NoSpace.com for Kids

FamilySecurityMatters.com ^ | 4/20/06 | Susan Konig

[wagglebee]

My daughter wants a screen name. She says she needs to instant message her friends.

 

First of all, she’s only eleven. She doesn’t need to instant anything to anyone.

 

Secondly, she doesn’t have a computer. I’m the one who has a computer and I need it for work and the kids already think it’s ridiculous that I have 334 messages in my inbox and we don’t really have time for others tying up the computer.

 

And the one time I let the kids download a game from some kid friendly

cartoon online site, my hard drive crashed. It may have been a coincidence but I can’t afford that kind of technical aggravation.

 

Here’s the other thing: what are kids going to IM each other for?

 

I think I know what it is. With the Internet, kids can reach out to each other at any time and have a private conversation without being overheard. It’s the trend. It’s cool and everyone’s doing it. She feels left out. She even got her friends to ask me.

 

“We all have instant messaging, Mrs. Konig,” they said in a sincere way.

 

“But she doesn’t need it.”

 

“But we like to talk to her.”

 

“Well, here she is, so talk away.”

 

“But when we’re not together, we can still talk to each other online.”

 

“She has permission to use the telephone. You can call our house at any reasonable hour.”

 

“But IMing is fun.”

 

And my daughter feels she is missing on the fun.

 

But it’s also on the Internet and the Internet is not a kids’ play space. It is everything in the world accessible to anyone who touches the keyboard right in one’s very own home. As Fr. Dunn, the priest at our church and school, told parents on Back-to-School night, “Parents who allow their child to have a high-speed internet connection in the bedroom or on the cell phone would save the family money if they just gave the kid $100 and sent them to Bangkok for two weeks. You can quote me on that.”

 

He’s right. In the simple course of searching the Internet for a project I was working on about young girls, the amount of pornographic materials I came across was mind boggling.

 

Already there are problems amongst my daughter’s group of classmates. People with unfamiliar screen names are IMing her friends and saying mean things. Girls are freaking out. It’s probably the boys in the class playing a joke but, with the Internet, you just don’t know.

 

Whenever I tell my daughter she can’t do something, she takes it to heart, as if it is a shortcoming of hers, a lack of faith on my part in her abilities to make the right choices, do the proper thing.

 

It’s hard for kids to wrap their minds around the fact that there are predators out there, that the Internet is not a safe place for children to go unattended. With the vast number of educational resources and game/fun sites to visit, they can’t understand that there are limitless ways to get in trouble.

 

With all the spam blockers and virus software I’ve invested in, my spam file is still full of gross messages. I wouldn’t want my kids to glimpse the subject lines. Even when a friend or relative sends a funny web site of talking dogs or singing cars they think the kids might enjoy, we have to be careful that the site doesn’t also feature inappropriate material, which it usually does.

 

And last week, MySpace.com, the Internet social networking site with 65 million members worldwide, hired a security expert to make it safer for kids. News Corp., which owns the site, hired Hemanshu Nigam, who was the director of consumer security outreach and child safe computing at the Microsoft Corporation, to oversee safety on the site that has a reputation as a place where sexual predators prowl.

 

Nigam was also a federal prosecutor against Internet child exploitation for the U.S. Department of Justice, an adviser to a Congressional commission on online child safety, and an adviser to the White House on cyber stalking, according to the New York Times.

 

The principal of our parochial school, which only goes up to eighth grade, sent a letter home warning us about myspace.com and warning parents not to allow children to post their personal information there.

 

I signed on to see what the teens who post on MySpace are up to. I picked a young college student at random and immediately found offensive images and language on her site.

 

News Corp. announced it will also launch an advertising campaign, with the Advertising Council and the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, to educate parents and young people about Internet safety. The AdCouncil, the nonprofit group behind the "A Mind Is a Terrible Thing to Waste" advertising campaign, will partner with New Corp. to run public service announcements. The spots will caution young people to be more skeptical of strangers who approach them online, the Times reported.

 

What ever happened to don’t talk to strangers, period.

[wagglebee]

What ever happened to don’t talk to strangers, period.

Excellent advice!

[wagglebee]

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DISCUSSION ABOUT:

"NoSpace.com for Kids"

This is a great commentary on keeping children safe from predators on the internet.

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[lesser_satan]

Good article.

I find it amazing that so many parents won't even let their kids leave the house unsupervised, but will let them access god-knows-what online with no supervision.

[King Prout]

But it’s also on the Internet and the Internet is not a kids’ play space. It is everything in the world accessible to anyone who touches the keyboard right in one’s very own home. As Fr. Dunn, the priest at our church and school, told parents on Back-to-School night, “Parents who allow their child to have a high-speed internet connection in the bedroom or on the cell phone would save the family money if they just gave the kid $100 and sent them to Bangkok for two weeks. You can quote me on that.”

Father Dunn has a brain.

[Knitting A Conundrum]

And this is why my kid wasn't allowed an internet connection of his own. Still ended up with a myspace account, but not because I let him. He did it at friends' houses. Sigh. But at least it wasn't as convenient.

[King Prout]

I have recently become aware of MySpace.
I have not formed a favorable impression of it.

[dawn53]

Friend's house, library, school...kids will get on the internet.

IMHO, the best way to deal with it is to talk straight to them about what is on the internet, what sites not to visit, and what not to post and why.

We actually solved the problem of wanting to be connected to friends by allowing our son to set up his own website and forum so his friends can communicate with each other that way (he was about 14 at the time.) The kids seem to enjoy it, we monitored the site...He's lost interest now (due to a busy schedule) but we maintain the site and the kids that belong are amazing. Those that have been made moderators "police" the others for language and content.

[Lizavetta]

Whenever I tell my daughter she can’t do something, she takes it to heart, as if it is a shortcoming of hers, a lack of faith on my part in her abilities to make the right choices, do the proper thing.

I doubt it's that complicated, honey.

She wants what she wants when she wants it......just like all other kids in our universe.

And why are kids so desperate to be connected and talking to one another all the time? Shaddup already and go read a book.

[MitchellC]

Good call by the mother. Browse Myspace and you'll see that most of the girls use it to get attention by dressing/posing like sluts for strangers.

[jamaly]

Bump for later.

[Knitting A Conundrum]

My boy has pushed the limits alot...sigh. He's starting to grow up now, but its been a hard row to hoe.

[wagglebee]

Browse Myspace and you'll see that most of the girls use it to get attention by dressing/posing like sluts for strangers.

From what I've seen most parents don't seem to mind if their daughters go out in public dressed like sluts either.

[JLS]

Do you similarly not have a phone or don't let your kids talk on the phone? Computers are just like any technology. They can be used for good, saving your life in an emergency or reading FR, or for ill wasting time. Of course if it is a business computer, then you certainly have good reason to not let your kids use yours.

So I certainly would not try to tell you how to run your family. Some people do not let their kids talk on the phone or do not let their kids watch tv. But some people are also intimidated by technology and use protecting the kids as an excuse to avoid technology that comes along when they are adults but readily accept the tech from their youth?

[theFIRMbss]

>First of all, she’s only eleven. She doesn’t need to instant anything to anyone.

This is a parent
without a clue to the world
their daughter lives in.

[dawn53]

Yeah, they do that...stand your ground.

Mine is coming out the other end (just turned 18) and things have gotten a lot easier, so hang in there...they do grow up and it's worth the struggle.

[Knitting A Conundrum]

Me either, but it's typical teenageness...lots of talk about stuff teens are focused on. Wouldn't be so bad if they could keep the grownup predators out. Still, it's like high school....not enough positive adult interaction, too many kids with too much time on their hands. They tend to experiment with the dark.

I'm not approving, mind you. If it were my decision, we would eliminate co-ed high schools, send many, if not most kids out into old style apprenticeships where they learn on the job and have a lot of adult interaction, and outlaw a lot of what passes for entertainment suitable for young people.

I'm not in control, so that won't happen. Life goes on.

[wagglebee]

So, I take it you're in favor of letting children post all sorts of personal information on the internet even if this makes them prey for perverts?

I have no problem with children using the internet, but I think that parents also have an obligation to supervise their children.

[bondjamesbond]

As Fr. Dunn, the priest at our church and school, told parents on Back-to-School night, “Parents who allow their child to have a high-speed internet connection in the bedroom or on the cell phone would save the family money if they just gave the kid $100 and sent them to Bangkok for two weeks. You can quote me on that.”

It's obviously been a while since Father Dunn hung out in the brothels of Bangkok...(ha ha!)

Better give Junior $1000.

[wagglebee]

So your advice to parents is to allow their children unlimited freedom to do "what everyone else is doing"?

[RHINO369]

I wouldn't let my young daughter (if i had one) go on the internet by herself and I'm just about the most secularized pro technology person around.

I was around 12 when my family got a internet connection (1997) and man there was a ton of stuff you could do to get into trouble on there back then. Now add in the fact that everyone has a digital camera and highspeed connection. So you could end up finding your daughters privates on myspace, and then you'd have to kill yourself. Or she could run off with some pervert she met online.

I think the best way of doing it is having a family computer and telling your kids that you can see everything they do on there.

[King Prout]

I think you miss the gist: Fr. Dunn is suggesting that the child would be USED in a brothel in Bangkok, not be a customer.

[Knitting A Conundrum]

Mine turns 18 in July. He's my stepson, and I love him to death, but it's not been easy. He was traumatized at 8 when his mom and sister died in an auto accident that he witnessed, and he carries a lot of guilt, so he's not had an average coming of age experience.

I come from a family of late bloomers, so I am not in panic mode. But oh, it's been a hard three or four years.

[maxwell]

I have not formed a favorable impression of it.

Been hearing all the hooplah about it, so just now checked it out. Biggest load of juvenile crap I have seen in a while.

[Knitting A Conundrum]

By the time some of us get through paying court fines and time spent on various treatments for dealing with adolescent angst and its side effects on us, we probably could have sent them to Bangkok...more than once!

[Amelia]

I don't think I'd trust "net nanny" software either. We have it at school, and the only people who don't know how to bypass it are the teachers.

[King Prout]

I am FAR from a prude, but I confess I find myself appalled by what passes for "normal" social interaction on MySpace... and elsewhere.

[King Prout]

I had a profile up for about a week before I chucked it.
In that short time:
-I received no less than a dozen "friend invitations" from what appear to be prostitutes within 250 miles of my stated location
-I received multiple nearlty identical scam messages from (supposedly) various people claiming to be young American women trapped in Africa
-I was witness to a broad range of remarkably lewd interchange among teens and "mature" adults
-etc...

"grotesque" and "decadent" come to mind as apt descriptors.

[Tanniker Smith]

It aint like in the old days where if I wanted to talk to a dozen kids at the same time while they all carried on their own conversations and people only half-paid attention to each other, I just went outside. There were 30-40 plus kids of all ages just on the one block, many of them outside at one part of the afternoon or another.

Not as many kids on my current block. And they all stay in their backyards.

[Geritol]

I hated highschool, and I would never again willingly submit to that structure again.

At work, I have never had the need to sit for 6 hours among 30 15 year olds. Instead, I have needed to interract with adults.

Even teachers who need to sit in front of 30 15 year olds have a totally different relationship, and need to know how to interract with the system and adult coworkers instead of being in the "peer group" of the kids.

Most of adult life requires the ability to work with adults and dependant children, not angsty teenagers as one of them. Most social structures that isolate kids from adult interraction and supervision are counterproductive to a long and successful life.

[mtbopfuyn]

I disagree with the article and wonder if the author really has a child since so much doesn't ring true. Letting the child talk on the phone is not that much different than IM. If a parent really wants an eye opener, record phone calls. Most ISP's have their own spam blocking software or the author can download any of a number of free online blockers or invest in some reliable blocking software. There's no reason for her to have 300 porn messages unless she's been visiting those sites. Sure, a few get past the blocks, but not 300 daily.

And who in their right mind would ever put a computer in a kid's room? Put the thing out in the middle of the family room for everyone to see. If she's that worried, check the history or if she suspects her kid is too smart for that, put on some software that logs every keystroke. We have that software and the kids are fine with it because their friends' parents monitor them, too. No, mine have no desire to get onto MySpace.com, but if they did, they know we'd know about it.

I find it hard to believe an 11 year old isn't being required to do school work using the internet. What, has this parent signed the paperwork for school stating her child is not to go near the school's computers? I doubt it, which is why I'm not believing a word of the article.

[HEY4QDEMS]

My Daughter has a MySpace account under the rules that my wife and I have access to her ID and password and we don't care that she is 18 years old.

65 million members is like having the population of France logging in.

[XR7]

I find it hard to believe an 11 year old isn't being required to do school work using the internet.

Believe it or not, some schools (mostly parochial) still have teachers and books.

[VictoryGal]

In a house with kids, all computers need to be in family-common areas.

[VictoryGal]

Um, you do realize she could get another account very easily, one you don't have access to?

[HEY4QDEMS]

Yes I do, but so far she has done nothing in her life to give us reason not to trust her.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

Whatever happened to parental responsibility? Lady, POLICE your child's Internet habits, OK?

[JLS]

So, I take it you're in favor of letting children post all sorts of personal information on the internet even if this makes them prey for perverts?
_________________________________________________________

I see you are willing to jump to conclusion about me too. I was very careful to say that I would not tell anyone how to conduct their family, but that people should be sure it is not fear of a new technogoly that causes them treat the internet differently than TV and telephones two older technologies that can equally get your child in trouble or help them out.

[KoRn]

"I have not formed a favorable impression of it.

Really its nothing more than a personal page, similar to a FR homepage, someone can get if they sign up. You can change your personal page any way you like and others can access it. I started one myself a long time ago after I first heard of it and never went back to it lol.

[King Prout]

read on - I gave thereasons for my disfavor a little later on

[JLS]

Now add in the fact that everyone has a digital camera and highspeed connection. So you could end up finding your daughters privates on myspace,
_______________________________


Actually, that everyone has a digital camera means anyones privates could endup on the internet someplace whether or not they ever are on the internet themselves.

_________________________________
and then you'd have to kill yourself.
___________________________________

Of course I would not have to kill myself and I am not 22 and tried hard to teach my daughter to that if she embarrasses herself she does not need to kill herself, but would have to face the music.

___________________________

Or she could run off with some pervert she met online.
________________________________

And she could run off with some pervert she met at church.

The fact that everyone else has a computer means anyones kid likely will be surfing the web. Do you want them to do that at home, friends houses or the library? I favor the people here who supervise their kids on the internet over the approach of washing ones hands and pretending that since it did not happen at my house it is not my fault if my kid gets into trouble on the internet

[KoRn]

Interesting. I dug out the URL and went back to the one I setup. I had allot of the same thing. Lots of 'friend' invites from some weird characters, and I never did anything to make anyone want to be my 'friend' lol. I didn't even put up any pictures, just some text. I wonder where that comes from, it seems to be like spam in email in how generic it is just to get anyone to follow up and reply.

Makes me wonder if someone has a bot of some type in place to send out mass 'friend' invites to see who they get to bite.

[WalterSkinner]

..MySpace has an addictive quality about it. We see students who would spend an entire day on it if they were allowed--and this is a college!

The Dean is just about to block it on campus--then watch fur fly...

[RHINO369]

"The fact that everyone else has a computer means anyones kid likely will be surfing the web. Do you want them to do that at home, friends houses or the library? I favor the people here who supervise their kids on the internet over the approach of washing ones hands and pretending that since it did not happen at my house it is not my fault if my kid gets into trouble on the internet"

Oh I agree, I was making the case for not allowing a young child to have her own internent connection on her own computer. But I gotta stand by the fact that if I had a daughter and I saw her naked on the internet I'd immediatly kill myself.

[Knitting A Conundrum]

You would be amazed what teens consider normal behavior nowadays, I suspect...when the adults aren't looking.

What a sick society we have created...

[rzeznikj at stout]

Something that definitely bears repeating.

Unfortunately on college campuses, that isn't emphasized enough these days...

[rzeznikj at stout]

I'm in absolute agreement here.

There is a subtle reason why I don't use Myspace, Facebook, AIM, etc.

I may be in the extreme minority, but with all the stalking and all the perversity going on, no thanks.

Also, there is also a lot of peer pressure to partake in these (and I can personally attest)--and unfortunately, most teens and college kids who use them haven't thought about the ramifications of using these, er, services.

[GrandEagle]

"The Net" is a very dangerous place for kids.
We use BESAFE internet filter and have been very happy with it so far. We also keep the Internet connected computer in the living room in full view of everyone.
Both of my daughters have an e-mail account but can only receive emails from a list that I manage. I also keep a copy of all emails on the email server which I review daily. So far they have not received any spam or anything objectionable.
I also track all websites visited.
So far it works well for us.

Cordially,
GE

[Old Student]

"I disagree with the article and wonder if the author really has a child since so much doesn't ring true. Letting the child talk on the phone is not that much different than IM. If a parent really wants an eye opener, record phone calls. Most ISP's have their own spam blocking software or the author can download any of a number of free online blockers or invest in some reliable blocking software. There's no reason for her to have 300 porn messages unless she's been visiting those sites. Sure, a few get past the blocks, but not 300 daily."


Letting a child talk on the phone is hardly like letting them IM unless you also allow them to set up conference calls. Keeping the phone in the public area of the house is the equivalent of having the computer(s) in the public area. That is a good idea. There is no such thing as reliable spam blocking software, as far as I can tell. Some things work better than others, and most can be fine-tuned to be reasonably good, but few parents have the tech skills to do such things, and most really don't have the time to learn how. (I would count myself among that number, for that matter, and I've been playing with computers since '75 or '76...) As far as the number of porn emails she receives, that would be a function of someone visiting those sites, but the parent isn't necessarily the one doing it. I usually get 5-30 a day; most of them get filtered, but not all, by my ISP. I NEVER visit such sites, but the university I attend doesn't seem to clue their secretaries and such in how to do a blind-carbon-copy; I constantly get email from OU addressed to everyone in the Graduate College, with a page or more of clear email addresses. Not to mention a few cousins and other relatives who do similar silly things.

I kind of believe the rest of the article. My school has ancient IMacs, 128Mhz machines. The one I got at a thrift store for $76 is a 500Mhz machine... They may get to upgrade the computer lab sometime before I retire, and I was hired the beginning of this year. It's not much use to have a kid try to do Internet research there. I'm doing it anyway because we don't have anything better, and they need SOME such skills. Most don't have computers at home, either. (Low SES area.)

Other than that, I think you're right about how to deal with the stuff at home.

[Maurice Tift]

Here’s the other thing: what are kids going to IM each other for?

Petey is online - Mikey is online

Mikey: Hey Petey! What you doing?

Petey: I dunno! What you doing?

Mikey: What's going on over there?!

Petey: I dunno! What are you doing over there??

...
Mikey and Petey - two 8 year olds living next door in the 21st century

[MineralMan]

"Oh I agree, I was making the case for not allowing a young child to have her own internent connection on her own computer. But I gotta stand by the fact that if I had a daughter and I saw her naked on the internet I'd immediatly kill myself.
"

You're awfully young to be making that kind of statement, it seems to me. I don't know if you're male or female, but I'm guessing you've seen someone's daughter or son naked, without the benefit of marriage. Should that person's parents kill themselves?

Here's the deal about teenagers: They do stupid things. Those stupid things are part of the inexperience and stupidity of youth in general. Somehow, they survive them, though, almost always.

If you have a daughter someday, she will be an adolescent girl someday. She, like most teenagers, will do stupid things, and that could easily include being naked on the internet. You won't kill yourself if that happens, I promise you.