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Pentagon/FMSO Iraq Pre-War Documents ^ | April 17 2007 | jveritas

Posted on 04/17/2006 8:40:37 AM PDT by jveritas

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To: cake_crumb
Believe me, I am not in any way eluding to the fact Saddam was not cruel and very calculating. But during his last five or more years, it appeared to some and mentioned by some of the interviewed Iraqi general officers, that he was losing it. I am not basing my statements on L/MSM but on US Army released documentation. As for the wmd programs. I have written many many times repeating various things the US military forces had found in many military bases. There is no doubt they had plans on using bio/chemical weapons on an invading force. In fact, Saddam gave the order for them to do just that.
For what reason would one have to let syringes, vials of atropine, and gas maskes lay in ammo bunkers, if they where not quickly removing binary shells and other bio/chem ordnance configurations so the stuff would not be found.
Hell. In early 2005 I believe it was, one of our Army units found and diffused a crude IED. It was a rigged binary shell, forget the caliber.
So I am in no way diminshing the idea they did not have wmds .
They had big plans to go full steam ahead and make more once the oil for food/sanctions where lifted.
301 posted on 04/18/2006 7:38:39 PM PDT by Marine_Uncle (Honor must be earned)
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To: jveritas; TheStickman

bump & a ping

302 posted on 04/18/2006 7:44:33 PM PDT by visualops ( ...Crime shouldn't pay: support LEGAL immigration...)
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To: Marine_Uncle; jveritas
If Saddam ever had it, he lost it by the time he was ten. He's a classic sociopath with homicidal tendencies, which means paranoia is a strong factor. I'm only saying he IS capable right now, today of discerning fantasy from reality. I mean that he IS competent to stand trial (that's law school talking, sorry)

Saddam was seriously into dual use tech. So he takes Tabun based pesticide (Google it; it's a German chem weapon, abandoned as a weapon for being too good) and figures if he drops undiluted pesticide on the Army of Satan outside Baghdad he can enough to make us think twice, without violating UN sanctions - after all, it's just bug spray. As for collateral damage, the outskirts of Baghdad are mostly poor, mostly Shia. We already Saddam's feelings on such masses of people. Masses can be replaced.

But most of his army are scared to death of him. They don't follow orders and say they do. They have a whole brotherhood of troops scared of Saddam, all supporting each other. Weapons are ordered to the troops but the troops don't comply. Saddam's only way of getting the guilty party is to kill his whole army. Thus herd mentality rules: there's safety in numbers, 'cause there's no way he can get us all. No doubt there was a frequent pattern of investigations and executions of alleged conspirators, while the rest of the grunts mentally wiped the sweat off their collective foreheads and breathed a sigh of relief.

He has a fanatical core of followers. Since Hitler failed him young, Saddam DID after all become a pure Stalinist. Think "Former Soviet generals" running raggedly from their second loss of the cold war. Oh yes, Saddam had fanatical followers and they didn't have to be Arab or Muslim or even Iraqi to join the club. He had a separate set of chems and possibly a nuke ( he DID deal militarily with the government of the DPRNK, we know this for fact; he'd buy one first, build his own later ) to threaten his neighbors with for after all the sanctions were gone because he had complied with the inspectors.

Saddam has no patience. He's a megalomaniac. He wants to be billed as the second coming of Nebuchadnezzar, who ruled WAY before Muhammad was a twinkle in his father's eye. HOWEVER he is devious. He is intelligent. In fact, I would like to play chess against him. Anyhow, his impatience is his weak point and that is the only thing that got him into consistent trouble.

However, never underestimate his native intelligence or cunning, NOR that of his followers whether they are Are Arabs or even Iraqis.

Jveritas has given us the tip of the iceberg. It will take years to reveal. When that happens, it will be massive enough (especially when you consider the whole of Asia and most of EUrope will be involved, just like blood for oil vouchers) that the oil for food scam will be lost in it's shadow.

You opened a can of worms, Joseph. I helped do that with blood for oil vouchers, including carefully worded letters to members of the media, saying the exact opposite of what was actually true in order to get them to read them verbatim or make the intellectual leap into Paranoia Land that would clue them that this sucker had legs. Either way, beyond Fox, blood for oil vouchers has gotten little press in the mass media. Just goes to show it AIN'T about the public's "right to know" after all.

I do not envy you your task, but I salute you and support your dedication. I wish my grasp of Arabic was up to helping you, but I never got much beyond pidgin.

I have to get up in four hours. Good night all.

303 posted on 04/18/2006 8:28:26 PM PDT by cake_crumb (Leftist Credo: One Wing to Rule them All and to the Darkside Bind them)
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To: cake_crumb
" I have to get up in four hours. Good night all."
Good writeing. I used similiar words way back to describe the Butcher of Baghdad. Like you I started with age 10. The rest of the years Satan worked him like a fiddle. Perhaps my using the noun fatasy was misleading to some extent.
Do not feel obligated to respond. We are basically on the same wave lengths concerning Saddam.
304 posted on 04/18/2006 8:55:00 PM PDT by Marine_Uncle (Honor must be earned)
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To: jveritas
In the Name of God the Merciful The Compassionate

Maybe Muslims who compliment their Allah with the characteristics of "Mercy" and "Compassion" could find a way to incorporate these attributes, and make themselves Merciful and Compassionate.....

305 posted on 04/18/2006 10:47:41 PM PDT by vrtom (Just an observer of the political scene, learning what I can.)
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To: jeffers; All
A good gentleman sent me an e-mail from Collin Powell presentation to the UN back in February 2003 where there is a picture that shows similar type of transportation vehicles (35 tons loads) appearing in a suspected Chemical Site AL Mussayeb (or AL Musayyib) that was also mentioned in this top secret memo.

Mr. JT, thank you for the information.

306 posted on 04/19/2006 5:50:42 AM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: jveritas

Those trucks stick out a sore thumb. Hard to miss.

307 posted on 04/19/2006 4:03:07 PM PDT by jeffers
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To: jveritas
In the Name of God the Merciful The Compassionate

Strange preamble for a military document in a "secular" country, that would have nothing to do with the likes of the fundamentalist Jihadies, isn't it?

308 posted on 04/19/2006 6:57:23 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: jveritas
I am not forwarding my translations to any intelligence government agency. Do you think they will consider it seriously?

I'd be sending your translations back to the Foreign Military Studies Office / Joint Reserve Intelligence Center folks. But you might have to somehow establish to them who you are, why you are doing the translations, etc. Although a sample of the juicer parts, along with your translation of them, would go a long way to convincing them you are "for real".

309 posted on 04/19/2006 7:26:17 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: El Gato

Thank you very much, I greatly appreciate this.

310 posted on 04/19/2006 7:32:00 PM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: BagCamAddict
Start by asking for the duty officer... tell them who you are and what you're doing and ask to be assigned to an Agent who is working on this stuff. They will check you and your background out to see if you're legitimate, etc. You should also check out the Agent they assign to you, to make sure it's not a Junior Agent who has no standing... make sure you get a good Agent who (a) takes you seriously, (b) has some standing/power in the agency, (c) can put you on the payroll, and (d) can offer you protection when/if that becomes necessary.

It may not work quite that way. Remember this website with the documents is run by the Joint Reserve Intelligence Center. There may or may not be any full time staff. I was in the Air Force Reserve Intelligence Force (actually call Air Reserve Intelligence Forces at the time), we had no full time staff, just a bunch of guys working weekends. (Mostly). I noticed on their website a form for reservists involving "virtual" or "distance" participation. That probably means the guys (and gals, one of ours is pinning on her second star later this month) don't travel to Ft. Leavenworth or even to any Army post, but simply analyze stuff from home. Or if they need to see classified stuff, then they'd have to arrange for some "host unit" to loan them their facilities on the weekend, which is the way our detachment worked. Still jveritas should be able to get in touch with someone. I suspect the JRIC has some full time staff, or at least someone who does his "drills" and "active duty training" at Ft. Leavenworth and at least answers the mail (or the email).

311 posted on 04/19/2006 7:44:23 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: RayRobisonblog
but many names don't have a common spelling even though many linguists use a common arabic dictionary.

Of course not, names generally aren't in the dictionary. Unless the name actually means something, like Bush for instance, it has to be transliterated, not translated. Clearly the names are not being translated, or they'd turn out as common nouns in English, like "Smith", which is a trade or the common noun for one who practices that trade. Or Driver, Weaver, Fisher, etc. When you transliterate, particularly into English pronunciations, there is generally no unique transliteration of the sounds. For example if someone's name sounded like school, it might be transliterated that way, or as Skul, or Schul, or well you get the idea. The phonemes of Arabic aren't even the same as English phonemes, adding to the possibilities for different transliterations. (a phoneme the smallest meaningful psychological unit of sound.).

312 posted on 04/19/2006 8:03:40 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: Eastbound
I'm sure. But they may not have believed that at that stage of planning.

They knew, they had to know. They'd mostly been under a "no fly" zone (two actually) for a decade. They knew, as much as we'd let them, how long it took before their aircraft would be intercepted. Not very long, and much shorter when a larger fighter force was airborne than during the no fly zone enforcement period. AWACS sees dang near everything that's up over the battlefield, and it talks to fighters.

313 posted on 04/19/2006 8:55:52 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: El Gato

Yes, IIRC, we chased a few of their planes into Iran moments after they took off during GWI.

314 posted on 04/20/2006 8:15:09 AM PDT by Eastbound
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To: jveritas
Dubyah should have a press pack put together and release it to the media on this. Just like to see who would print!
315 posted on 04/21/2006 6:08:05 AM PDT by Candor7 (Into Liberal Flatulence Goes the Hope of the West)
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To: All
After I further reviewed in “great and meticulous details” the whole 262 pages of document ISGP-2003-0001498 , there is a great possibility that the ammunition transfer in this 9 pages top secret memo was not of Chemical Weapons but rather regular ammunition. In fact the wording of Arabic “Al AA’TEEDA AL KHASA BEE MAJOMOOAT MAKHAZAN EETAD AL NAJAJ” can be interpreted as “Ammunitions Specialized to Al Najaf ammunition depots group” or as “ Special Ammunitions in the Al Najaf ammunitions depot group”.

Based on this and due to the lack of further and stronger evidence in the 262 pages document that support the theory of Transfer of Special Ammunition (or Chemical Weapons), and because we need to maintain the credibility of the translation and FR, I would like to ask the Admin Moderator to retrieve this thread from FR files.

I apologize for any problems I have caused.

316 posted on 04/25/2006 7:09:19 AM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: Danae


like fauxNEWS cares!

317 posted on 04/26/2006 2:30:56 PM PDT by fhlh (Polls are for Strippers.)
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