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Ditch US In Terror War, Say 80pc Britons
The Telegraph (UK) ^ | 8-17-2006 | Toby Helm - Philip Johnston

Posted on 08/16/2006 7:07:18 PM PDT by blam

Ditch US in terror war, say 80pc of Britons

By Toby Helm, Chief Political Correspondent and Philip Johnston

(Filed: 17/08/2006)

A majority of British people wants the Government to adopt an even more "aggressive" foreign policy to combat international terrorism, according to an opinion poll conducted after the arrests of 24 terrorism suspects last week.

However - by a margin of more than five to one - the public wants Tony Blair to split from President George W Bush and either go it alone in the "war on terror", or work more closely with Europe.

Divided state: The public wants Tony Blair to split from Mr Bush

Only eight per cent of those questioned by YouGov said Mr Bush and Mr Blair were winning the battle against Muslim fundamentalism.

A majority also wants tougher domestic legislation that would allow police more time to detain suspects while they investigate complex terrorism plots.

Some 69 per cent said that the police should be able to hold suspects for up to 90 days without charge, rather than be bound by the current 28-day limit.

The poll findings will encourage John Reid, the Home Secretary, who has warned the British public that they will have to forgo many of the freedoms and liberties they have grown used to in order to ensure the maximum level of security.

Yesterday Mr Reid highlighted the benefit of European co-operation in the battle against terrorism.

He told a mini-summit of European Union home ministers in London that Europe faced a "very real and persistent threat from a form of terrorism that is unconstrained in its evil. . . and its ability to cause immense harm, death and destruction".

United front: John Reid and Nicolas Sarkozy before the mini-summit

The meeting was "symbolic" of a Europe standing together against the most serious threat faced by modern governments, Mr Reid said.

He contrasted what he called the common EU values of "human rights, democratic freedoms and justice for all" with an "intolerant, violent totalitarianism that seeks to destroy those values, ironically by subverting a religion whose very name stands for peace".

Several of Europe's leading politicians, including Nicholas Sarkozy, the French interior minister, and Wolfgang Schauble, his German counterpart, attended. They agreed that airport checks across Europe had to be harmonised to ensure consistency and prevent terrorists exploiting security gaps.

The survey, carried out for The Spectator magazine, shows that a majority of people now recognises everyday lives will change fundamentally. Seventy three per cent agreed that "the West is in a global war against Islamic terrorists who threaten our way of life".

When asked whether Britain should change its foreign policy in response to terrorism only 12 per cent said it should be more conciliatory, compared with 53 per cent who thought it should become more "aggressive" and 24 per who wanted no change.

People were divided about the Muslim community in Britain. Fifty per cent said "most British Muslims are moderate" while 28 per cent disagreed with the statement and 22 per cent did not know.

While there was strong support for a hard line on terrorism at home, the survey exposed deep-seated distrust of the foreign policies championed by Mr Bush since September 11, 2001. Only 14 per cent believed Britain should continue to align itself with America.

On a recent five-day visit to the United States Mr Blair did nothing to distance himself from Mr Bush - despite pressure to do so from Labour MPs. In the White House he stood shoulder to shoulder with the President, stressing the struggle the West faced against an "arc of extremism" stretching from Afghanistan to the Lebanon.

Some 60 per cent of people thought the war on terrorism would continue for at least 10 years, with 44 per cent of these thinking it would still be going on in 20 years' time.

Fifty per cent of people believed Mr Blair should have broken his holiday to deal with the crisis caused by the arrest of suspects in last week's alleged plot to blow up transatlantic aircraft. Forty three per cent thought he could do the job as well by telephone and e-mail.

Stressing the need for European co-operation, Mr Reid said: "It's very important that the measures that are taken in one country are reflected in other countries because we want equal security for all our countries. We must not have a position where terrorists feel if it is difficult to get through security checks in London, they might be able to go to Paris or Frankfurt or Berlin".


TOPICS: News/Current Events; United Kingdom; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: 80pc; britons; ditch; eurotwitsforkerry; geopolitics; pollsoniraq; say; terror; terrorisourfriend; us; war; wot
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1 posted on 08/16/2006 7:07:20 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam

The public is obviously being spoon fed the same anti Bush propaganda there it is here. When will the people of the world realize the enemy is Islam, not Bush? Too late I am afraid due to total saturation from a leftist media.


2 posted on 08/16/2006 7:09:10 PM PDT by ladyinred (Thank God the Brits don't have a New York Times!)
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To: blam

These Brits don't sound too bright, do they?


3 posted on 08/16/2006 7:10:13 PM PDT by Chi-townChief
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To: blam

What a joke. Go ahead and throw in with the euroweenies. LOL


4 posted on 08/16/2006 7:10:44 PM PDT by pissant
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To: blam
The poll findings will encourage John Reid, the Home Secretary, who has warned the British public that they will have to forgo many of the freedoms and liberties they have grown used to in order to ensure the maximum level of security.

Umm, no. In order to ensure the maximum level of security the public will have to forgo all of the freedoms and liberties they've grown used to.

5 posted on 08/16/2006 7:11:14 PM PDT by AntiGuv ("..I do things for political expediency.." - Sen. John McCain on FOX News)
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To: AntiGuv

I doubt that I can be assurred that that isn't where we in the USA are being led as well. The way the Muslims are breeding here they'll demand Sharia law here, too.


6 posted on 08/16/2006 7:14:11 PM PDT by Spirited
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To: blam
"An appeaser is one who feeds the crocodile, hoping he'll be the last to be eaten."....Winston Churchill

Given the terms of the recent "cease fire" perhaps some in our own government could learn from these words, too....

7 posted on 08/16/2006 7:14:52 PM PDT by clintonh8r (To err is human; to forgive, divine. Neither is Marine Corps policy.)
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To: blam

Blair knows that he has no allies in Europe just as surely as we know it.


8 posted on 08/16/2006 7:15:02 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative
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To: Chi-townChief

Thank God for the American Revolution.


9 posted on 08/16/2006 7:19:08 PM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: AntiGuv

No they won't, they simply have to wipe out the Muslims.


10 posted on 08/16/2006 7:20:49 PM PDT by thoughtomator (Islam delenda est)
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To: Gay State Conservative
Well, if 80% of Brits think their government should form closer alliances with Europe then that's what they should do.

Uhm...let us know how that works out for ya, Britain.

11 posted on 08/16/2006 7:22:07 PM PDT by CremeSaver (Prayers for our Israeli friends. They're going to need them, as will we.)
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To: blam

What else would you expect 80 PC Britons to say?


12 posted on 08/16/2006 7:22:22 PM PDT by AndrewB
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To: AntiGuv

Actually, they should forego Muslims. No Muslims, know peace. But the UK has already rejected even the possibility of screening the most terrorist-prone among them because it might offend the tender sensibilities of the easily offended "Asians."

I think once Tony Blair goes, we are going to be forced to rethink our entire Brit alliance. Sadly, GB is probably going to be part of the caliphate even before France and Spain.


13 posted on 08/16/2006 7:25:30 PM PDT by livius
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To: Spirited

They can demand any law they want, but I plan to give them fusillade law. What are your plans?


14 posted on 08/16/2006 7:28:47 PM PDT by 3_if_by_Treason (Life is a series of lessons: Sometimes you're the student, and sometimes you're the teacher.)
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To: AndrewB
Ditch US In Terror War, Say 80pc Britons

Sure... And who is going to fight it? The United States has invested more resources in this war than all of the other countries combined. Europe doesn't have the resources or intestinal fortitude to see it through. Heck, other than some token (but much appreciated) British support, the Euros haven't even started.

Things were different when the Bolsheviks in the Soviet Union were right at Europe's throat after WWII, we gave them a hand with Marshall Plan and Nato, and this is the thanks and cooperation we get?

That's how it is with Socialists, they all want a hand-out but aren't willing to make sacrifices. To top it off, they bit the hand that fed them by constantly criticising us.
15 posted on 08/16/2006 7:31:14 PM PDT by lmr (You can have my Tactical Nuclear Weapons when you pry them from my cold dead fingers.)
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To: blam

They want a more aggressive foreign policy and think they can attain that by aligning themselves with the Euros? Haven't they seen what has happened in Spain, in France, in The Netherlands the last couple of years?


16 posted on 08/16/2006 7:31:15 PM PDT by Rummyfan
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To: blam
However - by a margin of more than five to one - the public wants Tony Blair to split from President George W Bush and either go it alone in the "war on terror", or work more closely with Europe.

In other words, they enjoy beating their heads against a wall and the migranes that go along with them.


17 posted on 08/16/2006 7:33:10 PM PDT by Tamar1973 (Don't argue with an idiot; people watching may not be able to tell the difference.)
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To: livius
"But the UK has already rejected even the possibility of screening the most terrorist-prone among them because it might offend the tender sensibilities of the easily offended "Asians." "

Isn't it amazing how easy it is for them to offend us at every turn, but absolutely blanch at the thought of offending all others especially their muslim population? I would like to see the US adapt a more isolationist position in the world. With friends like these we are better off alone, much less baggage.

18 posted on 08/16/2006 7:33:32 PM PDT by CremeSaver (Prayers for our Israeli friends. They're going to need them, as will we.)
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To: blam
"However - by a margin of more than five to one - the public wants Tony Blair to split from President George W Bush and either go it alone in the "war on terror", or work more closely with Europe."

The British public is not very bright are they?
That's what constantly listening to George Orwell's "1984" type propaganda does to ya.
How on earth do you 'go it alone" on the war on terror, when most of the planing in the recent terror plot in Britain for exzample, was done in Pakistan, and virtually all the ring leaders visited Pakistan in the past few months to finalize their plans?
You "go it alone by like just sit in London, and hope someone doesn't drive a plane from another country into your buildings?
Amazing.
So much for the British being "well informed".
19 posted on 08/16/2006 7:33:57 PM PDT by Jameison
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To: Tamar1973

"In other words, they enjoy beating their heads against a wall and the migranes that go along with them. "

Yup.


20 posted on 08/16/2006 7:34:33 PM PDT by Jameison
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To: Jameison

To top this ,the euros have no money for
their own defense. These are perennial losers.

Remenber back to the day of Ronald Reagan and his stance in Europe against the Soviets? Remember the massive protests against the U.S.?

Thanks for the gratitude.


21 posted on 08/16/2006 7:37:49 PM PDT by ChiMark
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To: Jameison
It's their dislike of us that prompts poll numbers such as these not because they actually believe they can go it alone. Heck, they even like the French more than they like us and would rather align themselves with Chirac. I say: Go for it Britain.
22 posted on 08/16/2006 7:41:32 PM PDT by CremeSaver (Prayers for our Israeli friends. They're going to need them, as will we.)
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To: CremeSaver

"...I would like to see the US adapt a more isolationist position in the world. With friends like these we are better off alone, much less baggage."

Yes ... and move the UN to Europe as well.


23 posted on 08/16/2006 7:43:16 PM PDT by MaDeuce (Do it to them, before they do it to you! (MaDuce = M2HB .50 BMG))
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To: AntiGuv

T"hose who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." B. Franklin


24 posted on 08/16/2006 7:44:48 PM PDT by RKV ( He who has the guns, makes the rules.)
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To: CremeSaver

I'm not an isolationist, but I sure wish we'd be a little more particular about who we let in. Would we have been accepting tons of Germans during the rise of Hitler? I doubt it. Muslims and people from Muslim countries should be very carefully screened and not admitted on a blanket or quota basis.


25 posted on 08/16/2006 7:47:45 PM PDT by livius
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To: blam; All
I say, if the Brits really wanna sing Kumbaya with the Muzzies, go ahead and let 'em! It's no skin off my nose.

Though they can just forget about any help when the inevitable day comes that they want to bail from the marriage with hell they made for themselves.

I've no problem whatsoever with going to help defend the Brits when they're standing up for themselves (they can do one h*** of a job of that, as history shows), but when they act like craven cowards or total idiots, no way. (May I note that even France had created a defensive line, albeit one with a loophole that the Nazis exploited, and that the French Resistance was an effort whose members put their lives on the line? Not all the French were craven cowards, nor did the Vichy represent all of France.)

Sure, I'll have to stock up on a lifetime supply of my favourite whisky ('cuz once the Muzzies rule, that's the end of that supply). I might even learn to like Jack Daniels.

Gives a whole new meaning to "a green and pleasant land."

"Pull up the ladder, Jack, I am on board."

26 posted on 08/16/2006 7:47:46 PM PDT by Clint Williams
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To: ChiMark
"To top this ,the euros have no money for
their own defense. These are perennial losers. "


Correct.

"Remenber back to the day of Ronald Reagan and his stance in Europe against the Soviets? Remember the massive protests against the U.S.? "

I remember very well.
So much for all this moonbat talk in America that George Bush has made the "world not like America".
I lived in Europe when Klinton was in power, and the Euros were every bit as anti-America as they are today.
Anti-Americanism is a congenital disease with the Euronuts.
Comes out of European inferiority complex to America's power and might, and European nostalgia over past, lost glories.
27 posted on 08/16/2006 7:49:26 PM PDT by Jameison
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To: CremeSaver
"It's their dislike of us that prompts poll numbers such as these not because they actually believe they can go it alone"

Exactly.

"Go for it Britain."

That's what I say.
And good luck with all then rabid British Islamofacis they have in East and North London, Southall, Finsbury Park, etc, and the Islamic crazies in the northern towns like Blackburn etc.
The British are in deep trouble. They just don't know it yet.
28 posted on 08/16/2006 7:53:57 PM PDT by Jameison
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To: MaDuce
"Yes ... and move the UN to Europe as well."

Works for me! :0)

29 posted on 08/16/2006 7:59:35 PM PDT by CremeSaver (Prayers for our Israeli friends. They're going to need them, as will we.)
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To: blam
My first reaction was to say, "You want to go it alone? Go for it!" Yet being objective, this article is very hopeful. The Europeans, especially the British, are waking up it seems. You wouldn't have seen this get-tough attitude a month ago. Frankly, when it comes to many policies of protecting your own country, you do have to go it alone. We can work with the British on tracking funds, identifying suspects, and such, but we can't decide for them how much liberty to forgo to preserve safety. And we all know that these same 80% don't want the lack of cooperation on tracking funds and the like to stop. I'm sure they are mostly (or completely) referring to Iraq. And with the mess in Iraq, that thinking may be understandable. I certainly understand it since I thought all along that flattening Iran was the better course.

Whatever the reason for the 80%, they're now understanding that militant Islam is the problem, and based on the poll, it looks like they may believe this more than the average American does. Geez, before ripping on the Brits, look how many people here want to appease terrorists and don't think Islam is dangerous!

30 posted on 08/16/2006 8:03:56 PM PDT by adam_smith_76
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To: blam
If the British public find Bush distasteful - and after the propaganda barrage they've been receiving for the last six years it would certainly be forgivable - then a European alliance against terrorism that is more aggressive than the current U.S. activity would be welcome.

Of course, riding a unicorn would be more fun than riding a horse, too. If they could only find one.

31 posted on 08/16/2006 8:05:09 PM PDT by Billthedrill
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To: livius
I would like us to be less involved with the rest of the world. The next time there is a natural or unnatural disaster let the Brits, Germans or French tax their people into oblivion to take care of it. No matter what we do it is never good enough, so let's do nothing and garner them same amount of appreciation. Let Europe lead for awhile and we'll sit back and critique. It's so easy. I'm tired of everything that comes out of Europe these days. (Our foreign Freepers excepted, of course.)
32 posted on 08/16/2006 8:06:25 PM PDT by CremeSaver (Prayers for our Israeli friends. They're going to need them, as will we.)
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To: blam

Doesn't "going it alone" require a huge sand pit? It'd take an awful lot of sand to accomodate all of those Brits who want to sink their heads in it.


33 posted on 08/16/2006 8:08:04 PM PDT by Chena ("I'm not young enough to know everything." (Oscar Wilde))
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To: Jameison

I think they are starting to get the idea of how much trouble they are, but still are unwilling to act on it. They would rather follow the Euro-appeasement model rather than take it head on. Too bad.


34 posted on 08/16/2006 8:09:54 PM PDT by CremeSaver (Prayers for our Israeli friends. They're going to need them, as will we.)
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To: Rummyfan
The Brits have enough of a nuclear arsenal to remediate the entire Islamofacisism infestation.
35 posted on 08/16/2006 8:12:08 PM PDT by RedStateRocker (Nuke Mecca, Deport all illegals, abolish the IRS, ATF and DEA)
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To: CremeSaver

Yes, it's pretty tiresome. We're the Big Dog, though, and for this reason, we're the ones who will be criticized. The problem with the Europeans is that most of them and their countries aren't even important enough for criticism. Unless you're a radical Muslim who wants to go after a few cartoonists, at least...


36 posted on 08/16/2006 8:14:04 PM PDT by livius
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To: RedStateRocker
"The Brits have enough of a nuclear arsenal to remediate the entire Islamofacisism infestation."


What they gonna do about the Islamofacst infestation in Southall (just outside London on the way to Slough)?
37 posted on 08/16/2006 8:16:18 PM PDT by Jameison
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To: blam

I'm glad my son is comming home tomorrow.


38 posted on 08/16/2006 8:19:27 PM PDT by Mike Darancette (This space for rent.)
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To: blam
Sure, ignore terror and it will just go away and never wiggle Jihad again.

What a bunch of wankers that feel that way.
39 posted on 08/16/2006 8:21:31 PM PDT by A CA Guy (God Bless America, God bless and keep safe our fighting men and women.)
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To: livius

I think the reason that I dislike them so much is because at one time I loved England almost as much as loved this country. That is no longer the case.


40 posted on 08/16/2006 8:29:00 PM PDT by CremeSaver (Prayers for our Israeli friends. They're going to need them, as will we.)
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To: blam

I'm reading this differently than most here. It seems the Brits, rattled by the 7/7 train bombings and then the failed airliner bombings, want to take the gloves off. I wouldn't read too much into the "closer ties with Europe" stuff... that can be interpreted as "we need to lead Europe in battling terror." Meanwhile they thing the U.S. is being too pussy in the battle. I don't entirely agree, but the message that stiffer spines are needed is a welcome one, IMHO.


41 posted on 08/16/2006 8:30:13 PM PDT by RightOnTheLeftCoast
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To: Rummyfan
They want a more aggressive foreign policy and think they can attain that by aligning themselves with the Euros? Haven't they seen what has happened in Spain, in France, in The Netherlands the last couple of years?

I'm afraid that by the time they figure out that nothing save death, conversion or dhimmi-hood will satisfy the islamonuts, it'll be too late. Britain is toast and Churchill has rolled over in his grave so many times, he's ground his bones to dust.

42 posted on 08/16/2006 8:31:26 PM PDT by Mordacious
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To: ladyinred
The public is obviously being spoon fed the same anti Bush propaganda there it is here

Nope--their propaganda is much worse--not just anti-Bush, but anti-American, pro-islamic and anti-semetic.

I read a lot of UK papers' have brit military pals and visit there. It's bad.

43 posted on 08/16/2006 8:34:05 PM PDT by Cogadh na Sith (There's an open road from the cradle to the tomb.)
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To: MaDuce

"Yes ... and move the UN to Europe as well."

Ok...all in favor of the UN remaining on US Soil and receiving US financial support say aye!!

*crickets chirping*

OK...all those in favore of shipping 'em over to the EU?

*deafening sound of approval*

Yep....gotta go with the majority on this one...


44 posted on 08/16/2006 8:43:24 PM PDT by GLH3IL (What's good for America is bad for liberals.)
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To: blam

Five to one is 83.33%

80.00% is four to one.




How do we trust them?


45 posted on 08/16/2006 8:45:01 PM PDT by Petronski (Living His life abundantly.)
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To: blam

Tehy're obviously Neville Chamberlain's descendents............


46 posted on 08/16/2006 8:49:06 PM PDT by Brett66 (Where government advances and it advances relentlessly freedom is imperiled -Janice Rogers Brown)
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To: Brett66

Teh'yre =They're. Stupid spell check that I don't use!


47 posted on 08/16/2006 8:49:51 PM PDT by Brett66 (Where government advances and it advances relentlessly freedom is imperiled -Janice Rogers Brown)
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To: blam

Makes one rethink our help during WWII. Remember that they made a deal with the devil -- "Peace in our time" -- and the devil repaid them with death and destruction.

And to this day the Brits complain that we waited too long to enter the war.

How soon they forget.


48 posted on 08/16/2006 8:55:44 PM PDT by dhs12345
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To: Mike Darancette
"I'm glad my son is comming home tomorrow."

Good on him.

My son left for London this morning.

49 posted on 08/16/2006 9:02:12 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
Must be a lot of illegitimate children of Neville Chamberlain running around the UK.
We pulled them out of two wars. Now they repay us like this.
Fine we can go it alone. They can't. When they start having people beheaded in their bed, and more terror strikes, then perhaps they will wake up.
50 posted on 08/16/2006 9:03:03 PM PDT by Doc91678 (Doc91678)
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