Posted on 10/28/2006 10:04:10 PM PDT by Kitten Festival
Today I went to the antiwar protests, over in Hollywood, to check out the scene. Compared to other antiwar rallies, this was small. It might have been put together hastily - I did not learn about it until yesterday. Still, ANSWER tends to attract many more people than this and they did have Cindy Sheehan as their headliner.
Without prejudice, I estimated there were only about 650 people at this one - I’ve been to the last three and this was the smallest of all. The ANSWER procession was led by a big billowing Venezuelan flag, followed by a Palestinian one, so you wouldn’t at first glance think this actually was a protest about the Iraq War. There were plenty of anti-Bush signs, too, which seemed to run through all groups as an energizer, but on the whole, there wasn’t all that much focus on Iraq. ...
I was amazed to hear speaker after speaker praise Hugo Chavez. I think the appeal of it is that he’s come out so strong against Bush - the common theme was hating Bush. I am starting to think the antiwar crowd is getting downright bored of the endless Iraq War ...
This was the first antiwar rally where Hugo Chavez figured so prominently. Yes, I saw Bolivarian circles there. People wore their regalia from their recent Sandalista trips to Venezuela. There definitely was that fashion-show quality at the rally, show how many exotic places you have been to in your attire. Meanwhile, one old guy gave me a free bottle of Citgo Venezuelan motor oil, pulling it out of a big paper bag. He urged me to buy Citgo and I assured him I would treasure the motor oil.
(Excerpt) Read more at publiuspundit.com ...
it must be a sad existence to live in perpeptual hate of your fellow beings. hate for breakfast lunch, and dinner. a depressing bunch lol
And getting smaller, smaller, smaller ....
Thanks for your service.
You know, after seeing Obsession, I realize even more how insipid the anti-war movement really is. Do they really not get it? Do they really believe that leaving Iraq is honestly a good long-term strategy?
Not that I believe for one second that she's speaking "from her heart" here...but the sad fact is that those who truly believe that the conflict in Iraq is a mistake simply don't get the bigger picture. Iraq is merely the main front on the global war against terrorism. Bin Laden gets it.
Bush gets it but doesn't explain it as well or as often as he should. I hope that we the American people understand what's truly at stake not only in the Presidential elections, but in any election where there's a danger that the reigns could end up in the hands of those who think the appropriate response to Islamofascism is to cut and run when things get tough.
Very beautifully said. You know, I think this is what the vast majority of the American people understand. This would explain the sparse attendence at this antiwar rally even with the 'star' power (to them) of Sheehan. I think most people know that Iraq is a war that we can't run from, we have to win it. That's why only the fringe is present at this rally even though logically they should be ascendent. They just aren't - they are shriveling faster than anyone realizes. Even THEY are bored of the war.
She is gonna pop someday. Most likely off herself.
Your question is ambiguous. Do mean to ask if they believe it's good for America, or good for their side?
Wait a minute! I thought there was a great blue tide of Bush hatred out there. That this bunch couldn't even get 1,000 to come out and hear the darling of the anti-war, anti-Bush set in loony-left Hollyweird speaks volumes.
"anti-Bush set in loony-left Hollyweird speaks volumes."
Ya think that maybe the loonies are not as popular as the lefties want us to think?
Ya think?
You know I had to stop and think about what you said here for a moment...and when I did, I realized how truly profound it is.
For leftist idealogues like Cindy Sheehan and Michael Moore, the Iraqi Front in the Global War on Terrorism [notice how I did not and never EVER again will say "The Iraq War"] is merely a weapon that they use to, in their mind, discredit the president because they hate him just that much.
They don't understand the stakes. They don't get that their necks are quite literally on the line. If their side wins (DEAR GOD ALMIGHTY...PLEASE FORBID), their victory will be truly Pyrrhic because the Islamofascists will have their "proof" that the United States does not have the stomach to stand up to them. Their tactics of death and destruction will have prevailed and they will be empowered to continue their campaign.
Do the Leftists really and truly believe that the war will end with us out of Iraq? That kind of foolish naivety can only have devastating consequences...because our retreating the primary front in this war will not end it, merely relocate it closer to home.
But then they don't believe that we are in a real war...just a fake one concocted by Bush to steal oil from the poor Iraqis and propel the American mission of global domination. To the leftists, we're the problem.
So to answer your question, I believe that it is a brilliant strategy for their side and for anyone else who actively supports the destruction of western civilization.
I hope the burka she'll be forced to wear under Sharia law chafes her skin something fierce. I know...I'm petty, aren't I? :)
They are bored with President Bush too. They need someone new to hate.
Man, that's a sexy women!
The rest of America has jobs.
Leftist jerks. They can all emigrate to Venezuela for all I care, this country will be better off. Idiots.
It was broiling hot and people were getting sunburned very rapidly. They all gathered to one shadowed spot near the truck where it was cooler, but also easy to count them. There were some ‘gold star mothers’ among the protestors, but few young people of draft age. I heard one saying to a pal that the young were so attracted to the military life, it was really hard for a good mom to stop them - she had a 16-year old at home and just really hoped she could dissuade him from joining the Marines like her 19-year old did. But she unwittingly was giving mixed message - the fanny pack she was carrying bore the bright red USMC logo, so I don’t know what she was thinking would dissuade her kid. Antiwar military moms were a small group - I only saw three; Code Pink was there - again, in very small numbers, only about three, too; some Korean activists were there, some Filipino Moro guerrilla supporters were there, a scrum of Hare Krishnas were there, dancing away, the Greens were a presence - there were about eight of them there; Palestinian scarves were in abundance and about two or three young women looked Arabic among them; I didn’t see any punk rockers or goths like I did last time. There was a young woman who went topless and painted her nipples like rainbows - and since she was saggy she wasn’t exactly photogenic. There were plenty of old people and 60s backwashers, too - two showed up in Vietnamese rice-farmer conical hats, no doubt fresh from a trip to Vietnam they’d taken to relive the good old days.
Thank you for adding to this thread - your words are RIGHT ON TARGET!!!!!!
Normally, I'd agree with you 100%, but this protest was on this SATURDAY. The California loony libbies should have been out in force.
If these people hate America so much, why don't they leave? They don't just express opposition, they actively hate America and love her enemies.
So how much did your braile keyboard cost?
Because when (in their hopes) America loses they want to enjoy witnessing the result at first hand.
You have to understand that the leftists think they love America. They don't (in their sometimes false estimation) see themselves as hating the land, hating the people, or anything like that. Although some, the most extreme, hate democracy and liberty as shams, and as part of an irredeemably corrupt system that inhibits "social justice," many don't even hate our form of government.
What they hate (or at least what they think they hate) is American "arrogance," and the acts of supposed "global injustice" that America's arrogance leads it to commit. They think that losing the war in Iraq, and that loss disastrously collapsing America's foreign policy, will chastise and chasten America. It will humble us and force us to realize our limits, and to recognize the legitimate claims of other cultures and indigenous peoples. Yada, yada, yada. Anyway they think our defeat will make America better.
I make that all sound too rational, but it's much more than that for the leftist; it's also deeply emotional. Leftists (far more so than center-left liberals) are EXTREMELY moralistic. In their own twisted way they're at least as self-righteous and judgmental as the worst sort of stereotyped Christian fundamentalist.
They've got themselves whipped up into a frenzy of moral outrage over Iraq, and over America's opposition to other radical regimes and/or terrorist and insurgency movements. If America fails and is humiliated and chastened in the failure, it will not only (in their estimation) transform America into a more "just" society, it will also give them a deep sense of vindication and moral satisfaction. This is the main reason they want America lose, whatever the cost: They are aching to experience the joy of witnessing her humiliation and the deflation of her arrogance.
They DON'T CARE about the stakes. If they think in those terms at all, and in fact probably they seldom do, such considerations are entirely secondary. The primary thing (see also my preceding on this) is that American arrogance must by checked, and for this to happen America must lose and be humiliated in defeat and chastened thereby. EVERYTHING else is secondary to this moral imperative.
It was the same way with Vietnam. America was humiliated and THAT outcome was of overriding importance. The fact that, in concert with this, millions of little yellow people were butchered, and millions more enslaved, while regrettable, was NOT too high a price to pay for America's humiliation.
It would be the same with Iraq. Of course they wouldn't believe it, but I'd warrant that even if the left were somehow able to know for a fact that millions of little brown people would die in consequence of American failure there, a significant number of them would still opt for American failure.
The idea of America succeeding, of (what they see as) America's arrogance being rewarded and vindicated, is utterly intolerable to the left. ANY result is preferable to that.
How incredibly and painfully short sighted. Seriously.
So they win. We leave Iraq in humiliation. The Islamofascist terrorists score a massive victory and in no time, take over Iraq. I'll bet we're out of Afghanistan too, because with the Dems in power, they no longer have to pretend to support part of the GWoT to impress the voters.
They don't support the Patriot Act and are more concerned with the Constitutional rights of terrorists than they are of really securing our country...so GitMo and other installations where we're holding enemy combatants would be shut down.
Everything's fine for a little while as we continue to live in the false sense of security that everything's just peachy keen. The leftists are patting themselves on the back about the lesson the U.S. has learned and is continuing tearing down our country whenever possible.
And then the inevitable happens because we forgot the lessons of 9/11. We dropped our guard and chose ignorance over preparedness. But it won't matter then who we can or should blame because by then, the terrorists will have had years to plan and scheme and heaven only knows what they'll do next, although we know we'll all be dead if they have their way.
So congratulations, Cindy. You win. I hope you enjoy the short bit of time you'll have to pat yourself and your friends on the back for your part in humiliating our nation before all hell breaks loose.
Excellent insight, albeit I believe you stopped one step too soon:
This is the main reason they want America lose, whatever the cost: They are aching to experience the joy of witnessing her humiliation and the deflation of her arrogance. Which, in turn, bestows both purpose and reason for their otherwise hollow lives.
And then the inevitable happens because we forgot the lessons of 9/11. We dropped our guard and chose ignorance over preparedness. But it won't matter then who we can or should blame because by then, the terrorists will have had years to plan and scheme and heaven only knows what they'll do next, although we know we'll all be dead if they have their way.
I've thought about this scenario, and you are right to worry. Any massive terrorist attack will likely target a major city. To paraphrase the movie 'Ninotchka', the result will be "fewer, but better, Democrats". Strangely, I don't think the Dems have really thought this out, or perhaps they really do have a death wish.
I agree. He emphasizes the benefits to Iraqi without clearly articulating the benefits to Amercians of fighting on this front of the WOT
This seems encouraging. If they can't gather a crowd in LaLa land perhaps there is trouble.
If the diehards won't come out perhaps the lukewarms won't either.
No voters, no new curtains in the remodeled Spewakers office..
Maybe something to do with the 2400 murders in Californicate in 2003. It kinda takes the wind out of the "bring them home safe" crowd.
That's my sense, too. They should have been able to rouse more leftists. But apparently they didn't. From their point of view, they've got a problem. I sure hope Rove is right and the GOP won't lose anything.
Well said. I know they claim to love America, and I believe they really think they do, which is why they get so excercised about anybody "questioning their patriotism". What I can't understand is that they so obviously hate America, or at least so,so, many things about it, but they don't have the guts to admit that they yearn to see America as we know it destroyed.
No. I think excepting a few of them -- the hard-left extremists, the A.N.S.W.E.R. types and such, who really do want America destroyed and envision that -- most don't want real destruction and don't even consider it as a real possibility. As noted before they don't really care about (or better to say will never accept responsibility for) little black, brown and yellow people being destroyed abroad as a result of America abandoning allies and withdrawing her influence.
But they think they're safe here at home. IOW you're not factoring in their invincible fecklessness. They think America can be chastened and humiliated without being endangered. In fact they (again the air-headed leftists and liberal dupes, not the hard-left) think this will make America safer.
Remember we've had virtually continuous safety and security, as well as continuous economic growth, here in America throughout all of these people's lives, for going on 60 years now. Lots of folks out there just don't have the imagination to conceive the future being substantially different from this pampered past. Sure they can look out at the world like you or I and see the dangers and the disorder and the chaos, but they think all that stuff is caused by America (and Western racism, colonialism, hegemony, etc, in general).
You and I understand that these dangers are mitigated and held in check by the influence and activism of America and other liberal societies. They, the feckless liberals and leftists, don't get that. It's an "up is down, black is white" world view difference. They think these dangers are all the result of "exploitation" (by America, not local thugs) and various misunderstandings that can be cleared up with talk and with policy changes by the West implementing "social justice".
The don't understand that there are people out there that choose to be ruthless enemies of liberal civilization, and would do so whatever our policies, would in fact be energized to greater acts of evil by accommodation.
By way of analogy these moralistic but feckless leftists are not like your average Old Testament prophet who would testify to the justice of God even as his people were utterly destroyed and led into slavery, even as he shared their fate, saying; "This is what we deserve, this is what we called down upon ourselves!" No, the feckless leftist, were such tragedy to occur, would insist this was not what they meant and not what they envisioned at all.
Again, these folks think America can be humiliated and humbled without being endangered or destroyed. This is the heart of their fecklessness.
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