Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Africa's Hunger - A Systemic Crisis
BBC ^ | 2-1-2006

Posted on 02/01/2006 11:05:03 AM PST by blam

Africa's hunger - a systemic crisis

By Martin Plaut
BBC Africa analyst

The number of Africans needing food aid has doubled in a decade

More than half of Africa is now in need of urgent food assistance.

The UN's Food and Agriculture Organisation (FAO) is warning that 27 sub-Saharan countries now need help.

But what appear as isolated disasters brought about by drought or conflict in countries like Somalia, Malawi, Niger, Kenya and Zimbabwe are - in reality - systemic problems.

It is African agriculture itself that is in crisis, and according to the International Food Policy Research Institute, this has left 200 million people malnourished.

It is particularly striking that the FAO highlights political problems such as civil strife, refugee movements and returnees in 15 of the 27 countries it declares in need of urgent assistance. By comparison drought is only cited in 12 out of 27 countries.

The implication is clear - Africa's years of wars, coups and civil strife are responsible for more hunger than the natural problems that befall it.

Critical issues

In essence Africa's hunger is the product of a series of interrelated factors. Africa is a vast continent, and no one factor can be applied to any particular country. But four issues are critical:

Decades of underinvestment in rural areas, which have little political clout. Africa's elites respond to political pressure, which is mainly exercised in towns and cities. This is compounded by corruption and mismanagement - what donors call a lack of sound governance.

"Poor governance is a major issue in many African countries, and one that has serious repercussions for long-term food security," says a statement by the International Food Policy Research Institute.

"Problems such as corruption, collusion and nepotism can significantly inhibit the capacity of governments to promote development efforts."

Wars and political conflict, leading to refugees and instability.

In 2004 the chairman of the African Union Commission, Alpha Oumar Konare, reminded an AU summit that the continent had suffered from 186 coups and 26 major wars in the past 50 years. It is estimated that there are more than 16 million refugees and displaced persons in Africa. Farmers need stability and certainty before they can succeed in producing the food their families and societies need.

HIV/Aids depriving families of their most productive labour.

This is particularly a problem in southern Africa, where over 30% of sexually active adults are HIV positive. According to aid agency Oxfam, when a family member becomes infected, food production can fall by up to 60%, as women are not only expected to be carers, but also provide much of the agricultural labour.

Unchecked population growth

"Sub-Saharan Africa 's population has grown faster than any region over the past 30 years, despite the millions of deaths from the Aids pandemic," the UN Population Fund says.

A decline in soil quality makes land less productive

"Between 1975 and 2005, the population more than doubled, rising from 335 to 751 million, and is currently growing at a rate of 2.2% a year."

In some parts of Africa land is plentiful, and this is not a problem. But in others it has had severe consequences.

It has forced farming families to subdivide their land time and again, leading to tiny plots or families moving onto unsuitable, overworked land.

In the highlands of Ethiopia and Eritrea some land is now so degraded that there is little prospect that it will ever produce a decent harvest.

This problem is compounded by the state of Africa's soils.

In sub-Saharan Africa soil quality is classified as degraded in about 72% of arable land and 31% of pasture land.

In addition to natural nutrient deficiencies in the soil, soil fertility is declining by the year through "nutrient mining", whereby nutrients are removed over the harvest period and lost through leaching, erosion or other means.

Nutrient levels have declined over the past 30 years, says the International Food Policy Research Institute.

Consequences

The result is that a continent that was more than self sufficient in food at independence 50 years ago, is now a massive food importer. The book The African Food Crisis says that in less than 40 years the sub-continent went from being a net exporter of basic food staples to relying on imports and food aid.

In 1966-1970, net exports averaged 1.3 million tons of food a year, it states.

"By the late 1970s Africa imported 4.4 million tonnes of staple foods a year, a figure that had risen to 10 million tonnes by the mid 1980s."

It said that since independence, agricultural output per capita remained stagnant, and in many places declined.

Some campaigners and academics argue that African farmers will only be able to properly feed their families and societies when Western goods stop flooding their markets.


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: africas; crisis; hunger; systemic
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-52 next last
Not one animal in sub-Saharian Africa was ever domesticated.

Also, today's Black (Bantu) natives over ran South Africa around 3,000BC displacing the San Bushmen who are a completely different race.

1 posted on 02/01/2006 11:05:04 AM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: blam

mugabes always blight the crops.


2 posted on 02/01/2006 11:07:22 AM PST by GSlob
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam
Zimbabwe- Rhodesia?

Not one bloody comment about the elimination of the white farmers and the non-production from their former lands?
3 posted on 02/01/2006 11:07:30 AM PST by Sundog (cheers)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Sundog

They don't want facts to get in the way of a good sob story.


4 posted on 02/01/2006 11:09:44 AM PST by 300magnum (We know that if evil is not confronted, it gains in strength and audacity, and returns to strike us)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: blam

Recolonize Africa - give it to the Chinese. They're looking for elbow room and resources, and they're pretty good at feedin' themselves for communists.


5 posted on 02/01/2006 11:12:59 AM PST by Little Ray (I'm a reactionary, hirsute, gun-owning, knuckle dragging, Christian Neanderthal and proud of it!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam

"Some campaigners and academics argue that African farmers will only be able to properly feed their families and societies when Western goods stop flooding their markets."

Yeah, that will help their soil.


6 posted on 02/01/2006 11:13:36 AM PST by mlc9852
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam
Africa needs more aid because of the curse of foriegn aid - it creates dependency. It props up corrupt dictators while putting local farmers out of business.
7 posted on 02/01/2006 11:15:45 AM PST by Jibaholic (We wouldn't let our enemies have guns, why should we let them have ideas? -- Josef Stalin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam

This is overall a very good article because it correctly places most of the blame on the African's themselves. Government corruption seemed to be the greatest factor of all in the hunger problem. Bet the South Africans wish the white farmers were back in business, life was much better for them then.


8 posted on 02/01/2006 11:21:23 AM PST by TheCrusader ("The frenzy of the mohammedans has devastated the Churches of God" Pope Urban II ~ 1097A.D.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam
Africa stays poor for the same reason people in the ghetto stay poor, because welfare (be it domestic or international in nature) robs people of their dignity and will and need to better themselves.

The best thing we could do to help the poor in Africa and ourselves is to STOP giving them aid of any kind.
9 posted on 02/01/2006 11:21:55 AM PST by conservative physics
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam; GSlob; TheCrusader; conservative physics
"Between 1975 and 2005, the population more than doubled, rising from 335 to 751 million, and is currently growing at a rate of 2.2% a year."

They refuse to stop having babies that they can't feed. Even when their children are literally starving to death, they go right ahead and have more. They obviously don't care, so why should I? Frankly, I'm more concerned about the fact that they're wiping out wildlife by overrunning and destroying every square inch of land they can get their hands on.

10 posted on 02/01/2006 11:30:06 AM PST by GovernmentShrinker
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam

This is a perfect argument for Empire America. The US moves in, takes over these third-world misery factories. It installs an effective local government overseen by American supervisors. Through that government, food is distributed, agricultural practices are reformed, and infrastructure is improved to the point where starvation is no longer epidemic. If the locals object to the "colonization" of their precious dungheap, then they can have the starvation, the disease, and the pestilence back. If not, then maybe they can learn to be human and eventually take over for themselves.


11 posted on 02/01/2006 11:35:50 AM PST by IronJack
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: IronJack
You forget that England and other European countries already did that. Many of these places were colonial paradises until Europeans left them to fend for themselves. The same would just happen again, we would come in ... fix everything... have everyone fat and happy... then when we left they would just run it all into the ground till they were starving and demanding aid again.

The best thing these people could do is LEAVE the cities, LEAVE the aid camps, go back to the jungle or where ever originated from and grow their own crops to feed themselves, and hunt and fish local game to survive. Waiting for the next handout at the capital or an aid camp is a recipe for death and misery.
12 posted on 02/01/2006 11:47:07 AM PST by conservative physics
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: blam

The late Sam Kinison had the right solution to the problem.


13 posted on 02/01/2006 11:47:45 AM PST by dfwgator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam
The (not so) funny thing is Africa is in many ways, the most resource rich continent on earth, and should clearly demonstrate with all finality, the clear failure of marxism as a political/economic system.

When this is pointed out to many; however, the blame will fall squarely upon, 'centuries of colonialism,' which in all honesty represented the highest standards of living much of the continent has ever known.

14 posted on 02/01/2006 11:53:38 AM PST by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: djreece

marking


15 posted on 02/01/2006 11:56:17 AM PST by djreece ("... Until He leads justice to victory." Matt. 12:20c)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: blam

Can anyone point to black majority ruled countries that are not unmitigated disasters and dependant upon outside financial and technical support?


16 posted on 02/01/2006 11:56:19 AM PST by river rat (You may turn the other cheek, but I prefer to look into my enemy's vacant dead eyes.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam
The number of Africans needing food aid has doubled in a decade

The new PC definition of "compassion": maximizing the number of humans who must die, as long as possible, and call it "compassion".

At the end of the day, when it is no longer possible, just say, "we mwnat well".

17 posted on 02/01/2006 12:46:07 PM PST by Publius6961
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: conservative physics
You forget that England and other European countries already did that.

Yes, but their mistake was in leaving before their time. They succumbed to the pressures of "anti-colonialism" and left the rats to scurry around their own hole and make a mess of things. Certainly, they have that right. But if they do, and they CHOOSE to do so, then they have no high ground from which to demand that the rest of the world subsidize their barbarism.

In other words, we'll bail you out for humanitarian reasons. But be assured that our money DOES come with strings attached. And those strings are -- among other things -- that you can't randomly hack each other up into chum, that you can't steal the money to buy hookers and limos, that you can't even claim to be a legitimate government. You're only caretakers until we give you the green light.

For a perfect example of the decay of a de-colonized African country, look at the history of Congo/Zaire. And they were colonized by the FRENCH, for cripes' sake!

18 posted on 02/01/2006 12:47:42 PM PST by IronJack
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: GSlob
The first world subsidizes its agriculture to the tune of $250 billion a year, about the GDP of the entire continent of Africa. Most people in Africa try to make a living as farmers or herdsmen. They are supposed to compete with that level of subsidies, how exactly?

The first world sends tens of billions in direct aid and hundreds of billions in loans, on terms that rarely involve actual repayment in full with interest. They make this available to and through corrupt governments more interested in the French Riviera than in their own countryside. But access to this endless stream of free money depends on political power in Africa, and manipulation of PC world opinion. So the lesson to would be leaders is that production is utterly unnecessary, but political control is absolutely essential.

So when the farmers dislike how they are treated, who is supposed to listen? Their production in unnecessary for the local pols. Their repression is mandatory, to maintain access to the western money stream. When local conditions get so bad their produce is driven to scarcity and its value soars - natural law's way of ensuring their useful cooperative work is rewarded and maintained - the first world steps in again and floods the place with free food, driving what should be their most valuable commodities to zero.

Then first worlders pretend all of Africa's problems are domestic and they have nothing to do with it. Or worse, that they must give twice as much no-strings bakshish to the dictators, and twice as much free agricultural product to the people.

19 posted on 02/01/2006 1:06:27 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: IronJack
Actually, Leopold the king of Belgium, as his personal fief. Which he looted mercilessly, killing about a third of the population in the process. That he did so profitably - and at the time, with a stellar reputation as an outstanding humanitarian, through sheer hypocrisy and spin - formed the model for profitable looting by all its subsequent African governments.
20 posted on 02/01/2006 1:09:26 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: river rat
Sure, Botswana. From the CIA world factbook -

"Botswana has maintained one of the world's highest economic growth rates since independence in 1966. Through fiscal discipline and sound management, Botswana has transformed itself from one of the poorest countries in the world to a middle-income country with a per capita GDP of $10,100 in 2005. Two major investment services rank Botswana as the best credit risk in Africa."

They have diamonds, which helps. But they haven't made a hash of things, and in fact have used the wealth those brought in, quite wisely.

21 posted on 02/01/2006 1:12:48 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: TheCrusader
As though the first world's lending and aid practices have nothing to do with the viability of corruption in Africa...
22 posted on 02/01/2006 1:14:13 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: Sundog
Not one bloody comment about the elimination of the white farmers and the non-production from their former lands?

Zim went from a food exporter to importer solely due to Mugabe's brutal dictatorship. What Africa needs is an end to corrupt dictators and enforcement of property rights and contract rights. And a little less agricultural protectionism in the West would help.

23 posted on 02/01/2006 1:20:34 PM PST by colorado tanker (I can't comment on things that might come before the Court, but I can tell you my Pinochle strategy)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: colorado tanker

Do you keep up with the 'Cathy Buckle' series of e-mails from Zimbabwe?

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1562632/posts

Go have 'clive' put you on the ping list. It is good. It is a real heart breaker. Go check on her e-mails over the past few months.

http://www.africantears.netfirms.com/thisweek.shtml


24 posted on 02/01/2006 1:37:41 PM PST by Sundog (cheers)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: JasonC
9% growth rates are nice, but Botswana is #2 in AIDS infections (over 37%) and life expectancy (33.8 years), and dedicates a rather high 4% of GDP to military spending. Unemployment officially is 23.8%, but unofficial estimates place it closer to 40%.

Since getting independence and democratic self rule in 1965, Botswana has elected both sitting vice presidents they have had. They've had a grand total of 3 presidents in 41 years. Seems more like a stable oligarchy with the assistance of the diamond merchants than a thriving democracy... but at least they can feed themselves when they're not dying of preventable diseases.

25 posted on 02/01/2006 2:18:25 PM PST by Teacher317
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: Teacher317
What's an aids infection?

4% is not high. North Korea spends 40%, that's high.

The question was has anyone managed to govern well since independence, and the answer is yes.

Also it is not the growth rate, it is the $10,000 per capital GDP that stands out from the rest of Africa. The next best is probably Cameroon, which has also enjoyed continued political stability. It has 10 times the people, and a per capital GDP of only about $2000, and a 5% growth rate. Still way better than most of the continent though.

As for "unemployment", it is a pretty meaningless stat in most of Africa, where employment in the western sense is almost unknown outside of the larger cities. Most people work for themselves or extended family units, and much of the economy isn't traded for money at any point from effort to consumption.

26 posted on 02/01/2006 2:35:24 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: JasonC
capita, of course. Mental typos...
27 posted on 02/01/2006 3:37:58 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: Sundog
I hadn't run across this. Thanks.

It's heartbreaking what is happening in much of Africa. It will take a lot more than Bono and feel-good European "debt forgiveness" to put it right.

28 posted on 02/01/2006 4:53:42 PM PST by colorado tanker (I can't comment on things that might come before the Court, but I can tell you my Pinochle strategy)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: JasonC
A quote from the CIA World Factbook webpage that you cited

"Botswana has one of the world's highest known rates of HIV/AIDS infection,"

Do you really not know what this refers to?

29 posted on 02/01/2006 6:23:35 PM PST by Teacher317
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: JasonC
The succeeding governments of Zaire haven't been European. Some have been backed by western interests, but they have been no more effective than those that arose internally. Repeated loans from the IMF have not been repaid. Extensions have been granted, the expiration passed, and only demands for more. Promised reforms haven't materialized, civil war is a constant threat, and the cycle just feeds on itself.

Now that the bottom has fallen out of the cobalt and copper markets, there is little chance that any of the IMF money will be repaid. Much of the mining machinery is broken down or just plain obsolete, and because of the nationalization of so many foreign investments, nobody will invest a dime there.

So refugees, corruption, and ignorant "self-determination" continue to suck the country dry, while its leaders beg money from anyone with a buck to spare.

It's a perfect example of a bed made for lying in. And you can't lay it at the doorstep of the colonizers. The Belgian Congo was stable for half a century while the Westerners ran things. Yes, it was a brutal, inhuman regime. But the rickety apparatus that replaced it is no better, and at least Leopold made the trains run on time. Under Mobutu, the trains didn't even run on tracks.

A more enlightened colonization could liberate the Congo. But world opinion would rather let them suffer and die under their own inadequacies than accept rule by their cultural superiors. Can Kabila turn it around? Don't be ridiculous. He's not even the man his father was, and HE wasn't much.

30 posted on 02/01/2006 7:51:42 PM PST by IronJack
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: JasonC
"As though the first world's lending and aid practices have nothing to do with the viability of corruption in Africa..."

America just forgave a 40 BILLION DOLLAR debt to Africa, what more do they need from the 'first world', welfare checks and 4,000 tons of government cheese?

South Africa, under white 'apartied', was actually doing so well agriculturally that they were exporting food products. As soon as the white farmers were chased off the land by the 'friendly' new government they began starving to death. This, I believe, speaks very well for itself.

31 posted on 02/01/2006 8:12:37 PM PST by TheCrusader ("The frenzy of the mohammedans has devastated the Churches of God" Pope Urban II ~ 1097A.D.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: JasonC
Ah yes, Botswana -- that paradise in central Africa...

A nation with the total population of 1,640,115, which is the approximate population of Philadelphia.

A nation where the life expectancy at birth for the total population is 33.87 years.

A nation where the 2003 est. for adult prevalence rate for HIV/AIDS is 37.3%.

A nation where the major infectious diseases still include the food or waterborne diseases: bacterial diarrhea, hepatitis A, and typhoid fever ---- in addition to the vector-borne disease: malaria (2004)

Unemployment officially is 23.8%, but unofficial estimates place it closer to 40%.

HIV/AIDS infection rates are the second highest in the world and threaten Botswana's impressive economic gains. An expected leveling off in diamond mining production overshadow long-term prospects.

All of the above is from the same source you quoted...
When all the facts are considered - the picture of Botswana is NOT nearly as bright as the GNP would indicate -- since the GNP is NOT equally distributed amongst the population...

Income from their ONLY significant industry - diamond mining - falls into very few pockets..

Now then -- back to my original question.
Can anyone point to a black majority ruled nation that is NOT an unmitigated disaster?

Semper Fi

32 posted on 02/02/2006 8:50:57 AM PST by river rat (You may turn the other cheek, but I prefer to look into my enemy's vacant dead eyes.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: JasonC
"The question was has anyone managed to govern well since independence, and the answer is yes."

That was NOT my question.....

My QUESTION was:
Can anyone point to black majority ruled countries that are not unmitigated disasters and dependent upon outside financial and technical support?

Semper Fi

33 posted on 02/02/2006 8:56:39 AM PST by river rat (You may turn the other cheek, but I prefer to look into my enemy's vacant dead eyes.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: IronJack
Leopold did not make the trains run on time, he slaughtered a third of his citizens. He was a monster every bit as bad as Pol Pot or Joe Stalin, just less ideological about it. The succeeding governments of Zaire were exactly as unprincipled and exactly as interested in profits extracted and ripped out of the country to pay for expensive villas in the south of France. And they did just as well - Mobutu was horrible for Zaire, but made a billion dollars looting it and died in his bed. (In exile in Morocco to be sure, but in perfect comfort - just like Amin in Saudi Arabia).

And yes I can lay it at the doorstep of the colonizers, as well as crooks like Mobutu, and the present gang of Marxist thugs, all of them complete rogues from start to finish.

The modern form of extraction in most of Africa consists of attending development conferences and buttering up first world bankers, followed by a soft loan, followed by simple robbery, followed by default. Where that isn't in the working part of the cycle, any available asset or raw material is gathered by press gangs with guns at their heads for the sole benefit of the extractors.

Nobody even tries to build wealth from the people up. There is vastly more wealth outside to be had through scams, and nothing the people make can compete with western subsidized agriculture, or the allure of a soft loan.

If the west actually gave a damn about Africa is would first abolish its own farm subsidies, second grant unilateral free trade to everybody there willing to take it, third cut out all the free money and handouts to ruthless tyants, and four back any reformers it could find who aren't Marxist thugs or looters, and if they can't find any go kill said thugs and make their own reforms.

But they can't be bothered. So the worst human beings on earth prey there with impunity.

34 posted on 02/02/2006 4:29:12 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: TheCrusader
They need the first world to stop giving $40 billion handouts to ruthless tyrants, for starters.

When you give billions to ruthless tyrants, it stabilizes ruthless tyranny.

It would also be nice if the US lifted the effectively world wide ban on DDT imposed by its green Nazis, and so eradicates malaria.

If would also be nice if the EU, instead of paying every French farmer thirty eight gazillion dollars to grow three beets and a potato, ended its agricultural subsidies and traded freely with primarily agricultural societies.

And no, giving away free rice to tyrants is not a substitute. Farmers in Africa have no status because their overlords do not need them. Guess why.

35 posted on 02/02/2006 4:34:03 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Teacher317
Do you really not know that AIDS in Africa is medical make believe, the population is rising tens of millions a year anyway, and not the slightest deviation in its demographic trajectory can be traced to the supposedly devasting AIDs epidemic?

If someone told you that you could tell the black death was raging in Europe because the population just doubled, would you look twice?

36 posted on 02/02/2006 4:36:48 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: JasonC
The modern form of extraction in most of Africa consists of attending development conferences and buttering up first world bankers, followed by a soft loan, followed by simple robbery, followed by default.

I agree 100 percent. However, it is not Western interests doing the "extraction." It is the Africans themselves. Or at least an influential elite.

Nobody even tries to build wealth from the people up.

I'm not sure how that is done. It's a bootstrap process, since it requires a fairly robust economy to build capital, let alone to attract top-down investment. And there is no African country I can think of that boasts even a stable economy, let alone a robust one.

If the west actually gave a damn about Africa is would first abolish its own farm subsidies, second grant unilateral free trade to everybody there willing to take it, third cut out all the free money and handouts to ruthless tyants, and four back any reformers it could find who aren't Marxist thugs or looters, and if they can't find any go kill said thugs and make their own reforms.

I agree with the last two ideas, disagree with the first two. I don't have time to go into any detail, but I don't think export trade -- especially in agricultural commodities -- is the answer for most African nations. It's everything they can do to feed themselves, let alone have any kind of surplus for export.

But they can't be bothered. So the worst human beings on earth prey there with impunity.

I don't believe that the predators are Western. I think they are home grown.

37 posted on 02/03/2006 6:31:24 AM PST by IronJack
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: JasonC
"And no, giving away free rice to tyrants is not a substitute. Farmers in Africa have no status because their overlords do not need them. Guess why."

Now the topic goes from starvation to 'status'? Africa is its own worst enemy. Nothing of what you claimed in your "blame the West" tirade rings true with me. It's just more of the tired old blame game and inability to take responsibility for themselves.

Every country has a government, and if you're going to try to help starving people it's those governments that must receive and distribute the aid to their people; there's no other viable way to do it. If Africans are so corrupt and unprincipled that they stand by and watch their own people die of starvation so they can feed their soldiers it is not up to the West to "fix" them. They need to "fix" themselves.

The last time the U.S. tried to help the African people they got ambushed by Somalian civilians, militia and guerillas loyal to their 'warlord'. Don't even get me started on that. The best foreign policy we can ever have with Africa is to pretend they don't exist until they can establish a government that will work with the rest of the world instead of against them.

38 posted on 02/03/2006 12:16:33 PM PST by TheCrusader ("The frenzy of the mohammedans has devastated the Churches of God" Pope Urban II ~ 1097A.D.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: IronJack
The "elite" tyrants are not the Africans themselves. That is the whole bleeding point. Why is it so hard to see this blatant moral fact the whole thing turns on? The tyrants running most of Africa are not the people of Africa, any more than Saddam Hussein was the Kurds.

As for how bottom up wealth is done, it is remarkably simple - you let the people work and keep the results of their efforts, and you don't give the tyrants any other way to get rich, than to have rich peasants. When the safety, wealth, and power of the governors depend entirely on the work, safety, and well-being of the people, the governors rapidly discover where their real interests lie. The few that don't, you or a smarter ambitious neighbor can go kill or remove.

Export trade is the route to prosperity for most of Africa. Coffee, cocoa, rubber, and other "cash crops" bringing in hard currency and delivering it not to the hands of corrupt banker's toadies in the cities, but people who actually work in the countryside, can and would develop the place. You can get a lot more rice with a ton of exported coffee than trying to grow it directly.

And first world ag subsidies dramatically harm the entire agricultural third world. They dramatically lower world wide prices for all agricultural products. They tell the rest of the world, "only urban production is of any profit or interest". And this is both nonsense, and a recipe for permanent hunger in the poorest nations, who produce the least. They are precisely the ones that should have the greatest portion of their output focused on agriculture. And instead, we keep most of world-wide ag output in the richest countries. Not because economics calls for it, but by deliberate government policy forcing it to be so.

The predators are equal opportunity scumbags and moral idiots, lots of them homegrown and some of them not. Including quite a few in the first world who pay no attention to the actual effects of their actions, and seem constitutionally incapable of making the simplest moral distinctions between African farmers who work for a living and African murderous goons who do not.

39 posted on 02/03/2006 1:50:12 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: conservative physics

"The best thing we could do to help the poor in Africa and ourselves is to STOP giving them aid of any kind."

I agree. Unfortunately, the Republicrats are not onboard with this idea.


40 posted on 02/03/2006 1:54:57 PM PST by reelfoot
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: GovernmentShrinker

"They refuse to stop having babies that they can't feed. Even when their children are literally starving to death, they go right ahead and have more. They obviously don't care, so why should I?"

Agreed. If you can't feed 'em, don't breed 'em.


41 posted on 02/03/2006 1:56:15 PM PST by reelfoot
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: TheCrusader
Murder their governments and create just ones. Of course there is a viable way to do it. Here is what is not a viable way to do it - give free sacks of rice to murderous scumbags. That doesn't help, it actually hurts.

People without guns can't "fix themselves" the murderous scumbags with all the guns oppressing them. And no, it doesn't help to give giant Citibank lines of credit and endless boatloads of free food to the goons with the guns. It hurts.

Do you honestly think the typical African tyrant would last five years without hard currency imports for his cadres? If they oppressed their peasants and nobody bailed them out, they would starve to death in that time. The natural relationship between them is, thug with gun needs farmer to eat, ergo must treat the farmer decently. Take away the thug's need for the farmer, and the thug simply has all the cards and wins.

You can't run around giving free food to tyrannies and pretend it has no political effects. You make the tyrants independent of the productive class of their own society. That is a deeply political act with dramatic political consequences. Cause by misguided intervention interacting with home grown thuggery.

We pay the PA billions a year to murder Jews and wonder why there isn't peace. Stop paying for it and then see. We pay Africa tens of billions a year in aid and loans on a basis of "need", and then wonder why there is need in Africa. Stop paying for it and then see.

42 posted on 02/03/2006 1:58:09 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]

To: IronJack

"This is a perfect argument for Empire America. The US moves in, takes over these third-world misery factories. It installs an effective local government overseen by American supervisors. Through that government, food is distributed, agricultural practices are reformed, and infrastructure is improved to the point where starvation is no longer epidemic. If the locals object to the "colonization" of their precious dungheap, then they can have the starvation, the disease, and the pestilence back. If not, then maybe they can learn to be human and eventually take over for themselves."

Of course, the western countries came in and did this very thing during the colonial period, the golden age of Africa. Now the infrastructure built by the west is decaying. A new round of colonialism will result in the same cycle: we spend untold billions, they will be ungrateful and ask us to leave, and the country will go back to the bush. I don't want $1 of my tax money going there. No more foreign welfare when we have staggering deficits.


43 posted on 02/03/2006 1:59:37 PM PST by reelfoot
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: river rat
Can anyone point to a black majority ruled nation that is NOT an unmitigated disaster?

Can anybody point to a black majority ruled American city which is not an unmitigated disaster?

44 posted on 02/03/2006 3:37:51 PM PST by SauronOfMordor (A planned society is most appealing to those with the hubris to think they will be the planners)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: reelfoot
The cost of maintaining these backwaters will be borne by the natives. At first, they will be unable to sustain themselves so yes, they will need to be subsidized. But as the nation develops and they begin to become self-reliant, we begin to exact our tribute. Eventually, they become independent and we've made a tidy profit and an ally.

If they try to forcibly seize the assets we've paid for, we exterminate them and replace them with someone more appreciative.

The Romans had it right.

45 posted on 02/03/2006 4:11:52 PM PST by IronJack
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: JasonC
Lumumba was African. Kasavubu was African. Mobutu was African. Kabila is African.

I guess I can see how exporting cash crops would enrich the Congo, but in order to do that, you have to have an infrastructure -- to get the crops in the ground, to harvest them, to transport them to market, to store them, to load them ... And you have to have a stable government if you're going to promote market agriculture. Farming beyond the subsistence level requires a substantial investment in machinery and land, in many cases in irrigation as well. The capital for those investments has to come from private wealth, or from loans. And no one would secure a loan in a country as unstable as Congo.

First world ag subsidies keep first world farmers alive, and finance an industry that is unmatched anywhere else in the world. Granted, it makes it tough for other ag producers to compete, but it makes it easy for consumers to buy American farm commodities, and for nations in Africa to concentrate on crops that America can't produce cost-effectively.

I doubt that the predators in the First World are going to be overly concerned about the well-being of the Third World, if for no other reason than the appearance that the folks in the Third World don't seem to be particularly concerned about themselves.

46 posted on 02/03/2006 4:24:24 PM PST by IronJack
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: Little Ray

"Recolonize Africa - give it to the Chinese. They're looking for elbow room and resources, and they're pretty good at feedin' themselves for communists."

I don't really think it's a good idea to encourage the Chinese to get any bigger than they are.


47 posted on 02/03/2006 4:32:17 PM PST by dljordan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: GovernmentShrinker

"They refuse to stop having babies that they can't feed. Even when their children are literally starving to death, they go right ahead and have more. They obviously don't care, so why should I?"

I'm 55 and I can't remember a time when Africa wasn't having some kind of crisis or other. We've been sending them aid forever and it doesn't seem to make any difference.


48 posted on 02/03/2006 4:34:15 PM PST by dljordan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: IronJack
America would produce plenty of agricultural goods with no subsidies. It is Europe that would get out of the farming business, other than a few high value items like vineyards, and a few people playing at it for sport.

Yes export agriculture requires political stability. The places that have managed the latter have managed the former, to their considerable gain. But there won't be any political stability in Africa as long as the rest of the world pays no attention to the difference between a tyrant and a just worker and pretends the superficial similarity between them is more important than the moral difference.

When a country ruled by a tyrant faces famine, demand the government step down as a condition of sending food. If they don't, send lots of guns and advisors to teach how to use them, but not an ounce of food. And forbid all western loans or aid to tyrannical governments. And end nonsense like DDT bans, and farm subsidies. The tyrants won't last a generation. If instead the victims being slaughtered by them are blamed, subsidized food is dumped free while being handed out by the tyrants, the tyrants can borrow whatever they want and steal whatever they please and never pay any of it back, then Africa will remain a playground for demons in human form, and the victims thereof will be the innocent common people of Africa.

And the blood will be on our hands as well as those of said demons.

49 posted on 02/03/2006 8:33:00 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: dljordan
It makes a difference alright, just not in the direction people hope for. If you make the production of the common people actually living there irrelevant, tyrants learn they can oppress those people with impunity.
50 posted on 02/03/2006 8:35:34 PM PST by JasonC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 48 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-52 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson