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Fish fossil fills evolutionary gap
Al-Jazeera ^ | Thursday 19 October 2006 | NA

Posted on 10/21/2006 8:10:12 PM PDT by Jeff Gordon

A 380 million-year-old fossil found in Australia has filled a gap in the understanding of how fish evolved into the first land animals.

John Long, lead researcher at Museum Victoria, said the perfectly preserved skeleton has revealed that fish developed features characteristic of land animals much earlier than once thought.

Long said: "We've got a fish from the Devonian period about 380 million years ago and preserved in three-dimensional stunning perfection.

"It has revealed a whole suite of characters that link it to the higher land animals or tetrapods, so it's filling in a blank in evolution we didn't know about before."

Head holes

The fossil of the Gogonasus fish, found in the remote Kimberley region of Western Australia, at a site of a former major coral reef, shows the skull had large holes for breathing through the top of the head.

The researchers said it also had muscular front fins with a well-formed humerus, ulna and radius, the same bones found in the human arm.

Long said: "The degree to which these features resemble the earliest four-legged land animals makes Gogonasus a new model in the picture of how fishes evolved into land animals.

"Gogonasus is the missing clue in vertebrate evolution, the world's first complete perfect skeleton of the kinds of fishes that gave rise to the first land animals.

"The transition from a fish living in water to an air-breathing land animal with arms and legs was one of the most dramatic transitions in the history of evolution and many unsolved questions remained."

Earlier this year, scientists reported the discovery of Tiktaalik roseae, a 375 million-year-old species of fish seen as the missing link in the shift from water to land animals.

While Tiktaalik had a skull that was identical to an amphibian, Long said Gogonasus looks much more like a fish.

He said: "I like to say it's a wolf in sheep's clothing. It's showing that evolution isn't as straightforward as we'd like to think."

The fossil was unveiled at the Melbourne Museum on Thursday and will remain on display for a month.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: creationbullshit; crevolist; evobullshit; evolution; evolutionisafarce; evolutioniscorrect; evolutionlies; junk; moreevolutionfacts; moreproof; mythinglinks; nicetry; olderthangenesis; speculation
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Science in the move towards enlightenment.
1 posted on 10/21/2006 8:10:13 PM PDT by Jeff Gordon
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To: Jeff Gordon; PatrickHenry
The fossil of the Gogonasus fish, found in the remote Kimberley region of Western Australia, at a site of a former major coral reef, shows the skull had large holes for breathing through the top of the head.
2 posted on 10/21/2006 8:12:06 PM PDT by Paleo Conservative
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To: Jeff Gordon

YEC INTREP


3 posted on 10/21/2006 8:12:40 PM PDT by LiteKeeper (Beware the secularization of America; the Islamization of Eurabia)
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To: Jeff Gordon

I wish they had offered a photo.

I love fossils. My collection is short of a museum, but it's pretty neat.


4 posted on 10/21/2006 8:13:07 PM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: Jeff Gordon
Good post, and interesting find, but its from Al-Jazeera???

I thought Muslims were strictly creationists!

Will wonders never cease.

5 posted on 10/21/2006 8:13:50 PM PDT by Coyoteman (I love the sound of beta decay in the morning!)
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To: Jeff Gordon
I saw a guy who looks like a fish the other day!


The missing link

6 posted on 10/21/2006 8:13:56 PM PDT by eleni121 ("Show me just what Mohammed brought:: evil and inhumanity")
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To: Jeff Gordon

People actually believe this crap. Too funny.


7 posted on 10/21/2006 8:14:46 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Jorge

Way to efficiently dismantle the argument for evolution.


8 posted on 10/21/2006 8:16:32 PM PDT by Young Scholar
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To: Dog Gone

9 posted on 10/21/2006 8:17:20 PM PDT by Jeff Gordon (History convinces me that bad government results from too much government. - Thomas Jefferson)
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To: Coyoteman

I bet you showed up here just to see if I'd post that damn picture again.


10 posted on 10/21/2006 8:20:55 PM PDT by satchmodog9 (Most people stand on the tracks and never even hear the train coming)
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To: Young Scholar
Way to efficiently dismantle the argument for evolution.

What argument? Holes in a fish head?

Seriously as an ex-evolutionist I have a hard time not laughing at these feeble attempts to explain away God and Creation.

11 posted on 10/21/2006 8:21:36 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Jorge

People believe a lot of stuff. Some of us actually believe in the concept of time ~ others don't.


12 posted on 10/21/2006 8:21:47 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah

You know people who don't believe in the concept of time?


13 posted on 10/21/2006 8:22:49 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Jorge

Do you doubt the head is 380 million years old?


14 posted on 10/21/2006 8:27:24 PM PDT by satchmodog9 (Most people stand on the tracks and never even hear the train coming)
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To: Jeff Gordon

Awesome. Thanks.


15 posted on 10/21/2006 8:27:29 PM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: Jorge
What argument? Holes in a fish head?

You are aware there are these things called "Scientific Journals" where they actually publish really long and detailed analyses of these fossils with diagrams and a crapload of cites, right? More than a couple simplistic paragraphs in some MSM article or website by an idiot journalist..

Ever read one?

16 posted on 10/21/2006 8:27:56 PM PDT by Strategerist (Those who know what's best for us must rise and save us from ourselves)
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To: LiteKeeper

It's curious that this link leads to Aljazeera SMS Mobile Service

17 posted on 10/21/2006 8:28:42 PM PDT by perfect stranger
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To: muawiyah
Concept of time? You wouldn't be working on a time machine would you?


18 posted on 10/21/2006 8:32:48 PM PDT by Boiler Plate (Mom always said why be difficult, when with just a little more effort you can be impossible.)
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To: muawiyah

$1000 cash, in small, unmarked bills, in a brown paper bag, to the first person who can demonstrate a time event that is NOT a kinetic energy event, at some rate.


19 posted on 10/21/2006 8:33:33 PM PDT by timer
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To: satchmodog9
Yeah, I doubt the age but it probably doesn't matter.

I don't believe it validates evolution anyway.

20 posted on 10/21/2006 8:35:21 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Strategerist
You are aware there are these things called "Scientific Journals"

There are?

For real?

I can see you must be a very educated person!

21 posted on 10/21/2006 8:37:58 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Jorge
I don't believe it validates evolution anyway.


Belief gets in the way of learning.

Robert A. Heinlein, Time Enough for Love, 1973


22 posted on 10/21/2006 8:38:58 PM PDT by Coyoteman (I love the sound of beta decay in the morning!)
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To: Jorge
OK, then the fish' daddy went out and found some new genes to stick in its genome to give its descendants two good arms.

Or did you have something else in mind?

23 posted on 10/21/2006 8:39:06 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Strategerist
fossils with diagrams and a crapload of cites

LOL

24 posted on 10/21/2006 8:39:36 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Boiler Plate

GREAT SCOTT!


25 posted on 10/21/2006 8:41:45 PM PDT by Checkers (Guys, I'm taking the stairs.)
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To: Checkers

LOL


26 posted on 10/21/2006 8:43:01 PM PDT by Boiler Plate (Mom always said why be difficult, when with just a little more effort you can be impossible.)
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To: Coyoteman
Belief gets in the way of learning. Robert A. Heinlein, Time Enough for Love, 1973

Sure it does. I graduated first in my college class with a 4.0 GPA.

And this was AFTER my conversion to Christianity and turning away from evolution.

Evolutionists and atheists aren't the only people capable of learning anything.

27 posted on 10/21/2006 8:43:06 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Jorge
Sure it does. I graduated first in my college class with a 4.0 GPA.

Nobody said you were stupid. You just believe things that are not so, which prevents you from looking at science with an open mind. Let me guess, your degree was in Italian Literature...?

28 posted on 10/21/2006 8:45:43 PM PDT by Alter Kaker ("Whatever tears one sheds, in the end one always blows one's nose." - Heine)
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To: muawiyah
OK, then the fish' daddy went out and found some new genes to stick in its genome to give its descendants two good arms.

And now it frantically pounds out messages on FR with women's underwear on it head.

29 posted on 10/21/2006 8:46:10 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Jorge

What college and major?

Belief certainly doesn't need to get in the way of learning, but it can get in the way of accurate conclusions. Of course, it's impossible to totally exclude belief of any sort, so all conclusions will invariably be influenced by some bias.


30 posted on 10/21/2006 8:47:12 PM PDT by Young Scholar
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To: Jeff Gordon

380 million years, ooooookaaaay...so does it have a sister?


31 posted on 10/21/2006 8:50:05 PM PDT by rusureitflies?
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To: Jeff Gordon

Grandpa.....grandpa....is that you?


32 posted on 10/21/2006 8:51:57 PM PDT by Wycowboy
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To: Alter Kaker
Nobody said you were stupid. You just believe things that are not so, which prevents you from looking at science with an open mind. Let me guess, your degree was in Italian Literature...?

Actually it was Applied Science, Electronics Technology. A lot of Math, Physics etc.

I would say my beliefs actually helped me grasp the sciences better.

Seriously, I was once a dedicated evolutionists...but it seems totally stupid to me now. And I feel like it makes fools of some of the most educated and intelligent people around.

33 posted on 10/21/2006 8:53:20 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Jorge
Belief gets in the way of learning.

Robert A. Heinlein, Time Enough for Love, 1973

Sure it does. I graduated first in my college class with a 4.0 GPA.

And this was AFTER my conversion to Christianity and turning away from evolution.

Evolutionists and atheists aren't the only people capable of learning anything.

Read the posts again. You said that " I don't believe it validates evolution anyway."

Not, there is evidence that this is not so. Not, the evidence argues against it. You said you don't believe it.

Your ability to learn about this fossil, and the hundreds of other discoveries made each year, is precluded by your prior belief.

GPA is nice, but by your own admission you have closed your mind to the discoveries of science which do not fit with your belief system.

That's pretty sad. It must be tough to read the newspaper in the morning knowing that there might be some new discovery you will have to wave away on the basis of your prior belief.

34 posted on 10/21/2006 8:55:10 PM PDT by Coyoteman (I love the sound of beta decay in the morning!)
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To: Jorge
Bingo!
There has been yet to be shwon a "fish dog" so to speak, so dig away my little porkchops, theorize away if you please.

Truth only smiles.
35 posted on 10/21/2006 8:59:23 PM PDT by p[adre29 (Arma in armatos)
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To: Jeff Gordon
You can think of it that way....

There are fish that can go onto land today. That does not make those fish the ancestors of land animals. So this fossil has bones in its front fins similar to human arm bones. Could that be because the fish actually could go on or very close to land and would have use for fins that could support its weight out of water?

In many cases, hypothetical missing links (such as feathered reptiles) would have been weeded out by natural selection unless their oddness conferred upon them usefulness. A reptile with feathers who couldn't fly (or who could fly but the feathers would not make it easier)would use up energy making feathers--energy which could be used for other things. Also, it would be a freak, so unless it could get lots of food, was very fast, etc. how would it have children?

36 posted on 10/21/2006 8:59:42 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( The r/l thing is Japanese, not pan-Asian, and, in any case, making a mockery of it is rude.)
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To: Jeff Gordon; DaveLoneRanger

Macroevolution ping.


37 posted on 10/21/2006 9:00:09 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( The r/l thing is Japanese, not pan-Asian, and, in any case, making a mockery of it is rude.)
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To: Jeff Gordon

Lots of loaded keywords, on both sides.


38 posted on 10/21/2006 9:00:38 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( The r/l thing is Japanese, not pan-Asian, and, in any case, making a mockery of it is rude.)
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To: Coyoteman

Nonsense. Muslims have plenty of Macroevolutionists, though--as with Christianity--they shouldn't. Good try in attempting to link Creationists and Islamo-fascism, though.


39 posted on 10/21/2006 9:02:15 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( The r/l thing is Japanese, not pan-Asian, and, in any case, making a mockery of it is rude.)
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To: Coyoteman
GPA is nice, but by your own admission you have closed your mind to the discoveries of science which do not fit with your belief system. That's pretty sad.

I have no problem with any true scientific discoveries.

I do have problems with the conclusions some try to draw from them.

40 posted on 10/21/2006 9:03:03 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: satchmodog9

Conversely, are you sure the head is 380 million years old?


41 posted on 10/21/2006 9:03:49 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( The r/l thing is Japanese, not pan-Asian, and, in any case, making a mockery of it is rude.)
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To: Jorge
I would say my beliefs actually helped me grasp the sciences better.

That seems unlikely, given that you've stated that you're dogmatically opposed to the possible existence of a 380 million year old fish. Dogmatic positions are the antithesis of science.

Seriously, I was once a dedicated evolutionists...but it seems totally stupid to me now.

Care to elaborate?

42 posted on 10/21/2006 9:04:27 PM PDT by Alter Kaker ("Whatever tears one sheds, in the end one always blows one's nose." - Heine)
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To: Coyoteman

That goes for Macroevolutionists, too.


43 posted on 10/21/2006 9:04:55 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( The r/l thing is Japanese, not pan-Asian, and, in any case, making a mockery of it is rude.)
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To: rusureitflies?

Are you trying to get a Helen Thomas photo?


44 posted on 10/21/2006 9:06:11 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( The r/l thing is Japanese, not pan-Asian, and, in any case, making a mockery of it is rude.)
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To: Jeff Gordon

Is this guy objective, or does he maybe have some preconceived notion about this evolution business?


45 posted on 10/21/2006 9:18:25 PM PDT by petertare (!)
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To: Jeff Gordon

It takes a whole lot of ignorance to believe the hooey.


46 posted on 10/21/2006 9:19:21 PM PDT by Frwy (Eternity without Jesus is a hell-of-a long time.)
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To: Jedi Master Pikachu
That goes for Macroevolutionists, too.

I don't know what a "macroevolutionist" is. If you believe in microevolution, you also believe in macroevolution -- it's the natural consequence -- unless you think that there is some sort of timer out there that allows evolutionary processes to take place for a while, but then somehow shuts them down.

47 posted on 10/21/2006 9:20:50 PM PDT by Alter Kaker ("Whatever tears one sheds, in the end one always blows one's nose." - Heine)
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To: Jedi Master Pikachu

Relative dating should tell. I'm sure they did all the tests. It's the usual method before publishing.


48 posted on 10/21/2006 9:23:19 PM PDT by satchmodog9 (Most people stand on the tracks and never even hear the train coming)
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To: Jedi Master Pikachu

A flightless reptile with feathers would still have an advantage over a featherless reptile. Feathers provide insulation, which would reduce the energy needed to keep warm and enable the reptile to live in a wider range of climates.


49 posted on 10/21/2006 9:56:46 PM PDT by gd124
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To: Jeff Gordon
so it's filling in a blank in evolution we didn't know about before."

So the B -I -I- I- I- I- I- I- I- G Gap is now the B- I- I- I- I- I- I- I- G Gap.

50 posted on 10/21/2006 10:50:30 PM PDT by taxesareforever (Never forget Matt Maupin)
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