Skip to comments.Terri's Day challenges the nation to unify
Posted on 03/14/2006 11:28:51 AM PST by KevinNuPac
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"In fact, when medical examiner Jon Thogmartin undertook the collection of Terri's medical records to launch his autopsy, he reported that he tracked her initial Humana Hospital-Northside admission records to Fox's office. According to Thogmartin, attorneys on both sides of the malpractice case conceded to the bulimia theory because there was nothing else 'to hang their hats on.'"
So: A consulting lawyer for Michael Schiavo had physical control of the medical records and made up the theory. Bad enough Fox was phishing the med records to contrive a malpractice case. But what was never revealed to the court or to the malpractice jury was the bone scan. I wonder if Fox had that document too? If he did, and suppressed it, the malpractice suit had to be premeditated flim-flam. Evidence that Terri was the victim of trauma would have gotten the suit thrown out of court on the spot.
I will hope and assume there is an innocent explanation for Mr. Fox's course of action; but it eludes me. For that matter, one looks in vain for evidence of integrity in any of Michael Schiavo's lawyers.
The same Gary Fox said this on Greta Van Sustenance's show last year:
GARY FOX, 1992 ATTORNEY FOR SCHIAVOS: "What happened, Greta, as best we know, is that Terri had a condition known as bulimia (search). It's an eating disorder. She'd had it for many years. She grew up as a chubby, overweight child, and over time, she coped with that condition by developing this eating disorder, bulimia."
***"One night, Michael and Terri had had dinner. And she had had a large meal, and not long after the meal, he heard a thumping sound in the couple's bathroom, went to investigate, found Terri lying on the floor of the bathroom. She had just purged, apparently, or vomited, binged, which is what bulimics do and had a heart attack. And by the time that fire rescue arrived at the Schiavo home, why, she had suffered severe brain damage."
Can you believe the guy had the nerve to say this? It could be shown to be patently false. His timeline is nothing like that of any testimony provided by either Michael, Terri's brother, Bobby, or her friend, Jackie.
Remarkable! My hat is off to Gary Fox. I don't believe I've ever seen so many lies in two short paragraphs.
Great advice. And it is getting easier to do since it appears their numbers are dropping....:)
God Bless everyone on this thread who stands up for life. The life God created.
If we don't deny an animal a drink of water, how do you arrive that it is possible that Terri should be denied a drink of water? Other than that, I liked your response.
If we don't deny an animal a drink of water, how do you arrive that it is possible that Terri should be denied a drink of water? Other than that, I liked your response.
There are facially-valid arguments that such action was legally right and proper. Many of them involve accepting some rather dubious claims as fact, and regarding certain legal theories as compelling over certain others which would seem they should take precedence.
Basically, I would regard that first issue as: if one were to view in the best possible light everything favorable to Michael, Felos, et al., and view in the worst possible light everything favorable to the Schindlers, would it be possible to conclude that Michael's actions were proper.
My interpretation is that if one really stretched the boundaries of "best possible light" and "worst possible light", one might conceivably be able to justify them. It would require stretching credulity to the breaking point, but it might be possible under such terms.
That having been said, my bigger point is that I see no satisfactory justification for the way the Bushes handled this, regardless of whether Michael's behavior was proper or not. It may be that Bush was told that Greer's cops would resist with bloodshed if need be to prevent Terri's rescue. Even if that's the case, I would suggest that bloodshed sufficient to uphold the law would be preferable to allowing open sedition.
Something good is happening in Minnesota, North Country Gazette reports.
MINNESOTAAs the first anniversary of the death of Terri Schiavo nears, the disabled Floridian whose feeding tube was removed by court order, Minnesota legislators debated a proposed new law that would require hospitals to give food and water to dying patients.
Hospice Minnesota opposes the bill.
Nat Hentoff of the Village Voice, dean of the Left's civil libertarians, angrily called it "the longest public execution in American history." It was the saddest, too.
Terri's judicial murder was an evil milestone. It was a day of shame. America's decency and honor were stained by evil. Until the stain is overcome and we are made clean, we will never again be the City on the Hill. A country that will no longer care for the children, the weak, the aged, the ill has become a barbarian rabble.
The White Rose is a perfect symbol for Terri. We say this to the evidoers who tormented Terri and brought shame upon America: We will not shut up, we are your bad conscience; The White Rose will not leave you in peace.
I can't think of even one. That part was outside the law, which permits the removal of a medical device but not denial of mouth feeding. That was simply an arbitrary act of evil by George Greer. He had no authority to do it.
It was an act of malevolence.
I don't think their numbers are dropping per se. I think they lurk aplenty. Still, I think it's best to ignore them.
May God have mercy on us for the evil we do as a society (and individually as well).
The doctors ignored her written instructions, and saved her life during a heart attack. She then decided she wanted to live, and agreed to get a pace maker. Her family is furious, and insists she can't mean it. ...the resources could be better spent on people who still have a quality of life. I wonder why her family is putting so much pressure on her to hurry up and die.
Some people speak of their own future death in hypothetical terms, and say they'd want to die. But this is another example of the very real reaction people have when faced with the reality of death. She doesn't want her next breath to be her last. Her family needs to stop putting their own selfishness ahead of her life.
Well, c'mon, BB! Don't you know that at 94 it doesn't matter if you change your mind? If you have no "quality of life" left, then it's time to boot you out the door! (Sounds to me like the kids must have talked their mom into signing something she didn't really want to sign, and since she got resuscitated by mistake, they are furious that she's not dead yet. Looking for an inheritance, by chance?)
Meanwhile, Florida is STILL the Starvation State.
Greta emailed me in 2004. That was a few email accounts back. She said the starvation/dehydration was sickening or disgusting. I can't remember which it was. And, she's a scientologist to boot.
Thanks for your Nat Hentoff post. Terri's support crossed all demographic lines, a marketing coup but her support couldn't save her. Powerful people were hell bent on killing her.
Didn't dispirit me a bit. Matter of fact, I count his inaction on what was clearly a state affair to be one of the few conservative things the man has done.
Somehow this and all the elderly and sick that were euthanized in New Orleans so the caretakers could leave their job should be looked at as a continuation of our culture of death in this country.
The euthanized in New Orleans are under investigation. Louisiana at least has a tough Attorney General. Florida has a weenie AG who wants to be Florida's weenie Governor.
Terri was robbed and then murdered. We cannot forget about the robbery of over half a million dollars. Terri's was the first death order by a judge issued for a NON-CONVICT who wasn't on death row. The first. That order violated the Florida Statutes. That wasn't the only violation by Judge Greer.
Violations against Terri are page after page long. The US Justice Dept. is conducting an investigation currently but if it's a faux investigation, the GOP will simply lose more members.
Check this out. Dr. Dave Weldon from Florida is one of the best congressmen we have in DC.
I sure didn't like hearing what those nurses and caretakers did there.
They had claimed to do that because of a state law that said they had to be dead to legally leave, SO THEY KILLED THEM ALL.
Horrible things were done.
I take that as a question. The answer would be no, unless one is deceived or are a deceiver. Pardon my Christianity, but the bible speaks of both. You have seen the result of opposite thinking.(death) Not even a humane death at that.
I bookmarked this new web site which was created by first string Terri supporters. There's a lot of good updates and resource material at this site. Too many people are dying before their time.
Just the beginning IMO. The older population will be the dominant voting population in this country in the next 20 or so years, and people love to vote themselves all kinds of goodies at others expense.
With so few people supporting a top heavy elderly population, I am sure the world actually would embrace a nice bird flu that would remove the elderly and weak from out responsibility. If the Bird flu don't kill them off, I think their heirs sure will be thinking about it.
The burden on the young might get unbearable.
The US Justice Dept. is conducting an investigation currently but if it's a faux investigation
Okay whatever you say.
the GOP will simply lose more members.
If that means chasing off kooks and returning to a more limited government platform, less interference into the affairs of the separate and sovereign states, and actually taking government out of familial decisions then I may rejoin the party. Doubtful but anything's possible.
No billbears, slavery isn't coming back anytime soon. Sorry. The next best thing you got going for you now is State sponsored murder, which I see you support.
Cute. Who in their right mind would want that? But that's about all you've got isn't it? One liners. Luckily most federal politicians have backed away from this current issue.
The next best thing you got going for you now is State sponsored murder, which I see you support
Again another assumption. I don't support anything of the sort. However I don't think 537 political hacks or 9 Justices in Washington know any better about the issue than I would. Of course, Justice Scalia stated that already didn't he?
Let's stop beating around the bush. You wanted Terri dead. Right?
That brings back poignant memories of the good old days. But even then we had to fight every inch of the way just as we are fighting the death culture for people like Terri.
This Saturday, March 18th, is the anniversary of the day Terri Schiavo's feeding tube was removed. She died thirteen days later, on March 31st. The public airing of Terri's situation caused us to consider and debate profound issues of life and death. We asked important questions. What is life? What makes it precious? What makes life, "worth living"? What is the difference between medical intervention and ordinary care, and when, if ever, can they ethically be withdrawn? When, if ever, should the dying be treated differently than the profoundly disabled? At our best, we discussed these things on our blogs thoughtfully and graciously, in spite of the emotionally-charged atmosphere. At our worst, we angrily hurled insults and attacks at the "other side".
Terri after the attack and before bioethicking.
Thank you, Ohioan.
CLEARWATER, March 16, 2006 (LifeSiteNews.com) The family of Terri Schindler Schiavo are working to establish a national day of remembrance in her name to commemorate the growing number of patients who are being killed in hospitals by removal of food and hydration assistance. Robert Schindler and National Urban Policy Action Council president Kevin Fobbs have joined forces in an effort to help disabled people and other avoid Terri's fate.
The goal is to gather a million signatures to petition state officials to establish March 31 as a national day of remembrance, similar to the annual remembrance of the anniversary of the abortion decision, Roe v. Wade.
Terri Schiavos legacy has taught us that life is precious and should be protected, Fobbs, also a Michigan radio talk show host, said.
You're right in your assessment of how things played out. A swamp judge weilded more power than the Executive and Legislative branches put together. And the liberals squeeled with delight.
Hear hear, BykrBayb.
But "liberals" and "squeeled" are indistinguishable.
Thank you, 8mm.
Whoops, thanks were to you, 8mm.
HMM, not sure what to think about this. However, I think that Terri's death was a day that should be remembered in our country as a day we all got to see that Euthanasia is alive and well in this grand old USA!
What I keep in mind is the incredible parallel to Easter which will never be the same for me. It will be a permanent reminder of what happened to Terri and what will happen to many of us if we do not learn and be vigilant.
I agree about Bush's poll numbers. Our govt just failed to see that we Americans saw them let a innocent woman be put to death because one pathetic judge in Florida says she deserved to die. I for one lost a lot of faith in Bush after that. I won't go as far to say bad things about Bush here cause I want to stay a member and I love FR, but my opinion on the entire administration and the Governor of Florida changed drastically the day Terri died.
We should have a Michael Schiavo Law too, that would make it a felony for a husband to petition a government court to murder his wife. Any judge who grants such a petition would be guilty of murder.
I'm glad you liked that pic of Terri. It's been floating around on various Terri threads recently, but I can't claim credit for finding it. Many of us thought it was important for people who believe the lies of the media (that Terri was in such bad shape all those years) to see that Terri was well on her way to recovery when Michael suddenly reversed course after the malpractice money came in. She was getting rehab back then. It's horrible that Michael was allowed to continue his guardianship of Terri.
If Michael's claim that oral feeding and hydration would have 0.00000000% chance of success were true, then the refusal to allow it would have denied Terri nothing. Further, if Michael were doing everything possible to improve Terri's condition (and if the treatments Michael was refusing would have offered no benefit, he would have been), there would be no basis for allowing the parents to inflict ineffective treatments upon Terri.
I think we would both agree that the treatments Michael was refusing would have had some significant probability of success. If, however, one were to view the testimony of Michael's "experts" in the most favorable light, and those of the Shindlers' in the least favorable light, it would be possible for a reasonable person to conclude that the proposed treatments would offer no benefit to Terri.
I don't think that a reasonable person who was familiar with all of Michael's words and deeds, or those of some of his "experts", would regard them as credible. But if one accepts them as truth, then Michael's actions may be justifiable.
Suppose that Terri's esophagus had been severed, whether by a bullet wound or other cause, such that her mouth was no longer connected to her stomach. Would it be appropriate to require that oral feeding/hydration be attempted in such case?
Michael's "experts" basically claimed that given Terri's condition, oral feeding/hydration would have no greater likelihood of success than if her esophagus had been severed. I don't think a reasonable person who knew about Michael and his "experts" would find such a claim credible, but if such claim was true, and if Terri had indeed expressed a clear and unambiguous desire not to be gastrostomically fed if she were incapacitated, then Michael's actions would have been legal and proper.
Of course, if I had received 270 electoral votes last election I'd be President right now, but I didn't so I'm not.
"Squeeled?" Did I really spell it that way? Oh well, it sounds the same either way. : )
Judge Greer had no authority to prohibit giving Terri water and food by hand. He simply ordered it by judicial fiat. It was a repugnant and unlawful act.
To justify such cruelty is depraved.
Yes, you did. It was SO cute <g>
Ah, the delicious pitfalls of English spelling. You know the song, "It's almost like falling in love"? Think of this line: "And from the way that I feel when that bell starts to peal..." There we have a nice hard E sound spelled both E-E and E-A. But think if we'd written it, "And from the way that I feel when that BELLE starts to PEEL" -- then we'd be in a burlesque house.
Dunno about anyone else, but I make most of my spelling errors when I'm tired and typing fast. The odd thing is, most of the mistakes are phonetic, like squeel.
That sounds a-peeling
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