Officer praises Haditha marines

SMH.com.au ^ | 6/7/06 | Adam Tanner

[pissant]

AN OFFICER who once led the US marine platoon later accused of killing 24 civilians in Haditha has said his unit acted with restraint and a firm moral compass in earlier engagements.

First Lieutenant Jesse Grapes, 27, led his 43-man platoon during months of fighting so fierce that three were killed and about half were wounded.

He left the platoon in August, three months before the incident in which some men who had been under his command are alleged to have killed innocent Haditha civilians in anger over the death of a fellow soldier.

"I can honestly say that throughout my time with the marines I knew, they served themselves and their country with honour and courage, and were guided by a strong moral compass," he said on Tuesday, in his first interview since news of the Haditha killings sparked fresh outrage over the US war in Iraq.

"I can think of a number of incidents where it could have been easy for them to lose that moral compass, and they never did."

Lieutenant Grapes, who now runs a school in Silicon Valley, California, said that in more than five months of "intense" patrols around Falluja, only once did he see a soldier fire a gun in anger.

In that incident, just outside Falluja, he said Lance Corporal Miguel Terrazas - whose death later appeared to trigger the rampage in Haditha - angrily shot an Iraqi leaving the scene after setting off an explosive device that killed a member of the platoon. Terrazas later received a commendation for his actions.

"He was probably the most popular marine in the platoon of 43," said Lieutenant Grapes, who volunteered for the military immediately after the September 11 attacks. "It was almost impossible not to love him."

Despite his pride in his platoon, Lieutenant Grapes said it was possible some of the marines were involved in misdeeds in Haditha. The military is now investigating the killings and some expect murder charges to be laid against key figures.

"These marines have been under a great amount of duress for long periods of time and seeing lots of terrible things," he said.

"It's not exonerating it in any way, but it provides some back story. I'm personally heartbroken that this occurred for all parties - for the Iraqis, for the marines involved."

The death toll among Iraqi civilians continues to soar. May was the bloodiest month in Baghdad since the war began, with nearly 1400 civilians murdered in targeted killings and many more dying in bomb blasts.

[pissant]

And America praises the Haditha Marines and condemns the traitors who aid our enemies.

[ken5050]

Remember the false story from Fallujah last year..an NBC videotape supposedly showed a Marine shooting an unarmed civilian..IIRC, it then turned out the guy was playing possum and had hand grenades concealed under his body..

[pissant]

I remember that well. ANd I remeber the hundreds of MSM stories trumpeting the "massacre" in Jenin told by the enemies of Israel. Islamo-fascists are liars, and the MSM knows it, yet they don't care, because they are allies in the war against western civilization.

This despite the fact that they would either execute people like Pinchy Sulzberger or castrate him and make him wear a burkha.

[mad_as_he$$]

There was a story from AP (of all MSM) last week by a reporter who spent time with these same Marines. He had nothing but praise for them. More and more this story stinks.

[jazusamo]

It's refreshing to read a positive story about these Marines who have risked all for us.

[pissant]

It's rotten to the core.

[DJ Taylor]

"More and more this story stinks."

"When a Muslim tells an untruth for the purpose of deceiving an Infidel, God does not consider it to be a lie."

[Coop]

I honestly didn't find it refreshing. The author made sure to conclude with the usual remarks about our troops being overstressed, and then had a big finale with the bloodiest month for Iraqi civilians. Pretty much business as usual.

[pissant]

Refreshing due to rarity. Somebody might be fired for this breach of MSM protocol.

[RobRoy]

From the article in this thread:

And this bears repeating:

Would Muslims lie in order to obtain blood money payments? Some insight comes in this response to the collapse of the British trial posted online by a Baghdad-based US contractor.

I've been in Iraq for about 18 months now performing construction management. It is simply not possible for me to exaggerate the massive amounts of lies we wade through every single day. There is no way - absolutely none - to determine facts from bulls*** from these people.

To be fair to individual Iraqis, lying and deception is an integral part of their culture. It is not even considered lying to them; it is more akin to being clever - like keeping your cards close to your chest. And they don’t just lie to westerners. They believe that appearances--saving face--are of paramount importance. They lie to each other all the time about anything in order to leverage others on a deal or manipulate an outcome of some sort or cover up some major or minor embarrassment. It’s just how they do things, period.

I’m not trying to disparage them here. I get along great with a lot of them. But even among those that I like, if something happens I’ll get 50 wildly different stories, every time. There’s no comparison to it in any other part of the world where I’ve worked. The lying is ubiquitous and constant.

Obviously in the case of these soldiers, the “witnesses” were lying with malice for profit - saving face had nothing to do with it.

But every Westerner here has been taken totally by surprise by the lies upon lies upon BS and lies. It makes it impossible to form any agreements, impossible to plan anything, and impossible to investigate anything….

Remember this every time you see news reports where Iraqi “witnesses” say that American planes killed a bunch of civilians somewhere…. First, those people are living under the threat of terrorists in their midst - what do you think they are going to say when a western camera is thrust into their face, nice shot America! Death to the terrorists! They’d be dead in 5 minutes.

It drives those of us who work closely with the Iraqis absolutely mad. It makes me sick and alarmed to think of any westerner being brought up on charges of any kind based strictly on the words of an Arab. I’m sure the prosecutors were informed by field officers and others about the Iraqi propensity to lie about everything all the time. Shame on them (the British Ministry of Defense) for going forward without any other evidence.

[RobRoy]

Oops. the thread is here: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1642134/posts

[pissant]

Still, a step up for the MSM.

[pissant]

Yep, this hits the nail on the head.

[geezerwheezer]

Don't suppose the demorats are Iraqi citizens do you -as they lie all of the time too!

[pissant]

They are worse, quite frankly.

[Mogollon]

Sean Hannity told the story of a little girl at the Haditha house where this took place: The little girl said she woke up and heard the marines coming and knew the "bomb" was going to go off so she covered up her ears.

Could it be that her family had some involvement with the roadside IED?? /sarc off

[pissant]

that same girl told 3 different versions of the story to 3 interviewers.

[GOP_Party_Animal]

It is simply not possible for me to exaggerate the massive amounts of lies we wade through every single day.

Wow, I never knew about that part of their culture. It must be endlessly frustrating.

[delacoert]

List of recent Haditha incident threads:

• Officer praises Haditha marines. Source: Sunday Morning Harold ^, on 06/07/2006 9:04:24 AM CDT by pissant. (17 replies)
• US military personnel do more good than harm. Source: The Christian Science Monitor ^, on 06/07/2006 8:58:55 AM CDT by presidio9. (9 replies)
• The Haditha Stratagem (we've been set-up...of course). Source: The American Thinker ^, on 06/07/2006 7:16:01 AM CDT by Dark Skies. (17 replies)
• 'Lawfare' Over Haditha (The administration's domestic opponents play into the enemy's hands) . Source: Opinion Journal ^, on 06/07/2006 5:16:52 AM CDT by IrishMike. (39 replies)
• Media dance macabre. Source: Washington Times ^, on 06/07/2006 12:40:58 AM CDT by duckln. (23 replies)
• Air Force Hero To Defend Accused Marines. Source: aero-news.net ^, on 06/07/2006 12:27:45 AM CDT by Names Ash Housewares. (103 replies)
• Senate to hold hearings on Iraq massacre - Haditha. Source: AP on Yahoo ^, on 06/06/2006 9:16:17 PM CDT by NormsRevenge. (81 replies)
• Warner Wants Hearings on Haditha. Source: ABC News ^, on 06/06/2006 9:06:35 PM CDT by xzins. (29 replies)
• [Blog] A Smear You Can't Take back. Source: MichelleMalkin.com ^, on 06/06/2006 7:42:05 PM CDT by jimboster. (26 replies)
• Letter From Iraq (Blasts the MSM) . Source: WSJ ^, on 06/06/2006 6:16:18 PM CDT by pissant. (12 replies)
• [Blog] Did Marine Haditha Photographer Have A Personal Motive?. Source: AP on Sweetness & Light ^, on 06/06/2006 11:30:47 AM CDT by Sam Hill. (42 replies)
• The Press and the Rush to Judgment. Source: New York Sun ^, on 06/06/2006 9:52:07 AM CDT by Coop. (33 replies)
• U.S. Curbs Iraqi Civilian Deaths In Checkpoint, Convoy Incidents. Source: Wall Street Journal ^, on 06/06/2006 8:23:03 AM CDT by Tolerance Sucks Rocks. (5 replies)
• [Vanity] Hannity and Liberal Nutbag go at it. Source: Hannity and Combs, on 06/05/2006 8:58:20 PM CDT by pabianice. (55 replies)
• Haditha: On the Ground. Source: Foxnews ^, on 06/05/2006 8:59:40 PM CDT by pissant. (49 replies)
• [Blog] Time's McGirk Wanted To Call Haditha "A Massacre". Source: New York Observer on Sweetness & Light ^, on 06/05/2006 2:20:16 PM CDT by Sam Hill. (50 replies)
• Haditha: reasonable Doubt. Source: Hawaii Reporter ^, on 06/05/2006 1:31:50 PM CDT by AndrewWalden. (16 replies)
• Media's Vietnam sin drone. Source: Washington Times ^, on 06/05/2006 12:07:27 PM CDT by pissant. (5 replies)
• “Supporting” the Troops--Why has the mass media already convicted the "Haditha" Marines?. Source: FrontPageMagazine.com ^, on 06/05/2006 7:35:51 AM CDT by SJackson. (45 replies)
• Muttering madman Murtha (pile of doo-doo that keeps coming out of your mouth). Source: World Net Daily ^, on 06/05/2006 7:30:08 AM CDT by IrishMike. (15 replies)
• How innocent are the 'innocents' at haditha ? (the cover-up by the MSM lynch mob). Source: Democracy Project ^, on 06/05/2006 6:42:06 AM CDT by IrishMike. (49 replies)
• [Blog] The Haditha Killings. Source: Michael Yon's Frontline Forum ^, on 06/05/2006 1:16:14 AM CDT by Starman417. (6 replies)
• How Haditha Came to Light. Source: Time ^, on 06/04/2006 10:08:05 PM CDT by MinorityRepublican. (52 replies)
• [Blog] A Brief Comparison of Haditha and St. Lo . Source: NewsBusters ^, on 06/04/2006 11:52:53 AM CDT by Congressman Billybob. (31 replies)
• Haditha, Hotbed of 'haddis or Guilt on the Western Front. Source: Newsmax ^, on 06/04/2006 10:46:23 AM CDT by Valkeri. (7 replies)
• Robert Riech - "We don't know how many Haditha's there are out there" -- Video. Source: This Week on ABC ^, on 06/04/2006 9:24:59 AM CDT by FreedomNeocon. (58 replies)
• Fantastic FR post 'Haditha uncovered' with thorough analysis and links. Source: Post #222 in Sunday Morning Talk Show Thread 4 June 2006, on 06/04/2006 9:11:06 AM CDT by Phsstpok.
• Take atrocity claims with grains of salt (Four BIG Reasons). Source: NY DailyNews ^, on 06/04/2006 8:53:18 AM CDT by IrishMike. (31 replies)
• Haditha killings could haunt the GOP in the midterm elections (BS Barf Alert). Source: Newsweek on MSNBC ^, on 06/04/2006 8:30:26 AM CDT by TSchmereL. (13 replies)
• Mark Steyn: Events at Haditha don't change need for victory . Source: Chicago Sun-Times ^, on 06/04/2006 4:22:14 AM CDT by croak. (61 replies)
• Fight a more sensitive, ethical war, troops told. Source: Scotsman.com ^, on 06/03/2006 10:13:28 PM CDT by EnigmaticAnomaly. (95 replies)
• Iraqi survivor wants U.S. troops executed (Haditha). Source: Yahoo! News ^, on 06/03/2006 4:52:25 PM CDT by El Conservador. (53 replies)
• What's Lost in the Hue and Cry Over Haditha. Source: Washington Post ^, on 06/03/2006 2:09:50 PM CDT by baseball_fan. (26 replies)
• [Blog] Innocent Until Proven Guilty...Unless You're A Marine . Source: GOP USA ^, on 06/03/2006 11:37:49 AM CDT by smoothsailing. (70 replies)
• [Satire] War Journalists Get ‘Core Values Training’. Source: ScrappleFace ^, on 06/03/2006 11:36:11 AM CDT by Kaslin. (2 replies)
• [Blog] UK Times Smears our Marines. Source: Michelle Malkin.Com ^, started on 06/03/2006 11:13:05 AM CDT by spanalot. (17 relies)
            See also Duplicate thread on 06/03/2006 3:20:19 PM CDT by GilGil. (17 replies)
• [Blog] Haditha 'Massacre' Source Once Jailed By US Troops. Source: Right Stream News ^, started on 06/03/2006 11:10:11 AM CDT CDT by HHKrepublican_2. (57 relies)
• Haditha Child: I Knew of Bomb Plot to Kill Marines. Source: NewsMax.com ^, started on 06/03/2006 10:26:22 AM CDT CDT by Carl/NewsMax. (177 replies)
• Haditha killings recall Vietnam's My Lai . Source: AP on Yahoo ^, started on 06/02/2006 8:52:09 PM CDT CDT by NormsRevenge. (50 replies)
• GIs at Ishaqi cleared; Haditha probe open. Source: Yahoo!News ^, started on 06/02/2006 8:10:29 PM CDT CDT by Kaslin. (21 replies)
• Hell & Haditha. Source: National Review Online ^, started on 06/02/2006 7:32:45 PM CDT CDT by SuzyQ2. (108 replies)
• Haditha Investigation Doesn't Reflect Majority of Troops, General Says. Source: American Forces Press Service ^, started on 06/02/2006 6:25:17 PM CDT by SandRat. (4 replies)
• Kristol: Haditha Handwringing (The last thing we need is hand-wringing liberalism). Source: The Weekly Standard ^, started on 06/02/2006 4:19:55 PM CDT by RWR8189. (17 replies)
• U.S. Military Denies New Abuse Allegations at Ishaqi (Marines Exonerated from Killings). Source: abcnews ^, started on 06/02/2006 2:43:57 PM CDT by demlosers. (85 replies)
• As accusations mount, Iraq furor grows. Source: AP/Yahoo ^, started on 06/02/2006 2:29:22 PM CDT by tobyhill. (90 replies)
• U.S. accused in more Iraq civilian deaths . Source: AP via Yahoooo ^, started on 06/02/2006 12:44:12 PM CDT by ARealMothersSonForever. (37 replies)
• Questions Arise About Haditha Doctor - Wahid al-Obeidi - Central Figure In "Massacre" Case. Source: Pipeline News ^, started on 06/02/2006 12:41:28 PM by pissant. (17 replies)
• BBC: Taking the Insurgents' Word For It. Source: NRO ^, started on 06/02/2006 12:34:36 PM CDT by pissant. (36 replies)
• Haditha Marines and Duke LaCrosse players. Source: American Thinker ^, started on 06/02/2006 12:26:53 PM CDT pissant. (24 replies)
• Marine Irked at Inclusion in Haditha Case. Source: AP on Washington Post^, started on 06/02/2006 11:53:21 AM by LSUfan. (24 replies)
• Marine Brass Seem Exonerated (And I predict, so will the Enlisted!). Source: The Washington Times ^, started on 06/02/2006 11:13:25 AM CDT by kellynla. (120 replies)
• [Vanity & Blog] Haditha, Iraq: What it should mean.. Source: JEFFHEAD.COM ^, started on 06/02/2006 10:17:29 AM CDT by Jeff Head. (107 replies)
• Haditha reporter's and doctor's backgrounds (motives emerging). Source: American Thinker ^, started on 06/02/2006 9:10:03 AM CDT by teddyballgame. (54 replies)
• Keeping the Faith (Some thoughts about Haditha, the war in Iraq, and historic context.). Source: The American Prowler ^, started on 06/02/2006 1:52:28 AM CDT by nickcarraway. (24 replies)
• Haditha: Blood Money, Lies and Videotape?. Source: Front Page Mag ^, started on 06/01/2006 11:09:03 PM CDT by beaversmom. (77 replies)
• Officers Likely to Be Charged in Haditha Killings, Sources Say. Source: ABC News ^, started on 06/01/2006 10:15:24 PM CDT by NormsRevenge. (87 replies)
• Investigators of Haditha Shootings Look to Exhume Bodies. Source: The Washington Post ^, started on 06/01/2006 9:46:12 PM CDT by WildPlum. (19 replies)
            See also Duplicate thread by kristinn. (109 replies)
• Haditha Doctor Was Arrested, Hates US Too (article has different title). Source: Uruknet ^, started on 06/01/2006 8:44:39 PM CDT by Sam Hill. (156 replies)
• Slain Marine's Kin Blasts John Murtha . Source: NewsMax ^, started on 06/01/2006 7:26:06 PM CDT by Aussie Dasher . (40 replies)
• Haditha Reporter Was Jailed By US, Shares Name With Source (Sweetness & Light). Source: Reuters on Yahoo ^, started on 06/01/2006 5:24:18 PM CDT by Sam Hill. (123 replies)
            See also Duplicate thread by Thebaddog. (44 replies)
• New 'Iraq massacre' tape emerges. Source: BBC ^, started on 06/01/2006 5:19:46 PM CDT by Axlrose. (149 replies)
• Freep a poll! (Haditha. Criminal act or accident?). Source: Pasadena Star-news ^, started on 06/01/2006 3:51:22 PM CDT by dynachrome. (63 replies)
• Marine officer a "political casualty" of Haditha investigation. Source: AP ^, started on 06/01/2006 3:51:16 PM CDT by NormsRevenge. (66 replies)
• Survivors say Marines went house to house in a rage. Source: Seattle Times ^, started on 06/01/2006 1:59:32 PM CDT by edpc. (107 replies)
• U.S. Troops in Iraq to Get Ethics Training( Iraq opens own probe of civilian deaths). Source: The Washington Times ^, started on 06/01/2006 1:46:43 PM CDT by kellynla. (20 replies)
• The Real Haditha The MSM Won't Tell Us (article has different title). Source: The Gaurdian ^, started on 06/01/2006 11:11:58 AM CDT by AmericanYankee. (99 replies)
            See also Duplicate thread: The Haditha Our Media Won’t Tell You About by Sam Hill. (42 replies)
            See also Duplicate thread: Guardian [UK] via NavySeals.com on 06/04/2006 5:27:23 PM CDT by blasater1960. (37 replies)
            See also Duplicate thread on 06/05/2006 7:37:09 AM CDT by SJackson. (14 replies)
• A Town Awoke to Slaughter (Haditha. Get your Barf Bag out!) . Source: Los Angeles Times ^, started on 06/01/2006 9:52:47 AM CDT by kellynla. (26 replies)
• Rep. Murtha: Semper Fi?. Source: The American Thinker ^, started on 06/01/2006 9:28:55 AM CDT by Quilla. (55 replies)
• Pentagon Haditha inquiry finds false reports- WPost. Source: Reuters ^, started on 06/01/2006 9:06:38 AM CDT by delacoert. (50 replies)
• Marine injured in Haditha talks about massacre (see the Video Interview). Source: King5 Seattle News ^, started on 06/01/2006 8:13:43 AM CDT by bobsunshine. (116 replies)
• Family of slain Marine doubts Haditha reports (New interview + great tribute). Source: MSNBC/AP ^, started on 05/31/2006 8:01:26 PM CDT by pissant. (81 replies)
            See also Duplicate thread by LSUfan. (25 replies)
• Probe Finds Haditha Killings Unprovoked. Source: Reuters ^, started on 05/31/2006 6:01:53 PM CDT by Types_with_Fist. (552 replies)
• White House: Haditha details to be public. Source: AP/Yahoo ^, started on 05/31/2006 8:20:21 AM CDT by Coop. (508 replies)
• Father of Marine Backs Son's Iraq Comrades. Source: Forbes/AP ^, started on 05/31/2006 1:02:15 PM CDT by pissant. (122 replies)
• A reporter's shock at the Haditha allegation (Was embedded with Marines - different perspective). Source: CNN ^, started on 05/30/2006 2:49:13 PM CDT by gondramB. (97 replies)
• Iraqis' Accounts Link Marines to the Mass Killing of Civilians. Source: New York Times ^, started on 05/30/2006 2:03:35 PM CDT by delacoert. (64 replies)
• Pilotless plane took video of town where Iraqis died (Important). Source: Mercury News/WaPost ^, started on 05/30/2006 12:13:00 PM CDT by pissant. (427 replies)
• On a Marine Base, Disbelief Over Charges. Source: New York Times ^, started on 05/30/2006 8:00:23 AM CDT by Peach. (308 replies)
• Drone's Video May Aid Marine Inquiry. Source: Washington Post ^, started on 05/29/2006 11:45:20 PM CDT by Lancey Howard. (84 replies)
• Evidence of massacre by Marines caught on film. Source: The Courier Mail ^, started on 05/29/2006 10:36:31 PM CDT by MinorityRepublican. (246 replies)
• Marine at Haditha: 'I Can Still Smell the Blood'. Source: ABC News ^, started on 05/29/2006 8:12:03 PM CDT by marli (438 replies)
• Probe Finds Marines Killed Unarmed Iraqi Civilians. Source: Los Angeles Times ^, started on 05/27/2006 6:37:13 AM CDT by billorites. (70 replies)

Related articles:

• Collateral Damage or Civilian Massacre in Haditha? old (Mar. 19, 2006)
• Pendleton Marine dies in explosion old -- original? (Nov. 22, 2005)
• FACTBOX-Investigation into Haditha killings in Iraq
• New Witness Describes Alleged Iraq Atrocity
• Three versions from the surviving child (Safa Younis Salim):
  • Iraqis' Accounts Link Marines to the Mass Killing of Civilians
  • Iraqis: Marines Killed 24 Civilians
  • What happened in Haditha?
• Marines' families discuss Iraq incident
• Military Inquiry Contradicts Marines Account Of Haditha Deaths
• Military Inquiry Said to Oppose Account of Raid
• PAULA ZAHN NOW: Did U.S. Marines Commit Massacre in Iraq?; Interview With Pennsylvania Congressman John Murth

Video link:

ITN videos on Haditha

Most current list is on my profile page.

[pissant]

Thanks for the update!!!

[Txsleuth]

Thanks for the ping...

[jazusamo]

Thanks again delacoert, I've used the list several times already.

[Paperdoll]

It is said that few liars can recall their lies, thus their own mouths are their worst enemies.

[demlosers]

Thanks for the good work. :)

[Just A Nobody]

Yes it is! Thanks for the ping.

[Just A Nobody]

Lieutenant Grapes ... said ... only once did he see a soldier fire a gun in anger.

In that incident, just outside Falluja, ... shot an Iraqi leaving the scene after setting off an explosive device that killed a member of the platoon.

Why is this considered firing in anger? Are we not in a war? Would this not be SOP? Sometimes I become very confused reading this stuff.

[pissant]

Slick Willie was exceptionally good at it.

[pissant]

Maybe he was not sure that it was the right guy. Not sure, but I'd have shot anyone near it.

[Paul Ross]

Why is this considered firing in anger? Are we not in a war? Would this not be SOP? Sometimes I become very confused reading this stuff.

Sometimes wonder if the Rules of Engagement are issued by the Xlintonites, who Bush refuses to clean house of...

[Just A Nobody]

I'd have shot anyone near it.

Ditto!

[Just A Nobody]

I'm not sure, but IIRC, the ROE have been in place for some time.

What Xlintonites would be in charge of this? Are they not military? Does the President have the option of cleaning house to rid us of them?

[Paul Ross]

What Xlintonites would be in charge of this? Are they not military?

Remember Weasley Clark? Gen. John Shalikashvili? Maj. Gen. Franklin Hagenbeck – with his MS degree in exercise physiology (but no combat experience)? These weren't all alone in the Pentagon. There are, as David Hackworth described, many "Perfumed Princes" stinking up the joint still.

One example during this Bush Administration, post 9-11:

On D-Day during America's first strike in Afghanistan, the cross hairs of an unmanned Predator's air-to-ground missile were locked dead center on Mullah Omar's forehead. But just as the Taliban's capo di tutti capi was about to receive his one-way ticket to Paradise courtesy of U.S. technology, a military lawyer in Tampa, Florida shouted, stop!

As an more-recent example, think about the degree of ongoing, still current cover-up required to do what was done to try and bury the findings of the ABLE DANGER data mining operation of the US Army...Curt Weldon statement in Congressional Quarterly.

For your information, Jamie Gorelick, before Xlinton appointed her to the Justice Dept. to screw up its ability to track and interdict terrorists and spies, with "The Wall", also had been appointed to DOD Deputy General Counsel in 1993...and created yet another Wall there. She continued to interfere with memos on The Wall from at least 1995 on. And then we saw her act as Xlinton CleanUp Crew in the 9-11 Commission.

Does the President have the option of cleaning house to rid us of them?

Yes. But unexercised. Just like his veto pen.

[JasonC]

The Lt is simply being literal. Marines shoot all the time while emotionally calm. They swear and rant all the time with the safety on. It was the only time he was there, when he saw a Marine physically angry, emotional, mad, and at the same time firing. He was justified in being mad and in firing, on that occasion. But it was the only one out of 43 people for months, where physical anger and physical firing coincided.

[cricket]

Thanks for the ping. . .and a bump. . .

[Doogle]

....this is becoming more and more a MSM witch hunt.
The FACT that more rants ARE NOT coming out makes me believe that this story is being fabricated by the far left in an effort to discredit our military. Iraqi's lie like we
blink, and anything the enemy says the liberal media, and people who wish this country harm are going to use it.

Mullah Murtha is a disgrace, he needs to be held accountable for aiding and abetting the enemy. His actions only encourage the insurgents and will have a negative effect on the war effort, sadly resulting in more American deaths and prolonging the conflict.


Doogle

[pissant]

Prolonging it yes, but not stopping the great march of our armed forces. He needs to be tried and hanged.

See this post on the "witnesses" the MSM has solely relied upon.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1645216/posts

[freema]

Ping

[strategofr]

"I've been in Iraq for about 18 months now performing construction management. It is simply not possible for me to exaggerate the massive amounts of lies we wade through every single day. There is no way - absolutely none - to determine facts from bulls*** from these people."

Yes, there are suspicious aspects. Did Americans ultimately get to perform autopsies---or are we relying on the Iraqi autopsy? If American autopsies were performed, was there reliable positive ID on the bodies?

Finally, if these Marines are innocent, do they still have any chance at all of a fair trial? Supposedly(according to the lawyer of one of the defendants, on Savage's show) the Marines are already in shackles and being threatened with capital punishment. Is it possible that our military establishment has decided to sacrifice these guys?

[RobRoy]

It could be just really tough talk by the marines to soften the blow later when they exonerate them.

It could be sort of a twist on the "good cop, bad cop" thing.

[strategofr]

"It could be just really tough talk by the marines to soften the blow later when they exonerate them.

It could be sort of a twist on the "good cop, bad cop" thing."

maybe.

[Marine_Uncle]

This whole deal stinks to the core, the way these Marines are being treated if indeed what we are reading in the various articles are indeed true. I cannot visualize how say a whole patrol or even a team of Marines would have somehow snapped, knowing they simply are not allowed to kill innocents. And they demonstrate on a regular basis they go out of their way to help innocent Iraqi, not do them any harm.

[SE Mom]

You make excellent points- in order for us to believe this took place in the way we're told- you would have to imagine them all drinking the koolaide at the exact same moment...

[Marine_Uncle]

"You make excellent points- in order for us to believe this took place in the way we're told- you would have to imagine them all drinking the koolaide at the exact same moment..."
And surely our Marines would prefere a cold beer to koolaide any day. They serve with HONOR. I have personally rubbed hands with enough of them over the past three years plus in visits to Marine bases, on visits with my nephew to know full well the type of grunts,NCO's, and officers on the ground in Iraq. They don't go around shooting innocent people. They go out of their way to avoid shooting are doing any harm to those trapped (held by the filth bags that use them as shields), often when they realize one of those filth bags might get lucky and shoot someone in a patrol or platoon. I salute them and love them. And that goes for all our men and women in uniform doing their best to serve with honor and duty bound to do the right thing.

[IrishMike]

Thanks for keeping track, great post !

[strategofr]

"It could be just really tough talk by the marines to soften the blow later when they exonerate them.

It could be sort of a twist on the "good cop, bad cop" thing."

I don't think so. The problem with that is they are making them look guilty now---which will just make the Marines look worse if they release them later.

[Unicorn]

God bless the US Marines.