:45 PM PST by p23185 (Why isn't attempting to take down a sitting Pres & his Admin considered Sedition?)
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To: Bullitt

e-mailing or calling the white house get's tapped/eves dropped and all mail is delayed do to the so called Anthrax problem's that Congress complained about. They do not want to hear from us. But I agree we should still try and be presistant!!!!


77 posted on 12/29/2005 9:26:26 AM PST by An American Opinionist
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