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DIGGING TO BYZANTIUM: Turkish Tunnel Project Unearths an Ancient Harbor
Der Spiegel ^ | 5/10/2006 | N/A

Posted on 05/10/2006 9:17:53 AM PDT by a_Turk

Workers digging a railway tunnel under the Bosporus Strait have uncovered the remains of a major Byzantine harbor that archaeologists say is a trove of relics dating back to Roman Emperor Constantine the Great.

The deepest underwater rail tunnel in the world will link Istanbul's Asian and European halves and ease bridge traffic across the Bosporus Strait. It may also be delayed by excited archaeologists. The tunnel, when it's finished, will end in a shining new railway station, the largest in Turkey -- a train and subway link surrounded by a 21st-century shopping center. Modern Turkish planners, though, weren't the first people in history to imagine the spot as a transport hub. The $4 billion tunnel project has uncovered a fourth-century harbor under the slums of Yenikapi, on the European side of Istanbul, and archaeologists excavating the area say it's a trove of relics dating back as far as Constantine the Great.

(Excerpt) Read more at service.spiegel.de ...


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: ancientnavigation; biblicalarcheology; byzantineempire; byzantium; constantinople; godsgravesglyphs; istanbul; navigation; romanempire; turkey; yenikapi

1 posted on 05/10/2006 9:17:56 AM PDT by a_Turk
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To: a_Turk

Thanks for the post. Being Byzantine Catholic I find it very interesting.


2 posted on 05/10/2006 9:22:15 AM PDT by Uddercha0s
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To: a_Turk
Hmmm....a harbor underwater...... global warming has been around a loooooong time............
3 posted on 05/10/2006 9:23:02 AM PDT by Red Badger (In warfare there are no constant conditions. --- The Art of War by SunTzu)
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To: Red Badger; SunkenCiv

ggg Ping!


4 posted on 05/10/2006 9:27:53 AM PDT by Red Badger (In warfare there are no constant conditions. --- The Art of War by SunTzu)
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To: Uddercha0s

Byzantine Catholic?........You must be VERY VERY old...........


5 posted on 05/10/2006 9:29:19 AM PDT by Red Badger (In warfare there are no constant conditions. --- The Art of War by SunTzu)
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To: a_Turk
They found entire ships? What happened here? Was the harbor abandoned or was there some sort of catastrophe?
6 posted on 05/10/2006 9:34:58 AM PDT by Boiler Plate (Mom always said why be difficult, when with just a little more effort you can be impossible.)
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To: Red Badger
Thanks Red Badger. Not a ping, because there are one or two of these already, but have added to the catalog.

To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list. Thanks.
Please FREEPMAIL me if you want on or off the
"Gods, Graves, Glyphs" PING list or GGG weekly digest
-- Archaeology/Anthropology/Ancient Cultures/Artifacts/Antiquities, etc.
Gods, Graves, Glyphs (alpha order)

7 posted on 05/10/2006 9:38:39 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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Treasure (Archaeology) Dig Threatens Bosphorus Rail Link
BBC | 5-2-2006 | Sarah Rainsford
Posted on 05/02/2006 2:44:06 PM EDT by blam
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1625431/posts


8 posted on 05/10/2006 9:40:06 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: Red Badger

LOL.. There are still a few of us around. One of these days I'd love to visit turk's home country and see the Hagia Sophia.


9 posted on 05/10/2006 9:41:57 AM PDT by Uddercha0s
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To: Boiler Plate
My guess is that it was probably garbage that entombed the ship. When a pre-revoutionary war sailing ship was found along the Manhattan shoreline there was no documented catastrophe. Rather the ship was not salvageable and was buried. Today, it has been unearthed and fully restored as a tourist attraction.

No doubt once the archeologists have completed their work the relics will be placed in a museum or sent traveling around the world so that we can see a slice on Constantinople circa Constantine!

10 posted on 05/10/2006 9:47:52 AM PDT by Young Werther
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To: Boiler Plate

There was a show on History Channel on undergound cities. I got the impression it was to be a series, but only Istanbul has been aired so far. Absolutely fascinating. Remains of the Hippodrome, palaces, and vast cisterns completely intact. This particular harbor was a lagoon or inlet that silted in over time, and there had been many sunken vessels in the relatively shallow water. I just saw a rerun of it last week, so look for it if you are interested.


11 posted on 05/10/2006 9:52:22 AM PDT by j.havenfarm (Issuing my fatwas from the holy city of Auburn, California.)
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To: Boiler Plate

As is the case with many ancient harbors it probably silted up and was eventually filled. The geology of that area is fractured with faults and there is a history of quakes so there could have been a series of uplifts.


12 posted on 05/10/2006 9:52:43 AM PDT by Leg Olam ("There is no Hell. There is only France." F. Zappa)
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To: Uddercha0s; MarMema; The_Reader_David; FormerLib
udderchaos, IF you were a GREEK Orthodox Christian it would be even MORE interesting since it was the Greek city of Constantinople before it was invaded and captured by the turk hordes in the 15th century.

The Great Schism happened in the 11th century and so, this city was the center of the EASTERN ORTHODOX CHURCH ( and still is, by the way), NOT THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH.

Since the head of your church is the POPE in Roman not the Patriarch of Constaninople, you are not Eastern Orthodox and not even in Communion with them!

13 posted on 05/10/2006 10:10:41 AM PDT by Lion in Winter (Violent islam is the same as plain islam. No peace at all.... Just mass mayhem.)
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To: Lion in Winter

I could type a whole bunch but it has already been done for me. There is a good explanation here:

http://byzcath.org/Faith-and-Worship/Who-Are-Byzantine-Catholics.htm


14 posted on 05/10/2006 10:20:31 AM PDT by Uddercha0s
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To: Uddercha0s
"The Roman emperor Constantine moved his capital from Rome to Byzantium in 330 AD and renamed the city Constantinople."

See, Hagia Sophia was A GREEK ORTHODOX CHURCH!! In fact during a crusade by the Pope of Rome's army in the 13th century, the Church was sacked and many Eastern Orthodox Christians and their Priests were killed.

The Altar made with precious stones and many valuable golden Icons were stolen by the Roman Pope's army. But, then... A storm at sea caused the ship carring the valuable items back to Rome to sink and the Altar and all the Icons were lost!!

WHEN THE TURKS TOOK THE CITY CENTURIES LATER, they MESSED THE CHURCH UP AND TURNED INTO A MUSLIM PLACE AND DESTROYED MANY BEAUTIFUL FRESCOES AND KILLED MANY MORE CHRISTIANS!!

The Eastern Orthodox Church has tried to re-open their senminary on a an island near the city but the Turks will not allow it! RELIGIOUS FREEDOM IN TURKEY IS NOT WHAT IT COULD BE. But, for a muslim country, at least they haven't killed another Orthodox Patriarch in quite a few years....

15 posted on 05/10/2006 10:29:44 AM PDT by Lion in Winter (Violent islam is the same as plain islam. No peace at all.... Just mass mayhem.)
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To: Uddercha0s
Look you all have services which sort of "LOOK-LIKE" the Eastern Orthodox Church, but your leader is, ULTIMATELY, the Pope in Rome, not the Ecumenical Patriarch in Constantinople .

And, you all are NOT given the Eucharist in an Eastern Orthodox Church, anymore than a Baptist or a Methodist is allowed to do so.

At one time in the past, your group may have been Eastern Orthodox Christians but somehow, you all wound up in the Roman controlled sphere of the Pope in Rome. If that is what your folks wanted, well, that is AOK for you... but you all are really VERY different theologically from the Eastern Church.

16 posted on 05/10/2006 10:39:51 AM PDT by Lion in Winter (Violent islam is the same as plain islam. No peace at all.... Just mass mayhem.)
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To: Lion in Winter

When Constantine moved the capital from Rome to Byzantium/Constantinople/Istanbul there was no such thing as orthodox. This is where the "eastern rites" originated. The schism betweem the eastern and western churches occurred around 1000. We are left then with those who are in union with Rome (Byz Caths, Melkites, Ruthenians, etc.) and the Orthodox under the Patriarch.


17 posted on 05/10/2006 10:44:16 AM PDT by Uddercha0s
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To: Lion in Winter

LOL.. it's not meant to be a religious war dude.. the fact is that all eastern rites trace theirselves back to Constantinople and that is history we should all be interested in.


18 posted on 05/10/2006 10:48:15 AM PDT by Uddercha0s
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To: Lion in Winter

Take a deep breath and relax. Sounding frantic doesn't build solid arguments. No one is insulting the greek heritage, if that is what you are reacting to. Costantinople was a Byzantine capital, part of an empire that included many races, including the greeks. Now it is a turkish city. Deal with it, it's been 600 years.


19 posted on 05/10/2006 10:58:16 AM PDT by aristotleman
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To: aristotleman
Yeah right! The muslims who are now running ISLAMIC Turkey REFUSE to allow the EOC to re-open a seminary!!

600 years ??? The OPPRESSION OF THE CHRISTIAN RELIGION IS NOW!!!

What are you? An apologist for anti-CHRISTIAN muslims TURKS???

20 posted on 05/10/2006 11:37:48 AM PDT by Lion in Winter (Violent islam is the same as plain islam. No peace at all.... Just mass mayhem.)
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To: FormerLib; kronos77; DTA

PING to a thread on islamic Turkey!


21 posted on 05/10/2006 11:39:08 AM PDT by Lion in Winter (Violent islam is the same as plain islam. No peace at all.... Just mass mayhem.)
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To: aristotleman
Oh, and the Turks will NOT allow Baptists to open a Church there either!

The EU says Turkey needs to clean up its act in regard to FREEDOM OF RELIGION!

22 posted on 05/10/2006 11:40:59 AM PDT by Lion in Winter (Violent islam is the same as plain islam. No peace at all.... Just mass mayhem.)
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To: Lion in Winter; aristotleman

Put the Kool-Aid down, step away from the keyboard and take a deep breath. This thread originally started about a dig that has turned up an ancient harbor in Byzantium. I expressed my pleasure in seeing it because of interest towards my background. At that point you decided to make it a religious war. We have covered orthodoxy and islam. There are plenty of other threads to discuss these topics but this is not one of them. No, I am not an anti-christian apologist and would be more than happy to debate it with you, but not here in this thread as this is not the topic.


23 posted on 05/10/2006 11:50:21 AM PDT by Uddercha0s
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To: Lion in Winter


On paper, Turkey is secular democratic republic. In reality, it is as you have described.


24 posted on 05/10/2006 11:55:27 AM PDT by DTA
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To: Uddercha0s
Of course, YOU are not an anti-Christian muslim apologist!! And the Turks are NO ally to the USA since they refused to help the USA in war against the taliban and saddam.

I hope their tunnel project is a flop!

25 posted on 05/10/2006 12:06:50 PM PDT by Lion in Winter (Violent islam is the same as plain islam. No peace at all.... Just mass mayhem.)
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To: Uddercha0s

Take the place back and remove that rubbish they filled it with.


26 posted on 05/10/2006 12:11:30 PM PDT by thebaron512
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To: aristotleman

Hi there. Fun forum, as usual.


27 posted on 05/10/2006 12:12:08 PM PDT by a_Turk (Temperance, Fortitude, Prudence, Justice, Comitas, Firmitas, Gravitas, Humanitas, Industria..)
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To: thebaron512

In some ways they are doing that.

"Due to its long history as both a church and a mosque, a particular challenge arises in the restoration process. The Christian iconographic mosaics are being gradually uncovered. However, in order to do so, important, historic Islamic art must be destroyed. Restorers have attempted to maintain a balance between both Christian and Islamic cultures. In particular much controversy rests upon whether the Islamic calligraphy on the dome of the cathedral should be removed, in order to permit the underlying Pantocrator mosaic of Christ as Master of the World, to be exhibited (assuming the mosaic still exists).
However, work has reportedly been purposely slow on the Hagia Sophia due to its important position and symbolism within the Eastern Orthodox Church. The Ecumenical Patriarch of the Greek Orthodox Church has claimed that the Turkish Government has denied offers to provide monetary assistance for the further restoration of Hagia Sophia in order to downplay its importance. Some Orthodox and Catholic Christians have gone so far as to demand the return of Hagia Sophia to the Orthodox Christian religion as a condition of Turkey's entry into the European Union."

Decent write up on wikipedia regarding it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hagia_Sophia


28 posted on 05/10/2006 12:15:02 PM PDT by Uddercha0s
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To: a_Turk

Any mention of Turkey, and attacks come flying.

The pavlovian response of haters is to bark at any stimulus, no matter how irrelevant it is to their agenda.


29 posted on 05/11/2006 7:03:15 PM PDT by aristotleman
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To: Lion in Winter

Idiot


30 posted on 05/15/2006 8:33:35 PM PDT by Sarajevo
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an update:
Dig for metro station uncovers long-lost port in Istanbul
Turkish Daily News
Thursday, June 22, 2006
They're calling the find the "Port of Theodosius," after the emperor of Rome and Byzantium who died in the year 395, and say the items they're digging up here could shed significant light on the commercial life of this ancient city. The excavations are being conducted in the Yenikapi area... So far, the archaeologists have found what they think might be a church, an old gate to the city and eight sunken ships, which archaeologist Cemal Pulak says he believes were all wiped out by a giant storm more than 1,000 years ago... Meanwhile, wall sections that are believed to be part of the Constantine Wall were unearthed in the western part of the excavation site, said Karamut. He added that underground graves dating to the fourth century were also unearthed in the same region.

31 posted on 06/22/2006 8:15:43 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (updated my FR profile on Wednesday, June 21, 2006.)
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32 posted on 11/17/2008 9:25:59 AM PST by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/_______Profile finally updated Saturday, October 11, 2008 !!!)
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To: a_Turk
Link.
33 posted on 11/17/2008 9:33:49 AM PST by <1/1,000,000th%
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