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2002 Document: Request For 500 KG Of SODIUM CYANIDE A Precursor For A Chemical Weapon (Translation)
Pentagon/FMSO website for Iraq Pre-war documents ^ | May 23 2006 | jveritas

Posted on 05/23/2006 7:13:05 PM PDT by jveritas

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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
" What was the chemical in the drums that we kept finding as we were rolling into Baghdad...?"
We do have to remember they had different types of industries, chemical, machine etc.. To darn things could probably be used in a duel use way. But it always goes back to we know he gassed his people and the Iranians. Any one that has a problem with that is rather naive. Gotta run. Started new job at Home Depot this week. work work work. hang in there.
101 posted on 05/24/2006 4:29:08 AM PDT by Marine_Uncle (Honor must be earned)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

The group seems to be from Zoo AL Fiqar factory.


102 posted on 05/24/2006 5:09:48 AM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: jveritas

This looks like a plating or pickling industrial operation. Cleaning, pickling, anodizing aluminum (hence the dye) or chromium plating by the zinc method.

Cyanide is not at all uncommon in industry; in the US the annual usage is tremendous.

Thanks for all the translations, jveritas.


103 posted on 05/24/2006 5:37:44 AM PDT by DBrow
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To: jveritas

Excellent j... will get it out.


104 posted on 05/24/2006 5:43:28 AM PDT by AliVeritas ("Quod Deus vult" (Urban II))
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To: jveritas

http://www.arb.ca.gov/toxics/chrome/chromeplating.pdf

This article is full of cyanide, acids, trivalent chrome, nickel, and all the other stuff that makes metal plating not a terribly "green" activity.

Do a search on cyanide in the pdf and you will see that it is frequently mentioned.


105 posted on 05/24/2006 5:47:08 AM PDT by DBrow
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To: xzins

bump


106 posted on 05/24/2006 6:00:27 AM PDT by Thunder 6
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To: Socratic

Your right, it could be used in a copper strike bath. I've seen pyrophosphate used. It gives a better coating and addresses the environmental concerns you mentioned.


107 posted on 05/24/2006 6:38:52 AM PDT by spunkets
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To: Eagles6

I'm sure it was all for chrome-plating AKMs for awards. Saddam had several. See? It's all harmless. /sarc


108 posted on 05/24/2006 6:59:06 AM PDT by Sender (ôThe beginning of wisdom is to call things by their right names.ö ľ Old Chinese proverb)
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To: jveritas

Thank you for keeping us informed jveritas. I was wondering where you were. Missed you. Tis a very interesting piece of information...Wonder what they were planning?


109 posted on 05/24/2006 7:02:05 AM PDT by tillacum
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To: jveritas

Not a chemist, but aren't these used to manufacture baby milk. Paging Peter Arnett...


110 posted on 05/24/2006 7:21:26 AM PDT by OrioleFan (Republicans believe every day is July 4th, DemocRATs believe every day is April 15th. - Reagan)
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To: jveritas

Bumped and bookmarked


111 posted on 05/24/2006 7:22:36 AM PDT by Skooz (Chastity prays for me, piety sings...Modesty hides my thighs in her wings...)
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To: jveritas
SODIUM CYANIDE is a dual use chemical used to make sarin. I'll get back to you when I find a complete list of dual use chemicals banned in Iraq.

Also: "Sodium cyanide is controlled by the Australia Group, an informal export control regime intended to prevent chemical weapon proliferation."

You may want to contact the Australia Group.

112 posted on 05/24/2006 7:34:19 AM PDT by avacado
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To: jveritas

Joe Wilson says this is not true. He had Turkish Coffee with some Govt officials (who always tell the truth) and determined that it is a lie, just like the yellocake.

LOL


113 posted on 05/24/2006 7:47:04 AM PDT by jw777
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To: jveritas

Here''s something about the Finnish supply sodium cyanide to Iraq in 2002.

Finnish detectives investigated suspicions of Iraqi WMDs in 2003

http://www.hs.fi/english/article/Finnish+detectives+investigated+suspicions+of+Iraqi+WMDs+in+2003/1101981878033


114 posted on 05/24/2006 7:48:44 AM PDT by avacado
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To: jveritas

Okay.... I found the GRL (Goods Review List) of banned dual use items.

http://daccessdds.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/N01/668/53/PDF/N0166853.pdf?OpenElement

All resolutions pertaining to Iraq with link to the GRL:
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/scriraq.html


115 posted on 05/24/2006 7:59:13 AM PDT by avacado
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To: SittinYonder

Nitric Acid has a lot of uses including processing yellowcake uranium!


116 posted on 05/24/2006 8:01:24 AM PDT by Chickenhawk Warmonger (All aboard the Chickenhawk Express... www.chickenhawkexpress.blogspot.com)
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To: Chickenhawk Warmonger; eyespysomething; jveritas
Nitric Acid has a lot of uses including processing yellowcake uranium!

Chickenhawk has provided interesting information. Did we ever figure out anything about the aluminum tubes at the plant?

117 posted on 05/24/2006 8:07:13 AM PDT by SittinYonder (Ic ■Št gehate, ■Št ic heonon nelle fleon fotes trym, ac wille fur­or gan,)
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To: avacado

Very interesting, thank you very much.


118 posted on 05/24/2006 8:46:22 AM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: jveritas

I doubt it is banned, but it is controlled. There are a fair number of chemical process that use it.


119 posted on 05/24/2006 9:01:16 AM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: avacado
"SODIUM CYANIDE is a dual use chemical used to make sarin."

No.

120 posted on 05/24/2006 9:05:26 AM PDT by spunkets
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To: spunkets
--- "SODIUM CYANIDE is a dual use chemical used to make sarin."---

No.

"Sodium cyanide is one component needed to make the nerve agents sarin, ..."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/3685392.stm

"Sodium cyanide, which is also widely used to produce insecticides and in metal industries, is used to produce sarin gas."
http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/world/archives/2004/09/19/2003203474

"Sodium cyanide is a dual-use chemical. It is used to make the nerve gas sarin."
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/845772/posts

"North Korea was stopped at the last moment in its attempt to import from Thailand sodium cyanide, a toxic chemical used to make sarine nerve gas."
http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200409/200409190032.html

"Sodium cyanide has many uses but can also be turned into the nerve agent sarin which causes paralysis and death. "
http://www.atsnn.com/article/82635

121 posted on 05/24/2006 9:44:50 AM PDT by avacado
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To: jveritas

That one link didn't work to the GRL list.

http://www.un.org/Depts/unmovic/documents/S-2002-515.pdf


122 posted on 05/24/2006 9:49:42 AM PDT by avacado
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To: jveritas

..but Iraq had no WMD's /sarcasm off.


123 posted on 05/24/2006 9:51:14 AM PDT by fhlh (Polls are for Strippers.)
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To: avacado

I don't believe any of those articles. If you want, you can't post the mechanism. I see no viable straight forward path to O-isopropyl methylphosphonofluoridate using NaCN at all.


124 posted on 05/24/2006 11:04:29 AM PDT by spunkets
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To: JustDoItAlways

This mix of Chemicals produces Hydrogen Cyanide Gas - a blood agent.

VX Nerve agent attacks the central nervous system.

Below describes what a blood agent does:

At room temperature hydrogen cyanide is a colorless liquid. Hydrogen cyanide, often known as known AC, is predominately absorbed through inhalation but both gaseous, liquid, as well as crystalized cyanide can also be taken up through the skin. Hydrogen cyanide is difficult to use in warfare because in is highly volatile which poses many problems. Along with being volatile, hydrogen cyanide is also non-persistent. If released in an open area, high concentrations of AC are hard to obtain, but if released in a confined area, high and lethal doses can easily be obtained.

Hydrogen cyanide has a faint odor that is similar to bitter almonds (not all people can smell this). In relation to hydrogen cyanide solubility, AC is highly soluble and stable in water.

Hydrogen cyanide belongs to a group of agents known as the CN-group. The CN-compounds hydrolyze slowly in water allowing for a gradual loss of toxicity. CN-compounds are also readily oxidized by strong oxidants. Hydrogen cyanide has an attraction for oxygen and is flammable. Along with its attraction for oxygen, CN-compounds, AC included, also have a strong attraction with metal ions (a reason for its lethal effects).



WHAT DOES HYDROGEN CYANIDE DO?

What makes hydrogen cyanide so lethal is the fact that it readily binds with metal-containing enzymes, such as the cytochrome oxidase enzyme system, an enzyme system that is essential for oxidative processes within the cell. When a cyanide ion binds with such an enzyme, cellular respiration is stopped because the fuel used (the cytochrome oxidase enzyme) is no longer produced. When cellular respiration ceases, bodily functions no longer receive the necessary oxygen and nutrients needed to survive, and therefore shutdown. Overall the cause of death due to hydrogen cyanide exposure is suffocation.


125 posted on 05/24/2006 11:17:04 AM PDT by roaddog727 (eludium PU36 explosive space modulator)
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To: BobS

Didn't Saddam hide tons of pesticides adjacent to artillery shells?


126 posted on 05/24/2006 11:27:50 AM PDT by Blue State Insurgent (English is a uniter, not a divider.)
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To: avacado
Thanks. It is just unbelievable, accroding the list A (Material of dual use) the UN allowed Saddam Regime to use Phosgene and Hydrogen Cyanide!!!
127 posted on 05/24/2006 11:43:40 AM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: spunkets
--- I don't believe any of those articles. If you want, you can't post the mechanism. I see no viable straight forward path to O-isopropyl methylphosphonofluoridate using NaCN at all.---

You appear to be correct. I looked at the molecular structure of sarin and I can't see how sodium cyanide NaCN would come into play. The articles were written by journalists and not chemists so all chemical agents are probably the same thing to them.

I did see that sodium cyanide is used to make the nerve agent called 'tabun' and that Iraq had produced tabun before.

128 posted on 05/24/2006 11:45:47 AM PDT by avacado
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To: jveritas
--- Thanks. It is just unbelievable, accroding the list A (Material of dual use) the UN allowed Saddam Regime to use Phosgene and Hydrogen Cyanide!!!---

Yep, it is unbelievable! But I do think Iraq had to declare those chemicals to the UN it written form. If Iraq did NOT, then that is trouble.

129 posted on 05/24/2006 11:48:38 AM PDT by avacado
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To: jveritas
--- Thanks. It is just unbelievable, accroding the list A (Material of dual use) the UN allowed Saddam Regime to use Phosgene and Hydrogen Cyanide!!!---

That's what the liberals called keeping Saddam "boxed in" or "contained!" LOL! He had all the ingredients for his Kool-aid ready to mix at a moments notice. The reality of it is that Saddam at any moment could cook up WMD in 1 hour. He didn't need to have pre-mixed WMD.

The left has managed to redefine WMD, that's the problem we face.

130 posted on 05/24/2006 11:56:38 AM PDT by avacado
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To: avacado
This U.N list A of allowed dual use material by Iraq is driving me crazy! How can any person with an IQ over 80 allows Saddam to use Phosgene and Hydrogen Cyanide and at the same claiming that they are disarming him from WMD! This is insane, Phosgene and Hydrogen Cyanide are the damn WMD.
131 posted on 05/24/2006 12:02:23 PM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: avacado

I think you should publish a portion of list A so Freepers will see the craziness and utter incompetence of the UN. This damn list was done during the Clinton administration as it appears from the date. Please correct me if I am wrong.


132 posted on 05/24/2006 12:05:04 PM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: jveritas
jveritas,

I am with you on that one. It's just plain nuts for the UN to allow Saddam to have those type of chemicals -- which are WMD. It makes no sense. But, those in list A have to be declared to the UN if they come in a solution of 10% or greater... If I read it correctly???
133 posted on 05/24/2006 12:07:55 PM PDT by avacado
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To: jveritas

UNSC Resolution 1409 (May 14, 2002)

Extends the oil-for-food programme by six months, and introduces a new import procedure. Only items on the annexed Goods Review List (GRL) are to be reviewed by the Sanctions Committee. Official version of the GRL (S/2002/515) are here (on the Unmovic site) and here (on the OIP site). Although the GRL is annexed to a letter from the US ambassador dated 3 May 2002 - before the resolution was even offically passed - it was only released on 14 August 2002. An unofficial version of the "Goods Review List" is also available on the UN Office of the Iraq programme website, in doc (2.2MB) and pdf versions (4.6MB). Some background is provided in the UN Press Release and a News Centre report. See also CASI's press release in response to the resolution (15 May 2002); Statement by Save the Children UK (May 2002); Statements by CAFOD of 16 May 2002 and 27 June 2002; and the analyses of Sarah Graham-Brown, Sanctions Renewed on Iraq (14 May 2002), and Colin Rowat, Iraq Sanctions Saga Continues amid Policy Confusion (10 June 2002). See also the fact sheet from the United States mission to the UN on the "Goods Review List" (14 May 2002).

Search on the string 'GRL'
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/scriraq.html


134 posted on 05/24/2006 12:12:48 PM PDT by avacado
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To: avacado
You are reading it correctly. If a solution contain less than 10% of these materials in list A it is does not have to be declared. Now the 500 KG of Sodium Cyanide must be declared but I do not know if the Iraqis declared it. It will be good if we can find somewhere a list of materials of what the Iraqi declared to the UN every six months as they were supposed to do so. May be the UN keep it in a record somewhere and hopefully they have these delcarations published on their website.
135 posted on 05/24/2006 12:14:41 PM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: jveritas

Some more about the GRL:

Resolution 1454 heightens the scrutiny over exports of a discrete set of goods that could support the Iraqi military and facilitate the development and use of weapons of mass destruction. Among the goods added to the revised GRL: specified chemicals and equipment useful in the production of chemical and biological weapons and their precursors; medical autoinjectors useful in the event of battlefield or terrorist chemical weapons use; guidance equipment and jammers with military applications; and other vehicles and related technology of value in particular military applications. Under certain conditions, specified medicines with particular value in chemical and biological warfare applications will also be reviewed.


http://usinfo.state.gov/is/Archive/2004/Apr/02-625954.html


136 posted on 05/24/2006 12:19:45 PM PDT by avacado
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To: SittinYonder

Oh wow, wonder what happened to the troll we played with the other day? He could have used a ping of this thread (grin)


137 posted on 05/24/2006 12:35:07 PM PDT by girlangler (I'd rather be fishing)
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To: girlangler
wonder what happened to the troll we played with the other day?

He's still reading the Peach/eyespysomething links!

138 posted on 05/24/2006 12:36:37 PM PDT by SittinYonder (Ic ■Št gehate, ■Št ic heonon nelle fleon fotes trym, ac wille fur­or gan,)
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To: SittinYonder; Saudaukar

Oh Saudauker, here's a little pingee.

On a more serious note, SittinYonder, I had overnight guests last night (a couple) and their oldest son works for the Pentagon. He is involved with the WMD search in Iraq.

They all say the WMD do exist, and are now in Syria.

Exactly what I have been reading here on FR, and believed, all along. I have believed it since I read about the convoy leaving Iraq in the buildup to the war, and when I read about the train (in Syria I believe) being hit with an unidentified missle of some sort -- the one carrying some chemical/nuclear weapons experts I believe. Remember that?

I predict this will be proven before the next presidential election.


139 posted on 05/24/2006 12:50:25 PM PDT by girlangler (I'd rather be fishing)
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To: OXENinFLA
Thanks for the Ping OXEN.
Another unreported WMD smoking gun.
Not a bit surprised.

 

140 posted on 05/24/2006 12:57:13 PM PDT by Smartass (Vaya con Dios - And forgive us our trash baskets as we forgive those who put trash in our baskets)
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To: avacado

Yes, I think they were just combining nasty terms.


141 posted on 05/24/2006 12:57:17 PM PDT by spunkets
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To: girlangler
They all say the WMD do exist, and are now in Syria

SARINDAR

142 posted on 05/24/2006 1:02:37 PM PDT by SittinYonder (Ic ■Št gehate, ■Št ic heonon nelle fleon fotes trym, ac wille fur­or gan,)
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To: jveritas
Do you all remember the story from February 2004 where they found a 7 pound block of Sodium Cyanide in the safehouse of a known terrorist chemical expert?

7 pounds of cyanide found in raid of Baghdad house

Cyanide Salt Block Found in Iraq

Cyanide Salt Block/Zarqawi Safe House Found in Iraq, Fox

Iraq Raid Yields Cyanide Linked to Al Qaeda

-PJ

143 posted on 05/24/2006 1:09:50 PM PDT by Political Junkie Too (It's still not safe to vote Democrat.)
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To: Political Junkie Too

WOW!!! Thanks for the this, Now we have over 1100 pounds of Cyanide salt i.e. Sodium Cyanide.


144 posted on 05/24/2006 2:31:53 PM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: jveritas

The number of views on this thread is interesting. This thread in terms of views is out doing most all other threads.

It must be the MSM checking in on their sealed fate of DOOM.


145 posted on 05/24/2006 3:11:03 PM PDT by avacado
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To: jveritas

HERE IS SOME STUFF OF INTEREST

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/843133/posts

very good chart


146 posted on 05/24/2006 4:12:10 PM PDT by CHICAGOFARMER (12 TH GENERATION PATROIT.)
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To: avacado

I am hoping my fellow freeper that we will eventually find the ultimate document or doucments that seal forever the fate of liberals and their media and expose all their lies that they have been spewing for the last three years against the Iraq war and President Bush.


147 posted on 05/24/2006 6:35:13 PM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: CHICAGOFARMER

Thanks.


148 posted on 05/24/2006 6:39:39 PM PDT by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: JustDoItAlways

BTTT to read later.


149 posted on 05/24/2006 8:35:13 PM PDT by mjaneangels@aolcom
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To: jveritas

"...SODIUM CYANIDE (NaCN), HYDROCHLORIC ACID ( HCL), and SULFURIC ACID (H2SO4)."

Maybe the Iraqi brass was just using this to keep their surrender hankies white...brown-nosing stains are stubborn.


150 posted on 05/25/2006 9:19:17 AM PDT by WestTexasWend
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