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Putin has joined the "Axis of Evil"
California Republic ^ | 10/10/06 | Joel Rosenberg

Posted on 10/11/2006 6:28:16 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe

Monday, Rush Limbaugh interviewed me on Epicenter for the November issue of The Limbaugh Letter. For about 45 minutes, we discused how since taking office in 2000, former KGB chief-turned Russian President Vladimir Putin has built strong personal, political and military ties to Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and North Korean dictator Kim Jong Il. Putin has sold Iran and North Korea billions of dollars worth of arms and even nuclear technology. He is arming America's worst enemies for war, and in so doing, Russia has joined the "Axis of Evil." Yet on this critical issue, official Washington seems to be in a true state of denial.

As I document in the book, Russia signed a $1 billion arms deal with Iran in December 2005, providing the radical Islamic regime in Tehran high-speed missile and other high-tech weaponry, despite Ahmadinejad's call to annihilate the U.S. and Israel two months earlier. Russia is building nuclear facilities for Iran, training over 1,000 Iranian nuclear scientists, and running political interference for Iran at the U.N. to prevent us for imposing economic sanctions that could slow down Ahmadinejad's feverish bid for nuclear weapons.

But there's much more to the story. Consider Putin's dangerously close ties to Kim Jong Il:

* On July 19-20, 2000, Putin became the first President of Russia ever to visit Pyongyang. He met with Kim Jong Il and explored ways to rebuild the once-close relationship between Russia and North Korea.

* In December 2000, the Kremlin announced its desire to dramatically increase military sales to North Korea.

* In April 2001, the Kremlin announced an official agreement to modernize North Korea's military. Sales have soared since then. "In 2001, Pyongyang imported combat plane parts, armored vehicles, helicopters and gunpowder worth $120 million from China and Russia," said one report. "In 2000 it bought aircraft parts, air-search radars, engines, automatic navigation devices, military jeeps and others worth $100 million" from Russia, China, Belarus and others.

* In August 2001, Kim Jong Il visited Russia and met with Putin in Moscow.

* In August 2002, Kim Jong Il visited Russia again, meeting Putin in Vladivostok.

* In 2003, the Kremlin refused to rule out further arms sales to North Korea, despite increasingly dangeorus and provocative moves by Kim Jong Il.

* In 2003, Asian intelligence services became increasingly concerned that "North Korea and Iran are in talks over a plan to export Pyongyang's Taepodong-2 long-range ballistic missiles to Tehran and to jointly develop nuclear warheads....The two countries have been negotiating the deal for about a year and are likely to reach an agreement in mid-October," according to defense sources "familiar with North Korean affairs."

* In 2004, the CIA estimated that North Korea had “at least” six nuclear weapons and by 2007 could produce enough highly enriched uranium to produce six new nuclear weapons a year.

* In 2004, the New York Times reported that the International Atomic Energy Agency recently found strong evidence that the 1.7 metric tons of the uranium in Libya’s possession came from North Korea. The uranium was described as being unusable for nuclear fuel, but was enough material to make one nuclear bomb, noted the web site MissileThreat.com. The Times said "that a new level of suspicion now lurks, that North may have sold uranium to other countries or to terrorists."

* In August and September 2004, U.S. intelligence officials and analysts began worrying openly about the threat of North Korea and Iran firing nuclear missiles at American cities off the back of commercial container ships, giving us little or no warning before impact and detonation. Defense Secretary Don Rumsfeld said one Middle East nation already has "launched a ballistic missile from a cargo vessel," referring to Iran. "They had taken a short-range, probably Scud missile, put it on a transporter-erector launcher, lowered it in, taken the vessel out into the water, peeled back the top, erected it, fired it, lowered it, covered it up. And the ship that they used was using a radar and electronic equipment that was no different than 50, 60, 100 other ships operating in the immediate area." According to Bill Gertz of the Washington Times: Air Force Gen. Ralph Eberhart, commander of the U.S. Northern Command, also said recently that the danger of ship-based missiles is growing. "I believe it's just a matter of time until the terrorists try to use a...maritime attack against us. I believe that attack could come in terms of bringing a ship into port, whether it's [carrying] high explosives or whether it's weapons of mass destruction." Noted Asian intelligence specialist Richard Fisher: "Should North Korea adopt this strategy, it would have the option of trying to infiltrate and pre-position its missiles in Canada, Central America or even the continental United States. U.S. missile defenses do not currently defend against either launches from the south of or within the contiguous 50 states." (I write more about Iran's efforts to develop a ship-launch capability in Epicenter.)

* In 2005, Putin actually personally awarded a medal of honor to the North Korean dictator who is starving his own people and threatening the world with nuclear war.

* In August 2006, a Russian newspaper reported that U.S. officials are increasingly concerned that North Korea is laundering money through Russian banks and in the process helping North Korea sell ballistic missile technology to Iran, Syria and Pakistan. “The American Center for Nonproliferation Studies released a report yesterday claiming that North Korean authorities, with the help of private Russian companies, are providing ballistic missile to third countries, Iran, Syria and Pakistan in particular. This information comes at the same time as a scandal is unfolding over the North Korean regime's transfer of a considerable part of its bank accounts to Russia, skirting American sanctions. Although these accusations are only coming from NGOs right now, they may become the case of the next strain in Russian-American relations." U.S. officials are increasingly concerned that “Russian firms help North Korea develop missile technology, Pyongyang sells it to other problem countries, and the proceeds from those sales are deposited in North Korean accounts in Russian banks. It is only a small step form that picture to the accusation of violating nonproliferation rules.”

The Bush administration and Congress must confront Putin directly on Russia's increasingly dangerous ties to North Korea and Iran. Time is running out.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Front Page News
KEYWORDS: armsrace; china; coldwar2; communism; evilempire; iran; kgb; kgbputin; russia; socalledfriendrussia; sovietunion; ussr
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1 posted on 10/11/2006 6:28:17 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Tailgunner Joe

The war against communism is far from over.


2 posted on 10/11/2006 6:33:53 PM PDT by Eagles6 (Dig deeper, more ammo.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Washington is in a state of denial over several things. First, they refuse to even admit that 12 to 20 MILLION illegal aliens in our country whom they have no idea where or who they are, is a problem. A few years ago they decided that China deserved permanent MFN trading status and now they think a country who is deiberately arming our enemies, and theirs, too, isn't a problem.


3 posted on 10/11/2006 6:34:09 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
"Putin has joined the "Axis of Evil""
No kegebun could ever leave that axis, but always remains firmly impaled on it by the definition of his very nature.
4 posted on 10/11/2006 6:34:34 PM PDT by GSlob
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To: Eagles6

We probably have almost as many home grown communists here as there are overseas.


5 posted on 10/11/2006 6:37:54 PM PDT by unkus
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Russia and her miserable people are eternal enemies of the United States.

Three places I wouldn't mind seeing get nuked: Mecca, Pyongyang, and St. Petersburg.

6 posted on 10/11/2006 6:39:41 PM PDT by Clemenza (Lets Go Mets!!!)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Didnt Putin meet with Chavez too?

I jhave been wondering what was going on with Putin making trouble for the United States.

I have thought for a long time now that Putin wasnt toobright. Doesnt he know that you cant make deals with these crazy bastids. One day they will turn on him like rabid dogs. Once KGB always KGB I suppose.


7 posted on 10/11/2006 6:42:28 PM PDT by sgtbono2002 (The fourth estate is a fifth column.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
[ Putin has joined the "Axis of Evil" ]

JUST JOINED?... Only could be spoken by one thats never read the Communist Manifesto..

8 posted on 10/11/2006 6:43:02 PM PDT by hosepipe (CAUTION: This propaganda is laced with hyperbole.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Putin has joined the "Axis of Evil"

He never left. He just went undercover.

9 posted on 10/11/2006 6:43:44 PM PDT by Chena ("I'm not young enough to know everything." (Oscar Wilde))
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To: Tailgunner Joe; Clemenza
"Axis of Evil" my a**!

Kremlin, Korean and Koran dictators--- have become the new KKK.

10 posted on 10/11/2006 6:44:57 PM PDT by melt (Someday, they'll wish their Jihad... Jihadn't.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants
Washington is in a state of denial over several things.

They are sheep moving through the slaughterhouse chutes, bleating nervously but not knowing what lies ahead.

11 posted on 10/11/2006 6:48:28 PM PDT by gotribe (It's not a religion.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Who do you think will be Russia's president in 2008? Will it be someone from the old line Communist bent, or an actual supporter of western democracy?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_presidential_election%2C_2008


12 posted on 10/11/2006 6:50:56 PM PDT by rjp2005 (Lord have mercy on us)
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To: rjp2005

It'll be Putin, again.


13 posted on 10/11/2006 7:08:02 PM PDT by RightOnTheLeftCoast
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To: Blood of Tyrants
a country who is deiberately arming our enemies

It depends on who you mean when you say our.

Do you mean our as in the citizens of the United States or do you mean our as in the politicians in Washington. I am not getting rich off of the U.S.-Chinese-Russian trade relationships but there are many in Washington who are. Russia and China are not enemies to some.

14 posted on 10/11/2006 7:12:28 PM PDT by nitzy (Every man needs a credo)
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To: RightOnTheLeftCoast

He cannot seek a third barring a Constitutional change. That seems unlikely.


15 posted on 10/11/2006 7:20:07 PM PDT by rjp2005 (Lord have mercy on us)
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To: rjp2005
I can think of no-one who would fit the bill better than clinton.
16 posted on 10/11/2006 7:47:52 PM PDT by AmeriBrit (Soros and Clinton's for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington = SCREW.)
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To: AmeriBrit

Ha! Funny, but as you know, Clinton and Gore have already done all the damage that can be done to Russia by allowing them to completely rebuild their missile technology - with some of OUR funding!


17 posted on 10/11/2006 8:16:29 PM PDT by rjp2005 (Lord have mercy on us)
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To: vox_freedom; Canticle_of_Deborah

Consecration anyone?


18 posted on 10/11/2006 8:19:50 PM PDT by murphE (These are days when the Christian is expected to praise every creed but his own. --G.K. Chesterton)
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To: murphE
The "errors of Russia" are clearly evident in the nuclear capability of North Korea because that is where the bomb technology originated. From there the errors went to Iran and elsewhere around the world.
The revelations by Our Blessed Mother in 1917 to the three little peasant children in Portugal speak directly to the worldwide threat and caused by the failure to consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. [but you knew all this]
19 posted on 10/11/2006 8:29:51 PM PDT by vox_freedom (Matthew 5:37 But let your speech be yea, yea: no, no)
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To: Chena
In November 1987, Mr. Gorbachev made the following statements to the Politburo

"Gentlemen, comrades, do not be concerned about all you hear about Glasnost and Peretroika and democracy in the coming years. These are primarily for outward consumption. There will be no significant internal change within the Soviet Union, other than for cosmetic purposes. Our purpose is to disarm the Americans and let them fall asleep."

(See the following paragraph for more of Mr. Gorbachev's intentions.)

Other organizations have been established in modern history to assist in the establishment of the new world order. The Bilderbergers were formed in 1954, as a sister organization to the CFR and with careful manipulation saw to it that Clinton was elected President. The Club of Rome is using environmental policies, and the unified protection of the worldwide environment as a force moving towards a new world order. This group has divided the world into 10 regions and has placed Mikhail Gorbachev as chairman of the World Environmental Movement.
20 posted on 10/11/2006 8:33:01 PM PDT by AmeriBrit (Soros and Clinton's for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington = SCREW.)
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To: rjp2005
Clinton and Gore have done NO damage to Russia. Quite the opposite - they've aided and abetted Russia like the good little communists they both are.
21 posted on 10/11/2006 8:38:22 PM PDT by AmeriBrit (Soros and Clinton's for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington = SCREW.)
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To: vox_freedom
Just in case anyone is paying attention:

Heaven's Key to Peace

22 posted on 10/11/2006 8:41:01 PM PDT by murphE (These are days when the Christian is expected to praise every creed but his own. --G.K. Chesterton)
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To: AmeriBrit

Thank you for those quotes, AmeriBrit. They solidify my beliefs.


23 posted on 10/11/2006 8:41:32 PM PDT by Chena ("I'm not young enough to know everything." (Oscar Wilde))
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To: JohnHuang2; Miss Marple; Howlin; Alamo-Girl

ping


24 posted on 10/11/2006 8:55:15 PM PDT by GretchenM (What does it profit a man to gain the whole world and lose his soul? Please meet my friend, Jesus.)
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To: Chena
Go to my post here, click on the link, then poke around in these national security reports of clintons 8 years in the Oval Office. It'll give you the chills.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1717289/posts?page=34#34
25 posted on 10/11/2006 8:55:34 PM PDT by AmeriBrit (Soros and Clinton's for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington = SCREW.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Still smirking at all the smart people over the years who told me communism is dead. It's a religion. How many religions die? They might go dormant for awhile, but they come back. How is Islamism that much different from communism?

All you need is a load of oppressed, impoverished, uneducated people. Throw in a charismatic leader to convince them that communism will bring them a utopia that has never existed, and you're good to go.

Kinda like the current Democrat party.

26 posted on 10/11/2006 9:00:00 PM PDT by FlyVet (Dan 4:17 "The basest of men")
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To: Tailgunner Joe

...a little to the left, Kimmy....

***it makes me uncomfortable that people are starting to come to the same conclusion about Russia, communism, and the enemies of American that I am...

27 posted on 10/11/2006 9:00:18 PM PDT by the invisib1e hand (* nuke * the * jihad *)
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To: AmeriBrit

I'm already chilled to the bone, but I can take up to 70-below. (I'm an Alaskan....'nuf said)

I'm on my way to the link in your post. If I don't come back, feel free to chisel my frozen self small enough to fit in the adult beverage of your choice. ;)


28 posted on 10/11/2006 9:03:21 PM PDT by Chena ("I'm not young enough to know everything." (Oscar Wilde))
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To: Tailgunner Joe

*BUMP*!


29 posted on 10/11/2006 9:12:33 PM PDT by ex-Texan (Matthew 7: 1 - 6)
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To: Chena
-70 BELOW !!! Ugh!!! and here I've been complaining because it's been going down to 60° above at night here in the So CA desert. LOOOL
30 posted on 10/11/2006 9:13:30 PM PDT by AmeriBrit (Soros and Clinton's for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington = SCREW.)
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To: AmeriBrit

I know, it sounds horrible doesn't it? LOL It does take your breath away. Actually, it freezes your breath, and your lungs, and your hair, and those pesky nose hairs too. heh heh

I can't complain right now though. We're having an Indian summer/fall and the temps have been up to 50 during the day (about 20 degrees warmer than they should be but please don't tell the global warming fanatics). I've never been to CA but I think I'd like the temperature. ;)


31 posted on 10/11/2006 9:19:59 PM PDT by Chena ("I'm not young enough to know everything." (Oscar Wilde))
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To: Eagles6

In the core of my consciousness I have known, ever since the collapse of the Soviet Union, and especially since the rise of Putin to the seat of the Russian emperors, that in due time Russia and China would become allies in an all-out struggle to reduce the United States of America to a tnentity among the nations of the world. Their steadfast and coordinated refusal to join in decisive actions against Iran and North Korea indicate their intent to include those nuclear powers in their anti-America gang.
Meanwhile, the American people, being lulled to sleep, in part by a soporific and essentially treasonous press, remain virtually totally unsuspecting of the fate being crafted for them, and for liberty.


32 posted on 10/11/2006 9:42:10 PM PDT by Elsiejay
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To: AmeriBrit

You missed my meaning - in the context of making Russia more democratic after it fell apart, they made it worse for Russian people by allowing their military to build up again and basically seize control. They hurt democracy growth there by being soft on Russia's mil indus complex.


33 posted on 10/11/2006 9:49:01 PM PDT by rjp2005 (Lord have mercy on us)
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To: GretchenM

Thanks for the ping!


34 posted on 10/11/2006 10:20:49 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Thank you for an informative read.


35 posted on 10/11/2006 10:42:00 PM PDT by nw_arizona_granny (Time for the world to wake up and face the fact that there is a war going on, it is world wide!)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

When did he leave, exactly?

I wouldn't call him a top priority threat atm, but Russia has never stopped being a threat.


36 posted on 10/11/2006 10:55:35 PM PDT by Alexander Rubin (Octavius - You make my heart glad building thus, as if Rome is to be eternal.)
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To: melt

All the despots of this word - add to your list the chinese on one end, the mugabes, castros and chaveses on another, and those in between, too.


37 posted on 10/11/2006 11:59:24 PM PDT by GSlob
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To: murphE; vox_freedom

Now, now, now. We can't have you going and spreading the real message of Fatima. All is well and completed, remember?


38 posted on 10/12/2006 12:04:02 AM PDT by Canticle_of_Deborah
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To: Elsiejay

If you study prophacy, it's no suprize. The day Putin stepped into power is when all hope for Russia was lost.

"Son of man, turn towards Gog and the country of Magog, the prince of Rosh, Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him." Ez.38:2-7

Putin has been sneaking around making back door deals with Satan for a while now. What comes of it whether Putin is
still around or not, will be bad news for Europe, and the entire west. This rise of this prince of Persia will most likely come about because of his meddling, which he may regret.


39 posted on 10/12/2006 2:00:44 AM PDT by Nathan Zachary
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To: Alexander Rubin

I wouldn't call him a top priority threat atm, but Russia has never stopped being a threat.==

WHy that? Let me guess. It is beacuse Russia exercises her independent policy but not follows the US wake? Am I right?:))


40 posted on 10/12/2006 3:09:52 AM PDT by RusIvan ("THINK!" the motto of IBM)
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To: Clemenza
"Russia and her miserable people are eternal enemies of the United States."
What makes any ordinary Russian, and not the KGB-led government, "an eternal enemy of United States"? And does "eternal" mean to you it was always that way, even before 1917, etc? If you believe that to be true, then you are simply an irrational bigot. You sound like an inverse of a typical paranoid Russian ultra-nationalist, who claim the West was always "out to get Russia". And why specifically St. Pete's? Almost sounds like a you have a personal problem with it for some reason.
41 posted on 10/12/2006 4:01:02 AM PDT by JadeEmperor
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To: AmeriBrit

Can you provide the source, where you quoting from?


42 posted on 10/12/2006 4:03:04 AM PDT by JadeEmperor
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To: Elsiejay
Let's not forget chinese control of the Panama Canal and the enemy's new friend chavez.

It's getting scary and, yeah, the press and the dems are on the side of the enemy.

43 posted on 10/12/2006 4:47:01 AM PDT by Eagles6 (Dig deeper, more ammo.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Here's another time line for you from my files:

April 30, 2001 - Russian military forces intervened in a mock nuclear conflict between China and the United States over Taiwan during strategic exercises that included Russian preparations to use nuclear weapons on U.S. forces in Asia, The Washington Times has learned.

Russian forces help China in mock conflict

Feb 2002 - China's military is covertly buying U.S. commercial satellite photographs of Taiwan that U.S. intelligence officials say will be used to target the island with the mainland's growing arsenal of cruise and ballistic missiles. Satellite photographs of most of the island are being purchased by China through a South Korean company, U.S. intelligence officials say.

Global Security

Nov 2003 - In a tough statement, the Vice-Minister at Beijing's Taiwan Affairs Office Wang Zaixi said Taiwan President Chen Shui-bian's recent pro-separatist activities had crossed Beijing's "red line" and that they "run the risk of triggering a war" with the mainland. "War will break out if the island declares formal independence," state media on Wednesday quoted Wang as saying.

CNN

July 26, 2004 - About 18,000 Chinese troops using their country's most advanced weapons systems last week rehearsed coordinated air, sea and ground attacks on Dongshan, an island in the South China Sea that resembles Taiwan in terrain and weather.

Washington Post

Feb 7, 2005 - Quietly, with almost no notice taken in the U.S. media, Russia and China have just stepped up their military cooperation to a level not seen in half a century since the end of the Korean War.

Washington Times

Mar 8, 2005 — China unveiled a law Tuesday authorizing an attack if Taiwan moves toward formal independence, increasing pressure on the self-ruled island while warning other countries not to interfere.

ABC News

June 26, 2005 - China is building its military forces faster than U.S. intelligence and military analysts expected, prompting fears that Beijing will attack Taiwan in the next two years, according to Pentagon officials. U.S. defense and intelligence officials say all the signs point in one troubling direction: Beijing then will be forced to go to war with the United States, which has vowed to defend Taiwan against a Chinese attack.

Chinese Dragon Awakens

June 28, 2005 - China's decision to open up massive bomb shelters to the public, ostensibly to provide a respite from summer heat, has U.S. intelligence analysts concerned about a possible strategic deception by Beijing, reports Joseph Farah's G2 Bulletin. The Chinese specialist agreed with others knowledgeable about nuclear arms that such a maneuver – opening up large fallout shelters to the public on a regular basis would serve two strategic purposes for Beijing: It would familiarize the Chinese people to the shelters, making it easier to evacuate the public in times of potential nuclear attack; It would confuse Western intelligence analysts who monitor movements of the Chinese public by satellite as evidence of the government's intentions; In addition to monitoring missile launches, U.S. national security officials keep an eye on large-scale public movements in countries like China. If, for instance, city residents were seen moving in large numbers into fallout shelters, it would be a sign the government might be preparing for an attack of some kind.

But if such massive movements became routine – because shelters are opened up in the heat of summer and in the cold of winter to provide shelters from the elements – then such movements would more likely be disregarded as militarily insignificant in the West.

"Think about it," said one U.S. intelligence source. "If you were planning, at some point in the future, to launch a pre-emptive first strike on some enemy, wouldn't it make sense to do what the Chinese are doing?"

China activates bomb shelters

Anyone else hear a drum beat? I truly do think China and Russia are miffed at NK right now...Kim Jong Mentally-Il's ego has overstepped the boundaries of what they all have planned. Finally, IMHO, although the articles above discuss Taiwan, I fear a strike on Japan by NK will be the first blow in a huge battle to come.

44 posted on 10/12/2006 8:19:06 AM PDT by ravingnutter
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To: FlyVet
"How many religions die? "
How many people are worshiping Zeus or Marduk? Bacchus cult is another matter - the drinking cult is very much alive. But you make one error of not quite trivial nature. Communism is not a religion but an ideology and [another related meaning of the word] a way of life. There is a difference between an ideology and a religion, although they continuously lay reciprocal claims to each other domains and functions:
Ideology is concerned with a behavior and uses [or pretends to use] professed beliefs as a means. No sane person believes in an ideology, but they behave it [or else]. Thus, one could say that an ideology exists to be behaved, and not to be believed in, and that a sincere ideology believer, when and if such one happens, is an embarrassment and a pain in everyday life. Now, religion concerns itself primarily with the beliefs and uses [or attempts to use] behavior and ritual as a means. Thus a religion exists to be believed in, and not to be behaved, for a sincere religious behaver [a "saint"] is likewise a massive embarrassment and a pain in everyday life.
45 posted on 10/12/2006 8:29:22 AM PDT by GSlob
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To: RusIvan

No.

And, please keep in mind, none of this is directed at you personally. ;p But you asked for a reason. And I'm giving you an honest answer.

It's because they are careening towards totalitarianism, with heavy approval from the people. Also, because there are deep pockeys of xenophobia. And massive stockpiles, frequently poorly guarded, of WMDs. And powerful organized crime out of control, and which has infilitrated high levels of military and government because of a culture of corruption. And because the average lifespan of a Russian male is plummeting to third world levels (I believe average male lifespan is 58 is the statistic I last saw).

Also, because they are trying to play not just both sides, but all sides, and then play each other. And because they are not sure whether they want to be European or Asian. And because they don't have the capability to guard their eastern marches against Chinese encroachment. And because civil liberties don't seem to be as enshrined in their value set as it does in the west. Also, because of the last 15-20 years of instability, and the Soviet dictatorship before that gives me little opportunity to hope.

I don't think that Russia is without hope, or value. And its not that I don't think that Russians as a people aren't cool (well, at least the ones I know in Canada...I only know one Russian-Russian, and he was a university student.) But independent policy, and sometimes openly hostile (not to mention counterproductive) policies are two different, but not mutually exclusive things.

That Russia exercises an independent policy, and does not follow the US, should surprise and disappoint exactly one guy in eastern Angola. Noone grudges them that. But if they think they can continue on their present course and not alarm or provoke anyone, they are delusional.


46 posted on 10/12/2006 9:18:58 AM PDT by Alexander Rubin (Octavius - You make my heart glad building thus, as if Rome is to be eternal.)
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To: RusIvan
Study Clintonism and you will have the picture of what has evolved from Soviet style communism. Western capitalism is NOT just about making dollars, although many believe that is the only difference in communism and capitalism.

I do not hold Russia as completely responsible for her approach they did get Clintonized.
47 posted on 10/12/2006 9:30:28 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: GSlob
Thanks for your interesting post.

I suppose I see communism and other totalitarian ideas as a religion because of the idolatry I see in them. Worship of the State, and worship of the leader. You see demonstrations all the time in the Middle east in which the participants hold portraits of their favorite imam or ayatollah high in the air. You see heroic-looking statues of the leader in every town square, and bigger-than-life murals on the sides of the buildings. They demand to be worshiped and are worshiped by many.

48 posted on 10/12/2006 9:50:30 AM PDT by FlyVet (Dan 4:17 "The basest of men")
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To: murphE
Thanks for the link. In the past I've been chastised on FR over discussing this prophesy.
49 posted on 10/12/2006 10:47:54 AM PDT by AmericaUnite
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To: RusIvan
As a sovereign nation, Russia has every right to "exercise her independent policy...". But that doesn't mean those policies won't make enemies for her, if said policies threaten other nations.
50 posted on 10/12/2006 10:56:08 AM PDT by LIConFem (Just opened a new seafood restaurant in Great Britain, called "Squid Pro Quid")
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