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Pro-life advocates are decrying a grisly new outrage
Salem Radio Network News ^ | 08/09/06 | Michael Harrington

Posted on 08/09/2006 12:19:59 PM PDT by .30Carbine

click here to read article


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To: .30Carbine

Thank you so much for your 2 Corinthians 4:7-18 reply
....blessings on your head : )

1 Do not fret because of evildoers,
Be not envious toward wrongdoers.
2 For they will wither quickly like the grass
And fade like the green herb.
3 Trust in the LORD and do good;
Dwell in the land and cultivate faithfulness.
4 Delight yourself in the LORD;
And He will give you the desires of your heart.
5 Commit your way to the LORD,
Trust also in Him, and He will do it.
6 He will bring forth your righteousness as the light
And your judgment as the noonday.
7 Rest in the LORD and wait patiently for Him;
Do not fret because of him who prospers in his way,
Because of the man who carries out wicked schemes.

12 The wicked plots against the righteous
And gnashes at him with his teeth.
13 The Lord laughs at him,
For He sees his day is coming.
14 The wicked have drawn the sword and bent their bow
To cast down the afflicted and the needy,
To slay those who are upright in conduct.
15 Their sword will enter their own heart,
And their bows will be broken.
16 Better is the little of the righteous
Than the abundance of many wicked.
17 For the arms of the wicked will be broken,
But the LORD sustains the righteous.
18 The LORD knows the days of the blameless,
And their inheritance will be forever.
19 They will not be ashamed in the time of evil,
And in the days of famine they will have abundance.
20 But the wicked will perish;
And the enemies of the LORD will be like the glory of the pastures,
They vanish--like smoke they vanish away.

Ps 37:1-7,12-20 NASB


There is also a related story on this thread:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1679141/posts


51 posted on 08/09/2006 1:15:08 PM PDT by FreedomProtector
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To: John Semmens
Thank you for that article. That link does not go to that particular quote, however, and I would like to read more!
52 posted on 08/09/2006 1:15:40 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: ndt

"abortion cosmetics" at Google was my search.


53 posted on 08/09/2006 1:16:31 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: INSENSITIVE GUY
One is forced to wonder what the consequences to the bodies - the faces - of these women will be. When I consider that injections of aborted babies' stem cells have already produced tumors (not cures) in Parkinson's and other human guinea pigs...
54 posted on 08/09/2006 1:21:29 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: Prov3456
Thank you for your comment.

No, the Lord will not wait for any man. That is why we who are Christ's Body on the earth must be working now with His Mighty Power - as long as it is called 'today' - to turn as many to righteousness as He sees fit to save through our prayer, and proclamation and praise of Him Who Called us out of darkness into His Marvelous Light.

Oh, that He would grant us to speak boldly! I believe the time is short.

55 posted on 08/09/2006 1:26:38 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: MEGoody

How many, many steps they have been.


56 posted on 08/09/2006 1:27:16 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: pageonetoo

I was looking for "abortion" in keywords under "sort by post time." Thank you so much for those links! I am happy to see that at least this radio broadcast was new to the list - I had no idea how to search for that as it did not come with a title of its own. Again, thank you!


57 posted on 08/09/2006 1:29:50 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: MEGoody

Posts #3, 6, and 9 - below the bold headlines, in blue. And now so many more links have been graciously provided by other FReepers.


58 posted on 08/09/2006 1:31:29 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: TChris
Since physical beauty is the god du jour, this was inevitable.

I can't add to that.

59 posted on 08/09/2006 1:32:31 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: .30Carbine
in places such as Moscow and Rotterdam

Well, the very "democratic and diverse" Rotterdam" is hopeless, but in Russia the nasty dictatorial Putin might put end to this trade.

60 posted on 08/09/2006 1:35:02 PM PDT by A. Pole (Carly Fiorina: "Technology will 'disappear' in 25 years")
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To: pageonetoo
Please read this article:

Doctors Seek Asylum After Exposing Ukraine Abortion for Cosmetics Scandal

By Gudrun Schultz

DUBLIN, Ireland, March 29, 2006 (LifeSiteNews.com) - Two Ukraininan doctors, Vadym Lazaryev and Vladymyr Ishchenko, have been seeking asylum in Ireland since 2004, after they were forced to flee their country for exposing appalling human rights abuses of women and unborn children in the Ukraine.

The doctors were part of a group working to uncover a macabre system of medical trafficking in the bodies of unborn babies, European Life Network reported today. Doctors were deceiving women into aborting their babies for false "medical" reasons, and then selling the bodies of the children. The children would be aborted live, and their bodies cut into separate organs. In some cases live dissection took place.

Most of the body parts were apparently sold to the burgeoning cosmetic industry of "foetal tissue" youth-enhancing treatments, as well as quack "medical therapies."

In many cases, women were paid to get pregnant and to deliver the baby at a given gestation. They were paid a higher price for carrying the child closer to term, since abortion is illegal in the Ukraine after 12 weeks gestation.

In September 2005 the rapporteur of the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe, issued a report on the disappearance of newborn babies in the Ukraine. Ruth-Gaby Vermot-Mangold called for an immediate re-opening of judicial investigations into allegations of trafficking of babies for adoption and of aborted or premature babies for "scientific" purposes, after visiting the Ukraine August 29-Sept. 1, 2005.

She obtained detailed information on four cases during her visit, reported the Council of Europe Press. In one instance, the family of the missing child had been told by doctors that their baby had died but had not been given permission to see or bury the baby.

Doctors Vadym Lazaryev and Vladymyr Ischenko had full police participation in their investigation, but when the investigation revealed government sanction of the trafficking and the involvement of prominent doctors, they were advised to stop. The police told them they could not guarantee their safety. After an attempt was made on their lives, they fled the country to Ireland, leaving behind their families. A documentary on the expose was screened in the Ukraine after they had left.

They are now seeking permanent asylum in Ireland for themselves and their families. Both have children-Dr. Vladymyr Ischenko has not seen his first children, twins who were born six months after he fled the Ukraine.

After four intensive interviews over fifteen months, they were denied refuge in January. Their appeal will be heard in Dublin tomorrow, March 30. It could take up to a year for the outcome to be known. They are asking for support and prayers for a satisfactory and speedy outcome.

61 posted on 08/09/2006 1:35:46 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: .30Carbine

My Urban Legend Alarm is going off.


62 posted on 08/09/2006 1:35:58 PM PDT by steve-b ("Creation Science" is to the religous right what "Global Warming" is to the socialist left.)
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To: .30Carbine
Oh, maybe this will be the very thing that turns many from godlessness, when they hear this news. I believe that it must.

The question is, WILL they hear this news. I think a lot will just plug their ears and sing, "La La La I'm not listening..."

Sadly, I think too many on the left, even the squishy moderates (as opposed to the real freak fringe) just don't want to think too hard about difficult things, let alone take unpopular stands against them.

I hope I'm wrong, though.

63 posted on 08/09/2006 1:36:44 PM PDT by RepoGirl ("Bobby, if you weren't my son... I'd hug you...")
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To: FreedomProtector

Thank you with tears.


64 posted on 08/09/2006 1:37:36 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: A. Pole

If the Word gets out abortion may come to an end altogether. May God Who is Merciful work through our leaders.


65 posted on 08/09/2006 1:39:39 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: steve-b

That may be, but please read all the information before coming to your own conclusions. They are your conclusions, and you are entitled to them, but if they differ from the truth, the truth will stand.


66 posted on 08/09/2006 1:41:40 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: .30Carbine
For those people who are disbelieving - this story has been posted several times through several different articles. Remember that people had a hard time believing in concentration camps until they saw them with their own eyes. Evil is hard to believe but just because it's hard to believe in, doesn't make it unhappen.
67 posted on 08/09/2006 1:45:08 PM PDT by Kaylee Frye
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To: BipolarBob

How spot on you are!


68 posted on 08/09/2006 1:47:12 PM PDT by Frwy (Eternity without Jesus is a hell-of-a long time.)
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To: RepoGirl
"La La La I'm not listening..."

I have literally had a post-abortive co-worker do this to me when discussing the facts of abortion, hands over the ears and all. It is very, very hard for a man or woman who does not know the forgiveness of God in Christ to come to the truth about their own abortion(s). Because the witness to life is in every man, their own hearts convict them if they encounter the truth, and so they refuse to encounter it.

Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.
Romans 2:14-15

69 posted on 08/09/2006 1:48:29 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: .30Carbine

I'm just crying.


70 posted on 08/09/2006 1:50:46 PM PDT by Frwy (Eternity without Jesus is a hell-of-a long time.)
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To: John Semmens

This kind of thing explains the origin of the adjective sophomoric.


71 posted on 08/09/2006 1:50:50 PM PDT by joylyn
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To: Kaylee Frye
Remember that people had a hard time believing in concentration camps until they saw them with their own eyes. Evil is hard to believe but just because it's hard to believe in, doesn't make it unhappen.

Thank you for contributing those excellent words. We have need to be reminded.

72 posted on 08/09/2006 1:53:16 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: Frwy
I remembered His promise today:

God will wipe every tear from their eyes and there will be no more sorrow and no more death.
Revelation 21:4

73 posted on 08/09/2006 1:55:29 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: joylyn; John Semmens

Ah, bottom of the page. Thanks for your comment that made me go back for a second look.


74 posted on 08/09/2006 1:56:58 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: All

I was supposed to be somewhere else even before I posted this article. The posting seemed the thing to do. If I have missed anyone's comment and failed to reply, please forgive me, and if anyone new comes by, I'll be back, Lord willing/Jesus tarries, in the morning.


75 posted on 08/09/2006 1:58:48 PM PDT by .30Carbine
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To: .30Carbine
At the risk of receiving everlasting damnation from the posters herein, what is the purpose of these threads? Are they designed to create sympathy, empathy, or outrage. I need to know how to respond, so I will be in tune with the choir!

As a Christian, I deplore the murder of the unborn. Who on FR is truly in favor of abortion? You sure call a lot of names, when none is required.

If activism is the goal, then for pete's sake suggest some, rather than just waste time repetitiously proclaiming: "tsk, tsk, ain't they terrible"!

One of the most important Scriptures to remember is overlooked by following John 3:16, but John 3:17 reads: "

17For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved."

76 posted on 08/09/2006 2:08:09 PM PDT by pageonetoo (You'll spot their posts soon enough!)
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To: BipolarBob

"It will be more tolerable for Sodom and Gomorrah than these murderers."

That's right, and I wonder if the end isn't a little nearer than we thought with horrors like that going on.


77 posted on 08/09/2006 2:08:44 PM PDT by RoadTest (For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to they seed forever - Gen. 13:15)
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To: .30Carbine

Jonathna Swift predicted this almost 300 years ago in his satirical editorial titled "A Modest Proposal"

A Modest Proposal for preventing the children of poor people in
Ireland, from being a burden on their parents or country, and for
making them beneficial to the publick.

by Dr. Jonathan Swift. 1729

It is a melancholy object to those, who walk through this great
town, or travel in the country, when they see the streets, the
roads and cabbin-doors crowded with beggars of the female sex,
followed by three, four, or six children, all in rags, and
importuning every passenger for an alms. These mothers instead of
being able to work for their honest livelihood, are forced to
employ all their time in stroling to beg sustenance for their
helpless infants who, as they grow up, either turn thieves for
want of work, or leave their dear native country, to fight for
the Pretender in Spain, or sell themselves to the Barbadoes.

I think it is agreed by all parties, that this prodigious number
of children in the arms, or on the backs, or at the heels of
their mothers, and frequently of their fathers, is in the present
deplorable state of the kingdom, a very great additional
grievance; and therefore whoever could find out a fair, cheap and
easy method of making these children sound and useful members of
the common-wealth, would deserve so well of the publick, as to
have his statue set up for a preserver of the nation.

But my intention is very far from being confined to provide only
for the children of professed beggars: it is of a much greater
extent, and shall take in the whole number of infants at a
certain age, who are born of parents in effect as little able to
support them, as those who demand our charity in the streets.

As to my own part, having turned my thoughts for many years, upon
this important subject, and maturely weighed the several schemes
of our projectors, I have always found them grossly mistaken in
their computation. It is true, a child just dropt from its dam,
may be supported by her milk, for a solar year, with little other
nourishment: at most not above the value of two shillings, which
the mother may certainly get, or the value in scraps, by her
lawful occupation of begging; and it is exactly at one year old
that I propose to provide for them in such a manner, as, instead
of being a charge upon their parents, or the parish, or wanting
food and raiment for the rest of their lives, they shall, on the
contrary, contribute to the feeding, and partly to the cloathing
of many thousands.

There is likewise another great advantage in my scheme, that it
will prevent those voluntary abortions, and that horrid practice
of women murdering their bastard children, alas! too frequent
among us, sacrificing the poor innocent babes, I doubt, more to
avoid the expence than the shame, which would move tears and pity
in the most savage and inhuman breast.

The number of souls in this kingdom being usually reckoned one
million and a half, of these I calculate there may be about two
hundred thousand couple whose wives are breeders; from which
number I subtract thirty thousand couple, who are able to
maintain their own children, (although I apprehend there cannot
be so many, under the present distresses of the kingdom) but this
being granted, there will remain an hundred and seventy thousand
breeders. I again subtract fifty thousand, for those women who
miscarry, or whose children die by accident or disease within the
year. There only remain an hundred and twenty thousand children
of poor parents annually born. The question therefore is, How
this number shall be reared, and provided for? which, as I have
already said, under the present situation of affairs, is utterly
impossible by all the methods hitherto proposed. For we can
neither employ them in handicraft or agriculture; we neither
build houses, (I mean in the country) nor cultivate land: they
can very seldom pick up a livelihood by stealing till they arrive
at six years old; except where they are of towardly parts,
although I confess they learn the rudiments much earlier; during
which time they can however be properly looked upon only as
probationers: As I have been informed by a principal gentleman in
the county of Cavan, who protested to me, that he never knew
above one or two instances under the age of six, even in a part
of the kingdom so renowned for the quickest proficiency in that
art.

I am assured by our merchants, that a boy or a girl before twelve
years old, is no saleable commodity, and even when they come to
this age, they will not yield above three pounds, or three pounds
and half a crown at most, on the exchange; which cannot turn to
account either to the parents or kingdom, the charge of
nutriments and rags having been at least four times that value.

I shall now therefore humbly propose my own thoughts, which I
hope will not be liable to the least objection.

I have been assured by a very knowing American of my acquaintance
in London, that a young healthy child well nursed, is, at a year
old, a most delicious nourishing and wholesome food, whether
stewed, roasted, baked, or boiled; and I make no doubt that it
will equally serve in a fricasie, or a ragoust.

I do therefore humbly offer it to publick consideration, that of
the hundred and twenty thousand children, already computed,
twenty thousand may be reserved for breed, whereof only one
fourth part to be males; which is more than we allow to sheep,
black cattle, or swine, and my reason is, that these children are
seldom the fruits of marriage, a circumstance not much regarded
by our savages, therefore, one male will be sufficient to serve
four females. That the remaining hundred thousand may, at a year
old, be offered in sale to the persons of quality and fortune,
through the kingdom, always advising the mother to let them suck
plentifully in the last month, so as to render them plump, and
fat for a good table. A child will make two dishes at an
entertainment for friends, and when the family dines alone, the
fore or hind quarter will make a reasonable dish, and seasoned
with a little pepper or salt, will be very good boiled on the
fourth day, especially in winter.

I have reckoned upon a medium, that a child just born will weigh
12 pounds, and in a solar year, if tolerably nursed, encreaseth
to 28 pounds.

I grant this food will be somewhat dear, and therefore very
proper for landlords, who, as they have already devoured most of
the parents, seem to have the best title to the children.

Infant's flesh will be in season throughout the year, but more
plentiful in March, and a little before and after; for we are
told by a grave author, an eminent French physician, that fish
being a prolifick dyet, there are more children born in Roman
Catholick countries about nine months after Lent, the markets
will be more glutted than usual, because the number of Popish
infants, is at least three to one in this kingdom, and therefore
it will have one other collateral advantage, by lessening the
number of Papists among us.

I have already computed the charge of nursing a beggar's child
(in which list I reckon all cottagers, labourers, and four-fifths
of the farmers) to be about two shillings per annum, rags
included; and I believe no gentleman would repine to give ten
shillings for the carcass of a good fat child, which, as I have
said, will make four dishes of excellent nutritive meat, when he
hath only some particular friend, or his own family to dine with
him. Thus the squire will learn to be a good landlord, and grow
popular among his tenants, the mother will have eight shillings
neat profit, and be fit for work till she produces another child.

Those who are more thrifty (as I must confess the times require)
may flea the carcass; the skin of which, artificially dressed,
will make admirable gloves for ladies, and summer boots for fine
gentlemen.

As to our City of Dublin, shambles may be appointed for this
purpose, in the most convenient parts of it, and butchers we may
be assured will not be wanting; although I rather recommend
buying the children alive, and dressing them hot from the knife,
as we do roasting pigs.

A very worthy person, a true lover of his country, and whose
virtues I highly esteem, was lately pleased, in discoursing on
this matter, to offer a refinement upon my scheme. He said, that
many gentlemen of this kingdom, having of late destroyed their
deer, he conceived that the want of venison might be well
supply'd by the bodies of young lads and maidens, not exceeding
fourteen years of age, nor under twelve; so great a number of
both sexes in every country being now ready to starve for want of
work and service: And these to be disposed of by their parents if
alive, or otherwise by their nearest relations. But with due
deference to so excellent a friend, and so deserving a patriot, I
cannot be altogether in his sentiments; for as to the males, my
American acquaintance assured me from frequent experience, that
their flesh was generally tough and lean, like that of our
school-boys, by continual exercise, and their taste disagreeable,
and to fatten them would not answer the charge. Then as to the
females, it would, I think, with humble submission, be a loss to
the publick, because they soon would become breeders themselves:
And besides, it is not improbable that some scrupulous people
might be apt to censure such a practice, (although indeed very
unjustly) as a little bordering upon cruelty, which, I confess,
hath always been with me the strongest objection against any
project, how well soever intended.

But in order to justify my friend, he confessed, that this
expedient was put into his head by the famous Salmanaazor, a
native of the island Formosa, who came from thence to London,
above twenty years ago, and in conversation told my friend, that
in his country, when any young person happened to be put to
death, the executioner sold the carcass to persons of quality, as
a prime dainty; and that, in his time, the body of a plump girl
of fifteen, who was crucified for an attempt to poison the
Emperor, was sold to his imperial majesty's prime minister of
state, and other great mandarins of the court in joints from the
gibbet, at four hundred crowns. Neither indeed can I deny, that
if the same use were made of several plump young girls in this
town, who without one single groat to their fortunes, cannot stir
abroad without a chair, and appear at a play-house and assemblies
in foreign fineries which they never will pay for; the kingdom
would not be the worse.

Some persons of a desponding spirit are in great concern about
that vast number of poor people, who are aged, diseased, or
maimed; and I have been desired to employ my thoughts what course
may be taken, to ease the nation of so grievous an incumbrance.
But I am not in the least pain upon that matter, because it is
very well known, that they are every day dying, and rotting, by
cold and famine, and filth, and vermin, as fast as can be
reasonably expected. And as to the young labourers, they are now
in almost as hopeful a condition. They cannot get work, and
consequently pine away from want of nourishment, to a degree,
that if at any time they are accidentally hired to common labour,
they have not strength to perform it, and thus the country and
themselves are happily delivered from the evils to come.

I have too long digressed, and therefore shall return to my
subject. I think the advantages by the proposal which I have made
are obvious and many, as well as of the highest importance.

For first, as I have already observed, it would greatly lessen
the number of Papists, with whom we are yearly over-run, being
the principal breeders of the nation, as well as our most
dangerous enemies, and who stay at home on purpose with a design
to deliver the kingdom to the Pretender, hoping to take their
advantage by the absence of so many good Protestants, who have
chosen rather to leave their country, than stay at home and pay
tithes against their conscience to an episcopal curate.

Secondly, The poorer tenants will have something valuable of
their own, which by law may be made liable to a distress, and
help to pay their landlord's rent, their corn and cattle being
already seized, and money a thing unknown.

Thirdly, Whereas the maintainance of an hundred thousand
children, from two years old, and upwards, cannot be computed at
less than ten shillings a piece per annum, the nation's stock
will be thereby encreased fifty thousand pounds per annum,
besides the profit of a new dish, introduced to the tables of all
gentlemen of fortune in the kingdom, who have any refinement in
taste. And the money will circulate among our selves, the goods
being entirely of our own growth and manufacture.

Fourthly, The constant breeders, besides the gain of eight
shillings sterling per annum by the sale of their children, will
be rid of the charge of maintaining them after the first year.

Fifthly, This food would likewise bring great custom to taverns,
where the vintners will certainly be so prudent as to procure the
best receipts for dressing it to perfection; and consequently
have their houses frequented by all the fine gentlemen, who
justly value themselves upon their knowledge in good eating; and
a skilful cook, who understands how to oblige his guests, will
contrive to make it as expensive as they please.

Sixthly, This would be a great inducement to marriage, which all
wise nations have either encouraged by rewards, or enforced by
laws and penalties. It would encrease the care and tenderness of
mothers towards their children, when they were sure of a
settlement for life to the poor babes, provided in some sort by
the publick, to their annual profit instead of expence. We should
soon see an honest emulation among the married women, which of
them could bring the fattest child to the market. Men would
become as fond of their wives, during the time of their
pregnancy, as they are now of their mares in foal, their cows in
calf, or sow when they are ready to farrow; nor offer to beat or
kick them (as is too frequent a practice) for fear of a
miscarriage.

Many other advantages might be enumerated. For instance, the
addition of some thousand carcasses in our exportation of
barrel'd beef: the propagation of swine's flesh, and improvement
in the art of making good bacon, so much wanted among us by the
great destruction of pigs, too frequent at our tables; which are
no way comparable in taste or magnificence to a well grown, fat
yearly child, which roasted whole will make a considerable figure
at a Lord Mayor's feast, or any other publick entertainment. But
this, and many others, I omit, being studious of brevity.

Supposing that one thousand families in this city, would be
constant customers for infants flesh, besides others who might
have it at merry meetings, particularly at weddings and
christenings, I compute that Dublin would take off annually about
twenty thousand carcasses; and the rest of the kingdom (where
probably they will be sold somewhat cheaper) the remaining eighty
thousand.

I can think of no one objection, that will possibly be raised
against this proposal, unless it should be urged, that the number
of people will be thereby much lessened in the kingdom. This I
freely own, and 'twas indeed one principal design in offering it
to the world. I desire the reader will observe, that I calculate
my remedy for this one individual Kingdom of Ireland, and for no
other that ever was, is, or, I think, ever can be upon Earth.
Therefore let no man talk to me of other expedients: Of taxing
our absentees at five shillings a pound: Of using neither
cloaths, nor houshold furniture, except what is of our own growth
and manufacture: Of utterly rejecting the materials and
instruments that promote foreign luxury: Of curing the
expensiveness of pride, vanity, idleness, and gaming in our
women: Of introducing a vein of parsimony, prudence and
temperance: Of learning to love our country, wherein we differ
even from Laplanders, and the inhabitants of Topinamboo: Of
quitting our animosities and factions, nor acting any longer like
the Jews, who were murdering one another at the very moment their
city was taken: Of being a little cautious not to sell our
country and consciences for nothing: Of teaching landlords to
have at least one degree of mercy towards their tenants. Lastly,
of putting a spirit of honesty, industry, and skill into our
shop-keepers, who, if a resolution could now be taken to buy only
our native goods, would immediately unite to cheat and exact upon
us in the price, the measure, and the goodness, nor could ever
yet be brought to make one fair proposal of just dealing, though
often and earnestly invited to it.

Therefore I repeat, let no man talk to me of these and the like
expedients, 'till he hath at least some glympse of hope, that
there will ever be some hearty and sincere attempt to put them
into practice.

But, as to my self, having been wearied out for many years with
offering vain, idle, visionary thoughts, and at length utterly
despairing of success, I fortunately fell upon this proposal,
which, as it is wholly new, so it hath something solid and real,
of no expence and little trouble, full in our own power, and
whereby we can incur no danger in disobliging England. For this
kind of commodity will not bear exportation, and flesh being of
too tender a consistence, to admit a long continuance in salt,
although perhaps I could name a country, which would be glad to
eat up our whole nation without it.

After all, I am not so violently bent upon my own opinion, as to
reject any offer, proposed by wise men, which shall be found
equally innocent, cheap, easy, and effectual. But before
something of that kind shall be advanced in contradiction to my
scheme, and offering a better, I desire the author or authors
will be pleased maturely to consider two points. First, As things
now stand, how they will be able to find food and raiment for a
hundred thousand useless mouths and backs. And secondly, There
being a round million of creatures in humane figure throughout
this kingdom, whose whole subsistence put into a common stock,
would leave them in debt two million of pounds sterling, adding
those who are beggars by profession, to the bulk of farmers,
cottagers and labourers, with their wives and children, who are
beggars in effect; I desire those politicians who dislike my
overture, and may perhaps be so bold to attempt an answer, that
they will first ask the parents of these mortals, whether they
would not at this day think it a great happiness to have been
sold for food at a year old, in the manner I prescribe, and
thereby have avoided such a perpetual scene of misfortunes, as
they have since gone through, by the oppression of landlords, the
impossibility of paying rent without money or trade, the want of
common sustenance, with neither house nor cloaths to cover them
from the inclemencies of the weather, and the most inevitable
prospect of intailing the like, or greater miseries, upon their
breed for ever.

I profess, in the sincerity of my heart, that I have not the
least personal interest in endeavouring to promote this necessary
work, having no other motive than the publick good of my country,
by advancing our trade, providing for infants, relieving the
poor, and giving some pleasure to the rich. I have no children,
by which I can propose to get a single penny; the youngest being
nine years old, and my wife past child-bearing.

The End


78 posted on 08/09/2006 2:15:16 PM PDT by Boiler Plate (Mom always said why be difficult, when with just a little more effort you can be impossible.)
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To: .30Carbine
This sounds like an urban legend. I can't imagine any European clinic doing this sort of thing.
79 posted on 08/09/2006 2:17:41 PM PDT by Zeroisanumber (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: .30Carbine

And yet the world finds it wrong to sell organs.


80 posted on 08/09/2006 2:21:20 PM PDT by weegee (Remember "Remember the Maine"? Well in the current war "Remember the Baby Milk Factory")
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To: SoftballMominVA
There must be a special place in hell for those that engage in any way in this abomination.

This evil is way over the top, even by hell's standards.
81 posted on 08/09/2006 2:47:04 PM PDT by Deo volente
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To: pageonetoo
"false "propaganda"

Do your Home Work!

Why are you posting this all over these threads when the story is true.

You quote the Lord but are try to convince others that
this abomination is not happening.
That makes you complacent.

Here you can call and make an appointment for your self:

http://www.medra.com/index.htm
For the Phone number:
http://www.medra.com/about-medra.htm



http://www.medra.com/about-diseases.htm
From their web site:

Another successful use of Fetal Stem Cells is in the field of anti-aging (rejuvenation/longevity).

I Have about 4 more if you like.
82 posted on 08/09/2006 3:05:08 PM PDT by DaveTesla (You can fool some of the people some of the time......)
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To: .30Carbine

My their faces rot from their bodies.


83 posted on 08/09/2006 3:06:27 PM PDT by brwnsuga (Black, Proud, Conservative!)
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To: .30Carbine

http://www.medra.com/index.htm
For the Phone number:
http://www.medra.com/about-medra.htm



http://www.medra.com/about-diseases.htm
From their web site:

Another successful use of Fetal Stem Cells is in the field of anti-aging (rejuvenation/longevity).
Destination: Dominican Republic

Medra Clinic

The treatment: Foetal stem-cell injections from £15,000.
Malibu psychiatrist William Rader, 67, previously owned a
string of private clinics in LA dedicated to treating
eating disorders. He recently founded Medra to offer stem-
cell treatments to wealthy clients who wanted to combine a
holiday on the exotic La Romana beach resort in the
Dominican Republic with their stem-cell therapy.

He has arranged for hundreds of patients to be injected
with cells taken from six to 12-week-old aborted foetuses
since the clinic opened its doors. Initial consultations
are done at Rader's LA surgery at Malibu beach.
Arrangements are then made for patients to fly out to the
luxury resort in the Dominican Republic to have the
treatment administered. The promise: According to Medra's
website, the foetal stem cell 'detects and then attempts
to repair any damage or deficit discovered in the body, as
well as releasing growth factors, which stimulate the
body's own repair mechanisms.

'Stem-cell therapy is the future. It's just unfortunate
that there is so much opposition to it in the West,' Rader says.

The reality: Debra Huff-Rader, director of physician and
patient relations, is deliberately vague when I ask where
the foetuses are sourced, saying only that they are from
the former Soviet republic of Georgia. But she invites me
to speak with Rader himself.

'Because Rader is acting outside America, his work falls
outside U.S. regulations on stem-cell therapy,' says Dr
Minger. 'Patients risk at best wasting a lot of money on a
treatment that is not proven in clinical trials and at
worst one that is putting their health at serious risk.'


84 posted on 08/09/2006 3:10:21 PM PDT by DaveTesla (You can fool some of the people some of the time......)
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To: DaveTesla
Do your Home Work!?

The story is more about you, my friend! You tell me I am complacent, when I am telling you that a sinner is going to sin. Your bemoaning sin is nothing new. Jesus shed His Blood for the foregiveness of our sins. It is irrelevant what story you are using today, to highlight your "concern".

That's the problem with all this heat and smoke. It draws attention to them, but doesn't do anything about the source, sinful, arrogant, ultimately selfish HUMAN BEINGS.

Of course they are wrong, but they see no difference with the scales of sin covering their eyes. You decry one action, then don't follow them to the bar, and then the motel for a quickie. Their lifestyle may be that sordid, or they may actually be well-meaning thoughtful SINNERS!

Maybe I am pissing in the wind, and Christianity is really about protest and complaint! Please don't tell me we all have different talents, when our primary mission is to Glorify Jesus!

85 posted on 08/09/2006 3:18:31 PM PDT by pageonetoo (You'll spot their posts soon enough!)
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To: pageonetoo
Come on TELL me the story is a fraud....

Tell me it is propaganda.....

Ill be waiting.
86 posted on 08/09/2006 3:24:45 PM PDT by DaveTesla (You can fool some of the people some of the time......)
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To: .30Carbine

Sounds like BS to me. You can't just inject tissue into someones body. An immune response would develop, and the tissue would be rejected, unless by a remarkable coincidence the tissue was a match. Perhaps they are matching the tissues, and that is why it costs so much. But it would be much easier to inject a small quantity of raw hamburger, and claim that it was stem cells, the results would be the same. The immune system of the recipient would not allow stem cells or any other foreign cells to survive the trip from the injection site to the wrinkled skin.

Also, the statement that the tissues fetuses are "cryogenically frozen" sounds a lot like the e-mail that claims Microsoft or AOL will pay you 1000 dollars if you forward this e-mail to enough people, and the writer says he knows what he is talking about because he is a lawyer. It's just BS. Why not just freeze it, instead of cryogenically freezing it? Because cryogenic freezing sounds so much better when you are trying to appear credible.

I don't doubt that there are women who would go to get this sort of purported treatment, vanity knows no bounds, really. And it is possible that fetal tissue is being marketed this way. But it just doesn't add up scientifically to be a believable story. The treatment would be innefective, just like wrinkle cream.


87 posted on 08/09/2006 3:27:15 PM PDT by webheart (Have a nice day!)
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To: webheart

Care to make an appointment???


http://www.medra.com/index.htm
For the Phone number:
http://www.medra.com/about-medra.htm



http://www.medra.com/about-diseases.htm
From their web site:

Another successful use of Fetal Stem Cells is in the field of anti-aging (rejuvenation/longevity).
Destination: Dominican Republic

Medra Clinic

The treatment: Foetal stem-cell injections from £15,000.
Malibu psychiatrist William Rader, 67, previously owned a
string of private clinics in LA dedicated to treating
eating disorders. He recently founded Medra to offer stem-
cell treatments to wealthy clients who wanted to combine a
holiday on the exotic La Romana beach resort in the
Dominican Republic with their stem-cell therapy.

He has arranged for hundreds of patients to be injected
with cells taken from six to 12-week-old aborted foetuses
since the clinic opened its doors. Initial consultations
are done at Rader's LA surgery at Malibu beach.
Arrangements are then made for patients to fly out to the
luxury resort in the Dominican Republic to have the
treatment administered. The promise: According to Medra's
website, the foetal stem cell 'detects and then attempts
to repair any damage or deficit discovered in the body, as
well as releasing growth factors, which stimulate the
body's own repair mechanisms.

'Stem-cell therapy is the future. It's just unfortunate
that there is so much opposition to it in the West,' Rader says.

The reality: Debra Huff-Rader, director of physician and
patient relations, is deliberately vague when I ask where
the foetuses are sourced, saying only that they are from
the former Soviet republic of Georgia. But she invites me
to speak with Rader himself.

'Because Rader is acting outside America, his work falls
outside U.S. regulations on stem-cell therapy,' says Dr
Minger. 'Patients risk at best wasting a lot of money on a
treatment that is not proven in clinical trials and at
worst one that is putting their health at serious risk.'


88 posted on 08/09/2006 3:28:15 PM PDT by DaveTesla (You can fool some of the people some of the time......)
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To: peridot

God must be fed up by now. Get ready for a bumpy ride. I think He's getting ready to do something big...


89 posted on 08/09/2006 3:29:45 PM PDT by Marysecretary (Thank you, Lord, for FOUR MORE YEARS!!!)
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To: Beelzebubba

Yes me too.....I'm alittle sceptical, what possible proceedure could be used with fetal corpses, be marketed as a 'beauty treatment'.....and work.


90 posted on 08/09/2006 3:33:00 PM PDT by DesignerChick
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To: DaveTesla
Come on TELL me the story is a fraud....

Whatever your real name is: KMA

Don't come on with your high-and-mighty indignation. Your bleeding heart will not save a single one of the children. Your prayers with legs may save a single soul. What are you waiting for, Jesus to tell you? How about Paul? Would you prefer a burning bush.

God spoke to Abraham, and told him to sacrifice his son. Abraham had the knife raised. Would Abraham have been a murderer, if if God had not stayed his hand and provided the lamb? Would God be a murderer?

What I am saying is simple. Sin is sin. Murder is sin. Lying is sin. Stealing is sin. ANYTHING OUTSIDE OF GOD'S WILL IS SIN.

You will not change a mind, until the heart is fed first!

91 posted on 08/09/2006 3:34:40 PM PDT by pageonetoo (You'll spot their posts soon enough!)
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To: pageonetoo
Let me tell you about Molech, Hades,Ball,Gehenna,and HELL.

The abomination of all abominations.

The Fall of Israel:
And they built the high places of Baal, which are in the
valley of the son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their
daughters to pass through the fire unto Molech; which I
commanded them not, neither came it into my mind, that
they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin.
And now therefore thus saith the LORD, the God of Israel,
concerning this city, whereof ye say, It shall be
delivered into the hand of the king of Babylon by the
sword, and by the famine, and by the pestilence

Now, tell me the story is propaganda.
92 posted on 08/09/2006 3:41:26 PM PDT by DaveTesla (You can fool some of the people some of the time......)
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To: DaveTesla
Would you like me to type S-L-O-W-E-R so you can U-N-D-E-R-S-T-A-N-D what I said?

You can spout all that typeface you wish, but it will do nothing to bring someone to know God as Savior, much less stop a single abortion! Get over yourself! You are making a mockery of the Gospel... God can take care of the Judgment without your help!

93 posted on 08/09/2006 3:45:07 PM PDT by pageonetoo (You'll spot their posts soon enough!)
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To: pageonetoo
You still haven't sown me where this article is propaganda.

Show me where it is a lie.

Luke 17
One day Jesus said to his disciples, “There will always be temptations to sin, but how terrible it will be for the person who does the tempting. It would be better to be thrown into the sea with a large millstone tied around the neck than to face the punishment in store for harming one of these little ones.
94 posted on 08/09/2006 3:56:44 PM PDT by DaveTesla (You can fool some of the people some of the time......)
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To: DaveTesla

Ok, I went to the website, and it looks like they actually are convincing people that they know what they are doing. In reading the scientific basis, it seems that they have anticipated the rejection argument and say that fetal stem cells cannot be rejected. I don't believe this for a second. For one thing, a fetus is usually genetically dissimilar from it's mother, and is not rejected. Why? Because it is surrounded by a placenta, not because its tissues are undifferentiated.

I do not believe the argument, and there really is only one way to disprove it, and that is by getting fetal stem cells and injecting them into a person. From the responses I see here on this thread, nobody is willing to disprove this premise. That does not make it fact.

And another thing, they make it sound like these stem cells are little nano robots that go looking for things to repair. I would like to call your attention to the disease known as Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. To try to sum it up, fetal cells, as they divide from 1 to 2 to 4 to 8 to 16 and so on, move to specific locations where they differentiate and become more specific types of tissues. With FAS, certain brain cells fail to stop at the destination location and continue migrating, causing severe congenital brain problems. Google some CAT scans of FAS brains and you will see what I mean.

Not to mention the possibility that the stem cell might actually survive and take hold somewhere, what kind of cell is it going to become? Is it just going to take on the characteristics of surrounding cells, even though they are not even as closely related as a brother or sister? Come on! More than likely, it would become a cancerous cell, just like most human cancers are caused by cells who are meant to divide but don't know when to quit. I personally wouldn't want any organ tissues like liver or pancreas or epithelium injected into my body.

Finally, one consequence of being outside of the US is that the clinics cannot be punished for using fetal tissue illegally, but I doubt if there are very many laws against it in the US anyway. I mean, most legislation about stem cell research deals with government funding more than actual permission. I think the advantage of being outside of the US for these cretins is that they cannot be prosecuted for fraud, for claiming to inject fetal tissue into people. All they would need is a soup of steroids and Human Growth Hormone to make it look like something was happening.

Anyway, check your BS meter. It may need calibration.


95 posted on 08/09/2006 4:01:31 PM PDT by webheart (Have a nice day!)
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To: DaveTesla
For what purpose did you post your thread?

prop·a·gan·da n.

1. The systematic propagation of a doctrine or cause or of information reflecting the views and interests of those advocating such a doctrine or cause.

2. Material disseminated by the advocates or opponents of a doctrine or cause: wartime propaganda.

3. Propaganda Roman Catholic Church. A division of the Roman Curia that has authority in the matter of preaching the gospel, of establishing the Church in non-Christian countries, and of administering Church missions in territories where there is no properly organized hierarchy.

[Short for New Latin Sacra Congregātiō dē Prōpagandā Fidē

96 posted on 08/09/2006 4:03:29 PM PDT by pageonetoo (You'll spot their posts soon enough!)
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To: .30Carbine
I call bs on this one. The thought is repugnant, but I don't think it's real.
97 posted on 08/09/2006 4:07:07 PM PDT by steveo (ADVERTISEMENT)
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To: webheart
How it BS if there paying Russian women to carry
and abort fetuses and using them for beauty treatments?

I have investigated this years ago and there are many other clinics doing this.
It is not about if it works or not it is the fact that they are doing it.
98 posted on 08/09/2006 4:07:28 PM PDT by DaveTesla (You can fool some of the people some of the time......)
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To: DaveTesla
You are probably a good person, but you are way over the top with your line of ATTACK. You will only confirm to others, that you are whacked out, or overly zealous. Heat and smoke do not always mean fire. Sometimes it is the pie in the oven!

The is another old saying, "you attract more flies with honey". Jesus never told his disciples to go and throw tantrums. He told them to go and tell the world about Him. He made us Christians joint heirs with Him, and gave us keys to the front gates and all they contain behind them. It's like having a corvette, and the gas to go in it.

But, you want to linger in the garage, rather than go spread the news about how others can get their corvettes, too. God's got plenty, I'm sure!

He's also got a pretty fair idea about Judgment. He reserved that for Himself!


99 posted on 08/09/2006 4:20:28 PM PDT by pageonetoo (You'll spot their posts soon enough!)
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To: pageonetoo
"For what purpose did you post your thread?"
You really don't understand do you?

A righteous man would have his very soul tormented by these ongoings.


So is the article true or false?"

Go look up the valley of Hinnom.
Who is Molech the star god of Saturn that Stephen
speaks of in the book of Acts?

You think all sin is equal?
100 posted on 08/09/2006 4:30:35 PM PDT by DaveTesla (You can fool some of the people some of the time......)
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