Cost of U.S. Military Shuffle Stuns Japan

AP ^ | 04/26/06 | HIROKO TABUCHI

[Marine_Uncle]

TOKYO (AP) - Top Japanese officials on Wednesday expressed shock at a U.S. estimate that put the price tag for the planned reshuffling of U.S. forces in Japan at $26 billion or more.
"My impression is that's an incredibly huge amount of money," Chief Cabinet Secretary Shinzo Abe told a news conference, saying he couldn't comment further because he wasn't aware of the details.
"Where did you get that number? Don't tell me groundless stories," a shocked-looking Foreign Minister Taro Aso earlier said on TV Asahi. "We shouldn't overreact over one official's estimate."
Japan and the United States are negotiating details of a plan that would streamline the 50,000 U.S. forces based in Japan and to give Japan's military greater responsibility for security in the Asia-Pacific.
U.S. Deputy Undersecretary of Defense Richard Lawless said Tuesday he estimated costs of the overall realignment at about $26 billion. Japan's annual defense budget is $42 billion.
"This is a huge investment on their part in the alliance, and we recognize it as such," Lawless said Tuesday.
The estimate includes the $6 billion Tokyo has agreed to pay to move 8,000 Marines from the Southern Japanese island of Okinawa to Guam, a U.S. Pacific island territory.
The U.S. has said it will contribute $4 billion toward transfer costs.
Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi tried to dispel Japanese worries over the price tag late Wednesday.
"Mr. Lawless must be heeding U.S. public sentiment that though the U.S. bears so much responsibility for Japan's defense, Japan's burden is too light," Koizumi told reporters at his official residence.
A Defense Ministry official who spoke on condition of anonymity, citing protocol, said the Japanese government hadn't been given an official cost estimate for the reshuffle.
"We understand the details of the realignment, including costs, are still under negotiation," the official said.
The planned realignment has met with some opposition in Japan. Local governments and civic groups have argued that priority should be given to reducing those forces and returning the bases to Japanese control.
Others oppose plans to deploy a nuclear-powered naval carrier to Japan for the first time, citing security concerns.
Japan is Washington's top ally in East Asia and has been a staunch supporter of the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq, dispatching troops there in 2004 to carry out humanitarian tasks. Japan's navy also provides fuel for coalition warships in the Indian Ocean.

[Marine_Uncle]

I cannot help but wonder how many buckeros the US has spent thus far on protecting Japan. I fully realize we are not doing it just to be nice to them, but we needed their land and ports to keep a strong precence in the Pacific Rim.
But surely, we have saved them hundreds of billions of dollars over the years they had put into building their industries into fierce competitors.

[GungaLaGunga]

Defense is a bitch, aint it Japan?

[HamiltonJay]

Better a fierce economic competitor, than a fundamentalist shinto terrorist camp.

[Gordongekko909]

Au contraire. The money that Japan has saved on defense has gone to a ridiculous amalgamation of overfunded pension systems. Koizumi was elected precisely to wean Japan off of big government and revitalize its economy. His party and their parochial pork barrels are making this difficult for him.

[Gordongekko909]

"Fundamentalist Shinto"? I'd be more afraid of fundamentalist Mormons. Shinto isn't really "convert-or-die" material. It's more a set of superstitions that anything else.

[1rudeboy]

So is losing.

[Doohickey]

Since we're the ones that told Japan in 1945 that they couldn't maintain a strong military (and rightfully so), it would follow that we would bear some of the burden for Japan's defense.

[coconutt2000]

In inflation adjusted dollars, the actual number is probably closer to a trillion or more.

You also have to add in a portion of the amount spent on R&D, the discounts to the Japanese for American hardware, and the value of relevant technology transfers. Add in the reconstruction of Japan, and the B.S. we've put up with and the real cost is actually beyond calculation.

Japan owes our country big time for not depopulating their islands and letting the pre-Commie Chinese move in.

Frankly, given our country's history since the end of WWII, I find it impossible to believe that anyone can possibly have a reason to hate the United States. Aside from some of the stupid things we've done in the 20th Century, and most of those involved a choice between two undesirables.

(And the only ignorant Americans I've ever met who qualified for the label were dyed in the blue liberals. For all they might now about the world and the capitals of Europe, liberals know very little about human nature.)

[Marine_Uncle]

"Better a fierce economic competitor, than a fundamentalist shinto terrorist camp."
No problem there.

[Marine_Uncle]

" His party and their parochial pork barrels are making this difficult for him."
No problem. But do remember, we are talking about huge amounts of money invested in the country going all the way back to the mid-late fifties. That was the point I was trying to make.

[Blue Highway]

50 years is quite a long time though...

[Eric in the Ozarks]

The Japanese government has paid for 100 the cost of our military stationed in Japan since the Occupation.

[Gordongekko909]

It was win-win. We didn't have to worry about Japan getting uppity again, AND we got a toehold in the region. Japan, meanwhile, didn't have to pay for defense.

Everybody happy and smiling!

Koizumi has considered repealing Article Seven of Japan's Constitution, though (the one that prohibits a standing military beyond a certain size). The US is, needless to say, fine with this; Japan, being a relatively not-corrupt, secular, capitalist democracy, is just the kind of ally we like. They can have their military back.

I forsee a SpecOps squad consisting of maho shojo, an air force with Mothra as its flagship, and an infantry corps revolving around Gundams and Eva units.

Big happy kawaii Japanese military! ^_^

[Marine_Uncle]

"... it would follow that we would bear some of the burden for Japan's defense."
I know that and agree. I tried to cover for the fact we had little alternative. And I was not complaining. I simply stated it is now time for them to better take care of their own defensive needs.

[RetiredArmy]

The last time JAPAN was in CHARGE of its own defense, we had WWII. Something to think about.

[Dr. Bogus Pachysandra]

Didja ever notice how much Koizumi and Pres. Bush look alike?

[magslinger]

"Fundamentalist Shinto"? I'd be more afraid of fundamentalist Mormons. Shinto isn't really "convert-or-die" material. It's more a set of superstitions that anything else.

It only took the US a year to get the Mormons under control while it took a vastly more industrialized US nearly four years to get the Shintos to surrender.

[Gordongekko909]

Didja ever notice how much Koizumi and Pres. Bush look alike?

Naah, not really.

[Marine_Uncle]

"Add in the reconstruction of Japan, and the B.S. we've put up with and the real cost is actually beyond calculation."
At last someone with a brain. I get so tired of writing reams of paragraphs to explain every nuiance a given posting may entail.
I am as you, very well aware of the huge amounts of money our corporations had invested in Japan. Hell, going back to the mid fifties RCA, Philco, Westinghouse, many many other electronic companies had sunk a lot of R&D into design and manufacture of lets just deal with one item....television.
Then bingo. The US gov sponsored the Japanese engineers to come over hear and learn everything they had to know to build their own industry up. I personally know this stuff.
Same goes for the semiconductor industry and a hundred other things either of us could go into probaby great detail on.
At any rate. Can't expect a lot of folks to follow on simple statements. I should not post because one should write a book for in each comment associate with a posting. Gets a bit weary to do so.
Thanks.

[Waverunner]

Don't forget Star Cruiser Yamato

also all those neat heat ray beams they developed for use on Godzilla.

And will the twins be in command of Mothra?

[Gordongekko909]

There were significantly more Shinto than Mormons, and the Japanese had planes and stuff. And they got a significant punch in before we went after them.

Besides, modern-day Shinto is of no threat to anyone. It's more a system of good luck charms than a religion. It doesn't concern itself with the afterlife, and doesn't demand that anyone convert to it, ever. Shinto != Islam.

[GnL]

That Koizumi has some serious hair.

[Marine_Uncle]

"The Japanese government has paid for 100 the cost of our military stationed in Japan since the Occupation."
I am sorry. I am not sure how to enterprete your statement. Please I am not giving you a hard time. Perhaps you can expand a little.

[Gordongekko909]

Of course the twins will be in command of Mothra! The only question is whether A-ko will be merged with the Sailor Scouts. A-ko doesn't have (nor does she need) a transformation scene, so it might be tricky.

[Mr. Jazzy]

Then consider the bill partial payment for the Bataan Death March, Pearl Harbor, the Hell Ships, human experimentation with chemical and biological agents, atrocities to civilians in each country they invaded, etc.


Oh, I'm sorry. My mistake. The Japanese government never has acknowledged war crimes of this nature.

Or just leave the Marines there, if the bill is too high.
Just my opinion.

[Gordongekko909]

The Japanese press described it as "rock-star" hair while he was running for PM for the first time.

[stormlead]

at the same time, it didn't hurt us to have the Communist world neatly encircled during the Cold War. The Acheson perimeter speech and all that. Note that most of the actually fighting during the Cold War occurred in the South, where who was more powerful was unclear.

Not saying we didn't save their butts, just that doing so was majorly in our geostrategic interest. Personally, I think we should keep a major presence in Japan just to send a clear mesage to China. I sure hope this re-alignment isn't somehow about appeasing China.

[SaxxonWoods]

It's those $900 kimonos that run the price up.

Sy-a-na-ra!

[wolfcreek]

I think he meant one 100th the cost.

[Eric in the Ozarks]

No doubt. The fact remains that the cost of stationing soldiers, sailors and Marines in Japan has been on their tab.

[HamiltonJay]

Yea, and that's why the peace treaty that ended war in the Pacific required that the Emperor and New PM never ever enter a Shinto Shrine.

[Gordongekko909]

O_O source? I've seen stuff saying that Hirohito and friends voluntarily did not go to the Yasukuni Shrine, but I've never heard anything about that. And Koizumi has visited the Yasukuni Shrine a few times, which has made Korea and China kind of nervous.

[Marine_Uncle]

"It's those $900 kimonos that run the price up. "
Gets slightly tough. heheh.

[Marine_Uncle]

"I think he meant one 100th the cost."
One things for certain. They would still be beating up people with swords if we did not save them from themselves.

[TheDon]

We will need a militarily strong Japan soon.

[BeHoldAPaleHorse]

Cost of U.S. Military Shuffle Stuns Japan

Uh-oh, America is so powerful we stuned an entire nation's beebers!

[Yo-Yo]

The estimate includes the $6 billion Tokyo has agreed to pay to move 8,000 Marines from the Southern Japanese island of Okinawa to Guam, a U.S. Pacific island territory.

That works out to $750,000 per Marine! Are we including the cost of building an entire new base on Guam?

[Marine_Uncle]

"We will need a militarily strong Japan soon."
Very strongly agree.

[manwiththehands]

"My impression is that's ($26B) an incredibly huge amount of money," Chief Cabinet Secretary Shinzo Abe told a news conference ...

Naw. $26B is nothin' over here.

Austin Powers: "I demand 26 billion dollars!"
"HAHAHAHAHAHAHA"

[Marine_Uncle]

" Are we including the cost of building an entire new base on Guam?"
Not sure. A article a day back or so indicated yes. Let us remember we maintain military bases on Guam. This would simply be a new base, or integrated into current structure. Not sure, we need more info.

[BeHoldAPaleHorse]

"A billion here, and a billion there, and pretty soon you're talking real money!" -- The late Senator Everett Dirksen

[BeHoldAPaleHorse]

Let us remember we maintain military bases on Guam.

Let us also remember that all our base are belong to us. :)

[Marine_Uncle]

" Naw. $26B is nothin' over here."
Seems like a lot of money trees with real deep roots.

[Marine_Uncle]

""A billion here, and a billion there, and pretty soon you're talking real money!" -- The late Senator Everett Dirksen."
How cavaler they have been with American tax dollars over the years. Yes. I understand we own and operate our own military bases on Guam. But good to add that comment, in case some folks are not up on this stuff.

[Tallguy]

It would appear that the Pentagon plans to pave over the entire island of Guam making it one great airstrip with an adjoining port.

[blam]

"That Koizumi has some serious hair."

Probably can thank the Ainu for it.

[sean327]

You need to give the Japanese a little credit here. They have finnaly realized that they need to take a lager part in the defense of the Pacific Rim. After WWII we imposed the requirement that their armed forces were to be structured for defense only. In fact we insisted it be part of their Constitution. Japan and the US have out grown that requirement and now see that Japan can provide quality forces if the need should arise. Japan has also been a damn good friend to us.

[sean327]

"That Koizumi has some serious hair."

Koizmi and the guy from the Iron Chef probably have the same hair stylist.

[Ed_in_LA]

Japan covers around 80% of the cost of U.S. miltary bases in their country, according to Senator Kaye Bailey Hutchinson: "Today, Germany contributes 21 percent to our basing. Japan and Saudi Arabia cover approximately 80 percent. Italy contributes 37 percent. In a relatively new agreement, the Korean government has pledged to increase its contributions from approximately 41 percent to 50 percent of stationing costs by 2004."

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Europe/hl782.cfm