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Judge Rules That U.S. Has Broad Powers to Detain Noncitizens Indefinitely
NY Times ^ | June 15, 2006 | NINA BERNSTEIN

Posted on 06/15/2006 1:41:05 AM PDT by neverdem

A federal judge in Brooklyn ruled yesterday that the government has wide latitude under immigration law to detain noncitizens on the basis of religion, race or national origin, and to hold them indefinitely without explanation.

The ruling came in a class-action lawsuit by Muslim immigrants detained after 9/11, and it dismissed several key claims the detainees had made against the government. But the judge, John Gleeson of United States District Court for the Eastern District of New York, allowed the lawsuit to continue on other claims, mostly that the conditions of confinement were abusive and unconstitutional. Judge Gleeson's decision requires top federal officials, including former Attorney General John Ashcroft and Robert S. Mueller III, the F.B.I. director, to answer to those accusations under oath.

This is the first time a federal judge has addressed the issue of discrimination in the treatment of hundreds of Muslim immigrants who were swept up in the weeks after the 2001 terror attacks and held for months before they were cleared of links to terrorism and deported. The roundups drew intense criticism, not only from immigrant rights advocates, but also from the inspector general of the Justice Department, who issued reports saying that the government had made little or no effort to distinguish between genuine suspects and Muslim immigrants with minor visa violations.

Lawyers in the suit, who vowed to appeal yesterday's decision, said parts of the ruling could potentially be used far more broadly, to detain any noncitizen in the United States for any reason.

"This decision is a green light to racial profiling and prolonged detention of noncitizens at the whim of the president," said Rachel Meeropol, a lawyer for the Center for Constitutional Rights, which represented the detainees. "The decision is profoundly disturbing because it legitimizes the fact that the Bush administration..."

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: District of Columbia; US: New York; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: court; courts; immigration; jurisdiction; jurisprudence; refugees; sovereignty; standing; terrorism
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Rachel Meeropol, IIRC, is the granddaughter of the convicted and executed Julius and Ehtel Rosenberg. Pardon me, but this is why the left must be monitored, i.e. reading the NY Times.
1 posted on 06/15/2006 1:41:08 AM PDT by neverdem
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To: neverdem
The decision is profoundly disturbing because it legitimizes the fact that the Bush administration...

I love how the excerpt places it perfectly. There's their objection. It makes things legitimate. Whoops, sorry, lefties, you lost. But please, don't get over it, keep fighting. It helps.

As to the ruling - what a shocker here. Pretty much has been established law since the founding of the nation, and to overturn it would be to say that most actions since the founding were illegal. You really can't pull that type of thing.
2 posted on 06/15/2006 1:44:45 AM PDT by kingu (Yeah, I'll vote in 2006, just as soon as a party comes along who listens.)
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To: neverdem; All

Pardon me, but that's Ethel Rosenberg.


3 posted on 06/15/2006 1:45:32 AM PDT by neverdem (May you be in heaven a half hour before the devil knows that you're dead.)
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To: neverdem
>>A federal judge in Brooklyn ruled yesterday that the government has wide latitude under immigration law to detain noncitizens on the basis of religion, race or national origin, and to hold them indefinitely without explanation.<<

If this stands I wonder if this will be reciprocal - will we accept that other countries have the right to hold Americans who violate their visas (or don't have a visa) indefinitely without explanation?
4 posted on 06/15/2006 1:47:18 AM PDT by gondramB (We may have done a lill' bit of fightin amongst ourselves but you outside people best leave us alone)
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To: gondramB
will we accept that other countries have the right to hold Americans who violate their visas (or don't have a visa) indefinitely without explanation?

We already do.

L

5 posted on 06/15/2006 1:49:58 AM PDT by Lurker ("They still see you as the infidel, the other, and they'll still kill you. " Mark Steyn)
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To: neverdem
Excellent catch! Of course, the NY Slimes would never give a reader the context or background and motivations of a leftist's opinions....knowing this person's relatives were executed SPIES against America might inform the casual reader of the Slimes.
6 posted on 06/15/2006 1:50:45 AM PDT by Recovering_Democrat (I am SO glad to no longer be associated with the party of "dependence on government"!)
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To: neverdem
BTTT
7 posted on 06/15/2006 1:53:16 AM PDT by nopardons
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To: neverdem
Rachel Meeropol, IIRC, is the granddaughter of the convicted and executed Julius and Ehtel Rosenberg.

Nicely spotted!
8 posted on 06/15/2006 1:53:17 AM PDT by TheWasteLand
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To: neverdem

>>Pardon me, but that's Ethel Rosenberg.<<

I thought they got their charges presented, had lawyers and a trial. I'm pretty sure they were even allowed to appeal and it eventually got to the supreme court.


9 posted on 06/15/2006 1:56:46 AM PDT by gondramB (We may have done a lill' bit of fightin amongst ourselves but you outside people best leave us alone)
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To: neverdem
SHOCKER: Judge Gleeson is a CLINTON appointee!



John Gleeson was appointed as a United States District Judge on September 28,1994, and entered on duty on October 24, 1994. Judge Gleeson went to college at Georgetown University and received his law degree in 1980 from the University of Virginia School of Law. After serving as a law clerk for a year for the Hon. Boyce F. Martin, Jr., United States Circuit Judge in the Sixth Circuit, Judge Gleeson was a litigation associate at Cravath, Swaine & Moore from 1981 to 1985.

Gleeson bio

10 posted on 06/15/2006 1:59:51 AM PDT by Recovering_Democrat (I am SO glad to no longer be associated with the party of "dependence on government"!)
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To: Recovering_Democrat; nopardons; TheWasteLand

If I didn't catch it, I should be declared demented. All this idiocy about not reading the NY Times dumfounds me. It's their party organ, without any shame!


11 posted on 06/15/2006 2:03:57 AM PDT by neverdem (May you be in heaven a half hour before the devil knows that you're dead.)
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To: neverdem

Spot on....now go read your FREEPmail. :-)


12 posted on 06/15/2006 2:05:23 AM PDT by nopardons
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To: neverdem

She's Also head of the Lawyer's Union (new York??) , a COMMUNIST PARTY organization.......

Funny how the NYT will NEVER tell you she's an avowed Communist, eh??


13 posted on 06/15/2006 2:06:14 AM PDT by tcrlaf (Liberalism-What a Pagan Religion...)
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To: neverdem

Thank you Judge Gleeson. It is a prudent and reasonable ruling on what the law actually is.


14 posted on 06/15/2006 2:20:25 AM PDT by Rapscallion (They're not pro-America; they're democrats first.)
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Comment #15 Removed by Moderator

To: neverdem
Amendment XIV
1. ... nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
16 posted on 06/15/2006 3:01:29 AM PDT by StACase
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To: neverdem
A spokesman for the government, Charles S. Miller, would not respond to those assertions, saying only that the Justice Department was "very pleased that the court upheld the decision to detain plaintiffs, all of whom were illegal aliens, until national security investigations were completed and plaintiffs were removed from the country." He said the government was reviewing the rest of the opinion to decide whether to appeal the rulings Judge Gleeson made to allow the plaintiffs' other claims to proceed.

I'd guess that most of these detainees are claiming they will be tortured if returned to their country of origin, and subsequently it may take years to get rid of them. In the meantime, releasing them with an order to appear for a deportation hearing has not exactly been effective in the past. If just one of them is released and subsequently commits a terrorist act, the media outcry of crocodile tears will have the usual element of amnesia with regard to the indefinite detention issue.

17 posted on 06/15/2006 3:01:51 AM PDT by browardchad
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To: neverdem

Are you the Spelling Police?? :O


18 posted on 06/15/2006 3:07:12 AM PDT by Shimmer128 (I thought that I was supposed to accomplish something before I was allowed to be proud of myself.)
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To: StACase
Amendment XIV 1. ... nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

This doesn't apply to ILLEGAL ALIENS, only to legal residents and citizens. People who are here illegally have no rights under the law. Spin all you want, the constitution is not for illegals, the constitution also gives each state the right to determine who is a legal resident or citizen within their state. Don't take one article out of context and try to justify illegal aliens being here and having rights. The only right they have is the right to be deported, and the sooner the better.

19 posted on 06/15/2006 3:57:29 AM PDT by calex59 (The '86 amnesty put us in the toilet, now the senate wants to flush it!)
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To: browardchad; raybbr
......I'd guess that most of these detainees are claiming they will be tortured if returned to their country of origin....

Nice take, all of it. Excerpting part I would reply to.........

The US government, and all of its trappings, and agencies, have been turned into a huge psychotherapy machine, designed to mobolize government power---and tax assets---to subsidize and shore-up the self-esteem problems of various hyphenated groups.

Anyone with a chip on their shoulder can claim victimization, persecution, discrmination, and is encouraged to apply for sanctuary on our shores which entitles then to numerous tax-subsidized financial benefits, head-of-the-line citizenship, and various other preference-based gov't programs.....all at our expense.

It's a big con game. To some of these scam artists, a day without "victimization" is like a day without sunshine.

Our lawmakers justify just about any tax-paid travesty as long as they're "feeling-good" about being "tolerant and compassionate" and can nail down campaign contributions and votes in the process, from various hyphenates.

20 posted on 06/15/2006 4:00:22 AM PDT by Liz (The US Constitution is intended to protect the people from the government.)
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To: neverdem

Okay Nelson, let's hear it : "Ha ha!"


21 posted on 06/15/2006 4:56:57 AM PDT by jmaroneps37 (John Spencer: Fighting to save America from Hillary Clinton..)
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To: neverdem

The rosenbergs: still undermining America, even from the grave.


22 posted on 06/15/2006 4:58:30 AM PDT by jmaroneps37 (John Spencer: Fighting to save America from Hillary Clinton..)
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To: StACase
Amendment XIV
1. ... nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

I think that the 13th Amendment is also probably relevant:

Amendment XIII

Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.

23 posted on 06/15/2006 5:09:31 AM PDT by snowsislander
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To: calex59

Just curious, but where do get that interpretation? The text of the 14th amendment just says, "...any person...", without specifying their citizenship status.
I don't like illegal immigration any more than any one else but I think all persons subject to US jurisdiction have "rights", even those jailed or interned.
There are many categories of people whose rights may be curtailed by circumstances or condition; serving soldiers, POWs, interned enemy aliens during wartime, convicted criminals, juveniles, those judged mentally unfit.


24 posted on 06/15/2006 7:28:00 AM PDT by skepsel
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To: neverdem

Hopefully he awarded attorney's fees... with extreme prejudice.


25 posted on 06/15/2006 8:19:22 AM PDT by thoughtomator (A thread without a comment on immigration is not complete)
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To: gondramB

"If this stands I wonder if this will be reciprocal - will we accept that other countries have the right to hold Americans who violate their visas (or don't have a visa) indefinitely without explanation?"

That was a rhetorical question, right?


26 posted on 06/15/2006 8:21:22 AM PDT by Poser (Willing to fight for oil)
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To: Recovering_Democrat
SHOCKER: Judge Gleeson is a CLINTON appointee!

The Rove mind meld is very powerful.

27 posted on 06/15/2006 8:21:22 AM PDT by Raycpa
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To: neverdem

Thanks for that info.


28 posted on 06/15/2006 8:24:57 AM PDT by MrCruncher
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To: skepsel

I forget the article and don't have time to look it up right now, you can research if you want, but ALL states, not the feds, have the right to determine who will be citizens or legal residents, this right is specifically given to the states. Also, use your head, if people who are here illegally have the same rights as legal residents and citizens then everyone, the world over, has those rights also, because not only are illegal aliens not legal residents, they are NON residents, they have no legal right to be here, therefore they have no rights other than to be treated humanely as we deport their criminal butts back to where they belong.


29 posted on 06/15/2006 8:40:20 AM PDT by calex59 (The '86 amnesty put us in the toilet, now the senate wants to flush it!)
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To: gondramB

Who would have thought it could happen in Brooklyn?


30 posted on 06/15/2006 9:36:22 AM PDT by conservative blonde (Conservative Blonde)
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To: neverdem
OMG!! The granddaughter of Communist spies is active against our CURRENT government!!

That LINK is VERY informative...Thanks!!

31 posted on 06/15/2006 9:50:41 AM PDT by Suzy Quzy ("When Cabals Go Kaboom"....upcoming book on Mary McCarthy's Coup-Plotters.)
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To: neverdem

"Rachel Meeropol, IIRC, is the granddaughter of the convicted and executed Julius and Ethel Rosenberg. "

The Meeropol name jumped out at me ... thanks for drawing that connection.
Traitors and enemies have enablers, and she seems happy to play that role.


32 posted on 06/15/2006 10:23:23 AM PDT by WOSG (Do your duty, be a patriot, support our Troops - VOTE!)
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To: calex59
Amendment XIV 1. ... nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

It was written without any of the exceptions that you find in the Bill of Rights. "Time of war or public danger etc." I have no idea why that wasn't put in there, but it wasn't. It says what it says.

33 posted on 06/15/2006 10:29:58 AM PDT by StACase
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To: browardchad

Strip away the hyperventilation of the lefwing ACLU types, and what you have is a ruling that says the US Government can detain illegal aliens of its choosing, while it investigates other potential risks and crimes of said individuals.

Govts ability to detain illegal aliens should not be in question, the ACLU types were trying to get some equalprotection get-out-jail-free card. No such luck.


34 posted on 06/15/2006 10:32:54 AM PDT by WOSG (Do your duty, be a patriot, support our Troops - VOTE!)
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To: neverdem
convicted and executed Julius and Ehtel Rosenberg

Convicted, executed, and proven indisputably guilty by the Venona transcripts. May they roast in hell. I spit on their graves.

-ccm

35 posted on 06/15/2006 10:36:49 AM PDT by ccmay (Too much Law; not enough Order)
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To: Suzy Quzy

Here's the lovely young traitoress.

-ccm

36 posted on 06/15/2006 10:40:38 AM PDT by ccmay (Too much Law; not enough Order)
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To: neverdem

>>Rachel Meeropol, IIRC, is the granddaughter of the convicted and executed Julius and Ehtel Rosenberg. Pardon me, but this is why the left must be monitored, i.e. reading the NY Times.<<

Hey lets be fair. Journalistic integrity requires the NY Times to diclose when someone has an obvious motive.

They printed the same day the faxt that Meeropol is the name that the Rosenberg boys took after their parent's death. Of course you had had to look in another section of the paper and read the bok reviews and then guess that Rachel was the daughter of one of the brother.


BTW, the book review makes it clear that the Rosenbergs were guilty and that the Meerpol's won't accept the obvious.

I guess mentioning that in the same story would have been an "inconvenient truth."

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9F02E2D6103BF932A1575AC0A9659C8B63

>>With the collapse of the Soviet Union, former K.G.B. agents began to talk, in particular Alexander Feklisov, who had been Julius Rosenberg's K.G.B. contact, and to whom Rosenberg had supplied classified military and industrial information. What did Meeropol make of that? Why should Feklisov be believed, he wondered; K.G.B. agents were hardly ''paragons of honesty.'' Then, in 1995, the Venona transcripts -- the decryptions of Soviet intelligence telegrams from the 1940's and 50's -- were released. The decrypted material told much of the story of an extensive military and industrial spy ring run by Julius Rosenberg, with Ethel's knowledge if not her participation; and the material confirmed the testimony of Ethel's brother, David Greenglass, about his recruitment by Julius to pass on to Harry Gold, a courier for the Soviets, whatever he could pick up about the atomic bomb from his work at Los Alamos.

Meeropol now had to deal with damaging information from a variety of sources (including old friends of the Rosenbergs). But such is the power of a fixed idea that Meeropol believed it was still possible that all of this evidence was ''no more than the clever creation of mirror images based on the known record.'' Finally, however, he was forced to reflect that innocence wasn't everything: ''Whatever actions'' his parents ''took sprang from their love of humanity,<<


37 posted on 06/15/2006 10:45:09 AM PDT by gondramB (We may have done a lill' bit of fightin amongst ourselves but you outside people best leave us alone)
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To: StACase
Amendment XIV
1. ... nor shall any State...


The federal government isn't a State.
38 posted on 06/15/2006 10:56:20 AM PDT by UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide (Give Them Liberty Or Give Them Death! - IT'S ISLAM, STUPID! - Islam Delenda Est! - Rumble thee forth)
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To: snowsislander
Amendment XIV
1. ... nor shall any State...


The federal government isn't a State.
39 posted on 06/15/2006 10:57:39 AM PDT by UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide (Give Them Liberty Or Give Them Death! - IT'S ISLAM, STUPID! - Islam Delenda Est! - Rumble thee forth)
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To: skepsel
Amendment XIV
1. ... nor shall any State...


The federal government isn't a State.
40 posted on 06/15/2006 10:58:16 AM PDT by UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide (Give Them Liberty Or Give Them Death! - IT'S ISLAM, STUPID! - Islam Delenda Est! - Rumble thee forth)
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To: StACase
Amendment XIV
1. ... nor shall any State...


The federal government isn't a State.
41 posted on 06/15/2006 10:59:06 AM PDT by UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide (Give Them Liberty Or Give Them Death! - IT'S ISLAM, STUPID! - Islam Delenda Est! - Rumble thee forth)
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To: ccmay

Fugly....Thank God for the Venona Papers!!


42 posted on 06/15/2006 11:03:12 AM PDT by Suzy Quzy ("When Cabals Go Kaboom"....upcoming book on Mary McCarthy's Coup-Plotters.)
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To: StACase

The Govt has the rightful power to detain illegal aliens lawbreakers, with or without a war going on. This isn't hard to figure out.


43 posted on 06/15/2006 1:12:31 PM PDT by WOSG (Do your duty, be a patriot, support our Troops - VOTE!)
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To: neverdem
"This decision is a green light to racial profiling..."

Goodness, I hope so.

44 posted on 06/15/2006 1:14:18 PM PDT by TChris ("Wake up, America. This is serious." - Ben Stein)
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To: WOSG

Well it certainly should have that rightful power, but it does seem to be at odds with that 14th amendment.

45 posted on 06/15/2006 1:48:59 PM PDT by StACase
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To: StACase

Government detention of illegal aliens is *not* against the 14th amendment, or our immigration laws would be a chaos.


46 posted on 06/15/2006 7:26:58 PM PDT by WOSG (Do your duty, be a patriot, support our Troops - VOTE!)
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To: wardaddy; Joe Brower; Cannoneer No. 4; Criminal Number 18F; Dan from Michigan; Eaker; Jeff Head; ...
Looney Left Update Click This Link For A Version Of The Looney Tunes Theme.

SPEWING RACISM ON THE CITY DIME (Prof Leonard Jeffries)

Two guilty in beating of (74 y.o.)newspaper carrier (lawyer blames victim)

Iranian and Mexican soccer fans: With enemies like these, who needs friends

47 posted on 06/15/2006 8:24:00 PM PDT by neverdem (May you be in heaven a half hour before the devil knows that you're dead.)
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To: neverdem

Of course, by reciprocity, other countries have broad powers to detain US citicizens indefinitely.


48 posted on 06/15/2006 8:36:06 PM PDT by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch ist der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: TChris
"This decision is a green light to racial profiling..."

Goodness, I hope so.

I don't have a problem with racial profiling, but with Islam it can be a problem, e.g. look at folks in Albania, Thailand and the Philippines.

49 posted on 06/15/2006 8:36:46 PM PDT by neverdem (May you be in heaven a half hour before the devil knows that you're dead.)
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To: Doctor Stochastic
Of course, by reciprocity, other countries have broad powers to detain US citicizens indefinitely.

If they were detained on a battlefield, I don't have a problem.

50 posted on 06/15/2006 8:40:42 PM PDT by neverdem (May you be in heaven a half hour before the devil knows that you're dead.)
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