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Jack Murtha's "Fake" Purple Hearts, An Open Letter
Strange Military.com ^ | Jan 12, 2006 | Kelly Anne & Don Bailey

Posted on 01/15/2006 4:00:20 PM PST by armydawg1

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To: Peach

"I said, you vets go after him. Have at it. Which part of that didn't you understand?"

And what did you not get from Karl Rove?

Are you claiming to be the "new Karl Rove"?

Rove Credits Swiftvets With 'Energizing' Bush Vote (Thank You Karl Rove!)

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1345603/posts


51 posted on 01/15/2006 5:15:29 PM PST by 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub (Be wary of the "Move On FReepers" who scream and howl "Move On Tonk, Get Over It")
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To: usmcobra
My understanding of Murtha's Vietnam experience was that he was part of an operational unit. I'm sure there are other unit members out there who can speak to his untruthfulness. If they can come forth for Kerry I submit they can come forth for Murtha. Maybe I'm wrong but I believe it would be far better coming from them than from others who may be criticized as having an axe to grind.

Don't' get me wrong; I'm all for going after Murtha if it can be proven beyond a doubt. However, I think he's more vulnerable on his ethics/corruption problems since being in office, would have a lot more jail time thereby, and what would such an investigation do to Pelosi's Republican corruption allegations?

Think about this long and hard. What would be the best way to both 1) Get at Murtha and 2) Bring the corruption home to roost with the Dimocrats?

Whether Murtha goes down for service fraud or corruption makes no difference to me. It just seems there's more than one way to skin this rat.

52 posted on 01/15/2006 5:21:25 PM PST by bcsco ("The Constitution is not a suicide pact"...A. Lincoln)
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To: bcsco

>>>>I'm all for going after him tooth & nail. I simply believe the accusation against his military service ought to come from his service group; not Freepers, or anyone else for that matter.

Why not anyone else? It was his service record that got him the position he holds. And, while in this position, his support and funding of the Afghan incident created funding for WTC'93.

Sheik Rahman was also instrumental in WTC'01 (see Lynne Stewart).

That makes it all of our concern.


>>> Believe me, there's method in my madness.

I'm listening. Share and maybe I'll agree.


53 posted on 01/15/2006 5:24:09 PM PST by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: armydawg1

Damn..another REMF with a GW he didn't deserve.

Whats the chance of someone having built a political career on that...LOL.../wise-a**


54 posted on 01/15/2006 5:26:41 PM PST by Khurkris ("Hell, I was there"...Elmer Keith.)
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To: bcsco

>>>>Don't' get me wrong; I'm all for going after Murtha if it can be proven beyond a doubt. However, I think he's more vulnerable on his ethics/corruption problems since being in office, would have a lot more jail time thereby, and what would such an investigation do to Pelosi's Republican corruption allegations?

Why do these statements, which I'm seeing on these threads by others also, give me the impression that the service record is off limits to hide more? Who is being protected here?


55 posted on 01/15/2006 5:27:08 PM PST by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: Cobra64
Kerry still refuses to sign his release form for his medical records and just as Benadict Arnold was a trusted military leader at one time greed and power turned him into a traitor, Murtha needed his military record and expertise to help his family get military contracts. Now he and kerry are helping the islamofacists kill real patriots.
56 posted on 01/15/2006 5:29:11 PM PST by bdfromlv (Leavenworth hard time)
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To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub
Tonk thanks for the ping.

Is this what we really want to do? Seems like this is an old issue and although a big deal to many of us here, it may seem as though we're muckraking to bring this up. Besides, if there is even a mere hint of it in the MSM it will be damaging enough to Murtha's reputation.

For the Reps to dig in on this, would appear cheap in my opinion.
57 posted on 01/15/2006 5:32:25 PM PST by tongue-tied
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To: JRochelle

No one would be going after Murtha if he wasnt going after our troops and aiding our enemies.


58 posted on 01/15/2006 5:33:31 PM PST by armydawg1 (" America must win this war..." PVT Martin Treptow, KIA, WW1)
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To: Calpernia
"Why do these statements, which I'm seeing on these threads by others also, give me the impression that the service record is off limits to hide more? Who is being protected here?"

Good Question

My "hunch", and that's all it is,
is that certain FReepers are also
PROFESSIONL GOP fund raisers
and groups like the Swift Boat Vets
PERSONALLY cost them money and they don't
want anymore groups like them.
59 posted on 01/15/2006 5:33:42 PM PST by 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub (Be wary of the "Move On FReepers" who scream and howl "Move On Tonk, Get Over It")
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To: Peach
I don't think we should pursue this. Murtha is not running for higher office, he is elderly and he is doing more damage every time he opens his mouth than anything we can do to him.

Unfortunately, when we let the little things go, they have a way of coming back as bigger things.

The only reason that Murtha is becoming a media darling now is that the Democrats are desperate for a war hero to counter the argument that they are weak on national defense.

When you consider that Jimmy Carter was their last war "hero" as a Navy submariner, followed by Dukakis in the tank, Clinton the draft dodger, Gore the protected "war correspondent", Kerry's quick service and anti-war protests, and then fired NATO commander Wesley Clark, the Democrats are foisting Murtha on the public as their next greatest war hero.

I think it's more damaging to let them let Murtha speak from the cloak of authority as a war hero, than for Republicans to be seen going after an old guy who's not running for higher office. You just can't let these things go by anymore, not in today's tough political world. They made the rules, we have to play by them.

-PJ

60 posted on 01/15/2006 5:34:52 PM PST by Political Junkie Too (It's still not safe to vote Democrat.)
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To: MizSterious
Murtha was in the Reserves for a long while, then volunteers to go to Nam in '66-67, gets a few decorations, then gets elected to the Pennsylvania house in the 68 elections.

The timing sounds like he was being groomed for a political career, and a tour in VN was a necessary "ticket punch" for that career. His bio lists him as being a captain in '59. Haven't seen what rank he was in '66, but I don't think he was leading from the front by that point

I would be curious as to his family history

61 posted on 01/15/2006 5:35:50 PM PST by SauronOfMordor (A planned society is most appealing to those with the hubris to think they will be the planners)
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To: tongue-tied

"Is this what we really want to do?"

Seems like it's running about 8-2
8 for 2 against

That's just an unofficial guess.


62 posted on 01/15/2006 5:36:04 PM PST by 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub (Be wary of the "Move On FReepers" who scream and howl "Move On Tonk, Get Over It")
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To: Calpernia
I'm not trying to protect anything. I don't believe one's service record is off limits when that person is in or seeking public office. What I'm saying is that maybe it's just a feeling I have but this subject of his service record came up because of an article on CNS and a supposedly public letter to Murtha by a friend of his that dates back to 2002 or thereabouts.

This seems awful 'loose' and questionable material to be basing an investigation on. And without him signing a 180 and releasing his records I don't think anything short of a purposeful challenge to him by his service 'buddies' will carry much, if any weight.

That's why I believe he's more open to the corruption charges and without further evidence believe that would be a preferable route. I would love to see him taken down as much as the next Freeper, I just don't want it to come back and haunt us.

63 posted on 01/15/2006 5:39:17 PM PST by bcsco ("The Constitution is not a suicide pact"...A. Lincoln)
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To: armydawg1

Ouch -- I'll bet this was a serious enough hit to "earn" a Purple Heart!

Semper Fi


64 posted on 01/15/2006 5:42:14 PM PST by river rat (You may turn the other cheek, but I prefer to look into my enemy's vacant dead eyes.)
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To: bcsco

Actually, the CNS article came out AFTER it was brought up on FR on a Code Pink article.

Murtha is the one that keeps bringing up his service record.


65 posted on 01/15/2006 5:45:43 PM PST by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub

I wonder if any GOPers would be hurt if that can of worms was open.


66 posted on 01/15/2006 5:47:01 PM PST by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: armydawg1

Giving a ton of leyway to Murtha (being a fellow US Marine), his diengeuous statements are truly his current ideals and he's justified them to himself in some convoluted form of anti-government rhetorical posturing.

Which brings into question his sanity.

Concurrently, his Purple Hearts coming into focus seems like simple copy cat political attacks left over from sKerry.


67 posted on 01/15/2006 5:48:50 PM PST by JoeSixPack1
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To: brushcop

You know, those words are very similar to the ones that have been uttered, muttered, and screeched by the left against Bush....


68 posted on 01/15/2006 5:52:57 PM PST by freema (Proud Marine Mom)
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To: darkwing104; 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub

Murtha better put some ice on that.


69 posted on 01/15/2006 5:54:00 PM PST by StarCMC (Old Sarge is my hero...doing it right in Iraq! Vaya con Dios, Sarge.)
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To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub
LOL...Rog

"In an official TGYC poll, respondents are saying--by an overwhelming margin--there is no need to pursue this line of questioning. An astounding 80 percent of respondents feel we have no need to further embarrass Mr. Murtha"

We'll see the quotes in tomorrows NYT...quoting a heretofore unknown polling source.
70 posted on 01/15/2006 5:55:48 PM PST by tongue-tied
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To: SauronOfMordor

Murtha was in the Reserves for a long while, then volunteers to go to Nam in '66-67, gets a few decorations, then gets elected to the Pennsylvania house in the 68 elections.

Then over the next 23 years he never receives has a significant deployment or receives another award until his DSM kiss at his retirement in 1990? Hmmmmmmm.......


71 posted on 01/15/2006 5:55:49 PM PST by Wristpin ("The Yankees have decided to buy every player in Baseball....")
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To: armydawg1

72 posted on 01/15/2006 5:56:08 PM PST by AZRepublican
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To: bcsco

He was an Intelligence Officer, not a Commanding Officer.

Since a famous incident on Guadalcanal, The Marines have perfered Their intellegence officer chained to a field desk, rock, or some other nonmovable object and not in the field looking for the enemy.

Lt Colonel Frank Goettge earned his Purple Heart the hard way on Guadalcanal, he died for it, leading a small patrol in search of intelligence, and as such has been The example of what a good Intelligence officer should never do, go off and look for the enemy.

Add that to the list of why Muthra's Purple Hearts are suspect, They fly in the face of Marine SOP.



73 posted on 01/15/2006 5:56:25 PM PST by usmcobra (Liberal=progressive...Conservative="Retro?" That's way cooler than being just a Neo-con!)
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To: Calpernia

I agree; he does! All the time! Lets just say we agree on the goal but aren't quite there yet on the method of achieving it.

Have a good one! I have to get some meds in me and some rest or I'll be hurtin' for certain.


74 posted on 01/15/2006 5:58:01 PM PST by bcsco ("The Constitution is not a suicide pact"...A. Lincoln)
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To: centurion316
"Anyone who fraudulently claims a military award defames and demeans the courage and sacrifice of those who have received those honors legitimately. They deserve to be exposed and reviled, especially if they are politicians."

Exactly. I'm suprised at those on this thread who would give a free pass to someone who may have received military awards through fraud. They must hold concepts such as honor and integrity in low regard.

75 posted on 01/15/2006 6:01:13 PM PST by Godebert
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To: Peach

I agree with you. He's a deluded old man. Leave him alone.


76 posted on 01/15/2006 6:02:39 PM PST by antceecee (i)
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To: usmcobra
That makes a lot of sense and, believe me, I'm not unsuspecting of Murtha's awards myself. I'm just leery of what I'm reading here on how to go about exposing it. I'd just hate for it to come back and haunt us.

Although I'm new here (since November) I've gained a lot of respect for FR and its people. I'd hate to see anything impugn its fine reputation.

Sorry, but I have to leave it at that. I have to get some meds in me or I'll be in trouble.

Take care!

77 posted on 01/15/2006 6:02:59 PM PST by bcsco ("The Constitution is not a suicide pact"...A. Lincoln)
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To: Peach

I agree.

It's on him whether or not he did or did not earn the Purple Hearts. He has to live with that.

But his arguements have been shot down several times, the military and the vets already hate his guts, so to speak.

There is very little, if any, gain to be had in going after him like that. It's in the past when he is giving up a LOT of stuff to be used now.


78 posted on 01/15/2006 6:04:06 PM PST by MikefromOhio
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To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub
Thanks for the ping,brother.

I've seen most of the threads on this guy Don Bailey.It's compelling, but how can we know it's true?

The way I see it, Murtha is an EX-Marine, he turned his back on the Corps.It's as if he had no military service at all.

But,if we want to demand he sign a SF180 and release his medical records, that's fair game.We have to be prepared to listen to the "How dare you question my patriotism" crap.But so what? We know that drill.

If Murtha is proud of his service,he has nothing to hide.

79 posted on 01/15/2006 6:05:24 PM PST by smoothsailing
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To: Fido969

There is a matter of truth. If you dont want to know the facts about traitors just read the nation and code pink news and stay out of FR.


80 posted on 01/15/2006 6:07:00 PM PST by bdfromlv (Leavenworth hard time)
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To: bcsco
I must state at this juncture that a very significant number of Bronze Stars were awarded (I like to use the word "issued") during the peak of the SEA conflict as essentially nothing more than "thank you" tokens for a clap-free in-country tour.

I cranked out far too many of them myself -- and am guilty of this perversion of the system. I got so good at it, I could grind out the Citation verbage to such a colorful degree that I could make Elmer, the postal clerk, into Audie Murthy in less than 10 minutes of serious scribing.

Farcical and demeaning to the process. I suspect the good Colonel may well have been caught up in one of these penmanship exercises as a reward for keeping his family jewels unsullied.

Just my real-life two cents worth. *S"
81 posted on 01/15/2006 6:07:45 PM PST by dk/coro
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To: Peach

the truth is always worth pursuing no matter the outcome.


82 posted on 01/15/2006 6:08:05 PM PST by bdfromlv (Leavenworth hard time)
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To: bcsco

The paper work doesnt lie and if he stands by the record let us see the record. I you do not want to know what is true so that you can make an informed decision you must be a democrat.


83 posted on 01/15/2006 6:12:14 PM PST by bdfromlv (Leavenworth hard time)
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To: dk/coro
Unfortunately, that is the moral authority that they are using today to give weight to their attacks against the administration.

-PJ

84 posted on 01/15/2006 6:14:18 PM PST by Political Junkie Too (It's still not safe to vote Democrat.)
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To: JoeSixPack1

Joe, I suspect the good Colonel has a very serious drinking problem. Even old farts like myself don't look like Murtha unless we imbibe a good 1-2 jugs a day.

Just a thought.


85 posted on 01/15/2006 6:15:00 PM PST by dk/coro
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To: smoothsailing

"If Murtha is proud of his service,he has nothing to hide."

Exactly!

Now who else do we "know" who has
refused to release ALL of his military records?


86 posted on 01/15/2006 6:15:32 PM PST by 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub (Be wary of the "Move On FReepers" who scream and howl "Move On Tonk, Get Over It")
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To: bcsco

If you desire the truth but fear the criticism then your opinion will be given to you when we think you need it. Fear not what can not kill you.


87 posted on 01/15/2006 6:16:40 PM PST by bdfromlv (Leavenworth hard time)
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To: bcsco

When you are done with whatever you needed to do, I'm still interested in listening to the method of your madness that you mentioned in post 50.


88 posted on 01/15/2006 6:19:26 PM PST by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: MikeinIraq
There is very little, if any, gain to be had in going after him like that

Bullshit. ABSCAM Murtha is as dirty and implicated as they come.

89 posted on 01/15/2006 6:20:51 PM PST by ARealMothersSonForever
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To: armydawg1
No one would be going after Murtha if he wasnt going after our troops and aiding our enemies.

It doesn't seem to me that going after an old senile guy accomplishes much and in fact is a waste of ammunition.

90 posted on 01/15/2006 6:22:45 PM PST by palmer (Money problems do not come from a lack of money, but from living an excessive, unrealistic lifestyle)
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To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub
Now who else do we "know" who has refused to release ALL of his military records?

The French guy, Hanoi John.Still no medical records and the SF180 was a limited release.

Murtha won't release anything, other than another whining attack.But there's nothing wrong with putting him in that position.

91 posted on 01/15/2006 6:30:00 PM PST by smoothsailing
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To: JRochelle

'---a lot of vets who received purple hearts will tell you what they did wasn't bbetter than others did who didn't receive purple hearts--'

Very true--however, it seems that Murthas awards were "requested"??---by whom??---if Murtha did it it he pulled the same stuff Kerry did to make sure it was a military record for posterity---whey not get the answer to that?


92 posted on 01/15/2006 6:31:50 PM PST by cmotormac44
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To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub

Did the Swift Vets have any members that understood legal?

Why can't we file citizen complaints with criminal charges against these people? Our elected officials certainly aren't doing their job. Maybe we don't need elected officials.


93 posted on 01/15/2006 6:32:32 PM PST by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: palmer
It doesn't seem to me that going after an old senile guy accomplishes much and in fact is a waste of ammunition.

You obviously did not have any family harmed by this useless POS. I did. May he get, and his family get, everything deserved. He brought it upon himself. Bill Casey was NOT the bad man.

94 posted on 01/15/2006 6:32:57 PM PST by ARealMothersSonForever
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To: MikeinIraq

What will be gained is that he will be prevented from speaking as the sole source of expertise in the field of military endevour as well as The expert on the moral of our troops there.

That is afterall how he is being portrayed in the press, The lone voice of reason as well as the expert on everything.

Based upon a sole Marine Reservist's tour in Viet Nam, better braver men then him are being ignored and we are being told to do nothing, to say nothing, to relax and wait for what might happen or for his fifteen minutes of fame to evaporate.

If his awards are bogus, then his entire congressional career has been based upon a fraud unchallenged until now and if it remains unchallenged then he will be re-elected yet again and free to continue his lies about the war.


95 posted on 01/15/2006 6:35:52 PM PST by usmcobra (Liberal=progressive...Conservative="Retro?" That's way cooler than being just a Neo-con!)
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To: AZRepublican

lol, great display of Kerry purple heart bandaids.

In all seriousness, Murtha's raging dementia is fed and encouraged by the media that currently adores him.

Where were his adoring followers in Code Pink and the media when he was making all of his hospital visits before he spoke out for our enemies?

Murtha is a classic example of every day having to say more and more outlandish things to stay in the media spotlight. Eventually they will tire of him as they have Cindy Mediawhore Sheehan.


96 posted on 01/15/2006 6:37:34 PM PST by armydawg1 (" America must win this war..." PVT Martin Treptow, KIA, WW1)
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To: Calpernia
Did the Swift Vets have any members that understood legal?

John O'Neil is a lawyer in Houston.

97 posted on 01/15/2006 6:38:25 PM PST by Just A Nobody (I - LOVE - my attitude problem! WBB lives on. Beware the Enemedia.)
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To: usmcobra

God bless you.


98 posted on 01/15/2006 6:38:36 PM PST by ARealMothersSonForever
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To: palmer

Murtha's treason can not go unanswered.


99 posted on 01/15/2006 6:40:24 PM PST by armydawg1 (" America must win this war..." PVT Martin Treptow, KIA, WW1)
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To: usmcobra

Well said Marine.


100 posted on 01/15/2006 6:41:46 PM PST by armydawg1 (" America must win this war..." PVT Martin Treptow, KIA, WW1)
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