[An example of a .45-cal HK Ump 45 submachine gun stolen out of an Orange County SWAT team member's car.] Posted on 11/11/2006 9:22:42 AM PST by kiriath_jearim
A submachine gun and other SWAT team weapons were stolen late Thursday or early today from an Orange County deputy's car.
The weapons were stored in an unmarked vehicle, one of three cars burglarized overnight near the corner of Curry Ford and South Dean roads, according to the sheriff's office.
"Obviously these are very, very serious military grade weapons," said sheriff's spokesman Jim Solomons. " If whoever took these weapons did it as a lark, they should reconsider and call Crimeline to return them anonymously. It's paramount that we get these off the street as quickly as possible."
The .45-cal HK Ump 45 submachine gun particularly concerns authorities because it was outfitted with a silencer. That means it can fire a 25-shot clip of ammunition almost soundlessly and without drawing attention to the shooter.
[An example of a .45-cal HK Ump 45 submachine gun stolen out of an Orange County SWAT team member's car.]
The submachine and a second weapon, a .308-cal. HK G3 assault rifle is capable of firing full automatic bursts. A semi-automatic .45-cal Glock 21 pistol also was stolen, reports show.
[G3A4 - retractable butt version of the G3]
The agency is offering a $2,500 reward for the return of the weapons. In addition to state criminal charges, anyone found in possession of automatic weapons faces federal charges
At least 200 guns a year are stolen from parked cars in Orange County. Gun thefts are so common that a 2002 Orlando Sentinel report found that more guns were stolen in Orange County in 2001 -- 680 -- than in Massachusetts as well as other states.
Earlier this year, a burglar stole a .223-cal. AR-15 assault rifle from an Orlando police patrol car. It has not been recovered despite a $1,500 reward.
(Excerpt) Read more at orlandosentinel.com ...
'The .45-cal HK Ump 45 submachine gun'
That's not a Machine Gun.
Typical writer. Yeah, 'sub' makes a difference in the title.
What a stupid@ss cop. He should lose his badge for that as an example.
Joe Citizen is expected to lock his guns in a gun safe. This dimwit leaves military grade weapons in the trunk of a parked car in an area which has seen a rash of car burglaries.
Duhhhhh....
Of course, the gun grabbers want you to leave your gun in the car even if you have a carry permit any time you enter certain criminal protection zones like schools, bars, government buildings, etc.
Evil guns, promoting violence. Let's ban them all.
/ insane totally divorced from reality rant
That swat member should be fired immediately... The Orange County Sheriff is a worthless lardass who is well connected politically , all he seems to do is beg for a bigger budget to buy toys such as Hummers , tanks and helicopters for his boys when he isn't out of the country observing speed control measures in Italy or some such junket, talk about an absurdley large and generally ineffective police force...
http://www.ocso.com/Agency/SheriffKevinBeary/tabid/53/Default.aspx
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ..... oh man.
Obviously, Mr. Solomons is completely oblivious to the irony of "military grade weapons" being a commmon tool of modern-day domestic law enforcement.
The .45-cal HK Ump 45 submachine gun particularly concerns authorities because it was outfitted with a silencer. That means it can fire a 25-shot clip of ammunition almost soundlessly and without drawing attention to the shooter.
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Just why should a peace officer have one of these? Why would he need to shoot a citizen, or citizens, "almost soundlessly"?
$2500 - not much of a reward. Shouldn't they at least offer retail prices?
Really only $2500. I would imagine the silenced Ump probably has a street value of $10000. Good luck boys getting your toys back.
It's a taxpayer purchased "toy".
What's the SWAT stuff doing in a patrol car anyway? Shouldn't the full-auto stuff be secured a bit better?
They have no more reason to have one than you or I do.
"Why would he need to shoot a citizen, or citizens, "almost soundlessly"?"
Occasionally, the cop has a touch of laryngitis, and can't yell "FREEZE!!!" first;)
Very serious military grade weapon? Ha! I wouldn't use that description on anything smaller than a belt-fed 50 cal.
That'd get the Glock back, but I think that the .308 auto might command a bit more $$. :)
So, if you allow the usefulness of Special Weapons and Tactics, then it seems to me it's not a big step to allowing them suppressors.
But it would amaze you what people own that are not law enforcement.
Yeah, and I'd like to shoot while listening to my George Jones tapes. The cops shouldn't have any weapons the citizens are bared from having.
In Texas cops can carry brass knuckles, switch blades, clubs, and Bowie Knives. All of which are banned for citizens including CCW holders. I asked my state Senator why that was and the dumb bimbo said, “I guess cops need them sometimes.”
"Military Grade" -- Ohh I hate it. It's new lib speak that (I think) migrated from the UN small arms schmucks.
Better than 'assault weapon'--It covers ANYTHING you might want it to.
I hope the @#$%^ who failed to secure those weapons (no,just locked in a car is NOT secured in my book--especially if it was a professional LEO's weapons) at least gets to pay for them out of pocket.
I wonder if they will have problems getting replacements pending ATF approval. :>)
What say you?
a silenced submachine gun. The is no reason the police need such weapons. This is an example of out of control law enforcement wanting the latest toys just so they can have them. These swat teams are a danger to society.
silenced to boot...
You're right.
The suppressor helps lower the risk of fire or explosion if raiding a meth lab. I know around the St Cloud area they have many meth labs.
"The suppressor helps lower the risk of fire"
First time I have ever heard that. Would you explain why?
But I don't see anything in your response that dealt with whether or not we need special weapons and tactics groups and whether or not those groups should be issued suppressors.
Let's try to keep the questions clear and distinct,okay? Unless, of course you just want to rant mindlessly, in which case I may join you.
I guess I think the injustice of restrictions on my god-given rights as expessed in the 2nd amendment is not rectified by not giving cops the arms which may help them do their job.
Yeah, yeah, you hate cops and we're all jerks. Okay. fine. If there were ever good cops, if that's not a concept that just doesn't work -- like, say,lite beer, would it be okay with you if they didn't have to act inefficiently and dangerously, if they were allowed the tools they might need to be safe and effective?
Your question implied that cops wanted to shoot citizens soundlessly. Well, okay, maybe just a few of them, but in general, no. I answered your question. You changed the subject to 2nd amendment issues. That's the way it looked from here.
Do you have any constructive thoughts on how cops should deal with, say, three bank-robbers who have fully automatic weapons? Or would you prefer it if they were just allowed to rob the banks and go their way? And if they kill a few cops with noting but revolvers, hey, that's the cost of doing business, PLUS it provides job openings for younger folks.
I'll buy that reason for $1.80. I actually hadn't thought about that. Don't they make low flash powders from that purpose also?
I am not familiar with the UMP but the MP5 suppressor and bolt assembly (closed bolt) work well specifically for drug lab risks.
I would bet on it. I think they also use wipes in the last baffle system to keep the chance of muzzle flash or any sparks to a mininum.
And yes, here in beautiful Virginia there are many who think my gun is safer in my car than on my belt. Except that 'think' is too generous a word, and what they WANT is not to have to confront the horrifying reality that some people actually own guns and don't live on the TV or movie screen.
I'm not sure that deputy needs ot be fired, but somebody does, maybe the deputy, maybe his boss.
heck, I would offer more than that ----->if I was an illegal person<-----to have them delivered to me.
This was an "unmarked car". I.E. a police vehicle. Should the police not be allowed to carry their equipment in their own police vehicles?
This isn't the same as my Chief getting his duty weapon stolen out of his own car, parked on a city street. This is a SWAT vehicle being broken into. You gotta expect to find SWAT equipement in a SWAT vehicle.
Why do cops need silencers?
As soon as the two year on the job, (stupid rule), time frame is up for me I'm getting a patrol rifle. Anybody like the idea of having a Glock 22 during a gunfight with a guy with a .308? Me either. The SWAT guys, in theory, go into the most difficult of situations. Barricaded subjects, hostage situations, active shooters. They clearly have a need for some of this hardware; just in case. The "in case" is what they are going to be asked to handle and having the stuff in a locker somewhere across town, in LA, Orange County, or any metropolitan area city type traffic isn't exactly smart either. That McDonalds shooter down on the border between San Diego and Mexico about 20 years ago, and those bank robbers in L.A., all required either getting through traffic for 20 minutes and/or borrowing rifles and ammo from a gun store. (said gun store has been run out of business by the local loon pols, but that's another story)
I think you're shifting the question -- while dodging mine.
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I'm sorry. I didn't mean to dodge your question.
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But I don't see anything in your response that dealt with whether or not we need special weapons and tactics groups and whether or not those groups should be issued suppressors.
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We don't need SWAT teams or special weapons.
*****
I guess I think the injustice of restrictions on my god-given rights as expessed in the 2nd amendment is not rectified by not giving cops the arms which may help them do their job.
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I say give them the weapons they need and let you and me have the same weapons. The disabled busdriver living in the projects is just as likely to need an HP5 as a cop is.
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Your question implied that cops wanted to shoot citizens soundlessly. Well, okay, maybe just a few of them, but in general, no.
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Agreed, but the ratio of cops who would want to do that is no lower than the ratio of civilians who would. If you can't trust the citizens to have them because a few might misuse them, we shouldn't trust cops to have them for the same reason. You can't have it both ways.
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Do you have any constructive thoughts on how cops should deal with, say, three bank-robbers who have fully automatic weapons? Or would you prefer it if they were just allowed to rob the banks and go their way? And if they kill a few cops with noting but revolvers, hey, that's the cost of doing business, PLUS it provides job openings for younger folks.
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I prefer the tellers and customers have full auto weapons as well as the cops. But very few bank robbers carry full auto weapons any way. Willie Sutton, just about the most successful bamk robber in U.S. history never carried a gun at all.
There was a case in CA where the bank robbers carried full auto weapons but I can't remember one since then.
When Charles Whitman had the cops and students pinned down in Austin in 1966, citizens went to their trucks and got their deer rifles and provided cover fire for the medics to pick up the wounded.
When the citizens are as well armed as the cops there is less abuse on both sides and less crime. There is also more likelyhood that the cops will have citizen support when the shit hits the fan.
In the Watts riot, I remember seeing the news pictures of a storeowner in front of his store with an AK47. His store didn't get burnt and the cops didn't have to put themselves in harms way to protect him.
The Second Amendment is about keeping the balance of power on the side of the citizens instead of on the side of the government. Like it or not, cops are the government's enforcers and when they are more powerful or better armed, than the citizens, the equation is out of balance.
I had read an article many years ago about suppressors and the MP5 being used by DEA. For "lab" work HK I think was using a "wet" system with wipes and the bolt and recoil spring were also modified. In the picture I saw the weapon has a special shell catcher fitted also. The whole system was just to cut down on flash or spark signature. I have been looking for the article for the last hour. I might be wrong but it did sound logical.
You're right. It was the Koreans during the Rodney King riots. It's hard to keep track of which riot is which in LA.
Why do cops need silencers?
If they all have the same type of silencer, they have the same sound and it determine friend from foe.
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