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Should the Unborn be Considered Human?
12/06/2006 | Matthew Brazil

Posted on 12/06/2006 10:56:00 AM PST by Ultra Sonic 007

Abortion: Should the Unborn be Considered Human?

Abortion is one of the most divisive issues in America today. The reasons for this are manifold, as abortion ties into many facets of American society. In this paper, I will elaborate on one part of the debate; specifically, the humanity of the unborn. The question being asked is whether or not a fetus should be considered a living human being. Viewpoints regarding this issue vary wildly, but I aim to clarify why one should be considered human from the moment of conception.

What is the fetus? According to the Merriam-Webster Dictionary, the word is originally derived from Latin, meaning “the act of bearing young, offspring”. It is a term that describes an unborn child, usually used from two months after conception to birth. However, is this an adequate definition of a “human life”? At first, this might not seem to be true; a human has to have a conscious, doesn’t it? Doesn’t the fetus need to have a soul, commonly defined as the spiritual essence of human beings? Does a fetus have any sense of self? How exactly do these questions tie into the whole abortion debate?

For starters, when is abortion acceptable? When should one be able to abort an unborn child? Pro-Life advocates say that there should be no such acceptable time. Pro-Choice advocates say that abortion should be allowed at all times. For the moderates in this debate, answering the question becomes trickier; some say that abortion is acceptable until the second trimester, while others some say it should not be allowed after the first month passes. Time is a key factor for a moderate; tolerating an abortion depends largely on time, as well as circumstances. For instance, what if a woman were raped? Should she be forced to bear the child of the one who raped her? This question may not be difficult for some; the mother should not be forced to bear the rapist’s child. However, as Frank A. Pravone of Priests for Life says, “Suppose your father committed a terrible crime and the police came to your home, arrested you, and had you sentenced to death? The unfairness of that is obvious. Yet that is the same unfairness that occurs if a child conceived by rape is aborted.” Phrased in this manner, the question is now very difficult to answer; this would be a case of where the victim assuages her pain by victimizing another person. However, this only applies if the unborn are actually human. Now there’s a new question to solve: why shouldn’t an unborn child be considered human?

It would seem that determining the “personhood” of a human being is an easy task at first. To be a human being would require that you are, firstly, alive. Secondly, you would have to have some sense of self, or consciousness, or even a “soul”, if you will. Thirdly, you would have to be able to recognize and rationalize your own existence, via reason and reflection. These conditions seem suitable; however, these conditions would also seem to designate young infants, the mentally handicapped, and even very decrepit old people as “non-humans”. There is a lot of debate over what constitutes the nature of “being human.” Yet in the end, a person is still a person whether or not our knowledge of what personhood “is” qualifies as absolute. If one sees a fish, yet does not recognize it as a fish, that does not mean it is no longer a fish. A fish is a fish, and a person is a person, regardless of whether we recognize that person as a “non-person” or not. After all, many esteemed scientists and philosophers – such as Arthur de Gobineau, who penned An Essay on the Inequality of the Human Races – recognized blacks as “lesser” than white people. Does that mean black people weren’t human back then, even though they are now considered human? No; the same principle applies here. If the unborn are human, then the debate over abortion almost becomes non-existent; abortion would be the equivalent of state-sanctioned murder.

How can one fully determine the humanity – or lack thereof – of the unborn? Can it be done? If not, then can any side in the abortion debate be right about the personhood of the unborn? There doesn’t seem to be a single logical reason to deny humanity to the unborn. What other reason is there to do so, other than to justify abortion? After all, abortion is the killing of a living organism: the unborn child within the mother’s womb. If that organism weren’t human, killing him would be far easier to contemplate. I have to say that denying humanity to the unborn might lead – or perhaps already has led – to a slippery slope with regard to American perception of life in general. When weighing the consequences of classifying the unborn as human and denying humanity to the unborn, I can’t help but come to the conclusion that a human is human from conception. The consequences of denying that conclusion are simply too severe to allow otherwise, no matter what one’s definition of personhood is.

In order to determine the humanity of a fetus, one must first determine whether he is alive. On this point, there is no debate. The Encyclopedia Britannica classifies that, for an organism to be considered alive scientifically, it must exhibit four characteristics: “metabolism, growth, reproduction, and some form of responsiveness and adaptation.” The fetus certainly metabolizes the glucose and nutrients coming in through the umbilical cord; otherwise, there would be no growth. Within the first month after conception, the heart, brain, spinal cord and nervous system have grown. Reproduction, in its most fundamental sense, implies the dividing of a cell into two more cells. Thus, a fetus is clearly capable of reproduction. An unborn child has been shown to respond to stimuli; according to the National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke, a device has been recently invented that “can detect fetal brain activity in response to flashes of light transmitted through the mother's abdomen”. As for adaptation, one only has to look at the placenta. “A healthy placenta is the single most important factor in producing a healthy baby,” says Dr. Harvey J. Kliman. The placenta, which is part of the fetus, removes waste products, induces the mother to deliver more blood through the umbilical cord, and helps protect the fetus from the mother’s immune system. If the placenta is damaged, or if it detaches from the uterus, or even if it attaches in the wrong place, great harm can come to both the fetus and the mother. If the fetus did not grow this unique organ, he would not survive. It is evident that the fetus is alive according to the scientific definition of life; however, if the fetus is to be considered “human”, must he meet more criteria?

Perhaps one can look at the fetus’s nature from a philosophical standpoint. One common argument by Pro-Choice advocates is that, as a mass of non-sentient cell tissue, an unborn child is not equal to a living human person. Not only that, but something has to be said about the viability of the fetus and his dependence on the mother for support. If the fetus were to be removed from the womb, he would die; seeing as how he is reliant on the mother whilst in the womb, it can be said that the child is a part of the mother, and thus is subject to her whims. As T.F. Barans says, “An EMBRYO is no more equal to a BABY than an ACORN is to an OAK. Each has the POTENTIAL to become the actuality of the other.” This seems to make sense; treating an embryo as a complete human doesn’t seem logical, as the embryo is incapable of utilizing his potential like an adult human can. However, upon closer inspection, there appear to be some problems with these claims.

Even though the fetus is dependent upon the mother for support whilst in the womb, that continues to be the case long after birth. Even if the mother gives her child up for adoption, the child will still need to depend on someone to survive. Humans have varying degrees of dependence, with further variations from person to person. Also, older people generally depend upon artificial means of support in order to function (e.g. a feeding tube, an I/V drip, some form of mechanical ventilation, etcetera). The dependability argument would imply that killing older people or infants is less severe of an act than killing an adult. This goes hand-in-hand with the argument for viability; even though a zygote would be incapable of protecting himself if left outside of the womb, an infant is also just as incapable of ensuring his viability. The argument about the fetus being part of the mother also has some holes; following it logically, that would mean parts of the fetus would be parts of the mother. In other words, a mother would have a penis if her unborn child were male. Also, consider the child’s genetic code; although partly given by the mother, the child’s genes are a fusion of both parents’ genes. The resulting genetic code is totally unique and independent of the mother’s. Even though an embryo is incapable of actualizing his potential, it is still there; the process of development within the womb is merely the unfolding of what already exists. Looking at it another way, a zygote is smaller, less mobile, less developed, and more dependent upon the mother than an infant is. Likewise, an infant is smaller, less mobile, less developed, and more dependent on other humans than an adult is. Using that logic, does this mean killing an infant is not as bad as killing an adult? There doesn’t seem to be a morally relevant difference between an unborn child and an adult human; even though an embryo does not look like a human, he will not develop into anything else other than a human. That kind of reasoning would imply that a blue whale is not a mammal because it looks more like a fish.

There are enough philosophical arguments to fill a novel, so now it’s time to look at the question from a different, more culturally relevant angle. After ROE v. WADE was decided in favor of the plaintiff Jane Roe, Justice Blackmun delivered the opinion of the Supreme Court. He noted that any law proscribing abortion “that excepts from criminality only a lifesaving procedure on behalf of the mother, without regard to pregnancy stage and without recognition of the other interests involved, is violative of the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment.” In other words, it was ruled that a woman had a right to an abortion, and that to prevent her from obtaining one was in violation of her legal rights. However, if one infers that the fetus is human, then this means that that the mother has a legal right to, at the very least, manslaughter. This contradiction shows how much of the abortion debate hinges upon the status of the unborn; if the unborn are human, then Justice Blackmun’s opinion transforms into one of how the U.S. Constitution protects the killing of young humans. Inconsistencies like this would be cleared up if the original question were answered.

Statistically speaking, the amount of recorded abortions is staggering; William Robert Johnston of the University of Texas at Dallas has compiled a summary of registered abortions worldwide through October 2005. The total number of reported abortions: 756,695,000. Out of a current global population of over 6,500,000,000, that’s almost 12% of all the people currently alive on Earth. It’s sensible to suggest how all of those people would’ve contributed to overpopulation; however, overpopulation can be rather hard to describe, as clearly defined measurements for “overpopulation” have yet to be agreed upon. Just to make an example, take Europe’s total land area – 3,837,000 square miles – and divide that number from the total global population. If everyone lived in five-story apartments with four people per floor, you could fit roughly 85 people per every square mile in a landmass the size of Europe. This leaves the rest of the world for other use. One could draw from this calculation that there’s room for a lot more people in this world. This brings another personal observation to mind; how many great people were aborted? I can’t help but wonder how many great scientists, philosophers, civil rights activists, and leaders were lost to abortion. After all, it only took one man – Alexander Fleming – to discover penicillin, an antibiotic that has saved countless lives. Who knows how far mankind could have advanced had these unborn lived?

Another disturbing piece of information to consider is the fertility rate; many of the world’s developed nations are not meeting the replacement rate of 2.1 children per woman. According to the Spanish news agency EFE, as reported by LifeSiteNews, the National Institute of Statistics has noted that there are 8.8 abortions for every 1,000 women as of September 2006. Spain’s fertility rate is already at 1.28; well below the replacement rate. This is a dilemma facing many other European nations as well. The drop in the number of women bearing children is resulting in a population implosion of sorts. This also has another effect: with less young people in the workforce, there will be less workers paying toward the retirement of older people. In Spain alone, there have been 920,000 abortions reported since 1941. Would Spain be facing this situation had those 920,000 people lived? Would their contribution to the Spanish economy have negated this problem? Had the unborn been considered human, would there have been as many abortions in Spain? In the world?

Considering how wide reaching the abortion debate is, many people have chosen to use satirical mediums such as political cartoons to get their point across. In the Examining Issues Through Political Cartoons series, there is a book about abortion. One of the cartoons contained in this book chronicles two scientists speaking in a lab; one scientist speaks of how the abortion issue “will never be resolved because no one knows when life begins!” However, he quickly berates his female partner for touching the fertilized egg of a California condor, resulting in a sarcastic response from the other scientist: “You seem to know when life begins for California condors!” This brings up an interesting point; although the fact that the California condor is an endangered species might have something to do with it, the condor egg is given much more respect than an unborn child. The fertilized egg in the cartoon is the equivalent of a human embryo in the fetus; the condor is born when it hatches, and a baby is born when he is expelled from the womb. Yet if the condor’s fertilized egg is not to be harmed, then why should a human zygote be treated any differently? Are humans worth less than animals? Although there are humans who have driven some animals to extinction – like the passenger pigeon, for example – there are also humans who are prominent environmental activists. As the value of human life seems to continually lessen, are people forgetting how much value one human life can bring to the world?

Denying the humanity to any human being is a recipe for catastrophe, oppression, and death. There is a historical precedent involved here; for example, many white people in the South during the antebellum years described black slaves as lesser beings. This brand of reasoning allowed them to mistreat and dehumanize blacks without a second thought. The Nazis, utilizing the “non-person” label, were able to remove moral obstacles to torturing and killing Jews during the Holocaust. These are just two historical examples; a culture that denies the humanity to anyone is opening the door for future abuse. If you murder someone that is legally classified as “non-human”, how can you be faulted? What kind of psychological damage would this have on those who were dehumanized? This is occurring right now to the unborn; although I cannot determine whether abortionists and mothers regard the unborn as human or not, I can determine the results. Over 44,037,000 people have been aborted in America alone, and that is a number of greater magnitude than the estimated casualty total of World War II, which totals at 20,858,800. If the unborn are human, should they not deserve the same protection offered other humans in American society?

As an odd irony, American culture generally paints a very positive image of babies. Infants and babies are almost always depicted in commercial advertisements as very cute and beautiful. When I see a baby, my usual reaction is a smile, followed by numerous attempts to make the child laugh. I do this because I see children as a source of purity; untainted by the evils of this world, a baby is a picture of innocence in my eyes. However, I have to say that I momentarily recoiled when I once saw a malformed baby. The sight of the misshapen face did make me cringe for a moment, but I let it go after remembering that the baby is still human. Physical defects do not detract from the inherent humanity of a person. As noted earlier, there doesn’t seem to be a morally relevant difference between an embryo and an infant, so why are embryos or fetuses not adored in the same manner as babies? Is it simply because they are not as endearing or as huggable as babies? If that is the case, then has America’s popular culture become too obsessed with “image” and physical beauty? Think of The Ugly Duckling and remember its moral: inner beauty will overshadow physical appearance. Does the same not apply to the unborn child?

I would classify the entire abortion issue as a moral dilemma. When I first learned what abortion is, I cried. How could this happen? How could people do this to human children, the purest form of life I know? My Aunt Kathy, when speaking to my dad once about women who have abortions, said, “You can’t hate them. But you have to pity them for their ignorance.” That underlines the whole argument for me; many people simply do not know. They are either unknowingly ignorant of the nature of the fetus, or they choose not to learn. Can one ever determine the true nature of the unborn? Whatever the answer, to continue to perform abortions without knowing what is being aborted is a logical fallacy. As a hypothetically resurrected Socrates postulates in The Unaborted Socrates, killing fetuses – not knowing if they are persons or not – is akin to the hunter that shoots at a moving bush, unknowing if it was a deer or his fellow hunter inside of it. If American society continues to tolerate abortion, then it must at least learn and clarify what exactly is being aborted. Nevertheless, my hope is that America will one day recognize the unborn as human. The consequences of not doing so are potentially catastrophic; if the unborn child is proven to be human, that would not only entail that we have killed innocent humans for years, but that we willingly allowed it to happen. That might deliver a blow to America’s moral fabric from which she may never recover.

Works Cited

“Abortion.” Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary. 27 Oct. 2006.

“Abortion Rates in Youth Climb as Spain Declines.” Smith, Peter J. LifeSiteNews. 21 Sep. 2006. 4 Dec. 2006.

“Alexander Fleming.” Ho, David. TIME. 29 Mar. 1999. 6 Dec. 2006.

“Behind Every Healthy Baby Is A Healthy Placenta.” Kliman, Harvey J. Lectric Law Library. Online posting. Apr. 1998. 6 Nov. 2006.

“Estimated war dead, World War II.” War Chronicle. Online posting. 5 Dec. 2006.

“Gobineau, Joseph Arthur, Comte de.” Encyclopedia Americana. Intl ed. 1999.

“Life.” Encyclopedia Britannica Online. 27 Oct. 2006.

“New Device Detects Fetal Brain Response to Light: May Help Prevent Brain Damage.” National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke. 8 Mar. 2005. 1 Dec. 2006.

“Rape and Abortion.” Pravone, Frank A. Priests for Life. Online posting. 5 Dec. 2006.

“ROE v. WADE.” Touro Law Center. Online posting. 27 Oct. 2006.

“Summary of Registered Abortions Worldwide, through October 2005.” Johnston, William Robert. Johnston’s Archive. Online posting. 4 Nov. 2005. 27 Oct. 2006.

“The Ugly Duckling.” Andersen, Hans Christian. 11 Nov. 1843. Trans. Keigwin, R.P. Odense: Flensted, 1965.

“The Unaborted Socrates: A dramatic debate on the issues surrounding abortion.” Kreeft, Peter. Downers Grove: InterVarsity Press, 1983. 71-72.

“This Abortion Issue…” Asay, Chuck. Cartoon. Examining Issues Through Political Cartoons: Abortion. Ed. Williams, Mary E. Farmington Hills: Greenhaven Press, 2003.

“Women's Reproductive Self-Determination: Pro Choice Right to Abortion.” Barans, T.F. Word Wizards. Online posting. 4 Dec. 2006.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Philosophy; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: abortion; humanity; moralabsolutes; prolife
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This is the final copy of my research paper for English 101 in my freshman year at UAB.

The professor's assignment was basically to take a current hot topic - like abortion, capital punishment, the war in Iraq - and write a 6-10 page research essay delving into a particular subject of that issue.

Mine involved whether or not the unborn are human.

I submit this to you, my fellow Freepers, for your opinion.

1 posted on 12/06/2006 10:56:03 AM PST by Ultra Sonic 007
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To: Ultra Sonic 007
Abortion: Should the Unborn be Considered Human?

They ain't chickens.

2 posted on 12/06/2006 10:56:46 AM PST by Always Right
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

why not? we consider Helen Thomas to be human...well some of us do anyway, the jury is still out...


3 posted on 12/06/2006 10:57:27 AM PST by camle (keep your mind open and somebody will fill it full of something for you)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

You'll get an A, easily. Great writing.


4 posted on 12/06/2006 10:58:54 AM PST by jdm
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

Ironic timing with NASA drooling over the notion that a few microbes in water will prove that "life" exists on Mars, but the medical/liberal community thinks an embryo represents something else.


5 posted on 12/06/2006 11:00:31 AM PST by Rutles4Ever (Ubi Petrus, ibi ecclesia, et ubi ecclesia vita eterna)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

bookmark


6 posted on 12/06/2006 11:01:17 AM PST by sageb1 (This is the Final Crusade. There are only 2 sides. Pick one.)
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To: wagglebee; Tired of Taxes; ImaGraftedBranch; little jeremiah; cpforlife.org; Coleus; ...

Education/School/College/Pro-Life/Abortion mega-ping!

Please take the time to read it.

10 pages is far too short to write about this issue. :|


7 posted on 12/06/2006 11:01:39 AM PST by Ultra Sonic 007 (LET ME SHOW YOU MY POKEYMANS MY POKEYMANS LET ME SHOW YOU THEM)
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To: Always Right
Should the Unborn be Considered Human?

Na... their Aliens... /sarcasm...

8 posted on 12/06/2006 11:01:51 AM PST by Echo Talon
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

FYI: mistakenly shooting a hunter here in MN during deer season is ,by law, felony manslaughter.

my 2 cent:
if we can use the presence of brainwave activity to claim scientific proof of death, why not for proof of life?


9 posted on 12/06/2006 11:02:05 AM PST by Rakkasan1 ((Illegal immigrants are just undocumented friends you haven't met yet!))
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

The question is: Did these aborted unborn have the capacity to grow into anything OTHER than a human being?


10 posted on 12/06/2006 11:02:09 AM PST by Gaffer
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To: Always Right

sorry for the poor grammar...


11 posted on 12/06/2006 11:03:23 AM PST by Echo Talon
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

I've read about half of it and so far so good! I'll try to finish it later and let you know.


12 posted on 12/06/2006 11:03:29 AM PST by b4its2late (Liberalism is a hollow log and a mental disorder.)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

Lovely piece. A shame you had to write it to convince someone of the obvious. Thank you


13 posted on 12/06/2006 11:03:48 AM PST by dforest
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To: Echo Talon
sorry for the poor grammar...

I'll overlook it this time. Me am a stickler for grammar.

14 posted on 12/06/2006 11:05:14 AM PST by Always Right
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

very good! Is this current then? (e.g. you haven't rec'd a grade yet?)


15 posted on 12/06/2006 11:05:52 AM PST by Terriergal (All your church are belong to us! --- The Purpose Driven Church)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007
Try telling an animal rights activist that an unborn California Condor(Egg) is not a Bird, so it's OK to make an omelet.
16 posted on 12/06/2006 11:05:52 AM PST by NavyCanDo
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To: Gaffer

---
The question is: Did these aborted unborn have the capacity to grow into anything OTHER than a human being?
---

Grand slam reply! BINGO!


17 posted on 12/06/2006 11:07:03 AM PST by avacado
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To: NavyCanDo

I've actually never thought of that. I'll have to try it.


18 posted on 12/06/2006 11:07:04 AM PST by TeenagedConservative
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

Bottom Line: Abortion is Child Sacrifice.

Primitive societies sacrificed their children to appease the Sun god, or the god of Fire, etc. They did this either out of fear or greed - self interest either way.

Abortions today are done for no different - or better reason.


19 posted on 12/06/2006 11:07:07 AM PST by jonno (...it almost seems as if the Universe must in some sense have known that we were coming...)
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To: Cyrano; shaggy eel; TommyDale; Alex Murphy; Calvert Cliffs Cafe; jumpdrive; blackie; RnMomof7

good writing ping!


20 posted on 12/06/2006 11:07:25 AM PST by Terriergal (All your church are belong to us! --- The Purpose Driven Church)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007
It's very good, IMO. However, I cannot guarantee you will get a good grade. As you know, some profs say they invite all views, when they really do not.

I've always found it sadly funny that liberals who favor abortion are often the types who talk to their "babies" while they are still in the womb, yet have no trouble aborting said baby fetus if they decide they don't want it.

Your prof may take you analogy of the hunter, and provide a counter analogy such as: "an unwanted pregnancy is like buying something at the store that you no longer want and are entitled to throw away".

21 posted on 12/06/2006 11:08:01 AM PST by Sans-Culotte ("Thanks, Tom DeLay, for practically giving me your seat"-Nick Lampson)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007
Should the Unborn be Considered Human?

Any parent who has heard their kids heartbeat on an ultrasound can answer this question.

22 posted on 12/06/2006 11:08:33 AM PST by Fierce Allegiance (SAY NO TO RUDY!)
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To: Terriergal

Just handed it in a few hours ago.

My last paper was an exploratory essay. The topic I chose for that - as per the professor's conditions - would be the topic I would have to put on my research paper.

I chose abortion, even knowing how controversial it is.

The exploratory essay was basically a simple assignment of exploring the issue in question (abortion) and ask questions without giving any answers.

Considering the five page limit, I still managed to get out questions about how abortion is tied into society, culture, religion, politics, fatherhood, teen pregnancy, and women's role in the debate. I was only one point away from an A...all because my citation was rather lacking (I did better for my final paper though, so I should do fine).


23 posted on 12/06/2006 11:09:13 AM PST by Ultra Sonic 007 (LET ME SHOW YOU MY POKEYMANS MY POKEYMANS LET ME SHOW YOU THEM)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007
Good luck on a worthy topic.

Something to also consider (if you already haven't: If a pregnant woman's fetus is killed, say in a car accident, the criminal can be charged with a crime, vehichular manslaughter, even if the woman lives. I believe this occurred in Long beach, Calif. a number of years ago (10-12 yrs). It probably has occurred in other cases or circumstances. The point is there is precedence for this in the law.

24 posted on 12/06/2006 11:09:28 AM PST by Michael.SF. (Note: Sell Diebold Stock.................NOW!!)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007
As T.F. Barans says, “An EMBRYO is no more equal to a BABY than an ACORN is to an OAK. Each has the POTENTIAL to become the actuality of the other.”

And each, if only left alone, will become exactly what it should. Crushing the acorn kills the future oak; killing the embryo kills a future human. End of discussion!

I didn't read every line, but what I did read rates an "A".

25 posted on 12/06/2006 11:10:24 AM PST by JimRed ("Hey, hey, Teddy K., how many girls did you drown today?" (Hello, I'm a TAGLINE virus. Please help m)
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To: Gaffer

I actually noted this point. :)


26 posted on 12/06/2006 11:10:30 AM PST by Ultra Sonic 007 (LET ME SHOW YOU MY POKEYMANS MY POKEYMANS LET ME SHOW YOU THEM)
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To: Always Right

hehe... I stink at it. ;)


27 posted on 12/06/2006 11:11:48 AM PST by Echo Talon
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

Bump for later...


28 posted on 12/06/2006 11:12:40 AM PST by The Blitherer (Fight On!)
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To: Sans-Culotte

My professor actually came up to me at the end of class on Monday and asked me why I chose abortion for the topic.

To paraphrase, it's because I see abortion as a moral dilemma.

To my (internal) surprise, he expressed some measure of gladness about this, saying that recognizing something as a moral dilemma makes for good writing.

I can only hope.


29 posted on 12/06/2006 11:13:23 AM PST by Ultra Sonic 007 (LET ME SHOW YOU MY POKEYMANS MY POKEYMANS LET ME SHOW YOU THEM)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007; Cyrano

my hubby Cyrano did that 'question' thing in an email with someone who said he'd go along with his g/f's decision to abort, should she get pregnant. Even though he wanted kids and planned to marry her.

Cyrano, do you have a copy of that somewhere?


30 posted on 12/06/2006 11:13:35 AM PST by Terriergal (All your church are belong to us! --- The Purpose Driven Church)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

Just because you're born doesn't make you human either. Take Hitler or Stalin, for example.


31 posted on 12/06/2006 11:13:53 AM PST by deathrace2000 (AP Photo shows Iranís new President as 1979 US hostage-taker)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

Let us know if there's any fallout on your paper!


32 posted on 12/06/2006 11:14:10 AM PST by Terriergal (All your church are belong to us! --- The Purpose Driven Church)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

If the answer, without a myriad of equivocations such as deformity, radiation induced malformations, etc., is no, then there is no question of whether the aborted unborn are human because if left alone and not murdered, they WILL be.


33 posted on 12/06/2006 11:14:13 AM PST by Gaffer
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

First of all, my heartfelt compliments.

Secondly, I am dumbfounded that a society that exacts a fine of $5000 or a year in jail for crushing an eagle's egg, inadvertently or not, permits prenatal humans to be burned alive in saline solutions, or dismembered alive in the womb, or decerebrated in the birth canal as they are actually being born.

.


34 posted on 12/06/2006 11:14:51 AM PST by Westbrook (Having more children does not divide your love, it multiplies it!)
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To: Westbrook

Ah.....the "logic" of the liberal mind....it's a grand doozy, ain't it.....


35 posted on 12/06/2006 11:15:43 AM PST by Gaffer
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To: Echo Talon
Nah... they're Aliens... /sarcasm...

Yet, if we considered these "aliens" to be illegal, they could have all sorts of rights :-(


36 posted on 12/06/2006 11:15:51 AM PST by pookie18 ([Hillary Rotten] Clinton Happens...as does Dr. Demento Dean, Bela Pelosi & Benedick Durbin!!)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

They shouldn't be CONSIDERED human.

They ARE human.


37 posted on 12/06/2006 11:16:34 AM PST by cubreporter (I trust Rush. He has done more for this country than we will ever know. Thanks, Rush!)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

38 posted on 12/06/2006 11:18:13 AM PST by Van Jenerette (U.S.Army 1967-1991 Infantry OCS, Hall of Fame, Ft. Benning Ga.)
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To: deathrace2000

Hitler and Stalin were human.

They were just evil humans.


39 posted on 12/06/2006 11:18:28 AM PST by Ultra Sonic 007 (LET ME SHOW YOU MY POKEYMANS MY POKEYMANS LET ME SHOW YOU THEM)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007; 69ConvertibleFirebird; Alexander Rubin; An American In Dairyland; Antoninus; ...
Moral Absolutes Ping!

Freepmail wagglebee or little jeremiah to subscribe or unsubscribe from the moral absolutes ping list.

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[ Add keyword moral absolutes to flag FR articles to this ping list ]

This is a wonderful piece by FReeper Ultra Sonic 007!

40 posted on 12/06/2006 11:19:08 AM PST by wagglebee ("We are ready for the greatest achievements in the history of freedom." -- President Bush, 1/20/05)
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To: Van Jenerette

41 posted on 12/06/2006 11:19:25 AM PST by Van Jenerette (U.S.Army 1967-1991 Infantry OCS, Hall of Fame, Ft. Benning Ga.)
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

I think this is an excellent paper. Your former teachers would (or, at least, should) be proud. Let us know what grade you receive, and any comments your professor makes. Personally, I think this is as well-written as many articles that have been published. Wouldn't it be great to see it in a periodical?


42 posted on 12/06/2006 11:20:29 AM PST by Ohioan from Florida (The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.- Edmund Burke)
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To: Michael.SF.
"Something to also consider (if you already haven't: If a pregnant woman's fetus is killed, say in a car accident, the criminal can be charged with a crime, vehichular manslaughter, even if the woman lives"


I prosecuted a person who killed a pregnant women while driving intoxicated. Two counts of criminal vehicular homicide. Two consecutive sentences. Yet abortion in this state is legal.
43 posted on 12/06/2006 11:20:44 AM PST by Prokopton
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To: Ultra Sonic 007
a human has to have a conscious, doesn’t it?

I wouldn't use 'conscious' as a noun, unless I was referring to the Freudian psychoanalytical concept, and even then it's typically expressed as 'the conscious.'

BTW, the question of whether an embryo/fetus/etc. is a living human has largely been conceded by the pro-abortion activists. Their arguments now go along the lines, 'yes, abortion does technically mean the death of a child, but it's justified because of"... economics/ethics/whatever.

44 posted on 12/06/2006 11:22:42 AM PST by Sloth (The GOP is to DemonRats in politics as Michael Jackson is to Jeffrey Dahmer in babysitting.)
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To: Prokopton
One can only shake one's head sometimes at the 'logic' of the legal system. Congrats on the conviction.
45 posted on 12/06/2006 11:23:52 AM PST by Michael.SF. (Note: Sell Diebold Stock.................NOW!!)
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To: Sloth

Sad, isn't it?

Are their senses of morality dead?


46 posted on 12/06/2006 11:27:27 AM PST by Ultra Sonic 007 (LET ME SHOW YOU MY POKEYMANS MY POKEYMANS LET ME SHOW YOU THEM)
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To: Ohioan from Florida

I was actually homeschooled from midway through 7th grade all the way through high school, so you can thank my parents.


47 posted on 12/06/2006 11:29:11 AM PST by Ultra Sonic 007 (LET ME SHOW YOU MY POKEYMANS MY POKEYMANS LET ME SHOW YOU THEM)
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To: Gaffer
Does this human being have the DNA of both parents? Of course!!

The idea that the "claim of right to kill" belongs to the female alone is an absurdity of this.

Kinda like "A pound of flesh but not one drop of blood". Take anything you want that contains ONLY the DNA of the mother. Everything else (for want of a perfect definition) has the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

48 posted on 12/06/2006 11:30:12 AM PST by Sacajaweau
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

I submit: the egg.

According to the PETA-type folks, if it potentially "has a face", it ain't for eatin'.

Yet, they'd get an abortion in a heartbeat. Oh, the logic of lefties.


49 posted on 12/06/2006 11:32:44 AM PST by AmericanChef
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To: Ultra Sonic 007

As a former fetus, I oppose abortion!


50 posted on 12/06/2006 11:36:14 AM PST by debboo (Stop socialism, vote conservative)
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