Posted on 04/02/2006 7:18:53 AM PDT by TaxRelief
KINGS MOUNTAIN, N.C. --North Carolina retailers raked in an estimated $10 million Thursday, the first day of the state lottery.
But that doesn't sway Robert Arey, who has no desire to sell the tickets at the 15 convenience stores he owns in the Charlotte region. "You work for what you get," said Arey, who runs the One Stop Food Stores. "You don't win it."
Arey said he is morally opposed to the lottery, which he calls a "poor tax," and he doesn't expect his decision to cost him money.
In fact, he said, his stores in South Carolina actually saw an increase in sales when the lottery went into effect there a few years ago. He said his customers have told him how much they appreciate not having to wait in long lines behind lottery players: "'Thank you so much for not having it. We waited in one store for 15 minutes just to buy milk.'"
Arey said the lottery also isn't worth the 7 percent return in sales. The more traditional items, such as tobacco, potato chips and beverages, haul in a profit of 20 percent to 40 percent.
"We're in the convenience store business," Arey said, "and lottery is not convenient."
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Lottery sales in NC began on March 30, 2006. NC was the last state on the East Coast to get a lottery.
I stood behind an elderly lady at my local grocery store customer service counter while she bought her weekly supply of lottery tickets. I don't play the lottery and had no conception of what all the terms meant. (Box this. Split that. 50/50 something else.) It took a full 10 minutes as she checked the couple of dozen tickets one at a time.
It was frustrating to many in line and I can't imagine it made all that much money for Giant Eagle since the face values of the tickets wound up being a mere $25.
But the state of Pennsylvania is happy.
My sister once worked at such a store to pick up some extra cash and she confirmed that this was true at her store.
Yeah, that's always befuddled me, too. Why do people have to scratch off their tickets, etc, when there is a LINE. Buy the damn tickets and get the hell outta my way!
Couldn't one argue that convenience stores are themselves a "tax on the poor?"
Yet he sells cigarettes and beer. Both addictive substances.
The store owner himself is gambling through his customers. Most states give the convenience store owner a cut (1%) in his customer's winnings.
In Massachusetts, vendors earn an average of $27,027 per year on lottery sales.
My guess it's the latter. The guy did not likely get to owning 15 stores by sticking to any "principles" other than maximizing sales by giving customers what they want.
Just wait until the giant Powerball jackpots start stirring up imaginations.
I was thinking the same thing. It's fine to take a moral stand, but if he thinks alcohol and tobacco are causing less damage than lottery tickets then he's a fool.
For the record, I'm not opposed to any of them.
The ones who do that can easily be spotted sitting in their cars, with piles and piles of losing tickets littering the ground under their driver's window.
In theory, we are a "Classless" society, but I do not think this is the original meaning of the term.
MA vendors earned an average of $27,000 per store in 2004.
Lottery tickets and cigarette customers are the worst about holding up lines.
I've only bought one lottery ticket a few years ago when I was in Atlanta. It was one of those scratch-off Blackjack tickets, and I won $50, which was nice beginner's luck. :)
I've never been much for gambling anyhow.
I'm pretty sure that in California, it's 5%.
The Neighbors chain of convenience stores and gas stations in the Forsyth, Stokes, and Surry County area is not selling lottery tickets and they are proudly advertising themselves as "lottery free."
For the record, the "tax on the poor" argument is dumb.
This is not dissimilar from the fault in arguments used by fat people suing McDonald's or homosexuals demanding equal access.
These arguments dismiss the fact that behaviors are based on personal choice.
Well, since the scratch off tickets started selling here in NC I think my family has spent about $10 on tickets. Won $0.
Had two tickets sitting in my visor overnight. The kids say they will scratch off the tickets for me as long as we split 50/50. They're waiting for "the big one".
Looking at other states, and most states are only giving a 5% return on sales.
I guess it doesn't matter - the intentions of an action are only secondary to the outcome of an action.
Lotteries are a tax on people who are really bad at math.
Heard my first (annoying) radio commercial for the NC lottery this past Friday. Apparaently the target market really is very stupid. The irony is that it's called an Education lottery. Would proceeds plummet if they actually teach math more effectively?
OK.The principle outcome of his decision is that lottery tickets won't be sold at his stores.If this decision results in increased sales/profits for him (which the story seems to suggest could happen) then his motive would seem to be profit oriented.
But if this decision hurts his slays/profits,then one could argue that his motives are admirable,IMO.
I hear you. I had to wait in line for roughly ten minutes trying to pay for $10 in gas recently because some lottery-obsessed 'old bat' kept buying and scratching; completely oblivious to the ten people in line behind her.
I didn't think of it like that!!
Here in SC it's called the "Education Lottery" also. The lottery sales must be at an all time low since the state is using the profits to buy used school buses from other states. I know of NO ONE who has benefited from this scam.
Wow. Sorry for the way that post came out. I did, indeed, have paragraphs. I guess I didn't check the preview carefully.
Most of the gas stations in NC already have inadequate parking. Adding a lottery clientele has made it a little more difficult to "grab a gallon of milk" on the way home from work.
>For the record, the "tax on the poor" argument is dumb.<
For the record you have not looked at the subject if you think that.The top 10 zip codes in Ga. for purchases of lottery tickets have the fewest Hope Scholarships.The 10 zip codes with the highest # of Hope scholars are among the lowest purchasesers of Lottery ticets.
NCSteve, I saw that this morning at the Neighbors store in Lewisville, where I live, and they had the "lottery free" wording on their sign at the road (which sign will be illegal in October, due to sign size restrictions and amortization). I was kind of glad to see it. I usually pay at the pump for gas and don't go inside very often.
As for the lottery itself, I might play occasionally. I wonder if my church would accept some of my winnings to help pay off our new building loan? I suspect they would.
As for the guy who declines to sell lottery tickets but sells cigarettes and alcohol (I assume that is what he means by beverages), I have no problem with that. I don't care if he sells lottery tickets. No one is forced to buy any of them. There is no "poor tax." Taxes are mandatory, none of these purchases is. If you can't help but buy this stuff, you have no one to blame but yourself.
By the way, where in NC do you live?
On a side note, the day the lottery started one of our local affiliates played an interview by the state superintendent. Now mind you this is the day the lottery started. She stated North Carolinians needed to realize the lottery won't pay for all that is needed for education but is just a supplement. Already setting the idiots up for higher taxes
It is a tax on people to support a system that teaches evolution.
It is a tax on people who believe in very long odds improbably benefitting them to support a system that teaches that we are all the beneficiaries of incredibly longer odds.
In fact, the schools have a vested interrest in not teaching math better. If the general populace were trained in real math, understood the probabilities against winning, or understood skills that would actually benefit them in life, the lottery proceeds would plummet. The schools get more money when people do not understand math, business, are not able to be a success without hoping for a lottery win, and are buying more tickets.
NOTICE OF APPEAL IN LOTTERY CASE FILED NOTICE OF APPEAL IN LOTTERY CASE FILEDThought you might find this press release (March 29, 2006) interesting. they have not updated their website ncicl.org as of yet.
A Press Release by the North Carolina Institute for Constitutional Law
RALEIGH - The N.C. Institute for Constitutional Law, at the request of the Plaintiffs and with approval of its Board of Directors, has today filed a Notice of Appeal to the N.C. Court of Appeals from the Orders entered by Judge Henry Hight in the Lottery Act litigation. We anticipate that the N.C. Justice Center on behalf of the Plaintiffs/Intervenors may file a separate Notice of Appeal later this week. As soon as the Record on Appeal is filed, it is anticipated that a Petition for Discretionary Review will be filed on behalf of the Plaintiffs and Plaintiffs/Intervenors with the N.C. Supreme Court requesting the Court to take the case and bypass the Court of Appeals as well as to expedite the briefing and argument schedule.
"As we have indicated from the beginning of this litigation, we feel that there are vitally important constitutional questions relating to the passage of the N.C. Lottery Act that need to be resolved with finality by our state's highest court." said NCICL's Executive Director Robert Orr. "With the lottery beginning in N.C. this week, the need for the quickest possible resolution of these issues is imperative. Millions of dollars will have been taken in by the state and debts incurred by the state to pay winners, while the appeal process moves forward. The constitutional issues involved not only affect the Lottery Act but potentially impact legislative enactments in the future." he added.
"While disappointed in the Trial Court's decision, we still feel strongly about the merits of our constitutional arguments and look forward to presenting them at the appellate level." Orr said.
And yet he eventually sold his business and retired because he adamantly refused to put any video slot machines in his pub -- and was losing customers over it. I never understood how someone in that kind of business could take a moral stand on something like gambling, but I think I eventually figured it out. I suspect he wasn't opposed to gambling on truly "moral" grounds, but on the grounds that it represents a serious violation of the basic work ethic that had driven his ancestors to settle out there and earn a living the hard way. In his mind, the notion that you can get something without working for it is probably the most destructive force in the world today.
They can get a bunch from Louisiana...
RALEIGH - The NC State Lottery sales results for part of Thursday (the first day of sales) have been released.
Unofficial estimates from some elected officials put sales at $10 million with pay outs at $1,350,000 on Thursday. Other unofficial estimates put Thursday's sales at $8 million with only $110,000 in payouts.
I noticed that too. He can do what he wants, and I'll support him completely, but he should hang up the "look how superior I am" facade. And I say this as someone who thinks "Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearems" would be a great concept for a convenience store.
Neither of which are sold by the government are they? I'm against the lottery on a moral standpoint and choose not to play. I smoked for 10+ years and just up and quit one day a few months back. Even drink a beer now and again. If a private industry without government 'supervision' started up a lottery tomorrow that's their business. However when the lottery is a government sponsored grab for even more money, yes I'm against it from a moral standpoint.
How is a person standing in line to buy a pack of Marlboros any different than a person standing in line to buy a bottle of Pepsi?
Good point, but aren't there some states that are still in the alcohol business (or am I a decade or two behind)? Hell, virtually ALL states are in the tobacco business lately.
North Carolina is in the alcohol industry yes. Which it needs to get out of as well. But some states are not a part of that either.
Agreed. I call it a volunteer tax. You don't have to pay it unless you want to.
It would be nice if all our taxes were volunteer.
Actually I have looked into it quite a bit. As a former elected official, I had access to all the materials collected on the subject by both sides of the question. There is no non-anecdotal evidence to support an argument that lottery tickets are purchased by the "poor" (whatever that means) in outsized numbers. Furthermore, there is substantial evidence to suggest that among those of modest means, every dollar spent on a lottery ticket is a dollar not spent on cigarettes and beer.
All that aside, though, the argument itself is dumb because it promotes the "poor as victims" sham. It implies that the poor are unable to take care of themselves and need someone to adopt them and prevent them from doing dumb things to themselves. It is also a class warfare argument.
Now if you want to argue that the lottery is a tax on stupidity, I'll have to go along with you on that one.
I know...I'm just making the point that this guy is claiming that selling lottery tickets is immoral, but is engaged in a type of business which is not all that dissimilar.
Northwestern Stokes County. Near Pilot Mountain.
Because they can't decide which brand or type they want. Then the store doesn't carry it or the cashier can't find it. Then they change their mind. Then the cashier has to go to the back to check. Then they decide on another. Then the cashier has to dig around for a new carton from the bottom of the counter and figure out how to open it. Then they decide they'd rather have the whole carton after the cashier has pulled out one pack and has taken forever reloading the bin. Then they spy what they originally wanted. Then they have to turn the pack over 3-4 times in their hands to make sure it's... well, who knows. Then they smack it on the counter once, twice, no 3 times real fast. Then they think about opening it. Then they decide to open it. Then they shake one out and put it in their mouths. Then the cashier has to tell them they can't smoke in the store and remind them they haven't yet paid. Then....
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