Exodus National Ex-Gay Conference 6/27 to 7/2 2006

http://www.exodusfreedom.org/freedom/index2.cfm ^ | 3/26/06

[dcnd9]

"LIVE OUT LOUD" 2006 FREEDOM CONFERENCE

[img] www.exodusfreedom.org/freedom/images/2006Conf/Box_Subtitles1.3.jpg[img]

[John O]

I am neither pro or anti homosexuality. I call each situation as I see it. I neither blame homosexuals for all the ills of this country or excuse them for problems they cause.

My posts stand for themselves.

While you tend to be somewhat less caustic than the typical homosexual agenda promoter, your posts do fall mainly on the pro-homosexual side.

I'm here. I've been posting here for a long time.

Newbie. :^)

Seriously though, I do see how the rooming arrangment could be a strugglinbg point for some. The conference needs to either rethink this or vet the attendees carefully. Of course, the typical person attending this conference will be interested in overcomming this disease so they will be more motivated to not succumb to temptation while in their room. Therefore, I don't think immoral activity will be a huge problem.

[John O]

Christians are "new creatures n Christ."

Therefore, to belong to a group that lumps Christians together with people who also used to share their same sin, is a problem, since they are now NEW CREATURES and not, supposedly, sinning in the same way that they sinned before.

To have a convention where the only glue between the people is their former sin -- or their "dead man in Christ" -- is a problem.

I have found very few people who get delivered from all their sicknesses upon becomming saved. Most are eventually delivered as they are transformed into a likeness of Christ. I've known smokers who smoked for years after getting saved. Likewise there are those who suffer from Same-sex Attraction Disorder who struggle with it for years after their salvation experience.

While SAD is a sin it is also a mental disease. God can and does heal miraculously. But not everyone gets a miraculous healing. Some need to work through their healing for some reason. Perhaps so they can help others be healed?

I see no problem with those who are further along in their healing helping those who are just starting. That's how Christianity works. Those who are closer to Christ help those who aren't there yet get there.

[MineralMan]

"While you tend to be somewhat less caustic than the typical homosexual agenda promoter, your posts do fall mainly on the pro-homosexual side."

---

Not really. My arguments are generally with those who extend illogical arguments against homosexuals...those who equate homsexuals as a class of people who are "satan's spawn" or some such.

I know some homosexual people. They seem to be productive, friendly folks. None of them have ever done anything that would engender my hatred. So, I defend homosexual "people," rather than universally condemming them.

Myself, I'm not gay, have never had any homosexual attractions, and have never performed any homosexual acts.

I'm neither pro-homosexual or anti-homosexual. I just don't like seeing entire groups lumped together, whatever the subject.

I just found this particular conference's rooming arrangements to be a little iffy, and mentioned it.

[MineralMan]

"Christians are "new creatures n Christ."

Therefore, to belong to a group that lumps Christians together with people who also used to share their same sin, is a problem, since they are now NEW CREATURES and not, supposedly, sinning in the same way that they sinned before."

From my understanding, a lot of Christians sometimes engage in sinful behavior. Becoming a Christian does not automatically end all sinful behavior, as experience will easily demonstrate.

The rooming arrangements here, if not carefully attended to, may cause unneeded temptation, and could possibly cause some of the attendees to fail in their resolve.

It happens.

[MineralMan]

"What are you basing this assumption on?
"

There are several statistical studies of Exodus and other groups of its nature that demonstrate that the process is often not successful in turning homosexuals into straight folks.

That's not a condemnation of their program. Most such programs, either drug rehab or others, have a fairly high failure rate. It just comes with the territory.

[DirtyHarryY2K]

Not a threat at all. Just good advice. Based on the long list of former homo agenda cheerleaders masquerading as FReepers that are no longer with us. ;-)

[dcnd9]

We don't hate the homosexual either, neither does the ex-gay [and who better knows the gay person than the exgay] We don't minimize the sinful nature of homosexual acts either.

Whatever gays choose to do in private is their business. It's the forcing of acceptance of said behavior and trying to legislate it as normal, a so called civil right, that is the poblem. It is chosen sexual behavior.

[dcnd9]

Can you post these links to back this up?

[MineralMan]

"Not a threat at all. Just good advice."

I see. Well, since I've been a regular poster on Free Republic for two more years than you have, and have never even been suspended, I guess I'm doing OK.

Your advice is noted, however. I believe I'll continue on as always, though. It's worked out OK for me so far.

I have a bit of advice for you, as well: Watch the name-calling. Calling people trolls is a quick way to get your posts deleted. I've found that avoiding name-calling is a really good idea here.

[MineralMan]

"We don't hate the homosexual either, neither does the ex-gay [and who better knows the gay person than the exgay] We don't minimize the sinful nature of homosexual acts either.
"

OK. Then I have no argument with you at all. Please go back to the beginning of this thread. I'm not taking any pro-homosexual position in this thread. I'm just saying that the housing arrangements for this conference have the potential for causing unnecessary problems.

Were I putting on the conference, I think I'd avoid any sort of random roommate assignments from the get-go.

[MineralMan]

"Can you post these links to back this up?
"

Not without a good deal of searching. This is information gleaned from many sources, I'm afraid, and not something I have links for at hand.

Sadly, I don't have time today to do the searching, or I'd be happy to.

[dcnd9]

I'm sure they have set procedures and guidelines to prevent this possibility. They've been in the business a long time.

Also can you post links backing up
"several statistical studies of Exodus and other groups"

[MineralMan]

Here's an interesting page from the Exodus-International site itself. It's basically a discussion of one of the early founders of the organization, who ended up forming a gay relationship with another Exodus person.

The main thing to look at here is the stuff at the end of the article, where the author more or less admits that they don't suceed in the majority of cases.

Remember, this is Exodus, itself, speaking.

Their success (and failure) rate is pretty typical of all sorts of programs designed to change behavior, such as drug and alcohol rehab. While they do get results, it's often with a discouragingly-small percentage of those who enter the program.

Changing behavior is difficult.

[MineralMan]

Phooey! Here's the link:

http://www.exodus-international.org/library_Society_12.shtml

[MineralMan]

Please see the link in #34.

Exodus is working on their own statistical studies. I don't know when they'll be released.

[MineralMan]

Here's another item from the Exodus site, itself. It's part of their FAQ. Note their own statement near the end that changes from 30-50% are "possible." I could find other links, but they would be suspect for you, I imagine, since they are not from the Exodus site. Link is at the end of the quoted text:

---

What's your "success rate" in changing gays into straights?

What you are really asking is whether there is realistic hope for change for men and women who do not want their sexual orientation to be homosexual. And the answer to that is yes!

In 1 Corinthians 6:9–11, Paul gives a list of all kinds of sinners that will not inherit the kingdom of God, including those that practice homosexuality. But he goes on to say, "and that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God." Some Corinthian Christians had formerly been homosexuals, but now were counted among the saints. Now, that's good news indeed!

No one is saying that change is easy. It requires strong motivation, hard work, and perseverance. But we find hundreds of former homosexuals who have found a large degree of change--attaining abstinence from homosexual behaviors, lessening of homosexual temptations, strengthening their sense of masculine or feminine identity, correcting distorted styles of relating with members of the same and opposite gender. Some former homosexuals marry and some don't, but marriage is not the measuring stick; spiritual growth and obedience are.

On the statistical side, careful reviews of research studies on sexual orientation change suggest that real change is indeed possible. Studies suggesting change rates in the range of 30-50% are not unusual, although "success rates" vary considerably and the measurement of change is problematic.

http://exodus.to/exodus_faqs_success.shtml

[dcnd9]

"The surveys and studies are being done and information is being complied. I believe we will all see that the statistics for change are much higher than 30%. In the past 10 years First Stone Ministries has noted that the men and women who truly work through the program and wholeheartedly apply themselves reveal that the percentage rate of people who are able to overcome the homosexual lifestyle is much greater than 50%." 1999

That was 1999. Probably even higher today 2006 due to the knowledge "You have the choice to change IF you want to change" is no longer a secret.

[DirtyHarryY2K]

Watch the name-calling

Funny you should mention it. I've been labeled with all sorts of titles. For example: "Right wing nut job", "Fundamentalist ignorant homophobic closed minded redneck" "Religious Nazi" just to name a few, add vulgarity for emphasis and you get the idea.

I just grow a thick skin and chalk it up to the anonymous environment of the Internet and dismiss it out of hand.

I can tell you this though, I don't have an obsession or predilection to go around on EVERY SINGLE thread with a certain topic that I claim neutrality on and play the devil's advocate. ;^) Maybe ther's a name for that behavior???? LMAO!

[MineralMan]

I think the bottom line is that the statistics are really not in, and never will be. Yes, some people are able to do something about changing their sexual activity preference. Others are not.

I doubt very much that the percentage of those who start any of these programs and successfully change their sexual orientation is anywhere near 50%. Your First Stone information qualifies their statement very strictly, limiting their success assessments to those who are the most active in "working the program." Assessed from the numbers who "start" the program, their estimates would, no doubt, be much lower.

It's the same in every behavior modification program, I'm afraid.

[DirtyHarryY2K]

ther's = there's

Sticky E key. LOL