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The manly man's man
Boston Globe ^ | March 12, 2006 | Christopher Shea

Posted on 03/12/2006 11:16:57 AM PST by Lorianne

Harvey Mansfield, conservative political theorist and academic provocateur, argues that women--and society--need to come to terms with 'manliness' ___ WHO IS NOT JUST a man, but a manly man? And who today can even say the words ''manly man" without smirking?

These questions are at the heart of ''Manliness" (Yale), the new book by Harvard government professor Harvey C. Mansfield, who has long shouldered a reputation as the campus's most outspoken conservative.

In answer to the first question, Mansfield nominates, among others, the marshal played by Gary Cooper in ''High Noon." When the town's sniveling semi-men slink away from the task, Cooper boldly goes out to fight the thugs arriving in his town. As for the second question-well it just shows how wanly gender neutral our society has become: Manly men scare us.

Liberals at Harvard may balk at the suggestion that Mansfield is an academic Gary Cooper. But while some of his conservative colleagues complain privately about affirmative action or grade inflation or women's studies, Mansfield has unfailingly stepped forward with his rhetorical Remington blazing away. Most recently, he stood by president Lawrence H. Summers, whom Mansfield says he considered a manly man-at least until Summers's every third sentence became an apology.

(Excerpt) Read more at boston.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: bookreview; males; manhood; manliness; men
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1 posted on 03/12/2006 11:16:59 AM PST by Lorianne
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To: Lorianne
''I think you have to say it is a cry of desperation," says Robin Lakoff, a professor of linguistics at Berkeley. ''Here is guy who has seen his male privilege vanish as society became more equal. He wants to turn the clock back."

Facing down the bad guys is hardly what I would categorize as "male privilege" but then an expert on "framing" such as Lakoff would know all about deliberate mischaracterization in order to cling to an outmoded feminist paradigm.

2 posted on 03/12/2006 11:28:45 AM PST by Billthedrill
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To: Lorianne
Howard Hawks hated the idea in High Noon of the lawman going around asking for help so he made in response to it Rio Bravo...one the greatest westerns. In it John Wayne never asked for help although he did get it in limited ways from the other characters.


3 posted on 03/12/2006 11:33:17 AM PST by xp38
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To: Billthedrill

The character of Atticus Finch in "To Kill a Mockingbird" is, for me, the epitome of how a man should be. It reminded me so much of my father that it was uncanny.


4 posted on 03/12/2006 11:57:50 AM PST by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: xp38

Greetings to all the Liberals and Feminists who are archiving my posts. Bezerkley that bastion of Conservative thought from a FemNag of all persons. I am shocked shocked I tell you. Well not really. That Masuclinity is under attack is like saying its dark at night. The Gender Equity Movement is trying as hard as it can to erase Gender all together. This is openly what Feminists stated was their goal.

They are upset that Men will not cooperate. Too bad so sad. Well from one Male they can kiss my hairy Arse. I am sick of the assult on my gender by the FemNags and their allies in the Media. Guess what Nags Men like Me are a by product of 3 decades of hatred towards Males. And the overwhelming silence of Conservative and Moderate Females.

Where were the Women's Groups decrying the Misandry and hatred of Men? Never existed. Where were the Women's Groups demanding fair Treatment for Fathers in Divorce and Access to their children? Also never existed. Where were the Women who demanded something be done about the appalling rate of suicide amongst Males? Never happened.

FemBots maintain it is about privledge and "The Patriarchy", wrong it is about survival. There has been a War of Attrition being waged against Men and now Boys. We are fighting back. Women who have Sons are finally speaking out. Gee it only took 3 Decades for it to happen. Men are refusing to Marry. The Hostile Family Court system.

We are drugging 10% of the boys in our schools. We have a record number of Boys on anti-depressants. There is a correlation between School shootings and SRRIs. One of the Columbine shooters was on anti-depressants. Conservative Women don't be silent speak up for us. Our voices are ignored by the Media, Politicians and the Courts.

Want Grandchildren? Want happily married daughters then damit speak up for your Men!!!


5 posted on 03/12/2006 11:59:10 AM PST by Khankrumthebulgar
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To: Lorianne
I find all the bitching about anti-male bias to be unmanly.
6 posted on 03/12/2006 12:02:39 PM PST by Physicist
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To: Lorianne; Victoria Delsoul
Manly man . . .

LOL.

7 posted on 03/12/2006 12:13:56 PM PST by Alberta's Child
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To: Lorianne
He cites the Berkeley linguist Lakoff, for example, for her work documenting how women frame requests in an apologetic, super-polite way.

.."We woman use super polite frames" says Georgie..rhymes with...

8 posted on 03/12/2006 12:21:08 PM PST by Donald Rumsfeld Fan ("fake but accurate": NY Times)
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To: Donald Rumsfeld Fan

He may have been referring to George's wife, Robin Lakoff, who is also a linguist.


9 posted on 03/12/2006 12:37:33 PM PST by RightWingAtheist (Creationism Is Not Conservative!)
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To: Lorianne; Slip18; NYC GOP Chick; hellinahandcart; sweetliberty; CARepubGal; LisaMalia; Ganymede; ...

Women who love manly men. Let me know if you want on or off the Retro Sexual ping list.

10 posted on 03/12/2006 12:47:02 PM PST by jellybean (George Allen 2008)
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To: Lorianne
Harvey Mansfield, conservative political theorist and academic provocateur, argues that women--and society--need to come to terms with 'manliness' ___ WHO IS NOT JUST a man, but a manly man?M/i>

Here's a good set of guidelines.


11 posted on 03/12/2006 12:55:13 PM PST by JRios1968 (A DUmmie troll's motto: "Non cogito, ergo zot")
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To: Donald Rumsfeld Fan

I thought Lakoff was a beard. Thanks for looking that up.


12 posted on 03/12/2006 1:16:48 PM PST by Billthedrill
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To: Lorianne
Mansfield nominates, among others, the marshal played by Gary Cooper in ''High Noon." When the town's sniveling semi-men slink away from the task, Cooper boldly goes out to fight the thugs arriving in his town. As for the second question-well it just shows how wanly gender neutral our society has become: Manly men scare us.

"Don't shove me Harv. I'm tired of being shoved".

"You're a good-looking boy: you've big, broad shoulders. But he's a man. And it takes more than big, broad shoulders to make a man".

"Don't try to be a hero! You don't have to be a hero, not for me"!

"Stay at the hotel until it's over".

"No, I won't be here when it's over. You're asking me to wait an hour to find out if I'm going to be a wife or a widow. I say it's too long to wait! I won't do it"!

"Amy"!

"I mean it! If you won't go with me now, I'll be on that train when it leaves here".

"manly men scare us"

13 posted on 03/12/2006 1:30:49 PM PST by Donald Rumsfeld Fan ("fake but accurate": NY Times)
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To: RightWingAtheist
He may have been referring to George's wife, Robin Lakoff.

Hmmm.....in this case a distinction without a difference.

14 posted on 03/12/2006 1:33:41 PM PST by Donald Rumsfeld Fan ("fake but accurate": NY Times)
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To: Billthedrill
I thought Lakoff was a beard. Thanks for looking that up.

You're welcome.

15 posted on 03/12/2006 1:35:02 PM PST by Donald Rumsfeld Fan ("fake but accurate": NY Times)
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To: Lorianne
?Quien Es Mas Macho?


16 posted on 03/12/2006 2:14:34 PM PST by jiggyboy (Ten percent of poll respondents are either lying or insane)
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To: Donald Rumsfeld Fan

Great post!


17 posted on 03/12/2006 2:16:21 PM PST by DCPatriot ("It aint what you don't know that kills you. It's what you know that aint so" Theodore Sturgeon)
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To: Khankrumthebulgar
Greetings to all the Liberals and Feminists who are archiving my posts.

LOL. Well, we should all aspire to that.

18 posted on 03/12/2006 2:19:45 PM PST by Zack Nguyen
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To: Donald Rumsfeld Fan

It's go time. Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum

19 posted on 03/12/2006 2:20:42 PM PST by Tribune7
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To: Physicist
I find all the bitching about anti-male bias to be unmanly.

Yep. I think the "gender-neutral" stuff is more worthy of attack. I'll never forget the time I rebuked a woman college administrator in the style of a mild flamewar here on FR, yet that drove her to tears. Women are easily disturbed when treated just like men, especially the more traditionally feminine. I worry all the new "GI Jane" stereotypes will only lead to more physical abuse of women because the thugs will somehow think they can take a punch like Trinity in the Matrix.

20 posted on 03/12/2006 3:29:56 PM PST by Dumb_Ox (http://kevinjjones.blogspot.com)
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To: Khankrumthebulgar
Finally a man gets it!

I wish more would before the media, the schools and feminazi's make more girlyboys!

21 posted on 03/12/2006 3:46:20 PM PST by SweetCaroline (Homosexuals intention is to serve none but themselves. THE PINK SWASTIKA)
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To: jellybean

Is Johnny Depp a manly man?


22 posted on 03/12/2006 5:20:09 PM PST by stanz (Those who don't believe in evolution should go jump off the flat edge of the Earth.)
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To: stanz
Image hosting by Photobucket you decide.....
23 posted on 03/12/2006 5:30:59 PM PST by loveitor.. ("I will leave with the greatest love for this country of ours..." Ronald Reagan)
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To: Lorianne
WHO IS NOT JUST a man, but a manly man?

You are going to tell me where you put the manliness, NOW!!

24 posted on 03/12/2006 5:42:20 PM PST by Plutarch
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To: jellybean

Good article. I'll want to get this book from the library!

(Dick Cheney is the Manliest, since John Wayne is dead :-).


25 posted on 03/12/2006 5:51:17 PM PST by Tax-chick (Death is perishable. Faith is eternal.)
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To: Lorianne
a blast from the past
26 posted on 03/12/2006 9:03:30 PM PST by King Prout (many accuse me of being overly literal... this would not be a problem if many were not under-precise)
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To: loveitor..

That's just role-playing.
I'll still take him any day.


27 posted on 03/13/2006 4:53:02 AM PST by stanz (Those who don't believe in evolution should go jump off the flat edge of the Earth.)
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To: Lorianne

bump for later


28 posted on 03/13/2006 9:24:20 AM PST by Centurion2000 (Islam's true face: http://makeashorterlink.com/?J169127BC)
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To: Centurion2000

It never ceases to amaze me the stupidity of American Women. Yes I know I am going to get flamed but here goes. What is the percentage of Males vs. Females who die on the Job? Men 94%. What is the percentage of Retail Floor Space devoted exclusively to Women? 85%! What is the Suicide rate of Males vs. Females? Men commit suicide 4 times as often as Females. What is the number of Divorced Fathers who committed suicide in the US Last year? Over 15.000 Men. What is the difference in Life Expectancy of Men vs. Women? Men live an average of 7 years less than White Females, 12 years less if Black.

What is the percentage of Men in College vs. Women? Men less than 40%. What is the average sentence in Prison for Murder for Men vs. Women? Men 16.5 years Women 6 years. What is the percentage of Women who file for Divorce 70%+. I could also talk about the Men in Prison for being behind on Child Support, the Bradley Amendment etc. etc.

My point is this look at the percentages of Men unfit for Military duty? Nearly 80%. Could there be an issue there? You bet your ass there is. We have been emasculating our Males for Decades. We have a media culture that spews forth anti Male bias and hatred. We have a National marriage Strike by Heterosexual males. Tired of being ass raped in Family Courts in Divorce. This Republic's days are numbered if we don't address these issues.


29 posted on 03/13/2006 10:47:17 AM PST by Khankrumthebulgar
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To: Plutarch
WHO IS NOT JUST a man, but a manly man?

[photo of limpwristed K.Southerland with improper Weaver stance].

Manly men should get a proper grip.

30 posted on 03/13/2006 1:18:41 PM PST by nonsporting
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To: nonsporting
Manly men should get a proper grip.

THERE ISN'T ENOUGH TIME!!!!!

31 posted on 03/13/2006 5:43:08 PM PST by Plutarch
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To: Alberta's Child
Excellent article, thanks. I agree with professor Mansfield, btw.

Looking manly, AC, hehe.

32 posted on 03/13/2006 6:24:52 PM PST by Victoria Delsoul
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To: Khankrumthebulgar
This Republic's days are numbered if we don't address these issues.

For the most part I agree with what you are saying... but just a word of advice. You can't expect anyone to take you seriously when you start insulting half of the population It never ceases to amaze me the stupidity of American Women. I've noticed a few freepers who have good ideas, but their cursing and insults get in the way of their message, turning people off and having the opposite result as a consequence of their put downs.

If you want to get your point of view across and want to address the issue, it is counterproductive to make blanket negative generalizations about the people you want to influence, since such a broad generalization is a fallacy - unless, you only want to express your opinion without engaging anyone, which is fine if you don't want to discuss it.

33 posted on 03/13/2006 6:30:41 PM PST by Victoria Delsoul
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To: Khankrumthebulgar
Maybe the first step towards getting support from American Women would be not calling them stupid collectively. Frankly I agree with the article's content to a point. My biggest problem with men is the lack of religious leadership. Manly men set examples. Regardless of the pressure. And they raise more manly men. It's a family tradition.

PS: IQ 132.

34 posted on 03/13/2006 6:33:54 PM PST by Hi Heels (Don't you wish there were a knob on the TV to turn up the intelligence?)
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To: Lorianne

Liberals are afraid of manly men.

I Luv em.


35 posted on 03/13/2006 6:33:56 PM PST by TASMANIANRED (The Internet is the samizdat of liberty..)
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To: RightWingAtheist

Cunning or otherwise.


36 posted on 03/13/2006 6:35:15 PM PST by TASMANIANRED (The Internet is the samizdat of liberty..)
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To: Victoria Delsoul
Looking manly, AC, hehe.

Cool . . . LOL. ;-)

37 posted on 03/13/2006 7:49:27 PM PST by Alberta's Child
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To: Alberta's Child

How are you doing, AC?


38 posted on 03/13/2006 7:50:48 PM PST by Victoria Delsoul
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To: Victoria Delsoul
Pretty good, after reading that. LOL.

How 'bout you? Busy weekend?

39 posted on 03/13/2006 7:52:21 PM PST by Alberta's Child
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To: Lorianne

Geez, I thought that this was a thread about George C. Looney???


40 posted on 03/13/2006 7:52:29 PM PST by eeriegeno
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To: Alberta's Child

Yeah, a bit busy but pretty good. This is a good article, I enjoyed reading it.


41 posted on 03/13/2006 7:54:26 PM PST by Victoria Delsoul
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To: Victoria Delsoul

Yep. And I enjoyed reading your post #33, too!


42 posted on 03/13/2006 7:55:50 PM PST by Alberta's Child
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To: Alberta's Child

Lol, thanks.


43 posted on 03/13/2006 7:56:41 PM PST by Victoria Delsoul
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To: Victoria Delsoul

Hey, don't mention it!


44 posted on 03/13/2006 7:58:04 PM PST by Alberta's Child
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To: Alberta's Child

I won't. :-D


45 posted on 03/13/2006 8:02:22 PM PST by Victoria Delsoul
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read later


46 posted on 03/13/2006 8:08:48 PM PST by rattrap
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To: TASMANIANRED

47 posted on 03/14/2006 12:59:38 PM PST by RightWingAtheist (Creationism Is Not Conservative!)
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To: RightWingAtheist

I wish being civil with Women got results. It definitely does not. Men have tried to have a discourse of a civil kind with our Women. It has fallen on deaf ears. My question to Libertarian and Conservative Women is what will it take? Seriously Ladies what will it take to get your attention to the War on Men and Boys? Will it take Homicide Bombers and Men burning down the Women's Center at Wellsley College?

Will it take Terrorism? The US Media refuses to even hear what Men have to say. We are losing 15,000 Men a year to suicide. Our life expectancy is 7 years less than yours. We are 94% of On the Jobs deaths. Damn it what will it take?

Turn on any network TV show and ask yourself this. What is the depiction of Fathers on TV? Like Father Knows Best? Family Affair? The Courtship of Eddie's Father? The Cosby Show? No hell no. Men are portrayed as idiots who cannot do anything without Women. And TV Commercials spew forth Male Hatred and Bigotry. TV is for Gays and Misandrist Women.


48 posted on 03/17/2006 7:41:17 AM PST by Khankrumthebulgar
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To: Khankrumthebulgar

"Our life expectancy is 7 years less than yours. We are 94% of On the Jobs deaths. Damn it what will it take?"

Being less clumsy?

Is it "manly" to capitalize every other word in a sentence? :)


49 posted on 03/17/2006 7:47:37 AM PST by linda_22003
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To: linda_22003

Someone please address the content of my arguements? I have very thick skin and could give a damn whether it offends Women or not. Life expectancy, No-fault Divorce, Prison, deaths on the job, quality of life. All are on the decline for Men. We have Women demanding to act like Whores. Slut Feminism and Women demanding the right to get falling down drunk without the consequences of their behavior. Please address the issues.

That I have called Conservative Women on this and get this whiney crap about capitalization? Give me a break. Katie O'Beirne of National Review wrote a book about Women making the World Worse. Christina Hoff Sommers wrote a Book "The War On Boys", and Phylis Schlaffly has been calling Conservatives on their refusal to defend Men and Family Life. Why is that Conservative Women will not listen to Conservative Men if it comes to the privledges of Feminism?

Do you not see the damage to our Republic? That its very survival is at Stake. Even Secular Humanists and Feminists are coming to that realization. Wafta Sultan raised that on her interview with Al-Jazeera. Who will fight the Radical Moslems? Emasculated, drug damaged Males? Think again. Choose Freedom or centuries of Darkness and the death of our Republic. Ladies the bill for Freedom has come due. An emasculated, cowardly Male populace cannot defend you.


50 posted on 03/18/2006 9:59:35 AM PST by Khankrumthebulgar
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