Posted on 03/05/2006 6:35:56 AM PST by rellimpank
Congressman wants better data on cruise ship crime
WASHINGTON (AP) -- Only five of the 28 people who disappeared from cruise ships in the past three years were found, according to data disclosed to Congress by the world's largest cruise lines.
A congressional memo compiled in advance of a House hearing on cruise ship safety Tuesday also details 177 sexual misconduct incidents, ranging from inappropriate touching to rape, and four robberies of amounts over $5,000.
During that three-year period approximately 25 million people embarked on cruises from North America ports, the memo said.
(Excerpt) Read more at siouxcityjournal.com ...
Perhaps most of these 28 people don't want to be found or fell overboard and won't be found. Either way, it isn't an issue on which Congress should waste time.
I would say that there were more crimes in the congressional district than on the ship. So why is the congress person not doing something about that.
A waste of my tax money.
Imagine a couple of crew members who found that they can grab a slightly inebriated girl (or maybe even put some roofies in her drink) and have a party after hours with her.
Her boyfriend catches them in the act and threatens them. He falls overboard late at night never to be seen again.
Not that far out.
Sounds like congress will have to take trips on these ships to investigate......
But think of all the free face time the critters will have on prime tme cable news shows. Much more than they would if they tried to end the treason of the Slimes.
bump
Cruise ship disappearances are clearly another failure of the Bush administration!
Gotta hand it to Congress - they'll really do whatever it takes to protect Americans.
Imagine the dangerous Carribean cruises they will have to take in order to do a proper investigation.
--and what do you propose Congress do about that?
Congress probably shouldn't waste time on it. But somebody should. Probably the FBI.
These people should be profiled to determine if they had motive to willfully dissappear. Or were they young girls, perhaps sold into sexual slavery? What was common about the 5 that were found, and why did they dissappear?
"Live and let die" is not an American slogan. We should to an extent watch each other's backs. Especially when dealing with foreigners.
I cruise several times a year. As a disclaimer, I have recently started a travel agency. I don't see any need to be concerned about 28 people missing in three years. In light of their admission of 25 MILLION passengers, that is a very tiny number.
Your scenario is one of many things that can happen anywhere. To think that Congress should waste one cent on it is ridiculous. I am curious about to which constituent (translated political donor) he is beholden for this.
The cruise lines are always open and aboveboard on investigations, contrary to press reporters beliefs. They have nothing to gain, and everything to lose, by being secretive, or unresponsive. They depend on public perceptions for their livelihood.
Cruise ships are safe. They have the best safety record of any industry. Bad people inhabit the world, and bad things happen, all too often. Feces occurs!
Imagine laying on a deck chair, with the sun in your face, and the breeze at your back. That makes a lot more sense!
This is Celebrity's Galaxy, pulling into Montego Bay, taken from aboard Celebrity's Horizon, when we took one last year.!
A foreign flag vessel (which I understand to be, functionally, the "soil" of that foreign nation) is plying the waters from one foreign port to another foreign port.
An American citizen falls (or is pushed) overboard, or in some other way turns up missing.
And Congress wants there to be an "accounting" of all such incidents!
Isn't this a bit like Congress "requiring" an incident report every time an American citizen loses his or her life in an automobile accident while in a forign country?
I can see where you are going with this, however, if a person loses their life in a car accident in a foreign country you know where they are. I think the issue of someone just plain missing warrants a little more accountability. Not sure if Congress is the answer, but people don't just disappear without a reason.
Banned liquor latest twist in cruise disappearance
Smith also drank shots of absinthe.
Jennifer Hagel-Smith was found sleeping on a floor in a corridor far from the couple's cabin the next morning.
Hagel-Smith and her attorney said she was unconscious and has no recollection of what happened.
Witnesses say Smith and his bride, Jennifer Hagel Smith, were heavily
intoxicated and argued in the ship's bar the night Smith disappeared.
Passengers say Smith called his wife names, and she responded by kicking him in
the groin hard enough to double him over.
Hagel Smith has disputed those accounts, but said she doesn't recall what
happened. She said she had never experienced the effects of alcohol as she did
that night.
http://tinyurl.com/kwffm
its amazing no one finds it odd that congress warns us perpetually that social security is going belly up, but never talks about how the congressional pension going... well, its as secure as fort knox...same management, two different results; if this were a business (which our government is) and a management team had one enormous account that went broke, and belonged to someone else, and this other, that was not as large, yet was theirs, was not only secure, but was growing, too, civil and criminal liabilities would be exposed by the very facts just stated...especially if funds that might have replentished the first went directly into their fund, which is what they are doing
and since they wouldn't be looting our funds for their direct gain, i think 28 folks in 3 years warrants massive interest and announcement...what if most of these are women and girls? what if the perpatrators are a gang of self-styled muslim terrorists? what if you'd be safer walking naked on a dark street with hundred dollar bills stacked in your hands? these are significant issues of importance, even if they are limited by how many folks need that protection...americans should be golden in overseas travel as often as is possible, and we also need to realize we have built ourselves into the new rome, so we need to watch and protect our own; our enemies have lured us into a war they are prepared to fight for a thousand years, if necessary, or longer, with the goal of breaking us at the bank--not on the battlefield (which is why immigration should be closed off to the moslem world, and managing our ports and entrenching on our turf is an unwise allowance; i don't remember reading about anyone welcoming nazis to immigrate here during world war II...all of this is an underlying concern from cruise ship problems to natalee holloway, so let congress go if they want to; at least they aren't stealing from anyone
That comes out to 9.3 disappearances per year out of a yearly population on 8.3 million for the cruise ship industry.
By contrast, the District of Columbia, a city ruled by Congress with a polpulation of 553,523, averages about 240 murders per year.
Thus, the city ruled by Congress has a murder rate that is 388 times greater than the death rate of the cruise ship industry.
Some congressman has been watching too much Greta Van Susteren.
I think we already know about them, don't you. what would a congressinal investigation add to the information already gleaned, besides waste time and effort.
I have enough people to worry about me, so you needn't! I don't need the gum't to be my shepard! Maybe you do! Here's a pic for your wall. Mine all say "We, the people!"
You are assuming facts not in evidence. Just because there are 28 reported missing, does not mean 28 dead, necessarily. In DC the facts stand as quoted, but sometimes, people don't want to be found! Some just got off the ship, and decided not to get back on. I can't find that many deaths reported re: cruise ships, and the news doesn't seem to have them, either.
It's just a pol trying to get his name in the headlines... and next week you will hear nothing more!
never talks about how the congressional pension going...
Good point and that can't be said enough! and their votes for their salary raises.
You're halfway to the right calcuation, but most people are only on a cruise ship for 4 to 10 days (say an average of 1 week), therefore the population would be comparable to a city of around 160,000.
I'm quite sure that the Congress will next seek an accounting for the 11 million or so individuals that have entered our country are unaccounted for.
You are too funny, and too much off point. If I was worried, I wouldn't have disclosed my agency. I thought you are worrying needlessly, and pointed that out. This is NOT a problem. This is speaking to so few instances of disappearance, as to be inconsequential to the masses. Certainly those affected would feel differently, and rightfull so.
But, for you to be making such a big deal of these few occurances, when your next door neighbor is much more likely to kill his wife, is bordering on ridiculous! Your chances of dying in an auto accident from an illegal here on dry ground is 100 times more likely.
I will repeat. It is not something for people to worry about, regardless of my agency affiliation. I go on cruises. I take my wife and (now) 16 yo daughter on cruises. I don't watch them every minute. It isn't necessary. WE go on a variety of ships, and they all have great security. Your posited scenario would be greatly abnormal, in the reality of the industry.
They are in much greater danger where we live. Here, we have all sorts of illegals coming and going among us. The other day, I reported one, when I discovered his background. I felt it was the right thing to do, to prevent him from harming any of my family or friends/neighbors.
Get real with your worries. Going on a cruise ship surely isn't one of them... It is just the opposite!
Get real with your worries
Well, you certainly are. $$$
Besides which I have no worry - I have no plans for any cruises. If people what to use their money to place themselves in a potential dangerous situation and then be TOLD by a tourism industry employee that 28 lives are a drop in the ocean - well, IMO, you will ONLY have the crazies on these ships.
Reading your posts, you are NOT the best of the best that the tourism industry needs right now.
...that was obvious when you posited your scenario. You are watching too much tv... and not enough time with reality!
When you step out of your door, you are in danger. Better lock it tight, and peek out the curtains! There may be a boogeyman lurking...
Thanks for proving my 'crazy' and 'panic' statement for those in the tourism business right now.
NEW YORK (December 08, 2005) -
The cruise industry’s robust passenger growth continued in the third quarter of 2005, as the member fleets of the Cruise Lines International Association (CLIA) carried 3.04 million worldwide guests, a 6 percent increase over the same period in 2004.North American passenger totals grew by 8.6 percent during the same period, to 2.55 million guests, up from 2.35 million in the third quarter of 2004.
The 2005 third-quarter passenger figures are new statistics released today by CLIA, whose 19 member cruise lines represent over 97 percent of the cruise capacity marketed in North America. In addition to the growing passenger totals, the CLIA-member cruise lines also maintained high utilization rates, posting a 106 percent occupancy factor in the third quarter, compared with 106.3 percent for the same period in 2004.
“More and more consumers are enjoying the pleasures of cruise vacationing, which extend beyond the diverse amenities, facilities and services found aboard today’s ships, ” said Terry L. Dale, CLIA’s president and CEO. “Cruises also offer the travel industry’s best values, plus the convenience of 30 North American embarkation ports. Most importantly, CLIA-member travel agency professionals are available across the U.S. and Canada to guide vacationers through the array of choices.”
Overall, statistics for the first three quarters of 2005 show a 5.7 percent increase in worldwide passengers to 8.35 million guests, up from 7.90 million for the same period in 2004. North American guest totals for the period grew 9.1 percent to 7.29 million, up from 6.68 million in 2004...
Let's put it this way - N/A. click!
I'm with you. Besides those things are floating cesspools. I think Dateline or somebody did a study-- You don't want to know what they found all over the walls, phone, bed etc. I have watched them sail into port one day, drop off passengers and load up the next day and sail away. Now you know they don't clean up the rooms in that length of time.
Safety *
All cruise ships must meet International standards set by the International Maritime Organization (IMO) and the International Convention for Safety of Life at Sea (SOLAS). Ships operating from U.S. ports also are subject to U.S. federal and state regulations as well as quarterly safety inspections by the U.S. Coast Guard. *
A cruise ship is comparable to a secure building with a 24 hour security guard. *
According to the Coast Guard, cruise ships operating from U.S. ports continue to be the safest form of mass transportation. No other form of transportation offers such a variety of safety equipment for the protection of its customers. *
The average cruise ship has more than 4,000 smoke detectors and five firefighting teams on board. The average response time in an emergency is a matter of minutes, as trained fire teams and emergency crews are stationed onboard only a few hundred feet away from the scene of any possible incident.
* According to FBI statistics, being on a cruise ship is safer than being virtually anywhere in the U.S. in terms of crime of any type. ALL ICCL cruise lines adhere to a unified industry standard-zero tolerance-for onboard crime.
You are absolutely correct in that statement. But, your first one was a little bit of WRONG. You must not have ever cruised on one. Looking at them arriving and leaving is not telling you much. It is amazing that they can load foodstuffs, and passengers, then sail away in such short time. Efficiency is the first term that comes to mind.
I love Celebrity and MSC. When I get on one of their ships, I see people cleaning. Not just the rooms, but the elevator walls, the ceilings, and everywhere else. They work in shifts, and someone always has cloth and polish ready. The ductwork is spotless, and everything feels clean.
The room never gets much chance to get dirty. When we leave our room for a while, our steward comes in and cleans behind us (they leave little bits of paper in the door to see when you are gone). In the evening, our bed is turned down, and a chocolate is on our pillow. The bathroom is always clean, as soon as we leave the room. Fresh towels are provided, and the trash cans empty.
Cleaning NEVER stops. I rise early, and the crews are scrubbing the decks. I go to bed late, and the crew is vacuuming the stairs and landings.
I wish I could say the same for many of the lodgings I have visited.
I just started the Agency, and didn't do it as a primary source of income. I don't need that. It gives my daughter something to do, and gets us great bargains...
no, I just don't like the things and though I have been offered free cruises from time to time, I haven't gone. I'm not the lay in the sun type though-- too active. Now those barefoot cruises down in Polynesia, or a sail where you help, now that's for me.
Hey, folks, if you want the real scoop on cruise ships, and not the propaganda being dished out here by a travel agent, go to this link:
http://www.cruisejunkie.com/
Illness outbreaks and health events on Cruise Ships:
http://www.cruisejunkie.com/outbreaks2006.html
Crime on cruise ships:
http://www.internationalcruisevictims.org/
If we had 25 million college kids I wonder how many have drunkenly fell of a balcony in the past 3 years. Prob more than 25.
Not propaganda, friend, real world first-person EXPERIENCE. I didn't denigrate those missing people, just the ridiculous knee-jerk statement. I can link to dozens of sites that will make some pretty strong statements about FReepers, or that criticize WalMart. Does that make them factual, and accurate, or just another bit of 60 minutes crap.
I also haven't called anybody nasty names, unlike you...
It's not a matter of being "Cold" or "unfeeling". It's the reality of life in this modern world. A cruise ship is like a little city of 3000 +/- at any time. I know that any of them are nearly crime free. I know from my own EXPERIENCE, and that I will continue to take my wife and SIXTEEN year old daughter. They are a hell of a lot safer on a cruise ship, than any place I could take them in the US of A (that's taken a statistical based analysis from the FBI)!
Have a nice day... I don't need your business, thanks.
I sure will. I'm watching the Busch race in Mexico City on my DVR. I don't like to watch the commercials.
Next month, we will be cruising with MSC...again! I'm taking the girls for a week of luxury and pampering, Italian style!
You're right! I forgot about that part of their lack of concern for their passengers.
We like to do off-beat stuff, and visit the local places. Last year, we were in Cozumel, Mexico. Rather than take the tour things, we walked into town, and found a little local tavern. Walking in, we were greeted profusely in Spanish. I can only speak a little, and the locals spoke no english. But, they made us part of the scene.
Along one wall was a table, laden with food. The local fisherman come in, and bring part of their catch. The kitchen does its job, and sets it out for all to enjoy. We ate and drank beer (I don't like beer, but when it rome, you shoot roman candles). The locals started communicating by hand gestures, and my poor Spanish. We had a hoot. We also got some really great seafood. The others in our party, on the ship, all wished they had gone with us. They took the tour...
The world really is all about people. Some are good, and others are not. How you treat others, and act around them, usually is reflected back to you. I try to never place myself into situations beyond my control, or where I perceive danger.
Sorry if some are offended by my statements. I think most of those folk didn't bother to read them, before thinking about what i said. We all tend to kneejerks!
.
see my #48. Sorry I didn't give you a courtesy ping...
I'll bet you're right about that. When I was that age, I did some pretty stupid things when I was drinking. I once got locked out on the balcony 7 stories up by my "friends" in a Daytona Beach motel. I was about 50 or 60 feet above the pavement; more than high enough to injure me badly or kill me. I climbed over the railing and shimmied to the balcony next door. In retrospect, it was the most brain dead thing I ever did in my life, and I'm lucky to be here writing about it now.
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