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Driving the car of the future [Test drive of hydrogen-fuel cell Honda]
BBC News on line ^ | February 11, 2006 | By Jonathan Head, BBC News, Yakushima island, Japan

Posted on 02/11/2006 8:05:22 AM PST by aculeus

The blue sky seemed to vanish in an instant, as wild, grey thunderclouds raced across the mountains. Rays of sunlight broke through in places, brightening spots in the forest like searchlights.

There are few landscapes more dramatic than Yakushima, and few places with more weather; within seconds we were being pelted by our 12th rainstorm of the day. But none of this bothered Sachito Fujimoto, one of Honda's top engineers.

"It's the perfect climate for us," he said with a grin, and we climbed into the dumpy little blue car he was testing.

The Honda FCX isn't much to look at, but it's the closest thing to a genuine car of the future you can drive on public roads.

Amid ancient forests

Underneath the bonnet - and under the passenger seats as well - is a revolutionary fuel-cell engine that produces no pollution and, in effect, runs on nothing more than the enormous amounts of rain that fall on Yakushima.

Which is why Honda has chosen to test it on this remote southern island - a Unesco World Heritage Site better known for its sheer mountains and ancient forests.

Fuel cells don't run literally on water, but on hydrogen, which is forced through membranes inside the fuel-cell stack, producing an electric current that powers the car. You can make hydrogen from water, but that also requires electricity - and it so happens Yakushima has abundant quantities of that, too.

The reason lies 170 metres (yards) down a steep tunnel, which takes you deep under the mountains, on a funicular railway.

That is where the local electricity company has built turbines to harness the enormous hydro-electric potential on Yakushima - and it has done that so successfully that it produces far more electricity than the island's 15,000 inhabitants can use.

Surplus electricity cannot be stored, so the company has joined forces with Kagoshima University and Honda, to make hydrogen for the fuel-cell FCX.

So some of Honda's top engineers have to spend several weeks a year on the island, running the FCX along its twisty mountain roads, and putting up with the endless rain.

"Actually it's a very good testing ground," says Mr Fujimoto, "we want to show that our car can perform well in all kinds of extreme weather conditions".

Impressive

It doesn't hurt the car-maker's image, either, that it is associated with one of the most pristine natural environments left in Japan.

Hiroshi Ishii, the president of the electricity company, has grander dreams, of an island entirely powered by renewable energy.

He pulls out a colourful leaflet showing how the hydrogen could fuel all the cars, buses and boats on the island. It could even, he thinks, be shipped to a neighbouring island where Japan's space programme is based, to power its rockets.

For the moment, though, this is just a dream; his main customer is still Honda.

The people of Yakushima have now got used to seeing the little blue car swishing silently around their island.

It is an impressive machine, with surprisingly good acceleration for a car that runs on water.

The technology is still too expensive for mass-production, but Honda has loaned other prototypes to city governments and individuals in the United States, in the hope that one day, they may be the first to produce a truly affordable fuel-cell car.

And the islanders, who are very proud of their World Heritage status, say playing host to such a clean-living car, seems quite appropriate for Yakushima.

Published: 2006/02/11 02:06:42 GMT

© BBC MMVI


TOPICS: Business/Economy
KEYWORDS: fcx; honda; hydrogen; japan

1 posted on 02/11/2006 8:05:24 AM PST by aculeus
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To: aculeus
I'm thinking I wouldn't want to be in the same country as one of these things when it overheats.
2 posted on 02/11/2006 8:07:51 AM PST by Psycho_Bunny (Women were put on Earth to look hot. Men are here to be stupid about it.)
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To: aculeus

It's a Renault Le Car without the sex appeal.

3 posted on 02/11/2006 8:09:00 AM PST by martin_fierro (I signed up in 1997 to post *this*?)
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To: martin_fierro

No thanks, I'll stick with petroluem.


4 posted on 02/11/2006 8:10:38 AM PST by tomahawk (Proud to be an enemy of Islam)
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To: aculeus; Physicist

I have a working fuel cell model car that uses a solar panel to recharge the cell. The thing works pretty good. :-)

http://www.discoverthis.com/fuelcelcaran.html

Good toy for a child interested in this kind of science.


5 posted on 02/11/2006 8:10:44 AM PST by RadioAstronomer (Senior member of Darwin Central)
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To: tomahawk
No thanks, I'll stick with petroluem

Me too. (2005 Vette) :-)

6 posted on 02/11/2006 8:11:27 AM PST by RadioAstronomer (Senior member of Darwin Central)
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To: RadioAstronomer

The photo is the actual size of the car.


7 posted on 02/11/2006 8:12:39 AM PST by Marius3188
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To: aculeus
I'm looking for something a little more fun....

The Ariel Atom

8 posted on 02/11/2006 8:13:58 AM PST by Mr. Mojo
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To: aculeus
The technology is still too expensive for mass-production, but Honda has loaned other prototypes to city governments and individuals in the United States, in the hope that one day, they may be the first to produce a truly affordable fuel-cell car.

I wasn't aware prototypes already existed for these. This could be interesting...

9 posted on 02/11/2006 8:14:03 AM PST by Alex Murphy (Colossians 4:5)
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To: aculeus

http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/campingsurvival_1883_89196380


10 posted on 02/11/2006 8:15:03 AM PST by gunnyg
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To: aculeus
Thanks for posting this.
I'm nowhere near as smart as some of the other savants who have submitted their profound comments, but I invest, (yeah I know, I'm throwin' away my money!), in H technology and fuel cells.
11 posted on 02/11/2006 8:19:13 AM PST by jla
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To: tomahawk
The problem with hydrogen fuel cells is the expense of extracing the hydrogen from the water. And then you get less energy in return. Petroleum is rech in hydrogen and there are groups working on fuel cells that will extract the hydrogen from gasoline to produce electricity and give off nothing but water vapor and CO2.
12 posted on 02/11/2006 8:24:39 AM PST by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: aculeus
A wind up toy spring could power that little piece of garbage. You can't have much self esteem or value for safety to drive something like that.
13 posted on 02/11/2006 8:27:26 AM PST by Proud2BeRight
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To: Blood of Tyrants
..give off nothing but water vapor and CO2

If automobiles ever begin to successfully use hydrogen fuel cells and the exhaust by-products are watervapor and CO2, you can expect environmentalist to soon thereafter begin complaining the there is too much water vapor being produced which produces clouds which causes 'global cooling'.
14 posted on 02/11/2006 8:33:21 AM PST by adorno
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To: Mr. Mojo

The Ariel Atom

Thanks for posting mr Mojo. That does look extremely fun to drive.


15 posted on 02/11/2006 8:45:22 AM PST by diverteach
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To: aculeus

My name is Lex, I am addicted to oil. I will keep my 2005 Honda Accord!(members of OAA-Oil Addicts Annonymous applaud)


16 posted on 02/11/2006 8:46:29 AM PST by lexington minuteman 1775 (I)
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To: aculeus
Hydrogen is not a fuel. It is an energy currency, made from one energy source or another. In this case, it is made from Gravity, in a roundabout process that would be thermodynamically bankrupt except in the unique instance of a place with a hydroelectric surplus.

To the guy who is investing in hydrogen energy:

Read the Motley Fool entry about "Greenvolt" to see some of the risks and pitfalls, and some of the types of scams that are out there.

If you want to see a process that works, funded by DoE programs, see www.safehydrogen.com., but I would not invest in this unless I understood that it was for a very long term.

I still believe the best reaction, when offered "Hydrogen Energy Investment Opportunities" is to instantly sell out all holdings and fire the broker within the hour.

17 posted on 02/11/2006 8:47:27 AM PST by Gorzaloon
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To: martin_fierro
Wow, all the beauty of a Pacer, but with a feul cell!


18 posted on 02/11/2006 8:49:04 AM PST by Always Right
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To: aculeus

Only practical approach I have seen so far for cheap mass production is hydrogen peroxide vehicals. I've seen a experimental 18 wheeler that ran on peroxide that traveled from Phoenix to Denver producing nothing but water vapor and oxygen.


19 posted on 02/11/2006 8:52:56 AM PST by AZRepublican ("The degree in which a measure is necessary can never be a test of the legal right to adopt it.")
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To: AZRepublican
I've seen a experimental 18 wheeler that ran on peroxide that traveled from Phoenix to Denver producing nothing but water vapor and oxygen.

And if we could get them perfected and build the infrastructure to support them, maybe we can get finally get the hell out of the Middle East.

20 posted on 02/11/2006 8:54:58 AM PST by Wormwood (Iä! Iä! Cthulhu fhtagn!)
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To: aculeus

2.5 jigawatts from a flux capacitor is really all you need.


21 posted on 02/11/2006 8:56:34 AM PST by showme_the_Glory (No more rhyming, and I mean it! ..Anybody got a peanut.....)
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To: Blood of Tyrants
The problem with hydrogen fuel cells is the expense of extracing the hydrogen from the water. And then you get less energy in return. Petroleum is rech in hydrogen and there are groups working on fuel cells that will extract the hydrogen from gasoline to produce electricity and give off nothing but water vapor and CO2.

Both of the emmissions are greenhouse gases so other than it being cleaner burning I'm not sure why there is so much attention on this technology.
22 posted on 02/11/2006 9:03:46 AM PST by stig
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To: aculeus
The technology is still too expensive for mass-production, but Honda has loaned other prototypes to city governments and individuals in the United States, in the hope that one day, they may be the first to produce a truly affordable fuel-cell car.

Maybe 20-30 years from now.

In the meantime we need to be drilling ANWAR and along the coast of CA and FL, erecting wind turbines where they will do the most good, building petroleum refineries away from the coasts and building nuclear power plants near large population centers.

We need to get going on this as we are already, thanks to the RATS and the environwackos, about 15-20 years behind where we need to be.

23 posted on 02/11/2006 9:05:33 AM PST by upchuck (27 out of 27 SAT questions answered correctly. http://www.collegeboard.com/apps/qotd/question)
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To: aculeus
It is an impressive machine, with surprisingly good acceleration for a car that runs on water.

VERY impressive "road test".

The technology is still too expensive for mass-production, but Honda has loaned other prototypes to city governments and individuals in the United States, in the hope that one day, they may be the first to produce a truly affordable fuel-cell car.

Lord, we've been saved! SOMEDAY an affordable fuel-cell car MAY be produced!

This is some great non-news from the BBC. Did they actually pay a correspondent to go to Japan so he could write this school newspaper piece? Sheesh!

24 posted on 02/11/2006 9:16:31 AM PST by Restore
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To: Psycho_Bunny
I'm thinking I wouldn't want to be in the same country as one of these things when it overheats.

Why not? Hydrogen is lighter than helium and when it escapes a container it goes straight up. Hydrogen has to be contained to explode. An explosion of a hydrogen fuel container would happen about as often as the explosion of a normal car's gas tank with about the same effect.

25 posted on 02/11/2006 9:33:45 AM PST by Mogollon
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To: Restore
Did they actually pay a correspondent to go to Japan so he could write this school newspaper piece?

The sort of reporting you'd expect from a monopoly that collects $300 (more or less) per year from everyone in the UK who owns a television.

They've got thousands of journos in hundreds of countries. They are probably the biggest news organization in the world.

26 posted on 02/11/2006 9:35:34 AM PST by aculeus
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To: Mogollon
Did you REALLY think I was serious?

>:P

27 posted on 02/11/2006 9:42:24 AM PST by Psycho_Bunny (Women were put on Earth to look hot. Men are here to be stupid about it.)
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To: aculeus

I have driven most of the fuel cell vehicles, including DaimlerChrysler's on the Mercedes test track in Stuttgart. This is the future, folks. Hybrids and biodiesel are eventually going to lead to hydrogen production vehicles. The stacks are getting smaller and more powerful.

For those who think this is Hindenberg redux, you need to do some further reading. We cannot let other countries take the lead and leave us behind.

What Can We Learn from the Hindenburg Disaster?

The explosion of the luxury airship Hindenburg at Lakehurst, NJ, on May 6, 1937, serves as one of the most spectacular moments recorded by the media. Until very recently, it has aided in paralyzing the development of widespread hydrogen use as a fuel, due to concerns for safety (and viewing the fiery picture above, understandably so). But knowing the actual nature of the Hindenburg disaster, as well as knowing the behavior of hydrogen allows us to dispel this stigma associated with hydrogen.

The Facts on the Hindenburg Disaster:

1. The bags of hydrogen that provided the lifting force for the Hindenburg were NOT the main contributor to the fire. The surface of the ship was coated with a combination of dark iron oxide and reflective aluminum paint. These components are extremely flammable and burn at a tremendously energetic rate once ignited. The skin of the airship was ignited by electrical discharge from the clouds while docking during an electrical storm. This reaction has been proven chemically for years, and was demonstrated with actual remnants of the Hindenburg sixty years later, which burned as vigorously as on the day of the disaster.

2. The hydrogen burned quickly, safely, above the occupants. When the escaping hydrogen was ignited by the burning skin of the airship, it burned far above the airship, and was completely consumed within 60 seconds of the ignition. During this period of time, the airship descended to the ground from the 150-foot docking tower.

3. Almost all deaths were caused by jumping or falling from the airship. Of the 35 deaths from the disaster, 33 were caused by jumping or falling. Only two deaths were caused by burning, and it is likely that those two were from proximity to the burning skin of the airship, or from the stores of diesel fuel that were ignited by the covering. Whereas the hydrogen burned within one minute of ignition, the diesel fires burned for up to ten hours after the ignition.

4. The Hindenburg would have burned if it had been filled with inert helium gas. Even if the Hindenburg had not been lifted by hydrogen, the ignition of the covering would still have happened, and would then have set ablaze the diesel stores, resulting in the same disaster.
5. The main cause of the disaster was pilot error. The only way to prevent the disaster would have been if the pilot had chosen to land in better conditions elsewhere, which was very feasible, considering he had had enough fuel remaining to reach all the way to California.

The Nature of Hydrogen:

Hydrogen is less flammable than gasoline. The self-ignition temperature of hydrogen is 550 degrees Celsius. Gasoline varies from 228-501 degrees Celsius, depending on the grade. When the Hindenburg burned, it took some time before the hydrogen bags were ignited.

Hydrogen disperses quickly. Being the lightest element (fifteen times lighter than air), hydrogen rises and spreads out quickly in the atmosphere. So when a leak occurs, the hydrogen gas quickly becomes so sparse that it cannot burn. Even when ignited, hydrogen burns upward, and is quickly consumed, as shown in the Hindenburg picture. By contrast, materials such as gasoline and diesel vapors, as well as natural gas are heavier than air, and will not disperse, remaining a flammable threat for much longer.
Hydrogen is non-toxic. Hydrogen is a non-toxic, naturally-occurring element in the atmosphere. By comparison, all petroleum fuels are asphyxiants, and are poisonous to humans.

Hydrogen combustion produces only water. When pure hydrogen is burned in pure oxygen, only pure water is produced. Granted, that’s an ideal scenario, which doesn’t occur outside of laboratories and the space shuttle. In any case, when a hydrogen engine burns, it actually cleans the ambient air, by completing combustion of the unburned hydrocarbons that surround us. Compared with the toxic compounds (carbon monoxide, nitrogen oxides, and hydrogen sulfide) produced by petroleum fuels, the products of hydrogen burning are much safer.

Hydrogen can be stored safely. Tanks currently in use for storage of compressed hydrogen (similar to compressed natural gas tanks) have survived intact through testing by various means, including being shot with six rounds from a .357 magnum, detonating a stick of dynamite next to them, and subjecting them to fire at 1500 degrees F. Clearly, a typical gasoline tank wouldn’t survive a single one of these tests.

What Have We Learned?

No fuel we currently use or have yet to develop will be totally without hazards, through all the processes of production, transportation, and consumption, just as no kitchen knife can be used without risk to the chef.
Hydrogen has long been considered close to ideal as a fuel due to its abundance, non-toxic characteristics, and international availability. We must recognize that each of us has learned to use knives safely, and do so daily. As long as we use wisdom in our methods of production, storage, and use of hydrogen, we’ll enjoy the same safety we have had with petroleum fuels, with the additional benefit of fewer health hazards when leaks do occur.

Sources

The following sources were used for this article:
Research by Addison Bain, NASA Investigator into the Hindenburg disaster.

McAlister, Roy. The Philosopher Mechanic.
Cox, Jack. "Will Hydrogen Bomb?" The Denver Post. April 5, 2000.

GOOD SOURCE MATERIAL: http://www.greencar.com

GREEN CAR JOURNAL recently named its first Green Car of the Year at the L.A. Auto Show. Among the judges were muscle car icon Carroll Shelby and former race driver Mario Andretti.


28 posted on 02/11/2006 9:44:03 AM PST by doug from upland (A dead body means one more chance for Democrats to have another funeral-op)
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To: doug from upland
Thanks for all that info.

Uninteresting geezer trivia: As a kid (six?) on Long Island I remember running out on the street to see the Hindenberg fly over.

29 posted on 02/11/2006 9:49:14 AM PST by aculeus
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To: aculeus
Oh, no. We wouldn't want to be caught in something this ugly ---


30 posted on 02/11/2006 9:53:40 AM PST by doug from upland (A dead body means one more chance for Democrats to have another funeral-op)
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To: aculeus

31 posted on 02/11/2006 9:54:45 AM PST by doug from upland (A dead body means one more chance for Democrats to have another funeral-op)
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To: doug from upland

February 2005

Army Scrutinizing Stealthy, Clean Vehicle

edited by Robert H. Williams

The U.S. Army in conjunction with Quantum Technologies, Irvine, Calif., has developed a speedy off-road vehicle that is powered by a compressed hydrogen fuel cell and is capable of producing electrical power for surveillance, targeting and communications.

Called the Aggressor Alternative Mobility Vehicle, it offers superior performance to gasoline or diesel powered platforms, is “virtually silent” in its operating modes and boasts a “reduced thermal signature,” noted a company spokesman.

He added that the Aggressor is exceptionally clean. It does not “produce any emissions throughout the different operating modes.”

The vehicle will be tested at several Army posts during the course of the next six months.

Meanwhile, Dennis Wend, executive director of the Army’s National Automotive Center, suggested the Aggressor stands as a “model for more efficient, high performance stealth vehicles through the use of fuel cells and advanced hybrid electric drivetrain technologies.”

It is the first fuel cell vehicle produced for the Army.


32 posted on 02/11/2006 9:59:31 AM PST by doug from upland (A dead body means one more chance for Democrats to have another funeral-op)
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To: Proud2BeRight

"You can't have much self esteem or value for safety to drive something like that."

Funny. I don't base my self-esteem on what my car looks like. I got over that years ago.


33 posted on 02/11/2006 10:07:50 AM PST by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: stig

It also produces more energy per gallon than burning it.


34 posted on 02/11/2006 10:09:19 AM PST by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: Always Right

The Pacer's a work of automotive art compared to that thing.


35 posted on 02/11/2006 10:09:27 AM PST by Mr. Mojo
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To: doug from upland

Sigh. I know it's the future. But is it ok if I go kicking and screaming?


36 posted on 02/11/2006 10:11:20 AM PST by pollyannaish
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To: Psycho_Bunny

Hydrogen is very manageable when it is pure. When it is mixed with methane as city gas, it can be a problem since its flame rate is very different.


37 posted on 02/11/2006 10:14:27 AM PST by RightWhale (pas de lieu, Rhone que nous)
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To: aculeus
H2 HYBRID

H2 Hybrid
By Ron Cogan

As the “hydrogen highway” vision takes form through incremental technology advancements and demonstrations on many levels, much of the glory is captured by hydrogen fuel cell vehicles. It’s true that they’re marvels of technology and are deserving of this attention. As shared in Green Car Journal’s Summer 2005 issue (“Hydrogen/Where We Are on the Drive to the Future”), automakers have come a long way and these vehicles are so good, they make it seem effortless to drive on this most environmentally positive fuel. But that’s far from the case.

The vehicles are truly million dollar machines, using hand-built or limited production componentry handsomely packaged within normal-looking sedans, minivans, and SUVs. They drive seamlessly, for the most part, assuring us that the mission of bringing hydrogen vehicles to the highway can be accomplished. Still, there’s a lot of work ahead to make this vision workable – costs must come down, fuel cell durability must improve, and challenges that go beyond the vehicles themselves must be met. Creating hydrogen economically is one of them, as is developing a widespread refueling infrastructure. Storing hydrogen is yet another significant technical challenge, and that’s what this story is about, although a car once again appears to be the star.


This story begins and ends with Stanford Ovshinsky, an inventor of rarified stature who, many decades ago, made discoveries involving amorphous and disordered materials that created a whole new area of materials science. He was recognized with a Time Magazine “Heroes of the Planet Award” because of this work and how it led to many breakthrough applications, including his patented nickel-metal-hydride batteries (he and the company he founded, Rochester Hills, Michigan-based Energy Conversion Devices, hold the patents). As it turns out, this work has also led to the ability to store hydrogen in solid form at low pressure, a technology being developed by ECD business unit Ovonic Hydrogen Systems.

This is no small thing. Before we can buy a hydrogen-fueled vehicle in the showroom, some big technical hurdles need to be overcome in the lab, and one of the biggest is hydrogen storage. A hydrogen vehicle’s range depends directly on how efficiently this fuel can be converted to motive power and, more fundamentally, how much fuel can be stored on-board. Range will be especially important in the early years of hydrogen vehicle commercialization since a refueling infrastructure will still be in its infancy.

Automakers have been grappling with the issue for a long time. Liquid hydrogen, championed most visibly by BMW, is attractive because a much greater amount of liquid hydrogen can be stored in a given tank size than gaseous hydrogen. This translates to greater range. However, the downside is that hydrogen must be stored at -423 degrees F to keep it in liquid form, and getting it down to this temperature requires a lot of energy and special fueling equipment.

Most automakers use gaseous hydrogen in their developmental fuel cell and hydrogen internal combustion vehicles because of this. However, gaseous storage also has its challenges. Current 5,000 psi (pounds per square inch) hydrogen cylinders simply don’t hold enough fuel for a decent driving range. That has prompted many automakers to explore a new generation of even higher 10,000 psi hydrogen storage cylinders, which require additional changes to support this high pressure including 10,000 psi-capable lines, fittings, and dispensing equipment.

Then there’s the approach offered by Ovonic Hydrogen Systems’ solid hydrogen storage, a concept so clever and intriguing it seems improbable…yet it works. A tank containing powdered metal alloys is filled with hydrogen at a relatively low 1,500 psi. Removing heat during the process causes the metal to absorb hydrogen like a sponge, and a new material called a metal hydride is created. Hydrogen stored in solid form like this is in a safer state and can be stored within a tank at a lower 250 psi.

On-board systems determine when hydrogen is needed by an engine or fuel cell, providing heat to reverse the process so gaseous hydrogen is released from the hydride and into the fuel system. In an interesting phenomenon, a greater volume of hydrogen can be stored in the same size cylinder with metal alloy than without it, a consideration that provides better driving range.

Several years ago, Green Car Journal drove a 2002 Toyota Prius hybrid equipped with such a system. Operating as a hydrogen hybrid vehicle, it produced near-zero emissions and drove seamlessly. Ovonic Hydrogen Systems has now gone one better by offering several second-generation Prius hybrids equipped with a similar system to showcase its solid metal hydrogen storage. Some of these vehicles will operate as part of a hydrogen hybrid demonstration fleet at Southern California’s South Coast Air Quality Management District in Diamond Bar, California, a program that will prove the viability of hydrogen hybrids in everyday use.

Beyond the solid hydrogen storage, other modifications to these vehicles include vents and leak detectors to ensure safe operation, as well as hydrogen-compatible fuel lines, an engine management computer that operates new gaseous fuel injectors, and a variety of sensors. A turbocharger is used to compensate for the lower engine output that comes with combusting hydrogen.

All this technology is wrapped within sharp-looking demonstration vehicles that promise to forward the company’s solid hydrogen storage message in a very high-profile way. These high-tech cars also demonstrate that hydrogen internal combustion could represent a more readily-achievable interim step toward the hydrogen highway as more complex and expensive fuel cell vehicles evolve in coming years. With potentially larger numbers of more affordable internal combustion hydrogen vehicles on the road, there’s also more incentive for building the hydrogen refueling infrastructure that will be needed for those fuel cell vehicles in the future.

38 posted on 02/11/2006 10:14:39 AM PST by doug from upland (A dead body means one more chance for Democrats to have another funeral-op)
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Comment #39 Removed by Moderator

To: pollyannaish

You may.


40 posted on 02/11/2006 10:16:12 AM PST by doug from upland (A dead body means one more chance for Democrats to have another funeral-op)
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To: doug from upland

Thanks. I still love the roar of a huge gas-guzzling engine on a bright and crisp spring day.

It's a little ironic really.

Thanks for the background info.


41 posted on 02/11/2006 10:18:29 AM PST by pollyannaish
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To: Mighty Eighth

The Hindenburg was coated with an explosive substance.


42 posted on 02/11/2006 10:20:19 AM PST by RightWhale (pas de lieu, Rhone que nous)
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To: pollyannaish
I still love 'em, too. This was my favorite vehicle at the auto show ---


43 posted on 02/11/2006 10:37:12 AM PST by doug from upland (A dead body means one more chance for Democrats to have another funeral-op)
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To: aculeus
That is where the local electricity company has built turbines to harness the enormous hydro-electric potential on Yakushima

How on Earth did they get permission to build on a World Heritage site??

44 posted on 02/11/2006 10:42:14 AM PST by operation clinton cleanup
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To: doug from upland

I had the extreme pleasure of getting to drive a Ford-GT. :-)


45 posted on 02/11/2006 11:45:13 AM PST by RadioAstronomer (Senior member of Darwin Central)
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