Posted on 04/13/2006 8:24:36 AM PDT by Mr. Silverback
Note: This commentary was delivered by Prison Fellowship President Mark Earley.
The headlines seemed almost triumphal in tone.
“Prayer Doesn’t Aid Recovery, Study Finds.” That was the Washington Post. “Long-Awaited Medical Study Questions the Power of Prayer.” That was the New York Times.
Both papers were describing a study designed to determine the power of prayer. Not only did it show that prayer apparently makes no difference, but some prayed-for patients in the study actually fared worse than the unprayed-for ones.
The research, led by Jeffery Dusek of the Harvard Medical School, involved 1,802 heart-bypass patients. One-third were told they would be prayed for (but they weren’t), one-third were told they might receive prayer, and one-third were told they would definitely be prayed for. Catholics and Protestants who agreed to pray for certain patients were told to ask for “a successful surgery with a quick, healthy recovery and no complications.”
Patients in the two groups that did not know if anyone was praying for them had about the same rate of complications—52 percent—regardless of whether they were being prayed for. But 59 percent of the patients who knew they were being prayed for suffered complications.
The researchers were quick to downplay the unexpected results. Knowing they were being prayed for may have led to stress among patients, they noted. And as one doctor put it, “Did the patients think, ‘I am so sick they had to call in the prayer team?’”
Naturally, some observers were delighted at the results. They think the study proves conclusively that prayer doesn’t work, and it’s time for men of science to “stop dabbling in the supernatural,” as one academic put it.
But wait a minute. The researchers acknowledged that they could not control for the fact that many “unauthorized” people may have interceded for loved ones in the so-called “unprayed-for” group. And plenty of other studies indicate that intercessory prayer does have an impact.
But perhaps the study’s biggest flaw involves how the results were interpreted. Christians know that there are three possible answers to prayer: “Yes,” “no,” and “wait.” The Harvard study measured only the “yes” answers. But just because we don’t get the answer we’re looking for does not mean God is not listening or answering.
We are given a glorious example of this truth by Jesus Himself. On the night before His arrest, praying in the Garden of Gethsemane, an agonized Jesus asked God to remove the cup that was before Him. He prayed that He would not have to go to the Cross. And yet, not long afterward, Jesus did die on the Cross.
To a modern researcher, this is the perfect example of a prayer that went unanswered. But we know that God did answer this prayer. He answered it in a way that led, over the next twenty centuries, to salvation for millions. And on Easter Sunday, millions of Christians around the world will thank God for answering it the way He did.
Yes, Jesus died on the Cross. But He rose again on the third day. And thanks to that so-called “unanswered prayer,” you and I can say this Easter, “Hallelujah! Christ is risen!”
And no matter what the researchers tell us, we know we can trust God to hear, and answer, every prayer.
There are links to further information at the source document.
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While many of us believe it to be so, how would someone really know whether prayer worked?
I find it puzzling why some "academics" as they are referred to here, are so anxious to disprove the existence of a higher power.
He's not a tame lion...
"but some prayed-for patients in the study actually fared worse than the unprayed-for ones. "
Sometimes, the answer is no.
That said, I often pray for others as a way to support them and also to benefit from the prayers myself. Of course, I recognize that, being human, all my prayers are most likely for me anyway, despite my attempts to be altruistic with them.
God Bless
I believe in the original study the authors claimed that a group of Evangelical Christians tried to "Fix" the results. I was curious about that statement when I read the first article here at FR. I don't see anyhting about it in this report, which is why I read this post. I guess I need to dig a bit and find out what I really read the first time.
Catholics and Protestants who agreed to pray for certain patients were told to ask for “a successful surgery with a quick, healthy recovery and no complications.”
Why stop there? Why not give God a list of demands? Treat Him like Santa Claus at Christmas?
The Lord's prayer includes "Thy will be done." This is what Christ taught, not this divine bank hold-up used in the "study".
People want God to be Santa Claus, and prayer to work like magic - if I do this ritual, that result will happen.
But it doesn't work like that.
God is interested most in spiritual growth, and we are all the tools in his hands. The seeming no we get from one prayer may be because the caretaker needs to care for us, or because it's time to come home, or because the place we would end up is not the place that would be good for us, or for someone whose life we are going to touch.
Prayer is about relationship, and being open to God, and to sharing our cares, and connecting.
It is not, and never will be x + y = c in a way that the study they did can measure.
This article does not identify the "prayers." THe protestant group was from a Unity church, which is a generally recognized cult that does not specifically even teach in a belief of God. As a former Catholic, I'll withoold my opinion on that group as well. I would also bet that the "Prayers" were paid to pray, which kind if dilutes the fervency of said prayers.
This study was mainly by religious people. The author is a firm believer that prayer on the part of the patient is beneficial, and he works at the Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center (a combination Jewish and Methodist hospital). And two of the participating hospitals were Baptist.
I do think this controlled study gave strong evidence that third-party prayer does nothing. However, other studies do show that prayer on the part of the patient does help. On the other hand, so does meditation. It's not about a deity helping a recovery, but about the mental state of the patient. The mental state of the patient is a known factor in health care, and both prayer and meditation put the patient in a mental state that helps recovery.
So in the end, go ahead and pray. It can't hurt, but prayer on the part of the patient does help.
Simple.
Academic atheists are typically arrogant narcissists who condescendingly "speak down" to other people.
They angrily defy all things Judeo-Christian because they know they will be judged in the hereafter, but pretending it away allows their conceited shallowness to endure.
They are in for a big surprise when they die.
Every single prayer was heard and answered.
HE IS RISEN! Amen! Alive and well and living inside this humble servant, that's for sure!
The flaw in these kinds of silly studies is that the world's definition of "answered" means "yes." For the Christian with unwavering trust in God it doesn't matter what the answer IS...yes, no, wait...it is answered, regardless, because God hears and answers. And He will answer according to His own wisdom and sovereign will, not according to what we think he should do or say. Prayer is always answered in one way or another.
No, but he's good.
The Almighty is not deaf.
A friend of mine drank, alot. He told me God had saved him from drinking. I asked him how he knew God was the one responsible. He told me "Because he's the only one I asked."
"He prayed that He would not have to go to the Cross."
Okay, Mr. Mark Early. The above statement proves that you don't have a clue about much of anything.
-First and foremost, that was not what Jesus Christ was praying for, you dumbo! Get your facts straight if you are going to put things in print. He prayed, that the FATHER would not discontinue their personal relationship, while he suffered the agony of scourging and crucifixion...
Yes. The problem some people have is they ask and never hear the answer.
I KNOW prayer works. 20 years ago, I was involved in a custody fight for my sons (in the democratic peoples republic of California, where it is still almost impossible for the dad to win custody).
Through the power of my prayers and countless others, I did win custody of my children. The good lord provided me with a winning lottery scratcher ticked worth $25000.oo to continue the fight just when I was out of resources. It provided enough finances to prevail.
The day before the winning ticket, I received $16.94 from the sale of the family home, my ex got the rest of the proceeds.
If this is the case, do you believe it's possible to construct an experiment to see whether or not prayer is effective? It seems to me that no matter what happens, people who believe in prayer will believe that the prayer was answered in one way or another, those who don't won't believe it without convincing evidence of effectiveness.
Yep. But none of my Christian charity will find it's way to you...
Always.
Of course an experiment can't be conducted to gauge God. The only people who think it can be done see God as George Lucas's Force. If you truly believe He is a sentient being far beyond our understanding, how can you possibly think you could make Him do YOUR will?
One way I heard it put was: "Sometimes God says No so He can say an even greater Yes later." I know there are prayers that have been answered 'no' for me, and I am probably closer to God now than I ever would have been without that 'no.'
Ward Churchill is a perfect example of what I speak of.
Science deals with the physical world. God is Spirit. Therefore, science is not an appropriate tool with which to evaluate God's interactions with this world.
In other words, scientific experiments having to do with God are a waste of time.
*Luke 22:42
Matthew 5:22
But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, 'Raca,'* is answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell.
*'Idiot'
That's one way of looking at it. For me, it's just recognizing that whether God is Spirit or physical (as in Jesus), He is sentient. You can't look at empirical actions based on petitions with an assumed motive as the basis of a scientific experiment.
> I find it puzzling why some "academics" as they are referred to here, are so anxious to disprove the existence of a higher power.
What I find puzzling is your belief that that was their goal. Consider two possibilities:
1) The researchers find no correlation between prayer and effect. Result: Shrug.
2) Researchers find Evidence Of God. Result: Nobel prizes all 'round. Buckets of money. Scientific knowledge of a staggering order. Groupies. Some idea regarding eternal life.
Scientists are humans. The results of #2 would be more appealing than #1.
> If you truly believe He is a sentient being far beyond our understanding, how can you possibly think you could make Him do YOUR will?
A question I ask Christians all the time regardign their prayers. No good answers yet.
> Science deals with the physical world. God is Spirit. Therefore, science is not an appropriate tool with which to evaluate God's interactions with this world.
That would be true if you assumed that God has no interactions with this world... i.e. if you're a Deist. But there are relatively few of those. Far more people believe in miracles... a valid subject for scientific inquiry.
I take it from your post that you don't see the power of prayer? That wasn't my implication.
When we pray, we are ASKING God. He isn't some George Lucas Force that "partially controls our actions and also obeys our commands". A prayer is a request of a benevolent father. It's not that He doesn't know what we need--He knows everything--it's that our requesting of Him is acknowledging for our benefit the source of our succor.
To try to conduct an experiment into whether our prayers have effect by watching the outcome is folly when you consider it is up to a sentient being to choose to act according to His own Will. Just because we don't always understand His answer doesn't mean He hasn't responded.
I emphatically believe that God interacts with the world, and that he's not held captive to the natural laws he created.
That said, making him the subject of a scientific experiment just strikes me as presumptuous and inappropriate.
Had to add that.
> To try to conduct an experiment into whether our prayers have effect by watching the outcome is folly when you consider it is up to a sentient being to choose to act according to His own Will.
If that was true, it would be folly to try to apply science and statistics to the understanding of human behavior. But as we know, and as insurance companies can attest, basic science helps here.
Assume two worlds:
1) God answers some prayers but not others
2) God answers no prayers
In World 2, you'd have no distinction in results between prayer/no prayer situations, assuming you used a statistically valid sample size. In World 1, you *should* notice such a distinction, as the prayed-for group should, in principle, have at least a few "yes" hits that the un-prayed-for group wouldn't.
If in World 1 you found no distinction between prayer/no-prayer, you have a few possible explanations:
1) God does what he's gonna do regardless of prayer
2) God answers prayers sometimes, but also aided the unprayed-for group just to mess with the statistics
3) God answers prayers at such a low rate that it's statistically invisible.
If you have further alternate explanations, by all means, the floor is yours.
> making him the subject of a scientific experiment just strikes me as presumptuous and inappropriate.
Why? If God's about, and God created Man, then it is reasonable to assume that God created Man with both the ability and desire to understand his world. Science is the means by which Man has come to understand how the world works. Why would it be inappropriate for Man to try to understand God?
Assume a third world: God answers all prayers.
In this world, would it be possible for those of finite perception to second-guess the infinite? Could we possibly be able to distinguish between the "no", the "maybe" and the "no response"? Could we be sure that having something go the way we wanted was truly a "yes" answer and not just laissez-faire?
I submit to you that there is no way for the finite to put the infinite to the test. He has told us to turn to Him in prayer--and so we do. If we truly acknowledge Him in all His Glory, we will have to trust the outcome of our relationship.
Your logical stream is interrupted by your sample size. You may statistically test a hypothetical behavior based on certain stimuli to a statistically significant number of people. There is no way to make a statistical, empirical nor scientific conclusion from the actions of one being.
Time to go home. I enjoyed our discussion. Happy Easter--may the risen Christ bless you.
>Could we possibly be able to distinguish between the "no", the "maybe" and the "no response"? Could we be sure that having something go the way we wanted was truly a "yes" answer and not just laissez-faire?
We should be able to, yes. For this simple reason: those without prayers will have a recovery rate of X. Those *with* prayers should have a recovery rate of X+Y. If Y is indistinguishable from 0, then you've demonstrated that prayer is ineffective in attaining the goal of the prayer.
These experiments are not designed to see if God exists, or how tall he is or how much he weighs, but simply to see if prayer is effective in aiding heart surgery patients. Assuming 1800 patients is a statistically valid sample size... they have demonstrated that there seems to be little validity to prayers as a means to improve recovery from such surgeries.
> I submit to you that there is no way for the finite to put the infinite to the test.
This experiment showed one way to do just that.
"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways," declares the LORD."
Isaiah 55:8
I would contend God hears EVERY prayer, what He chooses to do will be His will, and not ours.
An excellent question Orion. As a Christian who prays daily, I can tell you that my prayers have little to do with asking God to bend to my will.
I trust that God knows a future that I don't have the privilege of knowing. With that in mind, my prayer is that God will, through his Holy Spirit, show me His plan and allow me to grow in understanding the why's and how's of it.
I'd gladly offer you some examples of God showing me what comes next, but I won't bother unless your interested.
"I run in the paths of your commands, for you have set my heart free." (Psalms 119:32)
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