Patients: Hospital lawsuits to collect money pile tragedy on tragedy

Laconia Citizen ^ | November 26, 2006 | Victoria Guay

[Jim Noble]

Philip Plummer opened the door one morning in October to find an officer from the Belknap County Sheriff's Office standing there.

The officer handed Plummer a court summons saying he owed Lakes Region General Hospital more than $100,000 in medical bills.

"When I saw how much the hospital said I owed, I almost literally hit the floor," said Plummer, 36, a former Tilton resident who now lives with a relative in Massachusetts.

He said he lived in Tilton until just about two months ago, when he moved in with his sister in Massachusetts.

"I didn't know until I got served last month," Plummer said of the debt.

He was the victim of a car accident in Laconia on July 18, 2005 and was rushed to Lakes Region General Hospital, less than a quarter-mile away.

Plummer, in a phone interview, said a car came over a hill and crashed into him as he was stopped at the intersection of Union Avenue and Arch Street in Laconia, waiting to take a left onto Arch Street. The impact was so severe the car's roof had to be cut to free him.

He suffered severe spinal cord injuries and needed emergency care, surgery and a few days of hospitalization.

Plummer said he received no billing statements or phone calls from the hospital for months after the accident. He said he assumed the other driver's insurance paid his medical bills because that driver had been at fault.

Documents filed in Belknap County Superior Court by LRGHealthcare, the hospital's parent organization, indicate they're suing Plummer for medical bills incurred on July 18, 2005, the day of the accident. Those charges total $65,359.31.

The hospital does not comment on ongoing legal cases. But Henry Lipman, LRGHealthcare chief financial officer, has said the organization only goes to court as "the last resort."

Plummer's attorney, Thomas Craig, said his first priority is to get the hospital to reduce the amount they say his client owes. Craig called the amount unfair, saying the uninsured pay the highest charges because they don't have negotiated discounts such as those in effect with Medicare, Medicaid and most major insurers.

"If a person walks into a hospital with no insurance and their treatment costs $5,000, they will be charged the full $5,000," he said, adding that if the person has Blue Cross and Blue Shield, they automatically get a discount that would cut the charge to $3,000. If the person gets assistance from Medicaid, they will be charged $2,500, Craig said.

"The person who walks in with no coverage is the only one who pays full price," Craig said.

A report from the New Hampshire Center for Public Policy Studies supports Craig's argument. Titled "Cost-shifting in New Hampshire Hospitals," it analyses 2004 statistics and was released this year. Douglas Hall, the center's executive director, is the report's author.

All hospital charges in 2004 were, on average, 106 percent above the actual cost of service, the report states.

Hospitals set the charges so high because they don't expect to get full reimbursements from major insurance carriers or in particular, from Medicare and Medicaid, the report states.

Medicare and Medicaid reimburse less than the hospitals' actual cost in some cases, so hospitals add that deficit onto charges for insurance companies and the uninsured, the report states.

New Hampshire's 26 acute care hospitals charged $3.9 billion for medical services in 2004. The true cost of those services was $2.13 billion, the report states.

"Except for some persons who are expected to pay full charges out of pocket, the charge numbers are essentially 'list price' fiction," Hall wrote.

Craig said the state's Patient's Bill of Rights law requires hospitals to inform a patient, in writing, what their per diem rate is and what the services do and don't include.

"In other words, if you go into a hospital and you have no insurance coverage, you have to be told what it is going to cost," Craig said.

Plummer never was informed of what the per diem rate would be, he said.

"He should be given a reasonable rate, comparable to the rates they give to insurance companies and Medicaid and Medicare," Craig said.

He has asked the hospital to provide information on the rates charged to those organizations. The hospital has objected, calling the request "too broad" and "not reasonably calculated to lead to admissible evidence." A judge has yet to rule.

Attorney Margret Sullivan is representing LRGHealthcare. She also argues in court documents that since the nation does not have a universal health care system, different discounts are "common practice" and an "economic necessity."

The hospitals financial agreements with other organizations are "irrelevant" and "do not necessarily reflect the fair value of a service," she argues.

Plummer, who was a self-employed tattoo artist, said he now can't work in that field because of his injuries. Finding other work has been difficult given his injuries, he said, adding that he's tried to apply for federal disability but has been denied.

"I want to work; I hate not working," he said. "I'm a skilled tattoo artist."

He said he agrees with his attorney that at the very least, his bill should be reduced to the rate others are charged.

"It's unfair not just to me, but all the people this sort of thing has happened to," Plummer said.

Last year, Wendy and Paul Hough nearly lost their home and business because LRGH wanted to put a lien on their home. Wendy Hough had received breast cancer treatment at Lakes Region General from June through August of 2004 and underwent a mastectomy.

She subsequently was diagnosed with brain cancer and had just had a brain tumor removed when she began getting collection calls for her breast cancer treatment. The couple managed to pay only $450 on the original $48,000 bill.

Hough said he offered to make weekly payments to the hospital, but was told bill needed to be paid in its entirety.

Hough characterized LRGHealthcare's collection tactics as "overly aggressive."

In March 2005, the hospital sued the Houghs for just over $48,000 in medical bills plus interest and court costs, asking a Belknap County Superior Court judge to place a $60,000 attachment on the Houghs' home. The judge approved the lien, but limited it to $55,000.

The judge ruled in the hospital's favor, but shortly after the ruling, the Houghs managed to get retroactive coverage from the state's Medicaid program.

The hospital calls the number of court cases filed small when compared to the number of patients.

"Our philosophy is to try and do things up front, before people come into the hospital," LRGH's Lipman said. "We want to work with people because we have quite a bit of resources to meet their needs."

A review of Belknap County Superior Court records last year revealed the hospital had filed 165 collection lawsuits in 2004 alone. The hospital has filed five lawsuits in the court during just the last month, with amounts ranging from $1,000 to more than $60,000.

York Hospital in York, Maine, has a policy of not placing liens on people's property to get payment, nor will they report unpaid medical bills to credit reporting agencies. The hospital also doesn't sue patients, said Robin LaBonte, the hospital's chief financial officer.

"We could do it, but it doesn't feel like the right thing to do," LaBonte said. "People have enough stress in their lives, health being chief among them. We don't want to add to that pain."

The hospital does, however, send unpaid bills to collection if efforts to arrange payment plans are unsuccessful, LaBonte said.

A review of civil court records at Strafford County Superior Court revealed that Wentworth-Douglass Hospital in Dover has filed at least 11 collection suits in the last two years and Frisbie Memorial Hospital in Rochester has filed at least 26 during the same time period.

A suit filed in October by Wentworth-Douglass seeks to collect $32,298 from the estate of a patient who died in July, 2005. The patient received services between May 23, 2005 to June 17, 2005 and died on July 20, 2005, according to court records.

Frisbie recently filed suit against the estate of a Milton woman who received care from the hospital between March 18, 2005 and March 22, 2005. The woman died on March 24, 2005. The hospital is suing her estate for about $18,600.

Amy Sandler, a spokesperson for Frisbie, said she couldn't comment on hospital collection practices, but the hospital is committed to providing care to all.

"We have an open-door policy," Sandler said. "We never turn anyone away."

[Jim Noble]

What say you, FReepers? Pay for what you use, or steal it?

[ccmay]

If Medicare and Medicaid would pay their share instead of stiffing hospitals and doctors, everyone else's bills would go down. They are making slaves out of medical providers.

[LibFreeOrDie]

LRGHealthcare announces surplus
By PAULA TRACY
Union Leader Staff
Tuesday, Jan. 24, 2006


LRGHealthcare, which controls hospitals in Laconia and Franklin, has gone from an operating deficit of $5.8 million last year to an operating surplus of $7.9 million, it was announced at its 2006 annual meeting at the Franklin Opera House last night.

http://www.unionleader.com/article.aspx?headline=LRGHealthcare+announces+surplus&articleId=893e8b36-b161-44d3-a9ad-ed460b3c0dac

[goldstategop]

I told Kaiser to take a hike when they sent me my late father's hospital bill a year late. They had one year to send me a timely claim to the estate. Now its too late.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." -Manuel II Paleologus

[seacapn]

Stories like this will lead to a populist backlash that ends with socialized medicine. This is becoming a bigger and bigger issue. People shudder at the idea that a car wreck or bout of cancer could plunge them into bankruptcy, or cause them to lose thier home. And this is something that will cross party lines. I don't mean to sound alarmist, but those are the trends I see.

[freeangel]

"pay for what you use or steal it?"

A more apt question would be how much health care providers try to steal from uninsured users. I recently had several tests done at medical facilities and doctors appointment around town that, according to the bills sent out, would have benn several thousand dollars. Of course, it was printed on the bill that they were accepting about a quarter of that amt. because of the insurance network that we are members of. This would imply to me that they are ripping off the uninsured.

[SmithL]

Free health care sure seems expensive.

[MIchaelTArchangel]

It seems to me that Plummer owes the money for services rendered and probably interest because he made no attempt to pay. I don't believe for a second that he received no bills mailed to the address he gave and that the summons was served cold as he claims.

I also believe he chose to be uninsured believing he would either never need medical insurance or he would simply stiff the providers and the taxpayers.

I also find it difficult to believe that the other driver was at fault and that individual's insurance didn't cover his hospital bills--or could it be that individual also had no insurance.

I suspect Plummer moved to Massghanistan to place himself outside the easy reach of the process servers and to stiff the Taxachussans with his followup bills.

Maybe Plummer should just go to court and claim he is an illegal alien. After all, he seems to be acting like one.

[Turbopilot]

The hospital should be suing the other driver's insurance company, or failing that the other driver himself. I don't understand why this guy's lawyer wants to negotiate with the hospital to reduce the bill, when it doesn't seem that he's liable for any of it in the first place.

[Young Scholar]

I don't understand why this guy's lawyer wants to negotiate with the hospital to reduce the bill, when it doesn't seem that he's liable for any of it in the first place.

The guy's lawyer probably knows there's more to the situation than this new story reports.

[Hacksaw]

Part of the problem is all of the illegals, white trash, and other flotsam and jetsam who use the emergency room as their taxpayer funded health care plan. The costs for this eventually make their way to honest patients.

[Jim Noble]

It seems to me that Plummer owes the money for services rendered and probably interest because he made no attempt to pay.

Well, of course he does.

But even here, most people think having to pay for treatment of severe injuries which would have left you crippled or dead is being "ripped off".

[Jim Noble]

LRGHealthcare announces surplus

What's your point?

No profit, no hospital.

[sbMKE]

A good case for US citizens getting Matricula Consular cards, right? When in doubt, pass off your free healtcare card and 000-00-0000 social security number.

[goldstategop]

Of course he does. Most hospitals understand no one can pay anywhere near that sum of money. But that does not mean you don't have to pay something. Try to work something out with the hospital. You may find you may not owe as much as you think. But never stiff paying a bill.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." -Manuel II Paleologus

[Harrius Magnus]

You are correct. See post 6, the one right after yours. Few people have the background or the will to understand (medical) economics. They hear a sound in the dark and scream, "Monster in my closet!" It's very gloomy for our future.

[Hardastarboard]

The hospitals financial agreements with other organizations are "irrelevant" and "do not necessarily reflect the fair value of a service," she argues.

Just like how much one person pays for a car at a dealer, versus another. Does negotiating a better deal with the dealer than another guy mean I cheated the other guy?

Plummer, who was a self-employed tattoo artist, said he now can't work in that field because of his injuries.

Now there's a loss to society.

[digerati]

http://www.longmontfyi.com/Local-Story.asp?id=11405

By Trevor Hughes
The Daily Times-Call

LONGMONT — Patients with fake or nonexistent Social Security numbers are consuming millions of dollars’ worth of health care at the city’s local hospital, and the amount is increasing dramatically.

Longmont United Hospital is on track this year to provide about $25 million worth of health care to people who can’t or won’t pay, up from about $21.3 million in 2005.

Of that care, $7.7 million worth — about 30 percent — will go to people who lack a valid Social Security number, the hospital reported. In 2005, $3.6 million in care was given to people without valid documentation.

And the amount of free care given to those without proper documentation has leapt 1,620 percent from 2002 to today, In 2002, LUH provided just $448,000 in care to people without documentation, the hospital reported.

[KarinG1]

Some lessons to be learned here, I see three right off for folks who just fell off the proverbial turnip truck.

1. Insurance companies don't just 'take care of it', they have to be pressured.

2. Surgery and hospital stays are expensive.

3. Learn how to properly drop out of sight. Just moving to your sister's house probably won't do much good.

[PAR35]

I also find it difficult to believe that the other driver was at fault and that individual's insurance didn't cover his hospital bills-

You obviously have no experience dealing with insurance companies. They will settle between the filing of the lawsuit and the trial.

[YouGoTexasGirl]

Maybe our elected officials should weigh the costs of legal citizens picking potatoes/cleaning hotel rooms/landscaping, etc. to the cost of bankrupting healthcare for taxpayers and those of us who morally and ethically sacrifice monthly income for the ever increasing hospital premiums because many know how to abuse the systems laws. I say, fix their problems at the hospital and then arrest them/deport them. I am getting tired of all the freeloaders abusing my family!!!

[HighWheeler]

"If Medicare and Medicaid would pay their share instead of stiffing hospitals and doctors, everyone else's bills would go down."



So where do you think Medicare and Medicaid get their money?

[basil]

I guess Mr. Dimwit Plummer didn't see the need for buying health insurance, and car insurance that has a benefit if you are hurt by an uninsured driver.

I know these insurance plans aren't exactly cheap, but you should have them close to the top of the list in your budget of "necessities". Should be paid every month--just like the rent.

[Doctor Raoul]

"The person who walks in with no coverage is the only one who pays full price," Craig said.

Tell the Sherrif's Department he's an "Undocumented Payer". He being the patient Americans don't want to be.

[tired&retired]

Health-care finance used to be my specialty as an independent CPA performing hospital audits and also as a specialist completing the old cost reimbursement reports. I also changed hospital billing and accounting systems over to the DRG systems in the 1980's when medicine became production oriented rather than service oriented. The real problem became when the "for-profit" hospitals entered the scene.

One of the first things they do in the major cities is close the emergency rooms. This is due to the large number of "no pay" patients who enter the hospital through the ER door. That throws them all on the non-profit hospitals.

To give you an idea how bad it is.... My local regional hospital HMO insurance plan (Not the one I belong to) sued me to reimburse them for the fees they paid themselves (their hospital)and the Dr.'s for treating a person who without my permission went swimming in my pond and cut his foot on a rock. They backed off quickly when I said, If you do that I am going to sue you for malpractice for the botched up appendectomy your facility recently performed on me.

This same hospital recently billed my insurance company $120 for a routine office visit with a physicians assistant..(billed as a Dr's visit.) I received a notice from the insurance company(one of the Blues) that my bill was "paid in full" with my $10 co-pay and their $2.50 payment! Yes, paid in full with $12.50 on a $120 bill!

I've been an insider and issued many W-2s to hospital based physicians for in excess of a million dollars for one years work. This was back in the early 1990's. At the same time I had OB-Gyn clients who closed their practices as the mal practice insurance premiums were too high to make any living. (even with never having had one claim) Things are out of balance and moving toward being even worse. Health care is priceless, and the prices are rapidly approaching that point!

[Felis_irritable]

"What say you, FReepers?"

What I say is that, all my life I've carried medical insurance. If I worked at a dump that didn't offer it as part of my employment, I paid out of my pocket for a private policy. It's called personal responsibility.

Also, his accident was made to seem like it was totally the other guy's fault in the article, yet I didn't see anything about a lawsuit. Now, I'm not one to believe trivial lawsuits are a good thing, but a spinal cord injury and $65K of medical costs? Even at "list" price that seems like severe enough injury that the other guy needs to get a slapping, IF at fault.

[Old Airplane Driver]

The problem here is growing by the day and there is no solution if we continue on our present course. I recently retired and I still have the option of using COBRA-mandated coverage for the pleasure of paying $10,200 per year for coverage for my wife and I. That doesn't include copays or uncovered expenses (everyone knows that eyes and teeth are not part of the human body and therefore not covered by medical insurance), which add up to another several thousand per year. My retirement planning advisor told me to plan on a general inflation rate of 2.2%, but a medical care inflation rate of 7.6% per year. Once I run off the end of COBRA, I can look forward to my insurance bill going to something like $24,000 per year. That, of course, assumes I can even find insurance. It is hard to get into your sixth decade without at least one pre-existing condition. I am not sure that I will be able to afford $24K a year, as adjusted by a 7.6% annual increase. In fact, I am quite sure that most people cannot.

Enjoy the company-sponsored and subsidized group insurance rates while you can, as there is a great awakening in your future!

We know that if the answer is the gummint, it must have been a stupid question and that socialized medicine is not the answer. I wish I knew what the answer is, because we are going to need one very soon. I am just ahead of the baby boomers and they are totally unprepared for the medical costs that await them.

This is a problem that is going to take some constructive and creative thinking and a complete change to the way in which medical care is currently provided. The medical community itself should be looking for ways to solve this problem that go beyond bill collectors, as they ultimately have the most to lose. If a solution is not found, I guarantee we will end up with Hillary-Care!

[tired&retired]

The problem is the high cost of treatment. A friend of mine died last month after a year in and out of a hospital and nursing home from injuries he received in a vehicle accident that was not in any way his fault. The man hitting him had the minimum insurance coverage and no individual assets. My friend maxed out his own insurance and lost all his (and his wife of 37 years) assets except for the house. It would have been gone too if it were not for benefit fund-raisers and his death. The problem is the system....not the individuals lack of insurance coverage. The attorneys lawsuits hurt the system a lot more than the people with no insurance.

[sportutegrl]

My son was born by emergency section 6 weeks early. One of the bills I got was for 65,000 for neonatal care for 2 weeks. Aetna negotiated it down to 4000. I have always said that I don't need health insurance, just someone who can negotiate for me the same rate insurance companies pay. BTW, the WSJ had a real good article about this very topic. Hospitals charge uninsured people many times what insurance companies and the government pay. If no one had insurance, we could all afford health care.

[Mad Dawg]

Pay for what you use, or steal it?

I think there are other choices.

If I'm the hospital and the physicians and all, I don't care who pays, I just want to get paid. The patient got the treatment, he's on the hook. Maybe he needs to declare bankruptcy or to sit down and work out a payment schedule with me.

If there was a tort involved, then the patient needs to b e suing whoever torted him or that person's carrier. That person may have no or inadequate insurance. That's not the hospital's problem or fault.

On the flip ah de doo dah side, it sure has NOT been my experience that any medical person EVER volunteers the cost of anything.

Herewith my fave story as an example: My kid has myoclonic epilepsy of infancy. There is no way a kid can anticipate a seizure or compensate for it. ANd anyway she's not even 2 years old at the time were talking about.(This was 20 some years ago and THAT problem resolved, though she cropped up with grand mal epilepsy as a high school senior -- different problem altogether.) So were in the hospital while she's being observed at the initiation of some experimental (and useless) treatment - that's okay, we were desperate, and willing to try it.

SO, some pediatric nurse decides that it would be good if the kid had a padded hockey helmet to keep her from bopping herself when she seized. We're not told, asked, consulted, anything. All we know is somebody comes up from physical therapy and pads and jiggers and messes with a helmet until it fits the kid.

We are, you understand, at this point parents who have been told our kid is going to die, she's going to take a long time doing it, she's going to be a "vegetable" for part of that dying course. We are not at our best, or our most assertive.

Well the pediatric neurology resident from hell shows up. It's his totally irrational and inexplicable opinion that somehow the kid should not have a helmet. He honestly thinks she should learn to compensate and that s]other kids will laugh at her, as though in two years when she's four and has no mind left that would be a big feature of her quality of life. So some hospital minor functionary appears and takes away the helmet.

Some months later I receive a bill from the hospital charging me for the fitting of the helmet.

All this happened without our being consulted or being informed of the cost to us. The helmet appears because one person thinks the kid should have it. It disappears because another thinks the kid should NOT have it. And we're supposed to pay for this? Neither or kid nor we received any benefit from it, unless you count a delightful series of fantasies concerning the torture of pediatric neurology residents.

I called up book-keeping and tried to explain to them that I felt I was not liable. They were adamant.

I called up the president of the hospital and told him the story and that I would go to jail before I paid that bill.

The charge was dropped. Of course that means that the expense to the hospital was amortized over the other receipts, but I think the nurse and the resident should have shared the cost. They acted like petty nobility who had but to command and what they wanted appeared, and only "the little people", like the terrified and demoralized parents, would have to deal with the costs, and who cares about them, the peasants! Paying is what they were made for. It's our role in life.

As you can tell, I'm still working on this one. They play, we pay. Lovely folks.

[GravityFree]

There is more truth to what you say than you know. If NO ONE had and insurance and everyone had to pay out of the pocket Free Market forces would go to work and prices would go down. There would be tv commercials offering to cover all of your famalies needs for the maximum amount a husband and wife could contribute to their MSA in a year. I can remember back in the 1980s being billed $7.00 for an ASPIRIN and I was taking two a day.

[TheBattman]

There are two issues that need to be addressed in this case:

#1 - Who pay what? I have often wondered why the uninsured pay the highest price for medical care. One simple example- If I go to the Dr. for a simple office visit, the total cost (my co-pay + what the insurance pays) = $45. If my Father-in-Law goes to the exact same Dr. for the same type of visit, He pays $65 because he has no insurance, on a "reduced" sliding-scale fee....

So- is it right that those with no insurance pay more for the same health care?

#2 - in the specifics of this case - should the person in question EVER be billed for the medical care he received? The care was required because of the negligence of someone else (auto accident).

Add too that the late nature of the claim by the hospital.

I personally feel that I should not be stuck for medical care incurred because of someone else's negligence. But then again, the limit of liability in many auto policies is only $25K or $50K which would not have payed all of this bill.

I guess if I am still liable for my own costs when it isn't my fault, the I had better have Under-insured and Uninsured motorist coverage...

[freeandfreezing]

What say you, FReepers? Pay for what you use, or steal it?

Its not so simple. Hospitals price their services in ways which no other consumer oriented business could get away with. We would all be better served if there was less government, healthcare provider and large insurer distortion of the marketplace. When you see "list" prices that are 10 or more times what most customers pay that's usually a pretty good sign that something is amiss.

I also don't see many poor doctors or hospital administrators, so I don't have much sympathy for the industry as a whole. Remember, in most areas hospitals are essentially given protected territories to operate in -- preventing competition which would lower their income.

That said everyone should carry health insurance, and move towards a future where there is more competition among health care providers. A good start would be changing the regulations that today limit the supply of physicians and keep their prices high.

[Jim Noble]

One of the bills I got was for 65,000 for neonatal care for 2 weeks. Aetna negotiated it down to 4000.

What you or Aetna actually paid is unimportant.

What do you think 2 weeks in the NICU costs?

And who do you think should pay?

[TheBattman]

You sure are being what I am often accused of being here on FR---- Judgmental.

I have witnessed within my family a case where someone injured in an auto accident received no bill, or only a preliminary bill, only to be billed 8 months later for whatever was not paid by the other driver's insurance. Thankfully, the family member had under-insured motorist coverage which picked up 100% of the leftover tab.

When my first daughter was born (tw months pre-mature), one of the providers took 6 months to ever bill us- and they completely ignored our insurance on-file. Was a pain to straighten out.

And what if the "other driver" in this case WAS liable, but uninsured? Who is responsible? n There is a reason it is called "LIABILITY".

[Jim Noble]

I also don't see many poor doctors or hospital administrators, so I don't have much sympathy for the industry as a whole.

When you pay for groceries, do you want to know how much money the store owner has first?

[Tarheel]

This same hospital recently billed my insurance company $120 for a routine office visit with a physicians assistant..(billed as a Dr's visit.) I received a notice from the insurance company(one of the Blues) that my bill was "paid in full" with my $10 co-pay and their $2.50 payment! Yes, paid in full with $12.50 on a $120 bill!

There was a time when hospitals provided you with a detailed/ itemized bill of what was spent on your care while you were a patient. That stopped about 20 years ago +/-. If we were all able to get that bill and thoroughly inspect it for inaccuracies, there w/b a tremendous amount of money saved. That is one reason to have an advocate with you while you are a patient--someone who can observe what is being done, equipment used, etc.

Fortunately, as a health care professional, I know what to look for, IF you are able to get that itemized bill.

[bannie]

Along with the MediCal scam, lawyers screwed the fees up to a point at which people can't just pay for their services. Doctors/hospitals have to carry such huge insurance policies against some goon suing them that they have to charge abhorrent fees.

I'm not saying that some hospitals/doctors aren't taking advantage of the resultant expectations of huge fees, but I believe that litigious insanity is how this monster was born.

[TheBattman]

Solution- Press criminal charges against those using fraudulent info to obtain services, seize property (asset forfeiture), and go after employers (if illegal alien) and/or the country of origin.

[Jrabbit]

I say there is more to this story. Evidently, the other motorist was uninsured. And this guy didn't carry uninsured motorist protection. Here in Texas, we HAVE to pay more for the uninsured motorist policy. We'd be crazy not to. Perhaps the lawyer should go after the other guy.....if the accident was his fault as the article states. And if this victims injury was so severe, why was he turned down for disability?

Lots more to this story...

[Eclectica]

Stories like this will lead to a populist backlash that ends with socialized medicine.

Time was, you could deduct medical expenses from your Federal income taxes. Even allowing for fraud, deducting should be cheaper than socialized medicine.

[visualops]

I have to wonder about the guy from the car accident. Why wasn't at least some of his bill paid by the person who was at fault? Did the police not file a report which would show fault and the guy not make a claim against the other driver? On the surface it seems as if he assumed it would magically get taken care of- not smart.

[FFIGHTER]

If you can't pay for medical treatment, simple solution, die. Still the taxpayer will be stuck with disposing of the body.

[Felis_irritable]

"The problem is the high cost of treatment."

Yes that is part of the problem, and all the more reason to carry health insurance. Your friend's case appears to be more like an end-of-life scenario than like the average accident. We do the best we can do.

"The attorneys lawsuits hurt the system a lot more than the people with no insurance." Maybe agree. Some of my best friends are attorneys, but some of their peers are screwing up everything they touch.

I don't know what the solutions are, but I do know 2 things: 1, docs are highly trained, do a necessary service, and I for one feel most should make more than a plumber, and 2, healthcare insurance, like student loans, is probably one of the major drivers in healthcare costs. But I'm not dropping my insurance just to prove a point...

[driftdiver]

"What say you, FReepers? Pay for what you use, or steal it?"

I say pay whats reasonable and customary and not the finctional list price. Also, the other party should also be involved along with their car insurance.

The billing practices of hospitals and doctors are a farce.

[blu]

In my state, we have "coordinated benefits". In this instance, the auto insurance companies from both drivers would hash out who pays what. If the victim had had health insurance, his health ins co. would have been invited to play along.

I recently got a letter from our health ins idiots. Seems there'd been a claim *2 YEARS AGO* that they were just now thinking might have been caused by an accident, and maybe there were some coordinated benefits to be gone over. If I would be so kind as to provide them with more info, they'd look into it. I sent them a letter, telling them I needed more information in order to give them more info. Like, date of service, patient name, treating facility's name, reason for treatment. In short, I told them to do their own darn work!

Since our policy doesn't cover office visits, I pay less (cash) than I would be charged if I had insurance. I think my Dr.is getting it right.

[UglyinLA]

Listen up folks.

You will start seeing alot of this same story line from the MSM; ordinary everyday people who cannnot afford to pay for their medical bills, or people who cannot afford a much needed operation because they cannot afford premium health insurance.

The MSM hope their doom and gloom medical care stories will lead to one thing... HillaryCare, via a President Hillary.

Unfortunately, most of the "independent" voters are clueless to any of the real issues, formulating their opinions on evening news sound bites.

Don't underestimate our dinosaur media...they are solely responsible for the democrat's winning back congress. and they will do their best to bring us HillaryCare.

[politicalwit]

"The MSM hope their doom and gloom medical care stories will lead to one thing... HillaryCare, via a President Hillary."

These stories have been floating around for the last 20 years. It has nothing to do with your "HillaryCare." Time to loosen the tinfoil.

[sportutegrl]

And who do you think should pay?

Well, certainly not the poor sap without health insurance. I believe that everyone, from insurance companies, to the government medicaid/medicare, to uninsured individuals should each be charged the same amount for the same services.

[MarkL]

The hospital should be suing the other driver's insurance company, or failing that the other driver himself. I don't understand why this guy's lawyer wants to negotiate with the hospital to reduce the bill, when it doesn't seem that he's liable for any of it in the first place.

My guess, right off the bat, is that the guy who hit him had no insurance, and may well have been here illegally. I've got a friend in OKC whos uninsured/underinsured coverage wound up paying her $28,000+ medical bills when she was hit by an uninsured illegal alien.