Posted on 08/30/2006 11:14:35 AM PDT by SJackson
Neither farmers nor illegals have the authority to burden the taxpayers. Only the government can do that. Don't blame the farmer for the misdeeds of your elected representatives. And I suppose you can't even blame them entirely, since there are plenty of judges who have ruled that the costs must be borne.
Automation of harvesting crops is not new technology...
You can always grow the apples and pears in Ghana.
Uh, I can blame farmers for disobeying the law. And in disobeying the law they share some of the responsibility. Do you only obey laws you agree with? Do you recommend that to others?
ping
Stop trying to shift the topic. We were talking about costs borne by the taxpayers -- and those costs are imposed on us by our elected representatives, or forced on us by the courts.
If you want to complain about the cost to taxpayers, then complain to those responsible for imposing those costs.
The workers are busy in New England, mowing lawns and roofing houses.
I read an article somewhere, yesterday, about an NO couple, and the fact that their "good Samaritans" were getting tired of supporting them. The excuse the couple is using is that they are waiting for the right opportunity to come along. I read that as saying they are too damned good to shovel chicken poop, which is what I had to do, when I was 15, and wanted to buy a used motorscooter. The only thing I was ever too good to do was draw unemployment.
Welfare is part of a civil society, but it has gone way too far.
And of course, if people didn't hire illegal aliens in the first place, they wouldn't come here and burden the taxpayers.
And, btw, I'm done saying the same thing over and over to you. You clearly don't care to hear any side but your own.
susie
That's correct, we don't have a labor shortage, we have a worker shortage.
Why would the illegals go clear to Washington when they can make $10-15/hr cash being hired off the curb with no talant in San Diego or L.A. county?
"Last year, farm workers earned an average of $10.89 per hour. Adjusted for inflation, farm workers' wages have been stagnant for 15 years."
There's no shortage of workers.
Just a shortage of pay!
And for what we're paying for apples & peaches at a buck & a half a pound retail...somebody is making a HUGE PROFIT!
I unloaded produce boxcars & trucks 40 years ago.
And I can tell you I was making more than ten bucks an hour then!
There are a bazillion illegals in the Pacific Northwest. This just proves that most are not here to pick our crops, which is always mentioned as a reason we can't or shouldn't close the border.
1. They would come here anyway, as long as people are willing to pay them to work.
2. They only "burden the taxpayers" for things like schools and welfare because our elected representatives authorize the money to do so.
And, btw, I'm done saying the same thing over and over to you. You clearly don't care to hear any side but your own.
You mean to say, you're happy to feign ignorance (at least, I hope you're faking) about how tax money ends up getting spent on various things.
It's not the growers ... they're getting hammered by low-priced imported fruit.
"which is always mentioned as a reason we can't or shouldn't close the border."
Even more reason to close the border, they have ruined construction, not only with shoddy work but have reduced the wages (which are mostly paid in cash) to where they are less today than I was paying 20 years ago.
That's on topic per the article. Voters are complaining to lawmakers, the border is being tightened, and Heinz Humann is complaining about the supply of illegal workers caused by enforcement of immigration laws.
Two other questions raised, which you don't seem to want to address.
Why should we tolerate a portion of the economy, a growing portion, which operates outside of labor, tax, and immigration laws? Sould we tolerate other criminal enterprises on the same basis?
The H2 visa program provides for legal migrant workers. Yes, at greater cost. If growers are now, fall of 2006, aware of a labor shortage, when fall of 2007 rolls around, why should I assume that any grower who hasn't availed himself of the opportunity to employ legal workers is motivated by anything but the prospect of ill gotten gains.
I said:
And of course, if people didn't hire illegal aliens in the first place, they wouldn't come here and burden the taxpayers.
And then you said:
1. They would come here anyway, as long as people are willing to pay them to work.
Hmmmmmm.......in the dimension where I live, those are exactly the same thing.
Now, what were you saying about ignorance?
susie
As I've noted several times on the thread, foreign farm workers aren't being kept out. They can be employed, legally, withoug limitation.
And as I noted earlier, given the choice between exporting apple growing to Mexico or importing Mexico's abusive economic system, I'd opt for the former. But my guess, American producers will do fine. Most of them.
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