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NJ Bill To Ban More Rifles as "Assault Rifles" (My Title)
New Jersey State Assembly ^ | JANUARY 30, 2006 | Reed Guiscora

Posted on 04/24/2006 7:00:37 AM PDT by ZULU

ASSEMBLY, No. 2185 STATE OF NEW JERSEY 212th LEGISLATURE

INTRODUCED JANUARY 30, 2006

Sponsored by: Assemblyman REED GUSCIORA District 15 (Mercer)

SYNOPSIS Revises criteria for determining whether a rifle is an assault firearm.

CURRENT VERSION OF TEXT As introduced.

AN ACT concerning assault firearms and amending N.J.S.2C:39-1.

BE IT ENACTED by the Senate and General Assembly of the State of New Jersey:

1. N.J.S.2C:39-1 is amended to read as follows: 2C:39-1. Definitions. The following definitions apply to this chapter and to chapter 58: a. "Antique firearm" means any rifle or shotgun and "antique cannon" means a destructive device defined in paragraph (3) of subsection c. of this section, if the rifle, shotgun or destructive device, as the case may be, is incapable of being fired or discharged, or which does not fire fixed ammunition, regardless of date of manufacture, or was manufactured before 1898 for which cartridge ammunition is not commercially available, and is possessed as a curiosity or ornament or for its historical significance or value. b. "Deface" means to remove, deface, cover, alter or destroy the name of the maker, model designation, manufacturer's serial number or any other distinguishing identification mark or number on any firearm. c. "Destructive device" means any device, instrument or object designed to explode or produce uncontrolled combustion, including (1) any explosive or incendiary bomb, mine or grenade; (2) any rocket having a propellant charge of more than four ounces or any missile having an explosive or incendiary charge of more than one-quarter of an ounce; (3) any weapon capable of firing a projectile of a caliber greater than 60 caliber, except a shotgun or shotgun ammunition generally recognized as suitable for sporting purposes; (4) any Molotov cocktail or other device consisting of a breakable container containing flammable liquid and having a wick or similar device capable of being ignited. The term does not include any device manufactured for the purpose of illumination, distress signaling, line-throwing, safety or similar purposes. d. "Dispose of" means to give, give away, lease, loan, keep for sale, offer, offer for sale, sell, transfer, or otherwise transfer possession. e. "Explosive" means any chemical compound or mixture that is commonly used or is possessed for the purpose of producing an explosion and which contains any oxidizing and combustible materials or other ingredients in such proportions, quantities or packing that an ignition by fire, by friction, by concussion or by detonation of any part of the compound or mixture may cause such a sudden generation of highly heated gases that the resultant gaseous pressures are capable of producing destructive effects on contiguous objects. The term shall not include small arms ammunition, or explosives in the form prescribed by the official United States Pharmacopoeia. f. "Firearm" means any handgun, rifle, shotgun, machine gun, automatic or semi-automatic rifle, or any gun, device or instrument in the nature of a weapon from which may be fired or ejected any solid projectable ball, slug, pellet, missile or bullet, or any gas, vapor or other noxious thing, by means of a cartridge or shell or by the action of an explosive or the igniting of flammable or explosive substances. It shall also include, without limitation, any firearm which is in the nature of an air gun, spring gun or pistol or other weapon of a similar nature in which the propelling force is a spring, elastic band, carbon dioxide, compressed or other gas or vapor, air or compressed air, or is ignited by compressed air, and ejecting a bullet or missile smaller than three-eighths of an inch in diameter, with sufficient force to injure a person. g. "Firearm silencer" means any instrument, attachment, weapon or appliance for causing the firing of any gun, revolver, pistol or other firearm to be silent, or intended to lessen or muffle the noise of the firing of any gun, revolver, pistol or other firearm. h. "Gravity knife" means any knife which has a blade which is released from the handle or sheath thereof by the force of gravity or the application of centrifugal force. i. "Machine gun" means any firearm, mechanism or instrument not requiring that the trigger be pressed for each shot and having a reservoir, belt or other means of storing and carrying ammunition which can be loaded into the firearm, mechanism or instrument and fired therefrom. j. "Manufacturer" means any person who receives or obtains raw materials or parts and processes them into firearms or finished parts of firearms, except a person who exclusively processes grips, stocks and other nonmetal parts of firearms. The term does not include a person who repairs existing firearms or receives new and used raw materials or parts solely for the repair of existing firearms. k. "Handgun" means any pistol, revolver or other firearm originally designed or manufactured to be fired by the use of a single hand. l. "Retail dealer" means any person including a gunsmith, except a manufacturer or a wholesale dealer, who sells, transfers or assigns for a fee or profit any firearm or parts of firearms or ammunition which he has purchased or obtained with the intention, or for the purpose, of reselling or reassigning to persons who are reasonably understood to be the ultimate consumers, and includes any person who is engaged in the business of repairing firearms or who sells any firearm to satisfy a debt secured by the pledge of a firearm. m. "Rifle" means any firearm designed to be fired from the shoulder and using the energy of the explosive in a fixed metallic cartridge to fire a single projectile through a rifled bore for each single pull of the trigger. n. "Shotgun" means any firearm designed to be fired from the shoulder and using the energy of the explosive in a fixed shotgun shell to fire through a smooth bore either a number of ball shots or a single projectile for each pull of the trigger, or any firearm designed to be fired from the shoulder which does not fire fixed ammunition. o. "Sawed-off shotgun" means any shotgun having a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length measured from the breech to the muzzle, or a rifle having a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length measured from the breech to the muzzle, or any firearm made from a rifle or a shotgun, whether by alteration, or otherwise, if such firearm as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches. p. "Switchblade knife" means any knife or similar device which has a blade which opens automatically by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in the handle of the knife. q. "Superintendent" means the Superintendent of the State Police. r. "Weapon" means anything readily capable of lethal use or of inflicting serious bodily injury. The term includes, but is not limited to, all (1) firearms, even though not loaded or lacking a clip or other component to render them immediately operable; (2) components which can be readily assembled into a weapon; (3) gravity knives, switchblade knives, daggers, dirks, stilettos, or other dangerous knives, billies, blackjacks, bludgeons, metal knuckles, sandclubs, slingshots, cesti or similar leather bands studded with metal filings or razor blades imbedded in wood; and (4) stun guns; and any weapon or other device which projects, releases, or emits tear gas or any other substance intended to produce temporary physical discomfort or permanent injury through being vaporized or otherwise dispensed in the air. s. "Wholesale dealer" means any person, except a manufacturer, who sells, transfers, or assigns firearms, or parts of firearms, to persons who are reasonably understood not to be the ultimate consumers, and includes persons who receive finished parts of firearms and assemble them into completed or partially completed firearms, in furtherance of such purpose, except that it shall not include those persons dealing exclusively in grips, stocks and other nonmetal parts of firearms. t. "Stun gun" means any weapon or other device which emits an electrical charge or current intended to temporarily or permanently disable a person. u. "Ballistic knife" means any weapon or other device capable of lethal use and which can propel a knife blade. v. "Imitation firearm" means an object or device reasonably capable of being mistaken for a firearm. w. "Assault firearm" means: (1) The following firearms: Algimec AGM1 type Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder such as the "Street Sweeper" or "Striker 12" Armalite AR-180 type Australian Automatic Arms SAR Avtomat Kalashnikov type semi-automatic firearms Beretta AR-70 and BM59 semi-automatic firearms Bushmaster Assault Rifle Calico M-900 Assault carbine and M-900 CETME G3 Chartered Industries of Singapore SR-88 type Colt AR-15 and CAR-15 series Daewoo K-1, K-2, Max 1 and Max 2, AR 100 types Demro TAC-1 carbine type Encom MP-9 and MP-45 carbine types FAMAS MAS223 types FN-FAL, FN-LAR, or FN-FNC type semi-automatic firearms Franchi SPAS 12 and LAW 12 shotguns G3SA type Galil type Heckler and Koch HK91, HK93, HK94, MP5, PSG-1 Intratec TEC 9 and 22 semi-automatic firearms M1 carbine type M14S type MAC 10, MAC 11, MAC 11-9mm carbine type firearms PJK M-68 carbine type Plainfield Machine Company Carbine Ruger K-Mini-14/5F and Mini-14/5RF SIG AMT, SIG 550SP, SIG 551SP, SIG PE-57 types SKS with detachable magazine type Spectre Auto carbine type Springfield Armory BM59 and SAR-48 type Sterling MK-6, MK-7 and SAR types Steyr A.U.G. semi-automatic firearms USAS 12 semi-automatic type shotgun Uzi type semi-automatic firearms Valmet M62, M71S, M76, or M78 type semi-automatic firearms Weaver Arm Nighthawk. (2) Any firearm manufactured under any designation which is substantially identical to any of the firearms listed above. (3) A semi-automatic shotgun with either a magazine capacity exceeding six rounds, a pistol grip, or a folding stock. (4) A semi-automatic rifle with a fixed magazine capacity exceeding 15 rounds. (5) A part or combination of parts designed or intended to convert a firearm into an assault firearm, or any combination of parts from which an assault firearm may be readily assembled if those parts are in the possession or under the control of the same person. (6) A semi-automatic rifle that has the capability of accepting a detachable magazine and has at least one of the following configurations: (a) A folding or telescoping stock; (b) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon; (c) A bayonet mount; (d) A flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; or (e) A grenade launcher. x. "Semi-automatic" means a firearm which fires a single projectile for each single pull of the trigger and is self-reloading or automatically chambers a round, cartridge, or bullet. y. "Large capacity ammunition magazine" means a box, drum, tube or other container which is capable of holding more than 15 rounds of ammunition to be fed continuously and directly therefrom into a semi-automatic firearm. z. "Pistol grip" means a well-defined handle, similar to that found on a handgun, that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, and which permits the shotgun to be held and fired with one hand. aa. "Antique handgun" means a handgun manufactured before 1898, or a replica thereof, which is recognized as being historical in nature or of historical significance and either (1) utilizes a match, friction, flint, or percussion ignition, or which utilizes a pin-fire cartridge in which the pin is part of the cartridge or (2) does not fire fixed ammunition or for which cartridge ammunition is not commercially available. bb. "Trigger lock" means a commercially available device approved by the Superintendent of State Police which is operated with a key or combination lock that prevents a firearm from being discharged while the device is attached to the firearm. It may include, but need not be limited to, devices that obstruct the barrel or cylinder of the firearm, as well as devices that immobilize the trigger. cc. "Trigger locking device" means a device that, if installed on a firearm and secured by means of a key or mechanically, electronically or electromechanically operated combination lock, prevents the firearm from being discharged without first deactivating or removing the device by means of a key or mechanically, electronically or electromechanically operated combination lock. dd. "Personalized handgun" means a handgun which incorporates within its design, and as part of its original manufacture, technology which automatically limits its operational use and which cannot be readily deactivated, so that it may only be fired by an authorized or recognized user. The technology limiting the handgun's operational use may include, but not be limited to: radio frequency tagging, touch memory, remote control, fingerprint, magnetic encoding and other automatic user identification systems utilizing biometric, mechanical or electronic systems. No make or model of a handgun shall be deemed to be a "personalized handgun" unless the Attorney General has determined, through testing or other reasonable means, that the handgun meets any reliability standards that the manufacturer may require for its commercially available handguns that are not personalized or, if the manufacturer has no such reliability standards, the handgun meets the reliability standards generally used in the industry for commercially available handguns. (cf: P.L.2002, c.130, s.5)

2. This act shall take effect on the first day of the third month following enactment.

STATEMENT

This bill revises the criteria for determining whether or not a rifle is considered an assault firearm. Currently, a rifle is considered to be an assault firearm if it is a semi-automatic rifle that has the capability of accepting a detachable magazine and has at least two of the following configurations: (1) a folding or telescoping stock; (2) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the rifle; (3) a bayonet mount; (4) a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; and (5) a grenade launcher. Under this bill, a rifle would be deemed to be an assault firearm if it is a semi-automatic that accepts a detachable magazine and has one, not two, of those qualifying configurations.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; US: New Jersey
KEYWORDS: assaultrifles; bang; banglist; bradywatch; corzine; firearms; format; gardenstate; guncontrol; gungrabbers; guns; lautenberg; menendez; newjersey; nj; paragraphs; paragraphsplease; sopranos
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Onced again, the slimy state of New Jersey with its seedu politicians is breaking new ground in gun control.

I'm no attorney, but it looks like this bill is aimed at Springfields and Garands, along with a number of other firearms.

Since Garands and Springfields are still used by marching bands color guards, this idiot could be creating some kind of dilemma. Maybe they will let them use wooden rifles.

1 posted on 04/24/2006 7:00:48 AM PDT by ZULU
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To: ZULU

Sorry.

I forgot paragraph formatting in posting this.


2 posted on 04/24/2006 7:01:29 AM PDT by ZULU (Non nobis, non nobis, Domine, sed nomini tuo da gloriam. God, guts, and guns made America great.)
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To: ZULU

I wish that Corzine would get mugged, it may change his view on this. If Corzine doesn't get mugged, I suspect this bill will pass in a few weeks.


3 posted on 04/24/2006 7:04:30 AM PDT by John Geyer
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To: ZULU

When the original bill was passed, there were ZERO deaths attributed to "Assault Rifles".

What an F'ing Joke.


4 posted on 04/24/2006 7:04:44 AM PDT by spanalot
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To: John Geyer

It'll pass. It's ALL controlled by the Demoncrats.

If Corzine was assaulted he'd blame it on a bad childhood.


5 posted on 04/24/2006 7:06:12 AM PDT by nmh (Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God) !)
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To: ZULU
Fact: Large cities continue to loose large numbers of their inhabitants to the southern states and rural areas. Wonder why? (Major Sarcasm Off)
6 posted on 04/24/2006 7:08:35 AM PDT by mr_hammer (They have eyes, but do not see . . .)
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To: mr_hammer

Comeon down to the Missouri Ozarks.


7 posted on 04/24/2006 7:12:58 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks (BTUs are my Beat.)
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To: ZULU

Yes, the liberal crap-pits of the U.S. lead the way in destruction of the Constitution, bar none. It has long been the objective to disarm the American public, for the exact reason that the Second Amendment was enacted. It is the heavy oppressive element in our governments that want the citizenry disarmed -- they are worried about their health and their planned, equally oppressive government control and mandates.

It is clear, since it was established long ago, that gun control does nothing, but disarm law-abiding citizens. The libs continue to pretend to try to find laws that criminals will obey. Liberal chicanery.


8 posted on 04/24/2006 7:18:04 AM PDT by EagleUSA
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To: ZULU

This bill was also introduced as A2108 on 02/09/04. It was referred to the Assembly Law and Public Safety Committee where it died. Hopefully, this bill will meet the same fate.

If allowed, government will never cease in efforts to strip away individual freedoms. Regrettably, the majority of people in NJ who vote are all too happy to do so.


9 posted on 04/24/2006 7:20:42 AM PDT by KeyesPlease
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To: ZULU

Not sure that Springfields (assuming you mean '03's, not M1A's) or Garands would be affected by this, since neither use a detachable magazine and therefore do not meet the first part of the law, i.e. a detachable magazine and one/two additional features such as pistol grip, flash suppressor, etc.


10 posted on 04/24/2006 7:21:27 AM PDT by Panzerfaust
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To: ZULU

This reminds me of an article I saw months ago on FR about someone or some persons attempting to ban large kitchen knives in the UK. Does anyone recall this?


11 posted on 04/24/2006 7:22:23 AM PDT by RexBeach ("There is no substitute for victory." -Douglas MacArthur)
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To: ZULU
but it looks like this bill is aimed at Springfields and Garands

(6) A semi-automatic rifle that has the capability of accepting a detachable magazine and has at least one of the following configurations: (a) A folding or telescoping stock; (b) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon; (c) A bayonet mount; (d) A flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; or (e) A grenade launcher. x. "

The Bushmaster M4. My M4 has all the above except the grenade launcher. In addition, the bill mentions shotguns with a capacity greater than 6 rounds.

It looks like this bill is going after everything except for traditionally accepted hunting arms.

The Second Amendment
It ain't about duck hunting.

12 posted on 04/24/2006 7:23:39 AM PDT by cowboyway (My heroes have always been cowboys.)
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To: John Geyer

I believe it is Corzine that is MUGGING us.


13 posted on 04/24/2006 7:23:55 AM PDT by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: KeyesPlease
>>> Regrettably, the majority of people in NJ who vote are all too happy to do so.


14 posted on 04/24/2006 7:26:35 AM PDT by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: RexBeach

I was on that thread.


15 posted on 04/24/2006 7:27:27 AM PDT by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: ZULU

During the course of my job, I often speak with people in the Phillipines. One of the managers there was telling me that despite the fact that civilians can't own firearms there they were experiencing many murders involving firearms. No one will speak to the police about these murders because the killers have to have political friends to be armed. Excellent example of the end result of gun control....


16 posted on 04/24/2006 7:34:05 AM PDT by dragonhammer (The unwise man thinks he always will live, if from fighting he flees.)
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To: ZULU
I wonder if this rubber band gatling gun is prohibited:


17 posted on 04/24/2006 7:35:23 AM PDT by MineralMan (non-evangelical atheist)
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To: Calpernia

Night of the living dead?


18 posted on 04/24/2006 7:41:27 AM PDT by ZULU (Non nobis, non nobis, Domine, sed nomini tuo da gloriam. God, guts, and guns made America great.)
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To: Calpernia

I remember that too.


19 posted on 04/24/2006 7:41:55 AM PDT by ZULU (Non nobis, non nobis, Domine, sed nomini tuo da gloriam. God, guts, and guns made America great.)
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To: ZULU

SOB!


20 posted on 04/24/2006 7:42:33 AM PDT by stevio (Red-Blooded Crunchy Con, American Male (NRA))
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To: ZULU
It is reflecting our dead voters.

Excerpt:

More than 4,000 votes (4,755) were cast under the names of dead New Jerseyans in last November's election, and nearly 11,000 more people appear to have voted twice, according to state Republicans who say they fear election fraud when voters choose a new governor.

21 posted on 04/24/2006 7:44:34 AM PDT by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: MineralMan

You might want to send that picture to the idiot who framed this bill - predictably a Dem and an attorny:

http://www.njleg.state.nj.us/members/gusciora.asp

But then he might consider this a pornographic picture.


22 posted on 04/24/2006 7:45:02 AM PDT by ZULU (Non nobis, non nobis, Domine, sed nomini tuo da gloriam. God, guts, and guns made America great.)
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To: spanalot

It has nothing to do with deaths or crime. It's all about disarming the people as completely and quickly as possible. It's easier to control them and tax them to death that way.


23 posted on 04/24/2006 7:50:32 AM PDT by paul51 (11 September 2001 - Never forget)
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To: ZULU

Gee, I remember back in 1961 when they ONLY wanted to register handguns. Long guns would not be affected they said.
Then they wanted to register all guns.
Then they only wanted to ban "saturday night specials".
Then they only wanted to ban all handguns. Long guns would not be affected.
Then they wanted to ban all handguns and "assault rifles".
They lied to us in 1961.
They lied to us in 1968.
They lied to us in 1972.
They lied to us in 1978.
They lied to us in 1989,
and they are lieing to you now.


24 posted on 04/24/2006 7:59:27 AM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar (ISLAM is STILL the religion of the criminally insane!)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar

They know what they are doing - incremental suspension of the First Amendment.

At which point will the Federal Courts say "Enough"?!!

Santiago Matamorros is my favorite Saint.


25 posted on 04/24/2006 8:10:07 AM PDT by ZULU (Non nobis, non nobis, Domine, sed nomini tuo da gloriam. God, guts, and guns made America great.)
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To: All

The NRA has been sending me a lot of cool stuff. I watched a DVD they sent `Ten Guns That Changed the World' (from History Channel) twice last night, plus discount coupons, a cool black and gold cap . . why, it's been a virtual plethora, a cornucopia of earthly 2nd Amend. delights from Wayne L.
I sent some more $$ yesterday, and I'm getting a book. (They assure me it hasn't been colored-in yet . .)
Join the NRA today! tell NJ's `gun-grabbers' to get bent.
And don't forget FR!


26 posted on 04/24/2006 8:12:27 AM PDT by tumblindice (America's Founding Fathers: armed conservatives)
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To: tumblindice
Hi tumblindice-

It also wouldn't hurt to join GOA and JPFO as well. They each support firearms ownership from a different viewpoint, so it's all helpful to our cause.

~ Blue Jays ~

27 posted on 04/24/2006 8:19:13 AM PDT by Blue Jays (Rock Hard, Ride Free)
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To: Blue Jays

I'll look into those two, thanks!


28 posted on 04/24/2006 8:26:58 AM PDT by tumblindice (America's Founding Fathers: armed conservatives)
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To: tumblindice
Hi tumblindice-

Both are outstanding organizations committed to our Second Amendment rights. They are definitely allied with the NRA and seek the preservation of our important freedoms. Here are the hyperlinks to save you time:

Gunowners of America
JPFO

~ Blue Jays ~

29 posted on 04/24/2006 8:39:32 AM PDT by Blue Jays (Rock Hard, Ride Free)
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To: cowboyway

I think the law will ban all nonwooden stock semi auto rifles which uses a detachable magazine. Looks like the semi auto military clone rifle owners will need to switch over to the Ruger Mini-14 carbine or consider a SKS carbine. Gov Corzine within 48 hours of office passed an executive order that made blocked large capacity magazines (which were legal) illegal in NJ.


30 posted on 04/24/2006 8:51:17 AM PDT by Fee (`+Great powers never let minor allies dictate who, where and when they must fight.)
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To: EagleUSA

For every action there is an equal but opposite reaction.


31 posted on 04/24/2006 8:57:44 AM PDT by 2ndClassCitizen
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

"Comeon down to the Missouri Ozarks."...One of the few places hunting/fishing is lessthan a grand an acre....but that is disappearing too...


32 posted on 04/24/2006 9:00:37 AM PDT by litehaus
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To: ZULU

The USA as we knew it is disappearing so fast that it's sometimes difficult to remember what once existed. And most people seem to have no idea what once existed. The rest want to make sure it never comes back, liberals and conservatives alike.

It's pretty rare to meet someone who thinks our founding principles can still be useful today.


33 posted on 04/24/2006 9:02:41 AM PDT by Sam Cree (Delicacy, precision, force)
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To: litehaus

We paid a lot less. But we did our deal in 97 and built the new house in 2002. Still, there is plenty of good timber and waterfront around Lake of the Ozarks that is undeveloped and would sell for less than 1K/acre. Deer, turkey, bass & crappie. You can jug fish and live entirely on catfish if you don't mind catfish...


34 posted on 04/24/2006 9:08:59 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks (BTUs are my Beat.)
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To: Fee

This seems to get into the Dred Scott area of the law. If I live in state A and own a gun legally in State A and come to New Jersey and have that gun with me, Dred Scott says that possession of that gun is fine.

Just as a hypothetical, does this ban cover ownership of a pre-ban AR-15?


35 posted on 04/24/2006 9:16:00 AM PDT by ChiefJayStrongbow
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To: John Geyer

Corzine will not be mugged. Like all of the beautiful, improtant people, he has his own ARMED guards.


36 posted on 04/24/2006 9:19:13 AM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Joe 6-pack

Maybe the guards will pull an " E Tu Brute "??


37 posted on 04/24/2006 9:52:25 AM PDT by Renegade
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To: Sam Cree

You're communicating with one now. I think I am too.

Keep the faith. Truth triumphs in the end.


38 posted on 04/24/2006 10:44:07 AM PDT by ZULU (Non nobis, non nobis, Domine, sed nomini tuo da gloriam. God, guts, and guns made America great.)
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To: Renegade
"Maybe the guards will pull an " E Tu Brute "??"

Won't happen. They have too much job security. Corzine will always have a need for armed guards, even if he disarms all the peons.

39 posted on 04/24/2006 11:07:36 AM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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Comment #40 Removed by Moderator

To: spanalot
When the original bill was passed, there were ZERO deaths attributed to "Assault Rifles".

simple. expand the definition of "assault weapon" until it includes weapons that do have deaths attributed to them. it'd be quite easy to say that in the last 75-100 years, millions of deaths were caused by springfields and garands. of course they won't tell you that 99.999% of those deaths were war casulties..
41 posted on 04/24/2006 12:14:13 PM PDT by absolootezer0 ("My God, why have you forsaken us.. no wait, its the liberals that have forsaken you... my bad")
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To: ZULU

;-)


42 posted on 04/24/2006 12:22:29 PM PDT by Sam Cree (Delicacy, precision, force)
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To: Joe 6-pack

He might have a need for guards but he sure doen't have a need for a comb .


43 posted on 04/24/2006 1:46:07 PM PDT by Renegade
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To: ZULU

can't be "assault rifles" if they are not select-fire actions.


44 posted on 04/24/2006 5:25:31 PM PDT by King Prout (The UN 1967 Outer Space Treaty is bad for America and bad for humanity - DUMP IT.)
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To: King Prout

If it looks like an assualt rifle, it is an assault rifle...< / incredibly moronic media spoksperson >


45 posted on 04/24/2006 5:27:20 PM PDT by sit-rep (http://trulineint.com/latestposts.asp)
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To: sit-rep
If it looks like an assualt rifle, it is an assault rifle...[/incredibly moronic media spoksperson]

well, this LOOKS like an assault-rifle, but it is a semi-auto only shotgun...

46 posted on 04/24/2006 5:36:15 PM PDT by King Prout (The UN 1967 Outer Space Treaty is bad for America and bad for humanity - DUMP IT.)
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To: King Prout

And a good looking one at that... what's that, a ten round mag?


47 posted on 04/24/2006 5:47:43 PM PDT by sit-rep (http://trulineint.com/latestposts.asp)
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To: sit-rep; Spktyr; Eaker
five round detachable box magazine. iirc, military versions have the option of an eight round mag.

it is essentially a gas-operated semi-auto AK47 shotgun in 12ga, 20ga, and .410caliber

go to this site and check it out.

The Russian-American Armory Company is the current importer. Thank the LORD they came along - prices on Saiga shotguns were going through the roof at auctions, due to increasing rarity.

a detailed article on the Saiga-12 exists in wikipedia, copied from a dedicated AK review website iirc.

some happy folks among the FR banglisters have these weapons, and have endorsed them as generally excellent field and home-defense guns

48 posted on 04/24/2006 6:08:30 PM PDT by King Prout (The UN 1967 Outer Space Treaty is bad for America and bad for humanity - DUMP IT.)
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To: King Prout

And, as you know, I'm one of those happy folks.

Saiga forums: forum.saiga-12.com

They come with 5 round magazines, but you can get 8 rounders on the gray market, and there are US-made 10 rounders in development by at least three different entities. There's also talk about converting some mags to be drum feed mechanisms.

There's a small but growing aftermarket for these things. I love mine - the reliability of the AK mechanism in a mag-fed shotgun - best of all worlds.


49 posted on 04/24/2006 6:14:59 PM PDT by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: Spktyr

I shall be joining that happy group inside a month, now that they are once again available in a working-man's pricerange.


50 posted on 04/24/2006 6:21:02 PM PDT by King Prout (The UN 1967 Outer Space Treaty is bad for America and bad for humanity - DUMP IT.)
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