Posted on 04/01/2006 8:25:19 AM PST by B4Ranch
Immigration cited as reason for U.S. losses
It's a widespread belief, one reinforced by public officials including President Bush: ``Illegal immigrants do the jobs Americans won't do.''
But it's being challenged in a five-year study that concludes millions of undereducated Americans are without work in a labor market oversaturated by illegal immigrants.
Steven Camarota, director of the Center for Immigration Studies, a think tank that favors reduced immigration, released the findings Wednesday in Washington, D.C.
The study calls into question the theory that America is desperately short of underskilled workers, Camarota said. More importantly, he added, the research concluded that illegal immigration had a direct effect on job loss for native-born workers.
Employers who hire from the vast pool of illegal immigrants avoid paying workers' compensation, health benefits, Social Security and a whole slew of labor law requirements, he said.
From backbreaking jobs in the meatpacking industry to janitorial work, the research showed that from 2000 to 2005, participation in the labor force by U.S.-born adults without a high school degree fell from 59 percent to 56 percent. Among U.S.-born adults with a high school degree, participation dropped from 78 percent to 75 percent, according to the study.
During the same time, the number of adult immigrant workers with a high school degree or less increased by 1.5 million people … rising from 15.5 percent of the work force to 17.4 percent. In a hot political climate where ``guest-worker'' programs are being debated on Capitol Hill and anti-immigrant groups are protesting outside day labor centers across Southern California, the study's release comes as immigration is taking center stage.
Senate and congressional debates rely heavily on unsubstantiated information about the labor market and illegal immigration, Camarota said.
``There is nothing wrong with immigration; it's a very powerful force in the United States labor market,'' Camarota said. ``But the idea that immigrants are doing the jobs Americans won't do is absurd on its face. There are no such jobs that Americans won't do, because most of the jobs in America are done by native-born (residents).''
The number of American-born high school dropouts with jobs declined from 2000 to 2005 by 1.3 million, the study estimated. Census data collected in the study revealed that 4 million Americans between the ages of 18 to 64 with a high school education or less are unemployed, while 19 million others are not in the labor force.
However, Jared Bernstein of the Economic Policy Institute, who has conducted similar research into income and wage inequality, said the issue is not necessarily illegal immigration, but a sign of the U.S. market underperforming.
Bernstein said the lack of job creation in the U.S. over the past five years has contributed to the growth of unemployment for all unskilled laborers.
The overall weak demand for labor, outsourcing of U.S. jobs and low minimum wage contributes more to job loss among Americans than illegal immigration, Bernstein added.
Bernstein did not dispute the report's findings but did disagree with its conclusion.
``This is more of a sign of a labor market underperforming in general than an immigrant group doing better,'' Bernstein said. ``But the deterioration is worse for native than foreign-born. It's a pretty tough labor market for everybody.''
Sens. Edward M. Kennedy, D-Mass, and John McCain, R-Ariz., have proposed a guest-worker program that would admit 400,000 foreign workers annually. The Bush administration is looking for an open-ended guest-worker plan.
President Bush proposed that a guest-worker program ``match willing foreign workers with willing U.S. employers when no Americans can be found to fill the jobs. The program would be open to new foreign workers and to the undocumented men and women currently employed in the U.S.''
The administration's proposal falls in line with what the Mexican government has been seeking for a guest-worker program, said Raphael Laveaga, in an earlier interview. Laveaga, spokesman for the Mexican Embassy in Washington, D.C., said both nations must work together to create a guest-worker program.
``We are neighbors and friends,'' Laveaga said. ``A guest- worker program that takes into consideration the needs of both nations is important in combating the issues of migration.''
The proposals have led to the organization of hundreds of anti-illegal immigrant groups across the United States, from the Minuteman civilian border watch groups to Friends of the Border Patrol, chaired by Andy Ramirez of Chino. These groups argue that guest-worker programs should not be considered until the southern border with Mexico is secured.
``President Bush outsources high-tech jobs and imports illegal immigrant labor,'' Ramirez said. ``The question is, what happens to middle-class America?''
Camarota argues against the administration's stance for a guest-worker program, saying it harms the American worker. He added that cultural misperceptions of what illegal immigrants are willing to do, along with cost-cutting by employers, contribute to the growing number of illegal immigrants being hired in the United States.
Unemployment remains relatively high for some native-born groups … 9.3 percent for African-Americans and 12.7 percent for white teenagers, the study finds.
``If you flood the bottom of the labor market, it doesn't matter what laws you pass, they are unenforceable … the supply and demand will be overwhelming,'' Camarota said. ``It always trumps labor laws.''
KEY POINTS
A study released Wednesday by the Center of Immigration Studies challenges the notion that illegal immigrants are doing the jobs Americans won't do. It concluded that undereducated native-born Americans are without work partly because the labor market is oversaturated by illegal immigrants.
• Some of the occupations most affected by immigration include maids, construction workers, dishwashers, janitors, painters, cabbies, groundskeepers and meat/poultry workers. Workers in these occupations are overwhelmingly native-born.
• The workers themselves are not the only thing to consider: Nearly half of American children younger than 18 are dependent on a less-educated worker, and 71 percent of children of the native-born working poor depend on a worker with a high school degree or less.
• Native-born teenagers (15 to 17) also saw their labor force participation fall from 30 percent in 2000 to 24 percent in 2005.
• Wage data show little evidence of a labor shortage. Wage growth for less-educated natives has generally lagged.
Source: Center for Immigration Studies
Sara A. Carter can be reached by e-mail at sara.carter@dailybulletin.com or by phone at (909) 483-8552.
But it's being challenged in a five-year study that concludes millions of undereducated Americans are without work in a labor market oversaturated by illegal immigrants.
That was part of the plan, though. Effective wages for many jobs have fallen to subsistence levels, and the illegal and massive legal waves of immigration abetted by America's elites make this possible. From America's colonial beginnings, slave labor was seen as essential for the Commonwealth insitutions that sought profit here.
Not much has changed in 400 years.
.....need to send this to William Kristol so he can get a dose of reality.
ROTFLMAO!
BTTT!
Good morning B4Ranch!
Mornin Tex,
Tell me Gringo, is there any good news for today?
If he figures constant repetition of this big lie will be enough to convince the masses of its veracity, someone's been slipping mickeys in his margaritas.
Yes. I am going to go rake leaves in the yard today. One less job for Pedro to do.
Guten Morgen, Herr B4!
Liebe,
Helga
:)
That's pretty funny. Until I reflect that it's true. Then it's sad.
I have listened to all sides of the guest worker/amnesty debate. I have heard from Democrats and Republicans:
1. The poor hard working illegals, what they go though to get here, Mexico is sooooo poor
2. poor big business, they need the labor
3. there are jobs that Americans won't do (barf)
4. The parties (Dems and Repubs) can't peeve off the hispanic voting base and illegals.
The one thing that I have NOT heard from these politicians is concern for the American citizen and what we want. Every reliable poll out there says we are tired of illegal immigration and want the borders secured....not a guest worker program.
If/when this amnesty passes it will be total proof that we do NOT have a representative government any longer. What do we do then?
And we could probably have many of these jobs done even cheaper by (US) prison chain gangs.
Bush wouldn't lie to us, would he?
/sarcasm
This depends on ones perception. I construe this to mean that 3% of US born adults without a HS diploma found other jobs, as did 3% with a HS diploma. My conclusion is based upon the unemployment numbers going down. And the media is not showing hours of "homeless Americans" footage. Corporate earnings are at a historical high, and even our own Willie Green is warning of an imminent economic collapse (meaning that we are at a peak of expansion). Nice try at obfuscating and appealing to base emotion though.
Bumping the thread
Somehow, someway there has got to be a way for the American people to repeal the 17th Amendment. The Senate is where the people really get screwed. The House is standing firm on our desire to seal the borders and strictly enforce the laws.
Some Freeper needs to tell find out how we can get the ball rolling to get rid of these Senators. The Founders distrusted direct democracy that is why they wanted the Senators elected by the State Legislatures.
CIS bump
Look at the help wanted ads in the newapaper
Do a Google news search of "labor" + "shortage"
Haven't read the whole thing but it looks interesting.
Of course Google will not show and bias towards the illegals. Take a hike.
....
But even people here are seeing the signs, especially with the big homebuilders. They're hiring more and more illegals for construction and finishing work, driving down prices for local firms and forcing them to cut wages and benefits and even fire people. This is nothing but greed on the part of the builders. They are not passing the savings on to home buyers.
bump
Google doesn't write the news, they just index it.
Nor do that write the help wanted ads.
Well...we know this is a crock:
Illegal immigrants do the jobs Americans won't do.''
~ April Fool mayhaps?
:How about : don't want to do? If a person can live on welfare or off of another person who works/collects benefits, why would he do dirty, hard, low-payed work. End all benefits for able bodied people and attitudes about such work will change.
We also need to get over our fixation that every American should go to college. A tremendous amount of work, both skilled and unskilled, does not need any college. Young people hear a constant drumbeat about college to the point that they hear they are not worthy if they do not go to college, a false message, IMHO
BTTT
DOUG from Upland started with this thread U.S. BORDER PATROL: Turn In Illegal Aliens (and EMPLOYERS, followed by this one U.S. BORDER CONTROL Turn in illegal aliens
Go to either thread for more details on what to do. The TOLL FREE number to report ILLEGAL aliens or those employing ILLEGAL aliens to ICE is: 866-347-2423
How it works:
You are not required to provide your identity to ICE. All that is necessary to request an investigation by ICE is mere suspicion of any activity by ILLEGAL aliens.
ICE and the IRS are especially interested in "visiting" those businesses that employ ILLEGALS "off the books" to avoid the payment of payroll taxes.
I suggest looking around and see if you might spot a suspect. At work, at school, at a job sight, Micky D's, Store etc.
On the day(current plan is May 1) of this march check to see if you can determine if someone took the day off. Confirming grounds for suspicion.
:) Easy Does It
I think the base idea behind bringing in the illegals is to break the unions, get companies to cut back on benefits, especially retirement plans, get socialized medicine going and lower wages which will eliminate the middle class.
Then we will have a nation that fits more in line with 3rd world nations. Two classes of people instead of three, rich and poor instead of rich, poor and the 'comfortable middle class'.
The 'comfortable middle class' are people who don't have desires for their own private airplanes, inhome help, ie servants. They have their midsized lake craft, the RV, a couple of SUV's and the cottage at the summer place, not six homes on four continents with permanently staffed with hired help.
Make a phone call.
I get so angry whenever I hear some politician say that illegals are "doing the jobs that Americans won't do". I did these jobs and so did my brothers and sisters, our friends, kids in our school. The thing is, we did these jobs as teenagers. These were our first jobs. I worked in a fast food restaurant when I was 15 and then went to work at a movie theater and became assistant manager when I was 17. My sister got her first job as a maid at a Travelodge. My brothers worked in restaurants as busboys, dishwashers, and cooks. When I would go to McDonalds on a Friday night, the kid serving me was the same kid who was in one of my high school classes. So, this is really offensive. It's as if these elites want to tell us that we're all lazy and that none of these jobs would be done if it weren't for illegals.
ICE has no intention of dedicating funds to arresting and deporting the common illegal worker. They are currently interested in gang members and felons only.
The Chinese know that.
Is the President so retarded in his thinking and understanding of this issue that he still believes this? Or is he being disingenuous? Scary either way!
It is something that he is refusing to see the truth about.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1607447/posts
Lock and load and buy LOTS of rope.
Then we begin again.
If we really wanted to do something useful, we could replace all the illegals we can detect with guys (and women) coming out of prison after serving their time, with suitable screening to weed out the psychos. They have a helluva time finding work.
That would help address the Black unemployment problem, frankly, as most of these guys are black, and it would get the jobs done by what after all are home grown Americans. Maybe, just maybe, getting a shot at a job this way would be a good re-entry program and reduce recidivism in the bargain.
"My conclusion is based upon the unemployment numbers going down"
The phony number is down because welfare recipients are included as employed.
Worse than that the numbers are based on a telephone survey of employers.
" An illegal alien is willing to provide labor at a price lower than the price demanded by native-borns"
Thy aren't working cheaper but they are working for cash with no deductions, no comp insurance and no taxes paid.
In construction that's a savings to the employer of over 100%.
Yes, and I would like to see a return to representative federalist government also. The problem was, though, that the State legislatures were so full of corrupt A-holes that the Senate had become a joke. Now, the senate is still a joke, and state legislatures are about as trustworthy as a bunch of professional gamblers.
If we were to return to the original intent, we would also have to re-orient the voting public to the importance of the States, and get decent reps in the statehouses. Not an easy task. I live in Ohio, and frankly, if the terrorists had wiped out the statehouse and governor's mansion in Columbus on 9/11 they would have done the state a favor.
"The 'comfortable middle class' are people who don't have desires for their own private airplanes"
Not true, I desperatly want another airplane to replace the one that I totaled in Mexico.
I hear you and you are probably right, but Doug said he had information that the Border Control group was new and intended to take action.
He thought we should at least test them. He wants feedback for that reason.
I'm going to give it a try. I have asked some honchos at construction sites if all their employees had green cards. Sort of a trap waiting for the response.
I was told by one to get the F... off his job site. Another told me yes and asked me what authority I had. I told him none. He also invited me to leave.
I will have an opportunity to see what happens on May 1st. If it turns out some of them are off that day I will call.
You might read the ist thread of Doug's and see what you think.
:)Easy Does It:)
This is all you should have needed to read to know just how accurate the information is.
Revised: November, 2004
Contact us at
(c) 2004 U.S. Border Control
That is an incorrect interpretation.
It means that 3% dropped out of the labor force altogether.
They are neither "employed" nor "unemployed".
They do not have jobs, and are not looking for jobs.
Much the same as kindergardners or senior citizens living in a nursing home.
Slapping forhead.
I will still call on the guy who ran me off without answering if he has any guys gone on the ist. :)
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