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Rare fossil find on roadside (Extraordinarily preserved pterosaur)
News.com.au ^ | November 2, 2006 | Laine Clark

Posted on 11/03/2006 10:10:40 PM PST by DaveLoneRanger

DISCOVERING a rare, 100 million-year-old fossil is amazing enough.

But not as surprising as the way Queensland Museum palaeontologist Alex Cook found it.

Keen for a break after more than three hours of driving, Dr Cook thought he would stretch his legs at the northwest Queensland town of Hughenden - and literally stumbled over the fossil.

"I found it literally on the side of the road. It's serendipity, a happy accident," Dr Cook said today.

It is the third jaw fragment of a pterosaur - a winged, fish-eating reptile that lived in the time of the dinosaurs - found in Australia.

It also is one of the "most exquisitely preserved" pterosaur specimens found in the world.

Dr Cook said pterosaur bones were "rare worldwide".

Only 50 pterosaur bones have been found in Australia in 140 years of collecting.

No wonder Dr Cook couldn't believe his luck.

"We were getting a little tired ... so we stopped at Hughenden, had some lunch, had a bit of a look around and I literally kicked it over," he said.

"It is a little bit like finding an extraordinarily endangered species that you have been looking for - they are that rare."

Dr Cook was on a fossil-finding trip in northwest Queensland with fellow palaeontologists - Colin McHenry, from the University of Newcastle and Adam Morell of the Richmond Marine Fossil Museum, near Hughenden about 500km from Mt Isa - when he made the surprise find in 2004.

(Excerpt) Read more at news.com.au ...


TOPICS: Australia/New Zealand; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: crevolist; dinosaur; dinosaurs; evolution; fossil; godsgravesglyphs; junksciorgasm; paleontology; pterosaur
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To: ReignOfError
He's not as smart as you are.

You are right!!

Isaiah 55

8. "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways," declares the LORD.
9. "As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts.


It's amazing that the entire UNIVERSE can be created almost instantly, and folks seem to have no problem with that idea, some, strangely, choke up at swallowing the idea that animals and trees and humans could have been made the same way.

451 posted on 11/16/2006 3:37:17 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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To: Luis Gonzalez
Where did she come from?

You already know this story.

452 posted on 11/16/2006 3:38:02 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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To: Luis Gonzalez

"Some" used in that post implies something very inaccurate to the history. I suggest that the historical record is worth consulting.

Masses of Romanists in that region--essentially the whole Romanist hierarchy across several Central American countries and significant regions in Mexico--supported Marxists fairly vigorously . . . even ruthlessly.


453 posted on 11/16/2006 4:41:07 AM PST by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: Elsie

I do, she came from the other people on the Earth not related to the former inhabitants of Eden.


454 posted on 11/16/2006 6:16:15 AM PST by Luis Gonzalez (Some people see the world as they would want it to be, effective people see the world as it is.)
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To: Quix

Anyone who supports Marxism can no more be a Catholic than let's say Arlan Specter can be a Republican.

They may call themselves Catholics, but they're not.

Arlan calls himself a Republican, but he's not one.


455 posted on 11/16/2006 6:19:08 AM PST by Luis Gonzalez (Some people see the world as they would want it to be, effective people see the world as it is.)
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To: editor-surveyor
"God's word declares in so many places that evolution didn't happen."

Show me those places.

456 posted on 11/16/2006 6:20:27 AM PST by Luis Gonzalez (Some people see the world as they would want it to be, effective people see the world as it is.)
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To: Elsie

Ah...excuse me.

The Ten Commandments?

That's it?

That's not The Bible.

Nice try however.

Now...show me where God had THE BIBLE written Elsie; you said that He did, so show me.


457 posted on 11/16/2006 6:22:54 AM PST by Luis Gonzalez (Some people see the world as they would want it to be, effective people see the world as it is.)
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To: Luis Gonzalez; All

I understand the point . . . so . . .

when a whole region's hierarchy are still supported as legitimate holders of Romanist leadership positions

BY ROME

for decades . . . .

when they continue the rituals and leading the congregants in the rituals AS ROMAN BELIEVERS . . .

when they continue collecting and holding and using property

AS ROMAN BELIEVERS . . .

when they are considered by the populace to be ROMAN LEADERS AND BELIEVERS . . .

when they are considered by THE MEDIA AROUND THE WORLD

as ROMAN BELIEVERS AND LEADERS . . .

for at least the 1960's and 1970's . . .

I forget which Pope FINALLY began to make an issue of it . . .

then perhaps folks can be excused for thinking that

SUCH WAS authorized STATUS QUO FOR true ROMAN BELIEVERS.


458 posted on 11/16/2006 8:08:05 AM PST by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: MikeyGo

No. I think my sentence is poorly worded, upon re-reading. I think that life, in it's many different guises, was created. Not evolved.


459 posted on 11/16/2006 8:22:03 AM PST by jim35 ("...when the lion and the lamb lie down together, ...we'd better damn sure be the lion")
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To: Luis Gonzalez
I do, she came from the other people on the Earth not related to the former inhabitants of Eden.

And I'm sure you have proof of that.

(That would have made Cain's children half-breeds of human and what?)

460 posted on 11/16/2006 11:57:03 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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To: Luis Gonzalez

I am not going to search thru the whole book for you. You're a big boy, you can see it for yourself.


461 posted on 11/16/2006 11:58:16 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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To: Elsie

..and other humans.

Primarily, the humans created in Genesis I.


462 posted on 11/16/2006 12:29:48 PM PST by Luis Gonzalez (Some people see the world as they would want it to be, effective people see the world as it is.)
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To: Quix
"...when a whole region's hierarchy..."

Another broad stroke that I suppose you will refuse to substantiate.

463 posted on 11/16/2006 12:31:15 PM PST by Luis Gonzalez (Some people see the world as they would want it to be, effective people see the world as it is.)
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To: Luis Gonzalez
"Show me those places."

We've been there so many times; do your own search.

464 posted on 11/16/2006 4:37:31 PM PST by editor-surveyor (Atheist and Fool are synonyms; Evolution is where fools hide from the sunrise)
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To: Luis Gonzalez; Elsie
"Where did she come from?"

If you were even a beginning Bible scholar, you would know the answer to that. She had to be his sister; why is that so difficult? There was no reason for him not to marry his sister, since the corruptions were in the future at that time. Cain was the first willful sinner; his mother was not willful, she was deceived.

465 posted on 11/16/2006 4:43:47 PM PST by editor-surveyor (Atheist and Fool are synonyms; Evolution is where fools hide from the sunrise)
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To: Luis Gonzalez

This is not really rocket science.

The evidence is abundant.

I mentioned the region--CENTRAL AMERICA.

Particularly Nicuragua and other nearby countries. There were 1-3 exceptions to some degree.

The major actors within the Roman hierarchy in the region at the time who were most rabidly Marxist were well known and argued about while leaving them in place with all their organizational power and position.

The research should be easy if anyone really wants to know the truth. I don't care to bother. I know the truth. I was alive at the time. I read the daily newspapers, magazines and the like. I was furious at the time and couldn't understand why the Pope didn't immediately deal with the turkeys. I think one eventually did. I forget which one. But for at least most of 2 decades and more in some respects and cases--the Roman Catholic Marxists reigned with deadly power. They were instrumental, even complicit in more than a few deaths of authentic Christian believers.

Ignorance of the facts of that era while pontificating nonsense is not overly impressive.


466 posted on 11/16/2006 7:34:16 PM PST by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: editor-surveyor; Luis Gonzalez
She had to be his sister; why is that so difficult?

In fact, Eve was by definition, related to Adam in the first order, since God created her directly from Adam, who confirms this by saying "This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh."

There is no moral issue here. Remember what God said: "Your ways are not my ways, and your thoughts are not my thoughts."

As far as motive and opportunity with regards to creating an abundance of children, well, that's a given, and one would need to be completely ignorant of the Bible to even consider disputing that.....

467 posted on 11/16/2006 8:47:14 PM PST by csense
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To: Elsie

It's amazing to me that so many people believe that an omnipotent God could have created the whole variety of life instantly but couldn't have created it gradually.


468 posted on 11/16/2006 10:38:39 PM PST by ReignOfError
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To: ReignOfError

Oh, we don't say He "couldn't",
but that He "didn't"!

There is NOTHING in Scripture to indicate gradualism.


469 posted on 11/17/2006 5:31:05 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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To: Mrs. P

ping to #84


470 posted on 11/17/2006 5:40:14 AM PST by Mrs. P (I am most seriously displeased. - Lady Catherine de Bourg)
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To: Elsie
There is NOTHING in Scripture to indicate gradualism.

Nothing to deny it, either. More importantly, who said that scripture was the alpha and omega of human knowledge? There is nothing in scripture to indicate the existence of viruses, electricity or marinara sauce, but plenty of thinking folk get vaccinated and enjoy eating pasta with overhead lighting.

471 posted on 11/17/2006 9:39:32 AM PST by ReignOfError
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To: Quix
"The research should be easy if anyone really wants to know the truth."

The way one normally debates in this site, or at least the way debate USED to be carried out on this site, was to substantiate one's facts with sources.

Pontificating and posting unsubstantiated "facts" while calling others ignorant seems to be your style, not mine.

I substantiate my facts.

You are alluding to the liberation theology movement that flourished briefly and sporadically in Central and South America from the late sixties to the early 1980's.

The Vatican dealt with all appearance of this radical ideology swiftly, and decisively from its very onset.

The fact that there were some radical theologians within the Church does not make the Church Marxist anymore than the fact that there are some Marxist Americans make America a Marxist nation.

"But for at least most of 2 decades and more in some respects and cases--the Roman Catholic Marxists reigned with deadly power. "

That is just plain, unadulterated bull crap.

472 posted on 11/17/2006 6:33:00 PM PST by Luis Gonzalez (Some people see the world as they would want it to be, effective people see the world as it is.)
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To: Luis Gonzalez

"But for at least most of 2 decades and more in some respects and cases--the Roman Catholic Marxists reigned with deadly power. "

That is just plain, unadulterated bull crap.
= = = =

I guess the complicities of the Roman Catholic clergy in Central America in the reigns of terror of the Marxist dictators during those decades is not as well known as I thought.

Ah well. The truth will out eventually for each and every person who's ever lived to know.

We all prefer to construe our primary reference groups as pristine holy. Haven't met any yet who were.

And some are or have been in major portions for major periods of time . . . truly horrific.

= = = = =

"It would have meant banishment of those Jesuit priests who preached Communism. These [Roman Catholic] priests sought out the youngsters from the upper class families and indoctrinated them to the Leftist cause. Their effort never ceased."





Somoza was a Cardinal Spellman-era Roman Catholic in good standing.




From ..... NICARAGUA BETRAYED

by Anastasio Somoza as told to Jack Cox

[shortly before Somoza was gunned down]

Western Islands Publishers

395 Concord Ave. Belmont, MA 02178

copyright 1980 ISBN: 0-88279-235-0







pages 23-26, .......... 91-93

Chapter Two .................. HOW IT ALL BEGAN

As far back as 1963, there was guerrilla activity in Nicaragua. These were sporadic attempts by the Leftist movement to influence and control people in some of the remote areas. At that time, the Sandinistas represented no serious threat to the government of Nicaragua. While the government was in the throes of recovering from the earthquake, the guerrillas stepped up their activities in the mountainous northeast section of Nicaragua. This was done after a group of Cubans had crossed over the border on foot and conferred with the rebels. They were told by the Cubans that if they could recruit eight hundred fighting men, they would get all the arms and ammunition they wanted.

The rebel Sandinistas then began sporadic raids in the smaller communities of the northeast. In these raids they murdered eighty justices of the peace. In the eyes of the rebels, these were the local representatives of the government, so they were killed. The rebels even overran the small town of Rio Blanco and, for a short time, held it. So, I dispatched "Bravo" Salazar to this area and he and his men brought an end to that guerrilla activity. However, it was like a malignant cancer. You could stamp out the disease in one part of the body politic and it would suddenly appear in another part. Had I been a dictator, as was claimed by my political opponents and the international press, I could have eliminated the cancer entirely. This would have meant drastic action on my part and curtailment of the freedom I wanted the people of Nicaragua to have.

It would have meant banishment of those Jesuit priests who preached Communism. These priests sought out the youngsters from the upper class families and indoctrinated them to the Leftist cause. Their effort never ceased.

One must understand that within the Jesuit organization there are two religious concepts. One concept is based upon the theological thesis that a priest should be apolitical. This thesis adheres to the philosophy that the Catholic Church has no place in partisan politics.

Now, the other thesis is that it is the responsibility of a priest to become directly involved in partisan politics. But there is a "catcher" to all this. These priests teach Communism. They believe that Jesus Christ was a Communist; and that we will have world peace when all the world is communistic. They teach that capitalism is evil and that all material things should be shunned.

It is noteworthy that Pope John Paul II adheres to the thesis that all priests should be apolitical and should not engage in partisan politics. This religious philosophy has a significant impact upon those young minds which are in the formative stages. This is why children from successful families in Nicaragua turned against their parents. To use a phrase which evolved from the Korean War, it's a form of "brainwashing." An interesting report appeared in the July 11, 1979 issue of Accuracy In Media, Inc. This is a publication which comes out of Washington, D.C. In that issue, AIM quoted Mr. Robert Moss, who writes for the London Daily Telegraph, as follows:

Moss reports that the Sandinista "roving Ambassador," Fr. Ernesto Cardenal, showed up in Teheran last April, where he had long talks with the Ayatollah Khomeini. He broadcast praise for Khomeini over the Teheran Radio on April 8. Moss says that Cardenal has described experiencing his "second conversion" during a three months stay in Cuba in 1970. He established a Catholic commune on an island in Lake Nicaragua, which became a Sandinista recruiting base .........

We knew where Cardenal stood and we knew he was not merely a "philosopher poet," as he was described by some members of the press. He was only one priest whose political philosophy was exposed to a limited number of people. Most of them working under the cloak of priesthood, conducted their subversive activities without the exposure of public scrutiny.

I can't stress strongly enough the role that the priests played in the Sandinista movement.

I say again that the influence they exercised on their young students was far greater than an outsider could comprehend. And the quote from Mr. Robert Moss is revealing in another way. It shows the relationship between the Sandinistas and the Ayatollah Khomeini.

In Nicaragua there were many priests who actively opposed our government and continually painted me as some sort of an ogre. A number of these priests came from the United States and Spain, and they seemed more dedicated to the Communist cause than the local priests.

Naturally, I knew who these men were and I knew what they were teaching. Of course, we had intelligence sources and at any given moment I could have told you the names of those priests who wanted me dead and the government in the hands of the Communists. Had I been a dictator, such as Fidel Castro, or the leaders in any of the Soviet-controlled countries, these priests would have been banished or they would have been liquidated. After all, they were truly subversives and they were advocating the overthrow of the government. But I have always believed in freedom of religion and, even though these misguided priests sought to destroy me, I chose not to impose sanctions against them. Rather, I tried to monitor their activities and curtail, as much as possible, their field of influence.

If I had taken hostile action against this segment of the Catholic Church, I can visualize the hasty retaliation by the international press. SOMOZA DENIES RELIGIOUS FREEDOM IN NICARAGUA, or, DICTATOR SOMOZA KICKS PRIESTS IN THE TEETH - so the headlines would have read. Automatically, world opinion would have been against the government of Nicaragua and I would have been the devil with horns.

With only one side of the story, the Vatican would have had misgivings, the U.S. Congress would have denounced me, and condemnation would have come from every section of the world. It's ironical, but there are literally thousands of loyal Catholics in Nicaragua today who wish I had taken such a course.

I encountered substantial opposition from certain university staff members and students. They opposed me, my government, and the free enterprise system. The university was a hotbed of Communist activity and Leftist indoctrination was a way of life on the campus.

The same question is propounded again. Why did I permit such subversive activity at the National University? There is a parallel here to freedom of religion. I'm a great believer in excellence in higher education, and libertad de catedra.

In order to achieve excellence, I believe this sector of our society must not be fenced in. In other words, I feel it is wrong to impose educational limits. Such limitation can only deter mental expansion. The mind is a wonder to behold and intelligence capabilities will not be achieved if we autocratically install horizons beyond which a scholar cannot reach. In all Communist countries, as in Nicaragua now, there are strict governmental controls on what can be taught and what can't be taught. This is particularly true in the fields of history, philosophy, sociology, and any subject relating to the humanities. In intellect, therefore, the students who graduate from those universities have peripheral limitations.

With my high school education at La Salle in the United States and my most excellent education at West Point, I learned the meaning of expanded intellectual horizons. Not only did I study science, mathematics, physics, and other such engineering background courses, I was privileged to learn about other peoples, other governments, other languages, and a broad range of philosophical adventures were open to me. This kind of system is what I wanted for Nicaragua. And perhaps this explains why I opposed educational control. It was my dream that one day the National University of Nicaragua would have equivalency with any university in the world. A dictator would have stepped in and said, you can teach this course and you can teach that course but here are a list of subjects you cannot teach.

Contrary to the image created by the international news media, I was duly elected President of Nicaragua by the people of Nicaragua, and it was not a dictatorial position from which I could rule the country by decree. The National University of Nicaragua had autonomy and my political party and I believed it should be autonomous. Like all universities in the United States and countries of the free world, our university was run by a board of regents. The makeup of that board would astonish you. The govern ............. End page 26

SANDINO AND SANDINISTA

page 91

..........life on four different occasions. I couldn't save his life the fifth time. He had decided to abandon the urban areas and went to the bush with other guerrillas. In an encounter with the Guardia Nacional in the bush, Carlos Fonseca Amador was shot and killed. Then the FSLN, or the Sandinistas, had no leader.

At that time, the Leftist priests moved in to fill a void. They continued the work of Carlos Fonseca but at a much higher economic level.

In the Jesuit schools, the seeds of discontent and, basically, the seeds of Communism, were sown. Their doctrine was spread to the children from affluent families, and with many the doctrine was accepted.

You had young men like the Carrion Cruz boys, and the Langs Sacasa for example. They became avowed Communists and they had received their training from the Jesuit priests. Perhaps the foregoing again illustrates the liberty which existed in Nicaragua. Not a single school in which the Jesuits were teaching their communistic philosophy was ever closed.

It is my belief that Nicaragua was pinpointed in Latin America as the key government to destroy, and that the Jesuit priests figured prominently in the planning.

One might ask why, of all the countries in Central America, was Nicaragua pinpointed as the country to be taken? The answer is that we had a successful government. Our country was financially sound. Nicaragua had progress and the future looked bright for all of our people. Also, we had a successful political system based upon a constitutional form of government. More importantly, the people of Nicaragua were, and still are, anti-Communist. They believed in individual liberty and they were proud of their country. Moreover, Nicaragua had earned the respect of her neighbors. Their belief, and it was a sound concept, was that if Nicaragua could be taken by the Left, then the remaining countries in Central America could not stand the pressure. And one by one, they would also succumb to the Leftist onslaught.

With the death of Carlos Fonseca Amador, there was no one single leader of the Sandinistas. This situation would not last long. Shortly, the Sandinistas would have three distinct factions. These were the Communists, the Christian Sandinistas and the Terciary group.

Carlos Fonseca was gone and it was believed the movement could be easily stolen. They didn't realize that at that very moment, Castro had three hundred men trained to be leaders in the movement, and these were the men who took control of it. Additionally, we knew of many who had gone to the Soviet Union and to the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) to be trained. Some of the Sandinistas had been active with the PLO in Israel ten years previously. All in all, it can be stated with finality that the Sandinistas represent the movement of the people in Latin America which is against the United States.

I have talked to Sandinistas who are not Nicaraguans and who are not Communists, but they support the movement because it is strongly against the United States. One who is not familiar with the modus operandi of the Leftist priests might think that Somoza has to pick on someone, so why not the priests? On this important issue, there is complete verification and my word doesn't have to be taken. To make verification as current as possible, I refer anyone to the New York Times issue of February 8, 1980. The article by the Times writer, Alan Riding, is quite revealing. His article is headlined as follows: NEW NICARAGUA REGIME RECOGNIZES CHURCH'S POTENT ROLE.

From my viewpoint, this is a fascinating article because it backs up my every contention in reference to the Jesuit priests. First, Riding recognizes there are two factions amongst the priests - the apolitical and political. In reference to the political segment, Mr. Riding had this to say:

In Nicaragua, this change was first apparent among priests, often Jesuits, teaching in private Catholic schools: by the mid-1970's, many of their former students, children of wealthy families, had joined the guerrillas. And as the fight against President Anastasio Somoza Debayle intensified, several priests joined the Sandinistas, while others helped organize slum neighborhoods in preparation for last year's successful insurrection. But at the level of the priests, the church was participating fully in the revolution. The Rev. Miguel d'Escoto was named Foreign Minister, the Rev. Ernesto Cardinal became Minister of Culture, the Rev. Fernando Cardenal was placed in charge of the literacy crusade and the Rev. Xavier Gorostiaga was given a key role in the Ministry of Planning. Many parish priests, who had collaborated with the rebels, began organizing their community for the reconstruction effort .

How could it be stated more clearly, and how could I ask for a more clearly defined position of the Jesuit priests? It's all there. It should be made clear, however, that, at the priest level, the Communists have successfully infiltrated Catholic orders other than the Jesuits.

My sympathy goes out to the people of Guatemala, El Salvador, and Honduras.

The Jesuit priests, in collaboration with the Cuban-trained guerrillas, are following the same course in those countries that they followed in Nicaragua.

If they are able to pursue effectively their preconceived plan of action, then those countries, too, will fall. The plague of the Sandinistas and the ghost of Augusto Cesar Sandino have already fallen upon those other Central American Republics. It's one down and four to go in Central America but, in reality, it's one down and nineteen to go in Latin America.

[picture caption]- "General Anastasio Somoza and brother Luis flank Cardinal Spellman. This photograph was given to Somoza by Cardinal Spellman who had inscribed upon it the following message:

'General and Mrs. Anastasio Somoza, with a blessing for their families and themselves. Respectfully, F. Cardinal Spellman.'"

*END QUOTE*

from:

http://www.mosquitonet.com/~prewett/somozanicbetray.html

-------

from:

http://www.christusrex.org/www1/news/nyt-4-6-05d.html

At the start of John Paul II's papacy, the church had similarly been trying to adjust to changing social and political conditions in Latin America with liberation theology.

Drawing freely on Marxism for its "preferential option for the poor," the movement aimed at involving priests more in the daily concerns of parishioners and transforming what were seen as unjust structures that perpetuated inequality and poverty.

But with his experience living under a Marxist-Leninist government, John Paul II quickly showed himself to be skeptical of the approach and doubtful of its doctrinal foundations. In an emblematic moment during a Central America trip in the 1980's, he wagged his finger in admonition at priests in Nicaragua who had aligned themselves with the Sandinista revolution. All over Latin America, when bishops sympathetic to liberation theology retired they were replaced by priests who were not.

= = = =

I'm not willing to check further down the list of 100's of docs available.


473 posted on 11/17/2006 10:10:21 PM PST by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: Quix
Perhaps, you need to study this truth, and understand the relationship between Jesuits and the Catholic Church.

"The recently published "Passionate Uncertainty: Inside the American Jesuits" is a quirky yet convincing depiction of the collapse of the renegade Society of Jesus: papists who hate the pope, evangelists who have lost the faith. Deprived of their reason for existence as Jesuits, they respond either by putting an end to their existence as Jesuits (deserters outnumber active members in the United States) or by indulging a willed imbecility in which the explosively divisive questions are never permitted to surface."

~~ snip ~~

"SO, IF THE SITUATION in the Society of Jesus is really as McDonough and Bianchi describe it in "Passionate Uncertainty," why doesn't the pope intervene and make radical changes? Two reasons suggest themselves. On the one hand, the attitude of Pope John Paul II towards religious congregations, female as well as male, is somewhat Darwinian. He is content to let the healthy groups prosper--Mother Teresa's Missionaries of Charity are a parade example--while letting the unhealthy ones die out of their own accord, like sick caribou amid the permafrost. On the other hand, recent popes have judged the political cost of intervening to reform failing congregations as excessive in view of the likely benefits to be gained. A close analogy can be drawn with the moles that surfaced in the British Secret Service in the 1950s. Their treachery was known long before action was taken against them; bit by bit they were denied access to sensitive material, simply so that they'd have less to betray. In the same way, and for the same reasons, the popes have declined a dramatic showdown with the new Jesuits, preferring instead, without calling attention to the fact, to give the really important business to more dependable agents." -- Source

The actions of people who reject the Holy Roman Catholic Church does not taint the whole of the Holy Roman Catholic Church.

Nice try, sorry that you ended up being wrong.

474 posted on 11/19/2006 4:42:01 PM PST by Luis Gonzalez (Some people see the world as they would want it to be, effective people see the world as it is.)
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To: Luis Gonzalez

Nice try, sorry that you ended up being wrong.
= = =

I'll trust God to allot those percentages. I don't receive the allegation as stated.

Though I'm frequently wrong.

Doesn't usually cause me a kanipption fit, high blood pressure, dry heaves, dead faints, mouth dropping shock, humiliation, dismay, . . . to admit that I am or have been wrong.

On the other hand, I have different fingers.

And, I'm unlikely to just roll over and play dead. I tend to require serious convincing about being wrong.

Haven't observed much success at that on these issues on this thread.


475 posted on 11/19/2006 5:16:24 PM PST by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: Luis Gonzalez

In terms of the Jesuits . . .

I don't recall where Christ's example entailed molly coddling the pharisees because His cost/benefit analysis didn't encourage intervention. Perhaps a Scripture reference to that one could clear up my memory failure.


476 posted on 11/19/2006 5:18:35 PM PST by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: ReignOfError
Did someone say pasta?

May you be touched by his noodly appendage.

477 posted on 11/19/2006 5:24:00 PM PST by Central Scrutiniser (Pro Evolution, Pro Stem Cell Research, Pro Science, Pro Free Thought, and Conservative)
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To: Quix
"Perhaps a Scripture reference to that one could clear up my memory failure."

Call Ted Haggard, I hear he's full of them.

478 posted on 11/20/2006 11:40:06 AM PST by Luis Gonzalez (Some people see the world as they would want it to be, effective people see the world as it is.)
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To: Luis Gonzalez

He never claimed to be an expert on Romanist distortions of Scriptural fact, however.


479 posted on 11/20/2006 1:24:02 PM PST by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: Smokin' Joe

"My grandma always kept her pantry stocked, I do, too.<"

Mrs Gb has started doing this again. No particular sense of urgency, and the headlines are quiet. But I have agreed with her....the danger 'seems' low. But I am not sure it is, and enough reasons have been presented that simply pretending it is low is not necessarily wise.

Would you please add me to the flu list?


480 posted on 11/29/2006 1:59:29 AM PST by gobucks (Blissful Marriage: A result of a worldly husband's transformation into the Word's wife.)
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To: Elsie

Who created the first orgasm??? What a wonderful question. It begs the question, actually, was the 'Big Bang' noisy?


481 posted on 11/29/2006 3:46:39 AM PST by gobucks (Blissful Marriage: A result of a worldly husband's transformation into the Word's wife.)
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To: jennyp; AndrewC

Given my antipathy to Marxism, and how I indeed have said many times here that the evo folks seem hell-bent to be Agents of Marxism, here in Freeperville, then one would think I wouldn't have many positive things to say about any evo folks. But AndrewC isn't the only one who thinks jennyp is cut from a different evo cloth. The civility was always refreshing...

On the other hand, jennyp, the one thing I had always asked the evos was never answered, by any of them: how does support of methodological naturalism hurt the marxists, the left? How does shaming and demoralizing YECs, using the premises of methodological naturalism, hurt the left, and help the 'conservatives'?

For that is what this former boomer sailor is interested in: the utter and total defeat of communists, both abroad, but most especially, here.

Did you know that above certain latitudes, a submarine will begin to form frost on the hull? The inside, that is, of the hull? (The sea water on the outside, though below freezing for fresh water, is still quite wet.)

Do you know what happens when the hull experiences a sudden warmup? The frost liquifies, and drips ... all over highly powered electrical machinery.

It can be quite a sight after that. This is sort of what happened to the GOP a couple of weeks ago. And now our ship of war is not as war-ready as it should be....; and what caused this? And who benefits?

Unexamined support of rationalism leads directly to the 'rationalism' of communism.

Ratio, originally, a latin word, meant merely 'to number'.

We are more than animals that can count jennyp, and I'm quite glad Jim has made his point to you and your crowd.

That all said, jennyp, how is your golf game?


482 posted on 11/29/2006 4:11:13 AM PST by gobucks (Blissful Marriage: A result of a worldly husband's transformation into the Word's wife.)
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To: gobucks

;^)


483 posted on 11/29/2006 6:48:08 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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To: ReignOfError
 
Nothing to deny it, either.

Oh??? 

 

Isa 48:3 ... I have declared the former things from the beginning; and they went forth out of My mouth, and I shewed them; I did [them] SUDDENLY, and they came to pass.

Indeed!!

Genesis 1
1. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
2. Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
3. And God
said

, "Let there be light," and there was light.

This is a GOD who creates by speaking; but; how LONG did it take?


Now Jesus was a man who had God-like powers. Was HE God? The Book says so.......

NIV Colossians 1:13-17
13. For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves,
14. in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
15. He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
16. For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him.
17. He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

NIV Revelation 4:11
"You are worthy, our Lord and God, to receive glory and honor and power, for you created all things, and by your will they were created and have their being."

NIV Revelation 10:6
And he swore by him who lives for ever and ever, who created the heavens and all that is in them, the earth and all that is in it, and the sea and all that is in it, and said, "There will be no more delay!

 

Notice that when this man speaks, things happen RIGHT NOW! Not after some times passes and the body heals itself.

NIV Matthew 8:2-3
2. A man with leprosy came and knelt before him and said, "Lord, if you are willing, you can make me clean."
3. Jesus reached out his hand and touched the man. "I am willing," he

said. "Be clean!" Immediately he was cured of his leprosy.

NIV Matthew 21:19
Seeing a fig tree by the road, he went up to it but found nothing on it except leaves. Then he
said to it, "May you never bear fruit again!" Immediately the tree withered.

NIV Mark 1:41-42
41. Filled with compassion, Jesus reached out his hand and touched the man. "I am willing," he
said. "Be clean!"
42. Immediately the leprosy left him and he was cured.

NIV Mark 5:41-42
41. He took her by the hand and
said to her, "Talitha koum!" (which means, "Little girl, I say to you, get up!").
42. Immediately the girl stood up and walked around (she was twelve years old). At this they were completely astonished.

NIV Mark 10:51-52
51. "What do you want me to do for you?" Jesus asked him. The blind man said, "Rabbi, I want to see."
52. "Go,"
said Jesus, "your faith has healed you." Immediately he received his sight and followed Jesus along the road.

NIV Luke 5:13
Jesus reached out his hand and touched the man. "I am willing," he
said. "Be clean!" And Immediately the leprosy left him.

NIV Luke 5:24-25
24. But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins. . . ." He
said to the paralyzed man, "I tell you, get up, take your mat and go home."
25. Immediately he stood up in front of them, took what he had been lying on and went home praising God.

NIV Luke 8:44
She came up behind him and touched the edge of his cloak, and Immediately her bleeding stopped.

NIV Luke 13:12-13
12. When Jesus saw her, he called her forward and
said to her, "Woman, you are set free from your infirmity."
13. Then he put his hands on her, and Immediately she straightened up and praised God.

NIV Luke 18:42-43
42. Jesus
said to him, "Receive your sight; your faith has healed you."
43. Immediately he received his sight and followed Jesus, praising God. When all the people saw it, they also praised God.

NIV Acts 9:33-35
33. There he found a man named Aeneas, a paralytic who had been bedridden for eight years.
34. "Aeneas," Peter
said to him, "Jesus Christ heals you. Get up and take care of your mat." Immediately Aeneas got up.
35. All those who lived in Lydda and Sharon saw him and turned to the Lord.

NIV Matthew 8:13
 Then Jesus
said to the centurion, "Go! It will be done just as you believed it would." And his servant was healed at that very hour.

NIV Matthew 15:28
 Then Jesus
answered, "Woman, you have great faith! Your request is granted." And her daughter was healed from that very hour.

 

Now if this same personage, who does things in an instant; how LONG would it take Him to CREATE all that we find around us???



484 posted on 11/29/2006 6:55:44 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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To: jennyp
The rule of law, equality before the law, moral individualism, capitalism, federalism, the invalidity of racism but also the dangers of pomo-style (judgement-free) multiculturalism, the necessity for strong families... so many foundations of our society are firmy & safely rooted in the objective reality of human nature. All these principles have been evolved, some of them over centuries, because they work here in the real world. No, not every truth is "self-evident", unfortunately. Many truths need to be learned & re-learned in many permutations before they're fully understood and appreciated, and this can be a long, painful process indeed. But objective truth is out there, waiting for us to discover even more of it than we have already.
I respect your desire to think so. But the truth is that you are arguing for an "objective truth" which deifies history and cultural memory. The things you say we have painfully learned are still highly controversial in the Democratic Party in this country and just about universally worldwide. If we have learned anything it should be the ruefull lesson that we do not easily all learn the same things from history.

George Washington also respected your desire to think so - enough to rebut it:

Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports. In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism, who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens. The mere politician, equally with the pious man, ought to respect and to cherish them. A volume could not trace all their connections with private and public felicity. Let it simply be asked: Where is the security for property, for reputation, for life, if the sense of religious obligation desert the oaths which are the instruments of investigation in courts of justice ? And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion. Whatever may be conceded to the influence of refined education on minds of peculiar structure, reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.
Washington goes on to assert,
It is substantially true that virtue or morality is a necessary spring of popular government. The rule, indeed, extends with more or less force to every species of free government.
. . . and then to ask,
Who that is a sincere friend to [free government] can look with indifference upon attempts to shake the foundation of the fabric?
Thomas Sowell points out that slavery (which we can agree is, from the POV of the slave, indisputably the antithesis of "free government") was an accepted institution worldwide and throught history - until Christianity became hostile to the institution of slavery as such. That opposition only really congealed in the Nineteenth Century. And it was most effective through the English speaking peoples: the British Empire and the northern US.

Obviously Southerners, although Christians, were not in the vanguard of that particular program - but nobody other than Christians - not pagans, not Confuscians, not Hindus, not Animists, not Muslims - was in the vanguard of that movement. Even the Republican Party did not become abolitionist until halfway thru the Civil War. And even that, ultimately, traces to the exaggerations and distortions in the South of Lincoln's and the Republican Party's actual intentions regarding the "peculiar institution" in the South. Exaggerations and distortions which tragically led the South to secede.

the invalidity of racism
is a recent lesson. South or North, racism still exists some. That's smog from the past, but it carries over into attitudes which still affect behavior, and create cultural frictions, today. Even with the ugliness of our past, we have not descended into the sort of genocides here which, alas, are still a feature of the African landscape. But it does result in the traditional targets of that rascism taking political attitudes which run counter to what you would consider the lessons of history.

485 posted on 11/29/2006 7:09:11 AM PST by conservatism_IS_compassion (The idea around which liberalism coheres is that NOTHING actually matters except PR.)
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To: gobucks
Would you please add me to the flu list?

Certainly!

486 posted on 11/29/2006 11:52:41 PM PST by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly.)
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To: Jim Robinson
I can't believe I somehow missed this thread and this post...one of the greatest posts of all time!

Once again, thanks Jim for protecting the basic premise and foundation of Free Republic and conservatism...by pointing out that all things come from our Creator.

A much deserved BTTT...

487 posted on 12/17/2006 6:24:15 PM PST by NewLand (Always Remember September 11, 2001)
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To: Jim Robinson

Beautifully, eloquently said, JimRob! Thank you so very much!


488 posted on 01/10/2009 10:18:30 AM PST by betty boop
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To: Jim Robinson

HEAR HEAR JIM!

Evolution makes a monkey out of me.

There is no link between man and ape and until there is, evolutionist are still running on faith. Faith without hope.

Myself, I like faith with hope.

I thank my God and I love Him for all His blessings.

God bless you and yours and the people here at Free Republic and the people in this Free Republic.


489 posted on 01/10/2009 7:45:07 PM PST by do the dhue (They've got us surrounded again. The poor bastards. - One of General Abram's men)
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 GGG managers are SunkenCiv, StayAt HomeMother & Ernest_at_the_Beach
Thanks DaveLoneRanger.

Note: this topic is dated 11/03/2006.

Blast from the Past.

Just adding to the catalog, not sending a general distribution.

To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list.


490 posted on 05/20/2013 7:44:06 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Romney would have been worse, if you're a dumb ass.)
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To: Jim Robinson

BTTT !

Jim, you wrote this seven years ago, and it should STILL be heeded, including by all of the Freepers.

Too many don’t realize the consequences of their thoughts and ideas, and where that leads.


491 posted on 05/21/2013 6:23:25 AM PDT by fishtank (The denial of original sin is the root of liberalism.)
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To: fishtank

Thank you very much, fishtank. I think this is a primary difference between those who truly love liberty vs those who push statism. Those who believe in God know that our rights come from Him and that our Founders established our system of government and fundamental laws based on His Word and that no other form of government will work or be long lasting. Those who push statism believe the state is all powerful and that liberty is defined and redefined by the state as needed. They believe in unlimited government and restricted liberty which is exactly opposite of our Founders’ intent.


492 posted on 05/21/2013 11:28:50 AM PDT by Jim Robinson (Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God!!)
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