Posted on 01/07/2006 9:57:08 AM PST by squidly
yes, but then what is a "wiretap". If I put headphones on and listen to your conversation, or I write a computer program to analyze that conversation and email me a summary of what you said - its really the same thing (or can be made to be).
It's not like the Bill of Rights and basic morality isn't constantly put aside either by the courts or by legislation.
Wiretapping USA citizens who are conspiring with terrorists to devastate the USA or our interests undoubtedly falls under National Security and we are without a doubt, at war. It is also my feeling that they are not citizens in a true sense because their allegiance is "void". At the very least, they are "treasonous".
When at war, the President is Commander in Chief. He runs the war. Congress can declare war but it cannot run the war.
Surveillance is without a doubt, a part of running a war. It always was and always will be. The President does not have to ask Congress for permission on how to run the war in any way, shape or form. He seeks the advice of members of the Executive Branch.
On matters of National Security as related to terrorism and particularly as it relates to US citizens, surveillance without a warrant maximizes secrecy. It in fact affords protections for erroneous surveillance and prevents misuse.
In other words, unless you're connected to a terrorist, you'll never know that you were under surveillance and "the least few possible" will even know of your surveillance. Ordinary, broad surveillance will not continue through the system to the point where it is "of interest". From millions of blips, maybe one will make it to the "point of interest".
The FISA site states explicitly that it has never provided the Intelligence Committee info on USA citizens who are tapped because it gives the terrorists an edge. (It's right on the FISA site). I think Feinstein (maybe) asked for the info at the particular hearing I was reading and that was their response.
You better get your National Security priorities right because if you don't think the terrorists are plotting as we write and if you don't think that USA citizens are involved, you're a fool.
And if you don't think that Secrecy is the Highest Priority of Intelligence and a warrant diffuses that Secrecy, then you don't know anything about Secrecy because it's all over the newspapers that there's a "BIG SECRET" that everyone should know about, i.e.,
that if you're a terrorist and a USA citizen, there's a good chance we HAD YOU under surveillance and ONLY A VERY SELECT FEW KNEW.
I'm sure terrorists got the orders to: throw away all your phones, burn your harddrives, change your vehicle, move if you have to, do whatever you have to to counter US intelligence because they don't have boots on the ground to chase you.
My mind says: "My God...What have the Dems done. They planned this to influence the 2006 elections. They're crazy."
Rockefeller, the Judge who resigned on Dec. 19, 2005, Feinstein and Hillary. I hope they all rot in hell.
How about responding to those who responded to you instead?
Yes, you are wrong.
What you are sugegsting is in effect that we tell Sami Al-Hamood teh mad bomber, "Please stay on the line while we get a warrant."
It doesn't work that way.
Unless, of course, you're phone calling terrorists.
Then you might have cause to worry.
For purposes of discussion, I propose to define the term "wiretap" as meaning the obtaining of the contents of a communication, whether verbatim or paraphrased with selected verbaitim phrases.
Do you think the outcome of the discussion turns on that definition? It seems to me the discussion is rambling and not getting to ponts of agreement and difference. What are the limits of warrantless surveillance "reasonable under the Constitutional" or "under FISA?" What should be the extent of executive power without oversight vs. the protection of the 4th amendment? Is the challenge itself an encroachment on presidential power?
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