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Unmarried Couple Denied Right to Move In
WWTI (ABC) ^ | 2/23/2006 | United Press International

Posted on 02/23/2006 1:53:52 PM PST by Quick1

A Missouri couple say they were denied an occupancy permit for their new home because they're not married.

Olivia Shelltrack and Fondray Loving have been together for 13 years and have three children, ages 8, 10 and 15, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch reports.

The couple are appealing the occupancy permit denial from the Black Jack, Mo., board of adjustment, which requires people living together to have blood, marriage or adoption ties. Loving is not the father of Shelltrack's oldest child.

I was basically told, you can have one child living in your house if you're not married, but more than that, you can't, Shelltrack told the newspaper.

This is about the definition of family, not if they're married or not, Mayor Normal McCourt said. It's what cities do to maintain the housing and to hold down overcrowding.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events; US: Missouri
KEYWORDS: cohabitation; cohabitationlaws; cultureofbusybodies; fornicationlaws; homeowners; marriagelaws; occupancypermit; propertyrights; puritans; unmarriedcouple
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Unreal. How is having four people in a house overcrowding? I can understand not wanting 20 college kids in a house, but more than 3? This is ridiculous.

I could also certainly use an education on what exactly an occupancy permit is, as I have no idea.

1 posted on 02/23/2006 1:53:53 PM PST by Quick1
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To: Quick1

Isn't thirteen years long enough for a common law marriage?


2 posted on 02/23/2006 1:55:20 PM PST by Eepsy
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To: Quick1

If the family were illegals, the permit would have been approved plus the family would have received a signed framed picture of GWB to hang on their wall.


3 posted on 02/23/2006 1:56:16 PM PST by Extremely Extreme Extremist (We're Americans, we can do anything)
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To: Quick1
I could also certainly use an education on what exactly an occupancy permit is, as I have no idea.

I was wondering about that, too. I don't recall ever being asked for one!

4 posted on 02/23/2006 1:56:31 PM PST by Tax-chick (My remark was stupid, and I'm a slave of the patriarchy. So?)
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To: Quick1

Fondray Loving vs. Normal McCourt. You can't make this stuff up.


5 posted on 02/23/2006 1:56:38 PM PST by My2Cents ("The essence of American journalism is vulgarity divested of truth." -- Winston Churchill)
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To: Quick1; Eepsy

The "Black Jack, Mo., board of adjustment" is going to get a very quick adjustment from the courts. This matter was decided a long time ago by the Supreme Court.


6 posted on 02/23/2006 1:57:10 PM PST by GovernmentShrinker
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To: Eepsy

In Arkansas, they're probably considered cousins.


7 posted on 02/23/2006 1:57:18 PM PST by My2Cents ("The essence of American journalism is vulgarity divested of truth." -- Winston Churchill)
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To: Xenalyte
Fondray Loving vs. Normal McCourt. You can't make this stuff up.

(I think they're both men ...)

8 posted on 02/23/2006 1:57:30 PM PST by Tax-chick (My remark was stupid, and I'm a slave of the patriarchy. So?)
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To: Tax-chick

Good Lord above.

If they've been together for 13 years, how do they have a 15-year-old?


9 posted on 02/23/2006 1:58:51 PM PST by Xenalyte (Can you count, suckas? I say the future is ours . . . if you can count.)
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To: Tax-chick

I guess I coulda read the rest of the article . . .


10 posted on 02/23/2006 1:59:12 PM PST by Xenalyte (Can you count, suckas? I say the future is ours . . . if you can count.)
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To: Extremely Extreme Extremist

"would have received a signed framed picture of GWB to hang on their wall."

So that's how you get one of those.


11 posted on 02/23/2006 1:59:47 PM PST by kenth
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To: Xenalyte

LOL - happens to me, too.


12 posted on 02/23/2006 2:00:06 PM PST by Tax-chick (My remark was stupid, and I'm a slave of the patriarchy. So?)
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To: Xenalyte
from the article...

>> Loving is not the father of Shelltrack's oldest child.
13 posted on 02/23/2006 2:00:18 PM PST by beezdotcom
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To: My2Cents

"Fondray Loving vs. Normal McCourt. You can't make this stuff up."

Unfortunately we don't have to.

Mix in Shelltrack and Black Jack, MO and it sounds like bad comedy writing.


14 posted on 02/23/2006 2:00:24 PM PST by BadAndy (The DemocRATs are the enemy's most effective weapon.)
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To: Quick1
It's a condition precedent to closing on a home. Unless the local municipality deems a house fit for occupation and the prospective occupants qualified, then the deal doesn't go through.

It can be revoked (zoned for private occupancy, city finds out it's being used as an impromptu boarding house or group home, etc.)

I had to wait almost two months to move into my new home because the city would not give an OP until there was a regulation paved kerb in front.

15 posted on 02/23/2006 2:00:58 PM PST by wideawake
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To: Xenalyte
I guess I coulda read the rest of the article . . .

I guess I coulda read the rest of the THREAD... :)
16 posted on 02/23/2006 2:00:59 PM PST by beezdotcom
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To: Xenalyte

And why aren't they married?


17 posted on 02/23/2006 2:02:56 PM PST by wideawake
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To: wideawake

My guess would be that one or both of them is legally married to somebody else.


18 posted on 02/23/2006 2:03:46 PM PST by Tax-chick (My remark was stupid, and I'm a slave of the patriarchy. So?)
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To: Tax-chick

Classy.


19 posted on 02/23/2006 2:04:40 PM PST by wideawake
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To: wideawake
And why aren't they married?

Probably they need time to think it over and decide if it's right for them.

20 posted on 02/23/2006 2:04:44 PM PST by madprof98
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To: wideawake

Why is that any of the government's business?


21 posted on 02/23/2006 2:04:46 PM PST by jude24 ("Thy law is written on the hearts of men, which iniquity itself effaces not." - St. Augustine)
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To: BadAndy
it sounds like bad comedy writing

...or a reality show on Fox...but I repeat myself.

22 posted on 02/23/2006 2:05:28 PM PST by My2Cents ("The essence of American journalism is vulgarity divested of truth." -- Winston Churchill)
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To: Quick1

This makes sense. Let's see if we can break the "family" up. It's be much, much better if the kids had just one parent.


23 posted on 02/23/2006 2:05:52 PM PST by Gone GF
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To: jude24

There are minor children in the home whose welfare is clearly not the parents' primary concern.


24 posted on 02/23/2006 2:06:03 PM PST by wideawake
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To: wideawake

Just a guess, of course. Maybe they have an ideological opposition to marriage. Don't want to be slaves of the patriarchy, after all ...


25 posted on 02/23/2006 2:06:03 PM PST by Tax-chick (My remark was stupid, and I'm a slave of the patriarchy. So?)
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To: Xenalyte
If they've been together for 13 years, how do they have a 15-year-old?

It's a weird world. Maybe they were married once.

26 posted on 02/23/2006 2:06:14 PM PST by My2Cents ("The essence of American journalism is vulgarity divested of truth." -- Winston Churchill)
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To: wideawake

And you know this how? Have you spoken with the couple in the article?


27 posted on 02/23/2006 2:06:49 PM PST by Quick1 (Censorship: the worst obscenity.)
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To: Eepsy

People misunderstand common law marriage. Statutory law has replaced common law in most areas of the law. Nowadaws, the individual state has to recognize such marriages; Missouri does not. No matter what this couple does to 'hold themselves out' to the community as a couple, they cannot be legally recognized as married.

A bunch of kids and 13 years, why don't they go down to the Justice of the Peace already?


28 posted on 02/23/2006 2:06:53 PM PST by radiohead (Hey Kerry, I'm still here; still hating your lying, stinking guts, you coward.)
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To: Eepsy

I don't think Missouri has common law marriage.


29 posted on 02/23/2006 2:07:10 PM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: wideawake
And why aren't they married?

Afraid of commitment, I guess. LOL

30 posted on 02/23/2006 2:07:19 PM PST by My2Cents ("The essence of American journalism is vulgarity divested of truth." -- Winston Churchill)
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To: Tax-chick

Actually, as I recall now, I know of a divorced woman who was living with her boy toy for upwards of a decade and they wouldn't get married because both of them were living off the ex-husband's substantial alimony.


31 posted on 02/23/2006 2:07:31 PM PST by wideawake
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To: Quick1
They certainly had to go far to shop this story---Watertown, New York!

Lone Jack is a very small town about 40 miles east of Kansas City. It claim to fame is being the location of one of the larger Missouri Civil War battle sites. I'd estimate the population about 1000---most folks who work in the KC area.

Just more Libs whining when they don't get their way.

32 posted on 02/23/2006 2:08:34 PM PST by Crucis Country
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To: Quick1
And you know this how?

Because they aren't married. If you care enough about a child to be a real father to him, you marry his mother.

Period.

33 posted on 02/23/2006 2:08:55 PM PST by wideawake
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To: Tax-chick

Olivia and Fondray are men's names now?


34 posted on 02/23/2006 2:08:59 PM PST by Quick1 (Censorship: the worst obscenity.)
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To: wideawake

They're too enlightened to do something so mundane as marry


35 posted on 02/23/2006 2:10:00 PM PST by Shimmer128
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To: Quick1
How is having four people in a house overcrowding?

It's to keep college kids out. Four college kids can create quite a ruckus. We have the same ban in our neighborhood. We had three college kids in one house plus guests. They thought the mountain road was the Monte Carlo until one of them crashed into a tree. After they moved out, we had no more "racing" problems. The problem is that you sometimes catch others in the web. Our standard policy is that no one knows anything until a problem arises. We don't enforce unless there is a problem.

We have one college kid now. She was keeping multiple guests over until we threatened to call the homeowner that was renting to her. It was her parents.

36 posted on 02/23/2006 2:10:04 PM PST by AppyPappy (If you aren't part of the solution, there is good money to be made prolonging the problem.)
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To: Xenalyte

The couple thinks that they might have met more than 15 years ago but the woman doesn't remember for sure.


37 posted on 02/23/2006 2:10:18 PM PST by zerosix (Native Sunflower and avid ironer)
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To: Extremely Extreme Extremist

Great non sequitor. See if you can tie this story to abortion also.


38 posted on 02/23/2006 2:10:20 PM PST by opinionator
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To: wideawake
And why aren't they married?

Marriage has ruined a lot of perfectly good relationships.

39 posted on 02/23/2006 2:10:47 PM PST by elkfersupper
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To: wideawake
If you care enough about a child to be a real father to him, you marry his mother.

Says you. Some of us don't necessarily need marriage to know we've made a committment to one another. Besides, how is it any of yours or the government's business?
40 posted on 02/23/2006 2:10:59 PM PST by Quick1 (Censorship: the worst obscenity.)
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To: Shimmer128

Indeed. Obeying the basic rules of life is for unenlightened squares like me.


41 posted on 02/23/2006 2:11:07 PM PST by wideawake
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To: Quick1

The rules are set. You must be married. They weren't.

Tough. Get married.


42 posted on 02/23/2006 2:11:19 PM PST by rwfromkansas (http://xanga.com/rwfromkansas)
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To: zerosix

Where did you see that?


43 posted on 02/23/2006 2:11:40 PM PST by Quick1 (Censorship: the worst obscenity.)
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To: Quick1
Some of us don't necessarily need marriage to know we've made a committment to one another.

If there is no marriage, there is no commitment.

44 posted on 02/23/2006 2:13:19 PM PST by wideawake
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To: madprof98

13 years....


45 posted on 02/23/2006 2:13:41 PM PST by rwfromkansas (http://xanga.com/rwfromkansas)
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To: rwfromkansas

Sounds like a dumb set of rules. Why should the government decide if I want to buy a house with a few friends?


46 posted on 02/23/2006 2:13:47 PM PST by Quick1 (Censorship: the worst obscenity.)
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To: jude24

Because the govt. sets the rules on who can live there.


47 posted on 02/23/2006 2:14:37 PM PST by rwfromkansas (http://xanga.com/rwfromkansas)
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To: Gone GF

They aren't parents. Parents are married.


48 posted on 02/23/2006 2:15:05 PM PST by rwfromkansas (http://xanga.com/rwfromkansas)
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To: elkfersupper
Marriage has ruined a lot of perfectly good relationships.

A better description might be that marriage has exposed many, many superficial, shallow relationships for the sordid reality of what they actually were in the first place.

49 posted on 02/23/2006 2:15:14 PM PST by wideawake
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To: AppyPappy
It's to keep college kids out. Four college kids can create quite a ruckus.

Well, there's good law for you. "Let's screw 100 people over to prevent a possible problem with one or two of them." Yeah, that sounds about right.
50 posted on 02/23/2006 2:15:31 PM PST by Quick1 (Censorship: the worst obscenity.)
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