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US Links to Croatian War Crime?

Posted on 01/24/2006 8:36:47 AM PST by montyspython

Former Croatian General Ante Gotovina stands accused of war crimes in connection with a 1995 military offensive. Some 150 civilians were killed in the advance. Now, it looks like he may have had help from the United States.

His trial may not get started before the end of 2006 or the spring of 2007, but already the case against former Croatian general Ante Gotovina promises some surprises. Gotovina, who is accused of being responsible for the murder of at least 150 Serbian civilians and the eviction of some 150,000 Serbs from the Krajina region in August 1995, may have had some American help.

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TOPICS: Foreign Affairs
KEYWORDS: balkans; clintonistas; clintonlegacy; clintonsquagmire; croatia; gotovina; hoopielite; jihad; serbia; warcrimes; wrongplace; wrongside; wrongtime; wrongwar; yugoslavia
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1 posted on 01/24/2006 8:36:49 AM PST by montyspython
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To: Balkans


2 posted on 01/24/2006 8:37:24 AM PST by montyspython (Love that chicken from Popeye's)
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To: montyspython
It's all Bush's fault!, he was President in 1995, wasn't he? /sarcasm off

3 posted on 01/24/2006 8:41:47 AM PST by bcsco ("The Constitution is not a suicide pact"...A. Lincoln)
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To: montyspython

Because it was for a righteous cause, any behavior by the U.S. military and CIA against the Serbs (even Serbian kids) is justified.
Put another way, because Clinton was president, this story will never be examined seriously by the U.S. media.

4 posted on 01/24/2006 8:46:29 AM PST by threeleftsmakearight
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To: bcsco

Yes, the thick oder of Clinton droppings does permeate the air.

5 posted on 01/24/2006 8:47:16 AM PST by montyspython (Love that chicken from Popeye's)
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To: Wraith; ma bell; wonders; DTA; Banat; tgambill; FormerLib


6 posted on 01/24/2006 8:49:02 AM PST by montyspython (Love that chicken from Popeye's)
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To: montyspython

An interesting Croation report and analysis of the level of US support and involvement in 'Operation Storm':

US Role in Storm
Author: Ivo Pukanic

Source: Nacional, Croatian weekly magazine

May 24, 2005

Thrilled with Operation Flash, President Clinton gave the go ahead for Operation Storm

The United States was actively involved in the preparation, monitoring and initiation of Operation Storm: the green light from President Clinton was passed on by the US military attache in Zagreb, and the operations were transmitted in real time to the Pentagon

Considering that the US was much more interested in the situation in BiH than in Croatia, they asked Croatia to permit them to install a military base with ummanned aircraft. The United States not only monitored the complete Operation Storm, but they also actively participated with the Croatian Military in its preparation, and in the end directly initiated the operation. The green light from the White House and then President Clinton for Operation Storm was passed on by Colonel Richard C. Herrick, then US military attaché in Zagreb. Several days prior to the commencement of Operation Storm, Herrick visited Markica Rebiæ in Zagreb. Rebiæ, Miroslav Tudjman, then director of HIS and Miro Medimurac, then head of SIS, held the most intensive communications with the American military and intelligence agencies. As such, in 1996, Rebiæ was awarded the Meritorius Service Medal by Peter Galbraith, then US Ambassador to Croatia.

Herrick passed on the message that the US had no opposition to the beginning of Operation Storm, that the operation had to be ‘clean and fast’ and had to be completed in 5 days time. As Nacional has learned, Rebiæ was surprised that such an important political and military message would be passed on through those channels, and following Herrick’s visit, he immediately informed the state administration of the message in writing, and there is certain record of this today in the archives. As such, it is important to note the Ambassador Peter Galbraith was completely left out of the chain of ‘command’, and that this message came directly from President Clinton, Anthony Lake (then National Security Advisor) and Willian Perry (then Defense Secretary) via Rebiæ to Minister Gojko Šušak and President Tudjman.

This was the climax of the cooperation between the US and Croatia, which began to develop in 1992 at the beginning of the Serbian-Muslim war. In 1995, Clinton was preparing for his re-election, and Bob Dole was the Republican candidate who had requested that Congress remove the arms embargo for the Muslims in BiH. For Clinton, the Balkans became an important issue due to internal matters in the US and his stay in the White House. In their strategy to resolve the crisis, they decided to use Croatia to attack the Serbian forces in BiH, and therefore the Split Declaration was signed by Izetbegoviæ and Tudjman, which permitted the entry of HV forces under the leadership of Ante Gotovina into BiH for the purposes of cooperation with Army BiH. In order to realize that operation, HV had to climb the Dinarid mountains above Knin and liberate the city and Krajina through Operation Storm, and then immediately transfer their troops into BiH in order to pressure the Serbs and force Miloševiæ to sign the Peace Accord in Dayton.

This was a battle against the clock for Clinton, for he needed a quick solution to the crisis in order to halt Dole’s initiative and to prove himself before his voters as a decisive president who could resolve such great crises such as the one in the former Yugoslavia, the horrors of which were shown daily on CNN and other American TV stations. In order to keep the English and French off his back, Clinton bypassed the classical diplomatic channels, in order to be able to claim that he had not participated if the operation were to go sour. However, considering that the operation, led by Richard Holbrook on his behalf, ended successfully, and the men emphasized their success in their respective books.

The first contact at the highest intelligence levels began in 1992, when James Clapper was director of DIA (the Defense Intelligence Agency). His men in Croatia were Colonel Richard Herrick and his assistant Ivan Šaraè. Šaraè was a fourth order [master] sergeant, the highest rank for a non-commissioned officer. Of Croatian descent, he emigrated to the US when he was 17 years old. After a few years, he enlisted in the army and was sent to Zagreb at the beginning of the war there as he was familiar with the circumstances and knew the language. Colonel Herrick was a construction engineer, however, over time he climbed the ladder in the American military and became one of Clapper’s most trusted men.

Quickly a sort of ‘trade’ between the two agencies began. Croatia gave DIA Russian 500 kg underwater mines and the most modern Russian torpedos as well as the encryption codes used by the Yugoslav Army and the Russian army. These weapons were transferred to the US via the Split airport. When the transport was conducted, the entire airport was closed off. Hercules C-130s landed in the night, the arms were loaded and transferred to the US or one of their European bases under the greatest security measures. Also, the Croatian agency revealed the location of a chemical weapons factory in Bijelo polje near Mostar which the Serbs had transferred to Serbia. This was a well-concealed factory which was unknown even to General Bienefeld, who was the greatest expert for chemical weapons in Croatia. With the help of samples found, the American experts were able to uncover all the types of toxins produced there which had possibly been sold to Iraq or other potential enemies of the US. This was only the beginning of cooperation, by which the US immediately delivered wiretapping equipment aimed at monitoring Serbia and Montenegro, a system which could simultaneously record 20,000 telephone conversations. This cooperation was conducted with the US NSA.

Prior to Storm, the operations Summer 94 and Summer 95 had to be carried out. In planning the operations of bringing Croatian troops above Knin, the US assisted in the intelligence part of the operations. In order to precisely plan the penetration into the Bosnian mountains inland of Knin, much information was needed on the movement of Serbian troops, their communication system, codes and establishment of shelling points.

Considering that the US was much more interested in the situation in BiH than in Croatia, they asked Croatia to permit them to install a military base with ummanned aircraft. The basic condition was that this be the best-kept secret, so that it would not appear that the US had taken sides in this war. The island of Brac was selected, as it could be well protected. There all the equipment and personnel led by the CIA experts, with the long-range unmanned aircraft which could cover the entire territory of BiH to the Serbian corridor on the Sava River. The entire Krajina region in Croatia was also in its range. At that time, no one had any idea what was going on and what was being hidden on the island of Brac. Nor did the US allies, the Germans, have any idea. They sent their military attaché there on 1 January 1994. He hired a rent-a-car and drove the outer fence of the base and began taking pictures, thinking that the alertness in the base had faltered on New Year’s Day. However, he was quickly spotted by SIS and arrested. Only when he was brought into Gotovina for questioning was it learned that this was the German military attaché in Zagreb, Hans Schwan.

After this incident, the entire base was transferred to Šepurina near Zadar, and a triple line of defense placed around it. Equipment was brought in from the US overnight, and from Šepurina, the unmanned aircraft could cover every corner of Krajina and BiH. The Americans had a silent agreement with HV to hand over all the photos of the terrain and the Serbian troops, while the images were transferred via satellite in real time to the Pentagon. Three US and three Croatian officers monitored the situation at all times.

Prior to Operation Flash, which was supposed to serve as a dress rehearsal for Storm, at exactly midnight, six hours prior to the beginning of the operation, Herrick and Šaraè were called into the police and were informed that the planned action would begin in a few hours time. In the Police Ministry, at exactly midnight, the staff of Operation Flash was formed, which was transferred to the Defense Ministry at 6 a.m. When the staff was moved, the American military attaché moved with it. He constantly requested updates and sent them directly to Clinton in the White House. Each morning, the American President was informed of the preparations and every part of the operation. The Americans were thrilled by the way Flash was carried out, they realized that this model of cooperation with the Croatians was ideal, and could be decisive in the battle against Miloševiæ in BiH and could ultimately result in removing him from power. The Pentagon coordinated the entire action via Richard Herrick, and the CIA activities were coordinated by Marc Kelton, head of the CIA branch in Zagreb, who cooperated closely with Miroslav Tudjman, then head of HIS.

At the time Storm was under preparation, the Americans supplied HV with intelligence on the movements of Serbs in Krajina and the movements of YNA on the eastern borders of Croatia. They feared that Miloševiæ would launch a counter-attack with two tank brigades in eastern Slavonia if the Croats launched an attack on Knin. Through intensive monitoring of communications between Belgrade and Knin, and within Serbia, they came to the conclusion that there would be no counter-attack. It was risky that the Serbs might launch an attack from Knin itself when Gotovina and his units arrived on the Dinarid mountains above the city. Had the unmanned aircraft and monitoring showed offensive maneuvers by the troops, Storm would have begun ten days earlier.

In the wee hours of 4 August 1995, the Croatian units were issued the command to turn off all telecommunications devices between midnight and 4 am. Later it was learned that the Americans had used that time to electronically intercept and destroy the Serbian telecommunications devices.

HV was left with one hour, from 4-5 AM to use their radio ties to coordinate the operation. Just prior to Storm, the American military attaché was again called to the operation staff. Ivan Šaraè was again with him. One or two days prior to Storm, Herrick, who had prepared Storm with the Croatian officers and gave the operation the green light on Clinton’s behalf, was replaced by Colonel John Sadler. At exactly midnight, they arrived at the operative staff and from there followed all the events in the field. This time, the entire Operation was transmitted in real time via satellite to the Pentagon, where these images remain archived today. The signal transmitted to the signal by the Americans was also received by HV, and with the help of those images, the firing upon Serbian positions and the military base near Knin could be monitored to within millimeters. In addition to electronically destroying the Serbian communications, the US military also acted militarily against the Serbian positions, when it fired on the anti-aircraft battery near Knin from American combat planes that flew over the battle area. That news was released only once, on the 6 o’clock news. Afterwards, the US sharply condemned this, and that news was never repeated. No one believed the official American explanation for the rocket attack, and today the general perception is that this was direct US assistance to HV, only that even ten years after Storm this must not be admitted, due to US-British relations, as Britain had a completely different perspective on how to resolve the Balkan issue. And it still does today.

The US was thrilled with the how fast and clean the operation was conducted, and with its outcome, which permitted the lightning fast entry of HV into BiH and penetration all the way to Banja Luka and, finally, Belgrade’s consent to sign the Dayton Accord. The American control and satisfaction of the complete operation was later confirmed in the statements that the operation was carried out properly, and as such, the US-Croatian cooperation in intelligence and military matters intensified. General Colonel Patrick Hughes, Clapper’s successor as director of DIA, visited Croatia, intensified cooperation in the sector of electronic monitoring of Serbia and Montenegro, other intelligence was swapped, MPRI began its intensive training of the Croatian military and Rebiæ was decorated for his efforts.

The first word that Croatian officers might have to stand trial for the events during Storm was heard in 1997. The US immediately responded and requested on a dozen occasions in discussions with the Hague Prosecutor that Storm, as a militarily-clean operation, be left alone, as Nacional has learned from a high-ranking diplomatic source. At that time, there was a problem concerning the extradition of Mladen Naletiliæ Tuta to the Hague, and the US promised Croatia that the Hague would not raise charges for Storm if they handed Naletiliæ over. Naletiliæ was extradited, and Carla Del Ponte outwitted the American administration and began with her demands that the Croatian generals be investigated as suspects in Storm. The US was dismayed but was not allowed to show this, trying to resolve the matter through quiet diplomacy instead, which to this day has not succeeded. Therefore it would be a step in the right direction for the Hague to request that the Pentagon hand over all the images recorded by the ‘Predator’ unmanned aircraft during and after Storm.

Furthermore, for the interests of truth, all of the high ranking American military and intelligence officers involved in the entire operation, which ended the war in the Balkans and removed Miloševiæ from power, should be called to testify in the Hague. Those responsible for the crimes which took place after the operation are known, and they are the ones which should stand before the court, as they should have eight or nine years ago. Had these men been tried then, Carla Del Ponte today would have no aces up her sleeve, and Croatia would not have the problems it has, with the entire operation proclaimed a ‘criminal operation’ and the entire state administration of the time a ‘criminal organization’.

7 posted on 01/24/2006 8:50:40 AM PST by robowombat
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To: robowombat

This is very disheartening.

8 posted on 01/24/2006 10:30:29 AM PST by montyspython (Love that chicken from Popeye's)
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To: montyspython

Given no Racak Massacre, no mass graves in Kosovo, opppps, sorry, yes there some mass graves found at the end of 2005. Guess what.....wasn't Albanians........

Another Mass Grave In Malisheva Is Being Investigated
Trans: S. Gajtani
12 Aug 05(Zeri) – The workers of Office for Missing Persons and UNMIK forensic teams from Prishtina, lead by their Chief, Pablo Baraybar, started searching for another mass grave in the territory of Malisheva Municipality.
The searches are being made in the same location where three months ago a mass grave with 13 bodies was found, according to the information’s they belonged to the Serbian nationality.
Since Thursday in Mirdita neighborhood of Malisheva, two diggers are working on digging the ground and searching for the mass graves. Argentinean Special Forces are securing the location with tape and a sign to not cross into the area.
So far no bodies has been found according to the Baraybar. The office that is led by him has information that 10 to 13 bodies are in these mass graves, which they suppose are Serbs.
The new searches, according to Baraybar, will continue until they find the bodies. He has information’s that the new mass grave is somewhere near the mass grave that has been found in May of this year.

There Will Be More Exhumations In Kosovo By Year End
Trans. ZvonkoS
Merdare, 10 Aug 05(Tanjug) – President of the Serbia and Montenegro Ministerial Council Committee for investigation of war crimes Gvozden Gagic announced today, that by the end of the year, several mass graves in Kosovo and Metohija will be examined which contain around 40 bodily remains of Serbs and other non-Albanian victims.
“In the following months mass graves will be examined in Suva Reka and others in Kosovo and Metohija, for which is believed that around 80 people of Serbian nationality are buried”, said Gagic after handover of 81 body of Albanian to UNMIK, who were exhumed from mass grave in Batajnica, near Belgrade.

9 posted on 01/24/2006 11:47:18 AM PST by tgambill (I would like to comment.....)
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To: montyspython; tgambill; ma bell
I know of a Serbian family who lived in Okucani. Gave the old guy a can of gas in 1993 in preparation for the coming Croatian attack which came in 1995. They were good people very hospitable.
10 posted on 01/24/2006 12:10:50 PM PST by Wraith (The village called the idiot is missing...)
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To: threeleftsmakearight

How do you know this? Based on what source of information, three?

11 posted on 01/24/2006 1:15:30 PM PST by ma bell ("Take me to the Brig. I want to see the "real Marines". Major General Chesty Puller, USMC)
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To: threeleftsmakearight

"Because it was for a righteous cause, any behavior by the U.S. military and CIA against the Serbs (even Serbian kids) is justified."

******huh?? There was no righteous cause here. The Serbs have been demonized for no reason. Yes, there were war crimes committed, however, the Serbs are taking care of those responsibility. The Albanians (KLA), wiped out entire villages killing even the farm animals....there is taped testimony to that fact. The Albanian Extremist have been murdering Serbs since 1999, and it continues to a degree even as of last week. I was there from 1999 to 2004 in a capacity to observe these events.......No mass graves in Kosovo except for Serbian mass graves found in August of 2005.

You have the situation all out of whack....Even the Albanians were lied to by their own KLA and Albanians who were told or paid to give inaccurate information, especially about the "rape camps". This is also kidding.

You cannot trust Balkan History accounts post 1993....they are written by "experts", who are telling the wrong story. The records of history prior to 1990's are accurate. You will notice from the early 90's the facts change or, are distorted. It's interesting.

12 posted on 01/24/2006 2:34:15 PM PST by tgambill (I would like to comment.....)
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To: tgambill

"Because it was for a righteous cause, any behavior by the U.S. military and CIA against the Serbs (even Serbian kids) is justified."

Sarcasm on. Joke son, joke.

13 posted on 01/24/2006 3:22:08 PM PST by robowombat
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To: robowombat

oh.....sooooo bad...I guess I'm sensitive to the issue.....Dad... :)) (joking)...

It's a pet peave, See ya......


14 posted on 01/24/2006 3:31:18 PM PST by tgambill (I would like to comment.....)
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To: tgambill
It's interesting.

As interesting as jokers who come to online forums and try to push lies that are so pathetically transparent that their only recourse when confronted with the facts is to attack the source of those facts, whether it be the United States State Department, the OSCE, or ICTY?

Yeah, interesting.

But in an abnormal psychology kind of way, not a Balkan history kind of way.

By the way, Tom, the existence of the mass graves at Pusto Selo and Izbica, which had for so long been denied by Serb apologists, was confirmed by Stevanovic while he was giving testimony at Milosevic's trial, while being examined by Milosevic no less.

So not only have we confirmed the existence of mass graves you're lying about by actually finding them, we've had the existence of mass graves which the Serbs emptied before we could find them confirmed.

Ah well, like you said, you aren't being paid for your efforts, and like I said, you're giving the Serbs their money's worth.

15 posted on 01/24/2006 3:55:17 PM PST by Hoplite
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To: Hoplite

there are no where near the mass graves that was claimed. Tell me where Hoppy are the mass graves of Kosovo? Tell me where the mass graves of Racak? The Serbs that were responsible for killing Albanians are being handled by the Serbs as they are aware and are taking care of their own. Nothing can be said about ICTY and The Hague.

I wondered when you were going to pop your little ole head up and find something that you can say. There are many different ways to introduce information or points other than the less than professional way that you do.

However, I've certainly ran into a few that have been worse....if that were possible....:).

There have been many of the so called facts said about the Serbs that have been false to justify entrance into the Balkans. However, I do understand the reasons for entering, (race there before Al Qaeda gets an early foothold, pipeline from the caspian, and keep an eye on Islam that is germanating in the Balkans, etc... Obviously, this is a simplistic view, it's much more complicated and beyond the scope of this forum.....

One example of the manipulation and change of policy:

Circa 1998:

There's a military insurrection that is taking shape, backed by the members of the Albania Diaspora in Germany, Switzerland, and right here in New York City, where a lot of Albanians and Albanian-Americans are sending a lot of money and support to Kosovo. (Gosh - NYC? -SG)

Holbrooke: An independent Kosovo would "unravel Southeastern Europe."

JIM LEHRER: And they want an independent Kosovo ruled by Albanians, right?

RICHARD HOLBROOKE: Yes. And more. I met with several Albanian leaders in Kosovo who said their goal is an independent Kosovo, their goal is to recreate the Greater Albania that existed briefly during the 30's and 40's, which includes Albania, Kosovo, and part of Macedonia. That, I can tell you, Jim, would unravel Southeastern Europe and dramatically increase the chances of a general war. And that's why the situation is both not the same as Bosnia and why it's so dangerous I really need to stress this point so people do not misunderstand it. The Kosovo Albanians have been very badly treated for over a decade by the Serb minority in Kosovo. Their rights have been denied and the Yugoslav federal constitution was changed to reduce their powers. This was entirely wrong, and it led to the inevitable reaction which we're now seeing. At the same time, the violent solution which is being advocated by the so-called Kosovo Liberation Army, which is really not an army but a lot of different groups that are gradually forming an infrastructure of resistance, this approach is highly dangerous to stability in the region.

Sept. 10, 2002
Cumberland, Md.: Where you aware of the KLA and Bosnian Muslims' ties to Osama bin Laden at the time you were negotiating with them?

Richard C. Holbrooke: Yes. In fact, we were so concerned about this issue that we wrote into the Dayton Peace Agreements a clause requiring the withdrawal of all "foreign elements" within a short time after the agreement took force. When we found elements that had remained behind, we launched raids against them. Not all of these people were removed, and the effort is still continuing. Without the peace in Bosnia, there is a real chance that bin Laden would have been able to set up in the Balkans what he did in Afghanistan with far greater danger to the West.

Now--fast-forward Nov 8 2005:
Holbrooke, the architect of the 1995 Bosnian peace deal, who said that independence was the only way forward for Kosovo and its mainly Muslim Albanians.

"I cannot see any final status for Kosovo other than independence," said Holbrooke, who forged the Dayton Peace Accords that ended Bosnia's 1992-95 war.

"But at the same time ... this cannot be achieved without ironclad guarantees for the safety, security, and protection of the rights of the Serbs who live in Kosovo and the protection of their magnificent monuments," he said.

mass graves:

More mass graves were found in Maleselev in August 2005.....

Mass graves were found in several places of Albanians. The Serbs as I said before are prosecuting these criminals after the U.S. put their foot down for them to do so. The Serbs have been such good boys and girls in cleaning up their closet that they are sending troops to work with the UN.....

Now, what convictions have been upheld for Ramush H. and Fatmir Limaj? None.....Six witnesses against Ramush have been murdered to include Tahir Zemaj, was a former FARK member, and member of LDK pol party. Long time enemy of Thaci.

mass graves: Yes, both Albanians and Serbs...... for the truth not partial truth as you would cover up the truth......try again, cut the sarcasm and share, provided discussion, facts (that are researched). So, if you can't, don't go away mad....just go away. Or, come up with an unbiased opjective discussion.


16 posted on 01/24/2006 5:09:03 PM PST by tgambill (I would like to comment.....)
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To: tgambill
there are no where near the mass graves that was claimed

Well wait a minute, Tom.

One minute you're saying there were no mass graves of Kosovo Albanians, and now you're admitting, in a rather backhand way, that there were.

If you can't get even the most elementary facts straight, what use are you?

17 posted on 01/24/2006 5:14:57 PM PST by Hoplite
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To: Hoplite

Uh notice where I said there were no mass graves.....uh, Kosovo...there were no mass graves of Albanians...But, there were of Serbs.....

I see you are still up to your old tricks......


18 posted on 01/24/2006 6:20:50 PM PST by tgambill (I would like to comment.....)
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To: tgambill
So you're back to trying to say that there were no mass graves of Albanians in Kosovo - even when Milosevic has General Stevanovic testifying that there were?

Or are you just trying to say you don't know that either Pusto Selo or Izbica are in Kosovo?

19 posted on 01/24/2006 6:29:43 PM PST by Hoplite
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To: Hoplite

Hopeless, you have the time to waste, I don't have the time to lay out the complete scenario for you or details that you should know yourself. In other words, you are into the game playing, with the agenda of discrediting those that are passing out the truth.

You have a tendency of leaving out the right info, and trying to redirect answers like a lawyer or like those knotheads on libertyforum....what a bunch that is.

Present facts to give me, and I will say....opppppps...and I will learn something. Or, maybe you have something to learn. But, instead, you are reading the posts not to share, learn or participate but to find any and all possible holes to prove some point that you have to make and not because it's true.....


20 posted on 01/24/2006 6:33:58 PM PST by tgambill (I would like to comment.....)
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