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Suez's lesson (David Frum on Middle-East mistakes of 50 years ago)
National Post - Canada ^ | Saturday, July 29, 2006 | David Frum

Posted on 07/29/2006 6:50:28 AM PDT by GMMAC

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1 posted on 07/29/2006 6:50:30 AM PDT by GMMAC
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To: fanfan; Pikamax; Former Proud Canadian; Great Dane; Alberta's Child; headsonpikes; Ryle; ...

PING!
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2 posted on 07/29/2006 6:51:54 AM PDT by GMMAC (Discover Canada governed by Conservatives: www.CanadianAlly.com)
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To: GMMAC
What Westerners think of as goodwill, Middle Easterners often interpret as weakness.

This is a fact that is lost entirely on the appeasement crowd.....

3 posted on 07/29/2006 6:56:10 AM PDT by Thermalseeker
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To: GMMAC
I say David. I know in your knee jerk Bush hater little heart you lack the moral maturity to do this but in the future you MIGHT want to actually pay attention to what the Bush Administration is currently doing when you write about an issue.

A really purposeless column in light of what the Bush Admin is doing right now. Do try to keep up in the future Davy.
4 posted on 07/29/2006 6:58:46 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (Fire Murtha Now! Spread the word. Support Diana Irey. http://www.irey.com/)
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To: GMMAC
Humiliating Britain and France destroyed America's World War II alliance with them. And they still remember in those countries how America shoved them off into the sunset of history 50 years ago.

(Go Israel, Go! Slap 'Em Down Hezbullies.)

5 posted on 07/29/2006 7:01:10 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives On In My Heart Forever)
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To: GMMAC
That's a great reminder of what really happened to shut down the canal for 20 years and the mentality of the not only the Arab but the mind of the Persians as well. It makes you wonder if it's not so much the race of the people we are dealing with as much as the religion. I'm sure it won't be too long before we have some European Islamic nations to deal with. A day I'm not looking forward to.
6 posted on 07/29/2006 7:03:15 AM PDT by Dixie Yooper (Ephesians 6:11)
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To: GMMAC
Eisenhower fiercely opposed the Suez war. He ordered Israel to stop and threatened economic reprisals against the British and French. The Anglo-French intervention collapsed. Nasser survived.

Frum seems to have forgotten that there was another player in the drama - the USSR.

7 posted on 07/29/2006 7:09:23 AM PDT by Mike Darancette (999-TNS)
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To: Thermalseeker

An excellent summary of recent history of the Near East. Suez was Eisenhower's biggest mistake: an attempt to "play fair" with people who have no concept of fairness, and only a very primitive notion of honor.

Of course, the Soviets were backing Nasser. Today, Putin is backing anyone who will hurt the US, so I guess things have not changed that much.

Frum is exactly right. Of course, it is too late to undo Eisenhower's folly, but we should at least try to learn from mistakes of the past. Bush is trying to do that, but with all the domestic anti-Americans around, and a traitorous opposition party, it is very difficult.

I must conclude that democracies such as ours don't really learn very well, particularly when they lack an effective educational system.


8 posted on 07/29/2006 7:14:57 AM PDT by docbnj
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To: GMMAC; Alberta's Child; albertabound; AntiKev; backhoe; Byron_the_Aussie; Cannoneer No. 4; ...

-


9 posted on 07/29/2006 7:16:44 AM PDT by Clive
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To: GMMAC
Suez was the end of the illusion of British world power and many over here still harbour a hurt that we had to cave in under American pressure and the whole thing went pear shaped. That generation were cut down to size in a public and humiliating way on the world stage.

Is that how you read it in the USA?

It was not a good chapter.

Never the less if the lessons are learned it may yet help us face the issues of today.
10 posted on 07/29/2006 7:17:15 AM PDT by vimto (Blighty Awaken!)
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To: MNJohnnie

What did you read? The article is excellent and a good bit of historical review. Frum offers good counsel.


11 posted on 07/29/2006 7:22:58 AM PDT by em2vn
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To: docbnj
I must conclude that democracies such as ours don't really learn very well, particularly when they lack an effective educational system.

You touch on many very important aspects of the middle east.

In addition to a lack of honor and not having a concept of fairness, the middle eastern Muslims, mostly Arab, that I've dealt closely with in college and in my professional life, seem to lack an understanding of the concept of telling the truth, also. From my associations with Arabs it has become all too apparent that not only is it their belief that deceit is acceptable, but if you are good at it you will be held in high praise by your peers.

I completely agree with your assessment of the effectiveness of our public education system. I would go one step further to comment that it is precisely the lack of knowledge of history by the barking moonbat appeasement crowd that makes them completely oblivious to the folly of their argument.

12 posted on 07/29/2006 7:52:23 AM PDT by Thermalseeker
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To: GMMAC

I don't understand Frum's point here. Why the hell should the U.S. have cared about a dispute like this between shrinking colonial powers (France and Britain) and the new government of a former possession of theirs?


13 posted on 07/29/2006 7:53:49 AM PDT by Alberta's Child (Can money pay for all the days I lived awake but half asleep?)
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To: GMMAC
Sometimes even mistakes can do the job. In 1986, a U.S. warship mistook an Iranian passenger jet for a fighter plane and shot it down. Khomeini refused to believe the shooting was an accident. He became convinced that the U.S. was actively intervening to support Iraq in the Iran-Iraq war -- and, for that reason, he at last agreed to accept peace.

Hmmmm?

The eight-year Iran-Iraq War was Iran's first major external conflict since the Russo-Iranian wars of the first decades of the nineteenth century. The Iranian mullahs' policy of exporting fundamentalism ("spreading the Islamic Revolution") to Iraq played a key role in the outbreak of hostilities. Indeed, the Khomeini regime's determination to export revolution to Iraq was a major cause of the eight-year war...

The objectives for which Khomeini fanned the flames of war were finally left unrealized. The regime was defeated, and Khomeini, in his own words, "drank the chalice of the poison of the cease-fire" in July 1988. The defeat, however, did not destroy the mullahs' dream of dominating Iraq and installing a client fundamentalist regime. After the cease-fire, the mullahs strengthened their clandestine network in Iraq and waited for an opportune moment to revive their efforts toward realizing the old objectives. That opportunity came at the end of the Persian Gulf War.

14 posted on 07/29/2006 7:54:59 AM PDT by humint (...err the least and endure! --- VDH)
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To: MNJohnnie
I say David. I know in your knee jerk Bush hater little heart...

Do you know how dumb you sound? You don't have any idea who David Frum is, do you?

"Following the election of George W. Bush in 2000, Frum was appointed to a position within the White House. Still a Canadian citizen, he was one of the few foreign nationals working within the Bush White House. He served as Special Assistant to the U.S. President for Economic Speechwriting from January 2001 to February 2002. In 2002, he became a naturalized citizen of the United States."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Frum

15 posted on 07/29/2006 7:57:34 AM PDT by GATOR NAVY
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To: vimto
Never the less if the lessons are learned it may yet help us face the issues of today.

Well, that's the rub, though, isn't it? It appears that none of us learned any lessons from the Suez business, and that's why we're back in the same kettle of fish today - and doing no better than they did in 1956.

As someone once said, those who forget their history are condemned to repeat it. I would add "and repeat it, and repeat it, and repeat it, and . . . . . . "
16 posted on 07/29/2006 7:58:39 AM PDT by DustyMoment (FloriDUH - proud inventors of pregnant/hanging chads and judicide!!)
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To: GMMAC

BTW, thought provoking good post, bttt


17 posted on 07/29/2006 7:58:58 AM PDT by humint (...err the least and endure! --- VDH)
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To: GMMAC

BUMP


18 posted on 07/29/2006 8:03:13 AM PDT by kitkat (The first step down to hell is to deny the existence of evil.)
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To: MNJohnnie
What are you talking about?

David Frum was a speechwriter for the President--and wrote a book about the President which was very flattering.

19 posted on 07/29/2006 8:05:03 AM PDT by stockstrader
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To: MNJohnnie
I know David Frum has been unfair to President Bush at times, particularly during the Harriet Miers situation. But I have to disagree with you on this one.

I thought this particular column attacked the policies of President Eisenhower specifically to support the stand President Bush has taken.

I've heard David Eisenhower on NPR quite a bit; I don't know if he's still on there a lot but when he was, he was always attacking President Bush for not showing President Eisenhower's "nuance" and "even-handedness" in the Middle East. Fortunately, we have President Bush in charge rather than his grandfather.
20 posted on 07/29/2006 8:13:44 AM PDT by mjolnir ("All great change in America begins at the dinner table.")
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