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Army declares City of Patriarchs a "closed military zone"
.israelinsider ^

Posted on 01/16/2006 11:09:17 AM PST by avile

Army declares City of Patriarchs a "closed military zone" By Israel Insider staff and partners January 16, 2006

A Jewish girl is taken into custody by security forces.

The army declared Hebron, the City of the Jewish Patriarchs, a closed military zone forbidden to non-resident Israelis.

Israeli police seized buildings and rooftops in a Jewish settler enclave in the holy city of Hebron on Monday, restoring order after three days of riots sparked by plans to evict Israeli squatters from an abandoned Palestinian market.

The closure and scuffles could signal the opening salvo in a battle over the West Bank, if Israel follows its pullout from the Gaza Strip last summer with further withdrawals from territory that has far more biblical resonance.

Settler leaders and rabbis demanded that acting Prime Minister Ehud Olmert back down and abandon his plan to dismantle the outpost in a Hebron market and several other unauthorized settlements across the West Bank slated for destruction in the coming weeks.

Olmert stood his ground, saying he ordered security forces to deal sternly with the defiant settlers.

"There will be no forgiveness or compromises with this unacceptable behavior," he said Monday. "There are red lines that we will not allow to be crossed."

The fight over Hebron, where tradition says the biblical Jewish patriarchs are buried, has special resonance for the settlers. Many of the settlers here are extreme, religious nationalists and the city has been the scene of harsh fighting during the five years of Israel-Palestinian violence.

Hebron is the only West Bank city divided between Palestinian and Israeli zones. Israeli forces control the center of the city, where about 500 settlers live in several compounds. Settlers often clash with local Palestinians.

Olmert spoke about Hebron after being named acting head of the centrist Kadima Party in place of Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, who suffered a massive stroke Jan. 4. Sharon formed Kadima last year after rebellious lawmakers from his hardline Likud Party tried to torpedo his pullout from Gaza and four isolated West Bank settlements. Many Israelis assumed Sharon planned further withdrawals, if his party won March 28 elections as polls indicate.

The New Yorker magazine reported Monday that Sharon's National Security Council had been considering four different West Bank evacuation plans: dismantling isolated settlements, removing a whole settlement region, evacuating 88 percent of the West Bank and evacuating 92 percent of the territory.

At the same time, Sharon's aides were discussing withdrawing to Israel's separation barrier -- which includes major settlement blocs on the Israeli side -- in exchange for U.S. recognition of the barrier as Israel's permanent border, the New Yorker reported.

Sharon spokesman Asaf Shariv said several pullout options had been considered by the National Security Council ahead of the Gaza withdrawal, but "I don't know about anything since then that is new."

The Maariv daily reported Monday that Labor leader Amir Peretz also was considering calling for a large-scale unilateral pullout from the West Bank. Peretz spokesman Tom Wegner would not confirm the report.

Hoping to show the government that future withdrawals will not be as painless as the Gaza pullout, hundreds of protesters flocked to Hebron _ where the settlers live among 170,000 Palestinians _ to fight eviction orders given to eight settler families.

The families moved into an empty Palestinian market four years ago after Palestinian gunmen killed a 10-month-old Jewish baby and they ignored an Israeli court order that gave them until Jan. 15 to voluntarily leave. The army said it would remove them within a month.

"It's important to say 'No,"' settler spokesman David Wilder said. "You can't let them chop up your land and give it to your enemy."

The protesters, many of them teenagers and some of them masked, began rampaging through the area Friday, torching empty Palestinian shops and a home, throwing stones at Palestinian houses and trying to rush off-limits areas of the city.

On Monday, hundreds of youth milled about the market and ate fruit and bread left out for them in huge crates. Many wore T-shirts left over from the Gaza protests, reading: "We won't forget, we won't forgive." One wore a set of dog tags listing all the dismantled settlements.

Suddenly, riot police, border police and officers on horseback charged through the market and into the nearby Avraham Avinu settlement enclave, where many of the youth had camped out on mattresses scattered across the floor of a guest house.

The police stormed the buildings and forced the youth to evacuate the rooftops where they had fled. The protesters hurled curses at the police, shoved them and called them American lackeys. Three girls were arrested, police said.

Israel's police commander in Hebron, Avi Harush, said the operation targeted "those same lawbreakers especially the masked people ... who are throwing rocks, paint and other objects at us, and the goal is to bring them down from the rooftops and restore control to the police and the army."

"We have a zero tolerance policy against people who use violence against police and soldiers and vandalize Palestinian property," he said.

Authorities were discussing whether to declare the settlement a closed military zone, which would bar anyone who is not a resident from entering, Harush said.

Two separate groups of rabbis sent letters to Olmert on Monday demanding he cancel the plan to evacuate the market and other outposts. One letter, signed by 20 rabbis, warned Olmert that he courted personal tragedy if he withdrew from any of "the Land of Israel."

The second letter, sent by a group of settler rabbis, called the eviction orders "a war against God and his Messiah."


TOPICS: Israel
KEYWORDS: dreck; israel; kapo; squatters
How dare Jews try to live in Hevron!

You don't see Reform Jews trying to live there. They are too busy with important issues like providing abortion doctors and civil rights for the transgenderd.

We all know that if Israel pulled back to the 67 line the demographic problem with the 22% arab population would end because 1million reformers will come and just like the AA community becoming the most philosemitic ever because of the reform jewish social worker do gooders, the Arabs will become the Israeli ambassadors to the muslim world.

1 posted on 01/16/2006 11:09:20 AM PST by avile
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To: avile
A lot of these settlers are religious extremists.

I don't have a lot of sympathy for them.

2 posted on 01/16/2006 11:16:23 AM PST by conserv13
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To: conserv13; avile

A lot of them are extremists, that's true. But it's amazing that Israel can call out all this force against them. I suspect it's basically just a move to impress the Palestinians, who won't be impressed and don't give a darn anyway, since they simply want Israel to disappear. (And disappear including the secular Jews, which is something the latter have yet to understand.)


3 posted on 01/16/2006 11:20:34 AM PST by livius
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To: conserv13

Extremist because they desire to live where it is recorded Abraham bought a grave site.

Extremists because when the Arabs riot and murder a Jewish community- as the they did to the Jewish community in Hevron in 1929- the Jews should know never to return?


4 posted on 01/16/2006 11:20:57 AM PST by Sabramerican
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To: avile

Say bye-bye to Olmert...


5 posted on 01/16/2006 11:23:57 AM PST by EternalVigilance
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To: conserv13
A lot of these settlers are religious extremists.

I don't have a lot of sympathy for them.

How dare you?
If they can't be extremists" in their own country where can they be?
I don't see many Jewish extremists blowing up buildings and airplanes and school buses and children in their sleep in countries other than their own.

Do you think that if the savages, the knuckle-dragging mass murdering arabs and other muslims limited their thing to their own country that I would care?
Would you?

I don't see many Jewish extremists squatting in Saudi territory in and around Mecca...

If Jews can't protect and cherish the land of their patriarchs, what possible rational justification is there for that?
If muslims can't practice their primitive rites peacefully in other host countries, observing their host's laws and customs, they can just leave.

6 posted on 01/16/2006 11:40:25 AM PST by Publius6961 (The IQ of California voters is about 420........... .............cumulatively)
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To: Sabramerican
Extremist because they desire to live where it is recorded Abraham bought a grave site.

Yes. So what? Why should it matter even if you are living right on top of Abraham's bones?

I know what happened in 1929 was wrong. I think these people are taking resources away from the IDF that could be used to defend people in Israel, not a handful af people who insist on breaking the law.

7 posted on 01/16/2006 11:41:01 AM PST by conserv13
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To: Publius6961
If they can't be extremists" in their own country where can they be?

They are not in their own country.

I don't see many Jewish extremists blowing up buildings and airplanes and school buses and children in their sleep in countries other than their own.

So that makes it okay?

I will not defend Muslims either, I don't like extremists on any side.

8 posted on 01/16/2006 11:45:16 AM PST by conserv13
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To: conserv13

Why should Arabs live there and not Jews?

1929 was wrong? Bravo for that acknowledgement.

So?

Kill Jews, make area too costly to defend. Would work in Tel Aviv too.

You a big IDF supporter?


9 posted on 01/16/2006 11:46:49 AM PST by Sabramerican
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To: Sabramerican
You a big IDF supporter?

I sure am. With my thoughts and my tax money.

I think the IDF needs to spend more time defending people that live within the laws and don't insist on making matters worse.

10 posted on 01/16/2006 11:49:24 AM PST by conserv13
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To: conserv13
They are not in their own country.

Who's country are they in?

When did it become a country? Who was the first leader? What do the coins look like? What is their religion? Language? History?

11 posted on 01/16/2006 11:50:26 AM PST by Sabramerican
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To: conserv13

Then you should be glad.

When the IDF acts against Arab terrorists, it may be the only time you are getting your money's worth.


12 posted on 01/16/2006 11:52:34 AM PST by Sabramerican
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To: conserv13
I know what happened in 1929 was wrong. I think these people are taking resources away from the IDF that could be used to defend people in Israel, not a handful af people who insist on breaking the law.
The settlers in Kiryat Arba have turned the grave of the perpetrator of the Second Hebron Massacre (1994) into a virtual shrine and monument.

The current settlers in Hebron are even more extreme.

Long term, the solution is a large permanent Israeli consulate near Patriarchs, with the Palestinian government retaining the normal diplomatic right to declare individuals persona non grata for cause.

But the current bunch is like a bunch of Klansmen moving into Harlem and demanding close and aggressive NYPD protection.

-Eric

13 posted on 01/16/2006 12:09:43 PM PST by E Rocc (If I'm IBTZ, the thread gets pulled)
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To: E Rocc

Just like they took care of Josephs Tomb?


14 posted on 01/16/2006 12:26:29 PM PST by avile
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To: E Rocc
a large permanent Israeli consulate

Come on. you can do better then that.

How about a Hope for a Holocaust Museum. With rides, cotton candy, models of blown up buses, models of Jewish blood splattered pizza parlors, a booth where pregnant mothers can dedicate their unborn to Jihad. All the stuff that those "Palestinians" you champion, you know, the misunderstood, non extremists, love so much. How are those peaceful folks you love so much handling Gaza? Vacation there yet?

15 posted on 01/16/2006 12:28:35 PM PST by Sabramerican
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To: E Rocc; Sabramerican
Every religious Jew living over the "Green Line" has GOLDSTEIN "Christkiller" BLOOD GUILT!

They all share the guilt of GOLDSTEIN!

They must be PURGED!

How's my "Eric" impression?

16 posted on 01/16/2006 12:32:39 PM PST by Alouette (The Anti-Borg - You Will NOT be Assimilated!)
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To: avile
Court Issues Restraining Order Blocking Expulsion From Hevron
17 posted on 01/16/2006 12:37:48 PM PST by Alouette (The Anti-Borg - You Will NOT be Assimilated!)
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To: Sabramerican
We soon will confine Western civilization to a floating city near the antipode of Mecca and to the zones within the Arctic and Antarctic Circles, where Muslims cannot live. (The Ramadan fasting would lead to death in areas where the Sun never sets, and in which direction would you pray from the antipode of Mecca? Aah--too confusing!)
18 posted on 01/16/2006 12:39:00 PM PST by dufekin (US Senate: the only place where the majority [44 D] comprises fewer than the minority [55 R])
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To: dufekin

You know the rule.

Where ever an Arab donkey urinates. The land a thousand miles in any direction forever belongs to Islam.

Maybe we should kill all the donkeys.


19 posted on 01/16/2006 12:43:19 PM PST by Sabramerican
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To: Sabramerican

Should read: Arab's donkey


20 posted on 01/16/2006 12:44:00 PM PST by Sabramerican
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To: avile

My opinion, Israel should expel all Palestinians from Hebron, Bethlehem and anywhere else they choose (Gaza excepted). Jews were expelled from Libia, Syria, Iraq, Egypt and elsewhere and never given a dime for their property.

Payback is hell but hell should come a knockin'...


21 posted on 01/16/2006 12:44:17 PM PST by Prost1 (Sandy Berger can steal, Clinton can cheat, but Bush can't listen!)
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To: conserv13
They are not in their own country.

Sorry, Abdul. I thought I was addressing a normal rational human being.

Have a nice day.

22 posted on 01/16/2006 12:45:12 PM PST by Publius6961 (The IQ of California voters is about 420........... .............cumulatively)
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To: conserv13
So that makes it okay?

Perhaps not OK, but infinitely better than the cult of death, the murdering savages.

Close enough to OK in an imperfect universe.

23 posted on 01/16/2006 12:46:52 PM PST by Publius6961 (The IQ of California voters is about 420........... .............cumulatively)
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To: conserv13

What does that mean? Are they performing honor killings? Are they teaching their children to become suicide bombers? If you hurl epithets can you be more specific?


24 posted on 01/16/2006 12:49:15 PM PST by Honestfreedom
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To: Sabramerican

Where ever an Arab donkey urinates, an arab pitches his tent.


25 posted on 01/16/2006 12:51:26 PM PST by avile
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To: Alouette

Any word from Bibi?


26 posted on 01/16/2006 12:51:55 PM PST by avile
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To: E Rocc
Long term, the solution is a large permanent Israeli consulate near Patriarchs, with the Palestinian government retaining the normal diplomatic right to declare individuals persona non grata for cause.

One does not need a consulate in one's own country.
The state of Israel extends de facto from the Mediterranean to the Jordan, and from Syria and Lebanon to the Sinai.

No, they do not need your approval, nor anyone else's, to apply their sovereignty. There can be no "palestinian" government without a "palestine". That fiction, after 50 years, still can't fly:

"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct 'Palestinian people' to oppose Zionism."
PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein, March 31, 1977

Every person educated past the third grade knows, or ought to know that the arabs blew their one and only chance at a country in 1948. No second chances.

It is laughable in the extreme for a people to be called personna non grata in their own country!

Take your medication, please.

27 posted on 01/16/2006 12:54:45 PM PST by Publius6961 (The IQ of California voters is about 420........... .............cumulatively)
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To: Alouette
Goldstein is not relevant to the current situation, except for the equivalence between the First and Second Massacres.

The attitude of certain settlers and organizations towards his memory very much is.

As is the fact that they have crossed the line and the IDF must now deal with them by force.

Just as they would deal with Palestinian rioters.

-Eric

28 posted on 01/16/2006 12:56:10 PM PST by E Rocc (If I'm IBTZ, the thread gets pulled)
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To: Publius6961
The state of Israel extends de facto from the Mediterranean to the Jordan, and from Syria and Lebanon to the Sinai.
There isn't a single government on Earth that recognizes said boundaries.

Hebron is the home of 100,000 Arabs. Clearly it will end up as part of a Palestinian state.

The consulate plan would give Israeli citizens access to Patriarchs, while keeping the true agitators away from the people of Hebron.

Quite frankly, I wouldn't be suprised if the IDF loses its patience and evacuates all the settlements. I'll leave it to those who actually live in Israel to comment on what the political fallout would be.

-Eric

29 posted on 01/16/2006 12:59:56 PM PST by E Rocc (If I'm IBTZ, the thread gets pulled)
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To: E Rocc
equivalence

One guy, a doctor, after treating victim after victim after victim of Arab terror going Postal....

Is equivalent to........

On Friday, August 23, 1929, that tranquility was lost. Arab youths started throwing rocks at the yeshiva students. That afternoon, one student, Shmuel Rosenholtz, went to the yeshiva alone. Arab rioters later broke in and killed him, and that was only the beginning.

Friday night, Rabbi Ya’acov Slonim’s son invited any fearful Jews to stay in his house. The rabbi was highly regarded in the community, and he had a gun. Many Jews took him up on this offer, and many Jews were eventually murdered there.

As early as 8:00 a.m. on Saturday, the Jewish Sabbath, Arabs began to gather en masse. They came in mobs, armed with clubs, knives and axes. While the women and children threw stones, the men ransacked Jewish houses and destroyed Jewish property. With only a single police officer in Hebron, the Arabs entered Jewish courtyards with no opposition.

Rabbi Slonim, who had tried to shelter the Jewish population, was approached by the rioters and offered a deal. If all the Ashkenazi yeshiva students were given over to the Arabs, the rioters would spare the lives of the Sephardi community. Rabbi Slonim refused to turn over the students and was killed on the spot. In the end, 12 Sephardi Jews and 55 Ashkenazi Jews were murdered.

A few Arabs did try to help the Jews. Nineteen Arab families saved dozens, maybe even hundreds of Jews. Zmira Mani wrote about an Arab named Abu Id Zaitoun who brought his brother and son to rescue her and her family. The Arab family protected the Manis with their swords, hid them in a cellar along with other Jews who they had saved, and found a policeman to escort them safely to the police station at Beit Romano.

The police station turned into a shelter for the Jews that morning of August 24. It also became a synagogue as the Orthodox Jews gathered there and said their morning prayers. As they finished praying, they began to hear noises outside the building. Thousands of Arabs descended from Har Hebron, shouting "Kill the Jews!" in Arabic. They even tried to break down the doors of the station.

The Jews were besieged in Beit Romano for three days. Each night, ten men were allowed to leave to attend a funeral in Hebron’s ancient Jewish cemetery for the murdered Jews of the day.

When the massacre finally ended, the surviving Jews were forced to leave their home city and resettled in Jerusalem. Some Jewish families tried to move back to Hebron, but were removed by the British authorities in 1936 at the start of the Arab revolt. In 1948, the War of Independence granted Israel statehood, but further cut the Jews off from Hebron, a city that was captured by King Abdullah's Arab Legion and ultimately annexed to Jordan.

30 posted on 01/16/2006 1:01:15 PM PST by Sabramerican
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To: Sabramerican

http://www.hebron.org.il/pics/tarpat/people1.htm

http://www.hebron.org.il/pics/tarpat/people2.htm

http://www.hebron.org.il/pics/tarpat/places1.htm

http://www.hebron.org.il/pics/tarpat/aftermath.htm

http://www.hebron.org.il/1929/slides/slideshow.htm


31 posted on 01/16/2006 1:03:15 PM PST by Sabramerican
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To: Sabramerican
69 people killed in 1929, because they were Jews.

29 people killed in 1994, because they were Muslims at prayer. (The number was smaller largely because one man in the mosque had the nerve to go after Goldstein with a fire extinguisher as he reloaded).

Some Arabs risked their lives to save Jews in 1929. Some Jews risked their lives to save Arab victims in 1994. The extremists on each side lionize the killers.

Quite a bit of equivalence.

-Eric

32 posted on 01/16/2006 1:08:00 PM PST by E Rocc (If I'm IBTZ, the thread gets pulled)
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To: E Rocc

Only in your sick mind.


33 posted on 01/16/2006 1:09:03 PM PST by Sabramerican
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To: E Rocc
the killers

And there is one huge difference difference.

One Jewish Killer.

An entire community of Arab Killers.

With the Arabs, it always takes a village. Hell no, not just a village but an entire society of psychopaths.

The lowest form of human beings, except for their supporters.

34 posted on 01/16/2006 1:13:58 PM PST by Sabramerican
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To: E Rocc
There isn't a single government on Earth that recognizes said boundaries.

You missed the part about Israel not needing your approval nor anyone else's?

35 posted on 01/16/2006 1:15:51 PM PST by Publius6961 (The IQ of California voters is about 420........... .............cumulatively)
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To: E Rocc
Hebron is the home of 100,000 Arabs. Clearly it will end up as part of a Palestinian state.

The Germans have set up succesful concentration camps to kill human beings by the millions in Eastern Europe. Clearly that entitles them to keep running them forever.

Sometimes words are the shiniest tools of the deluded.

36 posted on 01/16/2006 1:18:34 PM PST by Publius6961 (The IQ of California voters is about 420........... .............cumulatively)
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To: avile

Where is Kahane when we need him?///////


37 posted on 01/16/2006 1:20:04 PM PST by litehaus
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To: Publius6961

You too


38 posted on 01/16/2006 1:23:03 PM PST by conserv13
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To: Honestfreedom
There are violent troublemakers on both sides. Putting a handful of Jewish religious extremists right in the nmiddle of a sea of Muslim religious extremists is just asking for trouble.
39 posted on 01/16/2006 1:28:25 PM PST by conserv13
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To: conserv13

Kind of the same trouble as a Jewish State in the Arab Middle East wouldn't you say?

And in the future, a Vatican in Islamic Europe may have a similar problem.


40 posted on 01/16/2006 1:31:54 PM PST by Sabramerican
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To: litehaus

Although some may be shocked by this, i have always wondered if Rabin et al set his execution up. Castro did the same with Guevara in Bolivia


41 posted on 01/16/2006 2:34:12 PM PST by avile
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To: Sabramerican

"And in the future, a Vatican in Islamic Europe may have a similar problem.".......Not "MAY"....WILL!


42 posted on 01/16/2006 2:37:17 PM PST by litehaus
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To: E Rocc; Sabramerican; Convert from ECUSA
Some Arabs risked their lives to save Jews in 1929.

That was not out of any sense of human morality.

Only those whose greed temporarily overcame their blood lust, in order to extort from the survivors their remaining money and possessions.

Read the testimony of survivors before you assign the humanity to the Arabs that you stripped away from the victims.

Even the eeville Baruch Goldstein, during his career as a doctor prior to 1994, saved the lives of many Arabs, many more lives than your "noble" Arabs who "protected" Jews in 1929 only to rob them.

The only "exact equivalence" exists in your hallucinations.

43 posted on 01/16/2006 3:42:58 PM PST by Alouette (The Anti-Borg - You Will NOT be Assimilated!)
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To: avile
Although some may be shocked by this, i have always wondered if Rabin et al set his execution up.

I'm sure Kahane's hate for Arabs had something to do with their hate for him. If David Duke got shot by a black extremist, we wouldn't blame Bush.

-Eric

44 posted on 01/17/2006 2:47:47 AM PST by E Rocc (If I'm IBTZ, the thread gets pulled)
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To: Alouette; Sabramerican

45 posted on 01/17/2006 4:55:32 AM PST by Convert from ECUSA (Not a nickel, not a dime, stop sending my tax money to Hamastine!)
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To: Alouette
Even the eeville Baruch Goldstein, during his career as a doctor prior to 1994, saved the lives of many Arabs, many more lives than your "noble" Arabs who "protected" Jews in 1929 only to rob them
Actually, Wikipedia reports that he was threatened with court-martial for refusing to treat non-Jews, even if they were active IDF.

That's still not really the point. His memorial/shrine in Kiryat Arba, combined with recent events that not even the Yesha Council can spin away, makes it clear that the extremist problem exists on both sides of this issue.

-Eric

46 posted on 01/17/2006 6:04:30 AM PST by E Rocc (If I'm IBTZ, the thread gets pulled)
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