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Allstate to stop insuring new N.J. homeowners
msnbc ^ | 12-7-06

Posted on 12/08/2006 6:17:12 AM PST by Hydroshock

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To: CharlesWayneCT

Alot of people that pay premiums in most cases never file claims for total loses in regards to homes. In Cane country (Like where I live) , it's for damage on structures that can be salvaged like roofs. So if I have a policy for 10 years with zero claims and then my roof gets damaged and is replaced at $8,000 or so, and I have paid $12,000 ( I pay about $1,800 on $250,000 home probably will shoot up over $2000 next year ) in premiums during that time span, is it ethical for them to cut you lose after one fricken claim? Better yet if you have paid for that time span and you have no claims at all, is it? Then when one of the big boy companies leave, the smaller ones raise their premiums accordingly because people have no other place to turn too.

Try telling your mortage company you are not buying insurance.
Ha, ha, ha!


151 posted on 12/08/2006 9:25:28 AM PST by The South Texan (The Democrat Party and the leftist (ABCCBSNBCCNN NYLATIMES)media are a criminal enterprise!)
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To: 3niner

Extended warranties are not insurance.


152 posted on 12/08/2006 9:25:43 AM PST by laotzu
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To: xarmydog
It is more pronounced around the Holidays

ROFLMAO. Around here we refer to those as "Christmas Claims!"

For all the wailing going on on this thread about the big bad insurance companies, there ARE two sides to this story.

One of my favorite stories is the woman in Charlotte who tried to convince my husband that the little "arc" under the door lock (where her keys had OBVIOUSLY scarred the doors for years) was caused by Hurricane Hugo!

153 posted on 12/08/2006 9:26:24 AM PST by Howlin (42 days to Destin!)
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To: bmwcyle

"Many Jersey people have the mob mentality, soak the system. I'm sure this is about fraud and false claims."

I can't believe you said that. I would expect a comment like that from someone at DU. Here's the real reason. It took a simple "google" to find this:

Allstate to stop writing new homeowner policies in 3 states
December 8, 2006

HARTFORD, Conn. --Allstate Corp., Connecticut's biggest homeowners insurer, will stop taking on new homeowners policies in the state as part of its efforts to control its exposure to areas at risk of hurricanes.

The Northbrook, Ill.-based insurer plans to stop writing new homeowners policies in Connecticut Feb. 12. It is taking similar steps in New Jersey and Delaware, and has said previously that it will stop selling policies in some coastal New York counties.

Allstate, which had a 13.2 percent market share in Connecticut at the end of 2005, says the decision will not affect current policyholders. It also plans to continue writing new auto insurance policies in those three states.

"The risk of a catastrophic event occurring in New England has increased dramatically," said Tim Knapp, Allstate's Northeast regional counsel. "If we don't start dispersing our risk in the marketplace, that's not good for anybody."

Allstate said it will keep its 180 Connecticut offices open and has arranged for its agents to offer homeowner policies from six other insurers. The company has about 121,000 homeowners policies in Connecticut.

Allstate spokesman Brett Ludwig said, "This isn't about one quarter's profits or one year's profits," and that Allstate is trying to do what's right for the company, its customers and agents in the long term.

Hurricane Katrina and other storms cost Allstate $5.7 billion in 2005. Like other insurers, Allstate believes it needs to better limit its exposure to future hurricanes, company officials said. The reasons include climate trends, new computer models showing potential future storm damage and soaring reinsurance costs -- the protection insurers buy for themselves.

Thursday's announcement came two days after the state Insurance Department reversed a June ruling and prohibited insurance companies from requiring shoreline homeowners to install expensive storm shutters. Allstate said its decision was not connected to the state ruling.

------

Information from: The Hartford Courant, http://www.courant.com


154 posted on 12/08/2006 9:31:39 AM PST by toldyou
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To: bmwcyle
There is something to say for morality.

When I first started working as a court reporter, I did a lot of personal injury work for defense attorneys; most of them worked for insurance companies.

One night when I was typing a deposition from some whining woman who had "soft tissue injury," I asked my husband, who is in the insurance business, why they didn't just pay these people so I wouldn't have to listen to them whine and lie.

He pointed out to me that they HAD already paid the people with legitimate claims.......which, of course, I could have figured out from the testimony most of them give. ("I can't even lift a CD to put in my DVD player.")

155 posted on 12/08/2006 9:32:08 AM PST by Howlin (42 days to Destin!)
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To: Mark was here

"Should someone who sky dives every day, pay the same rate for health insurance as someone who doesn't?"

for HEALTH insurance, I think you could legitimately argue for lower rates for sky-divers.

LIFE insurance, well that is another matter......


156 posted on 12/08/2006 9:32:42 AM PST by RFEngineer
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To: Doohickey

You're smart. Actually, my husband was almost angry enough to do something like that. These people had the nerve to have a customer service person call us afterwards to see how we found their service. She got an earful and didn't know what to say.


157 posted on 12/08/2006 9:32:45 AM PST by twigs
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To: Howlin

WOW life is hard on that poor woman. /sarcasm


158 posted on 12/08/2006 9:35:38 AM PST by bmwcyle (The snake is loose in the garden and Eve just bit the apple.)
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To: CindyDawg
We (in other states) need to help them fight this. If they can cherry pick in NJ, the next step will probably be Florida and the Gulf States.

They pulled out of South Florida, for the most part, long ago -- after Andrew, to be exact.

Last year, they tried to cancel the policies of homeowners in Brooklyn, NY, who lived within a certain number of miles of man-made Prospect Park Lake -- due to the threat of "tidal surge." LOL!

They didn't get away with that one, but you can bet they'll keep trying.

159 posted on 12/08/2006 9:40:22 AM PST by browardchad
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To: toldyou; bmwcyle
I can't believe you said that. I would expect a comment like that from someone at DU.

Why would YOU say that?

During Hurricane Isabelle, the most claims filed were in New Hanover Country, North Carolina, a county that wasn't even TOUCHED by Isabelle.

160 posted on 12/08/2006 9:46:24 AM PST by Howlin (42 days to Destin!)
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To: Mo1
NJ doesn't get that many huricanes ... but boy are the Folks in Jersey gonna be ticked about this

That's probably Allstate's intention ... screw a few in N.J. with the Hurricane pretext to set a legal precedence. Then do the same to the millions in the gulf states.

161 posted on 12/08/2006 9:46:41 AM PST by bimbo
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To: laotzu

It is not a choice if you have a mortgage.


162 posted on 12/08/2006 9:50:38 AM PST by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: bmwcyle

Not as hard as the guy who lived in Murrell's Inlet, South Carolina, who could only manage to drag himself across the street to the beach, where he read "the Bible and books on pain" all day.

The attorney let him go on and on for about three hours and then pulled out a local paper with a picture of this guy in it and asked him, "Is that you holding that 450 marlin," whereupon the "deponent" blurted out, "It was 460 pounds!"

Case over.


163 posted on 12/08/2006 9:56:18 AM PST by Howlin (42 days to Destin!)
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To: fleagle
I'm a capitalist, of course, but there are certain businesses that should exist above and beyond simple profit.

Schizophrenia

164 posted on 12/08/2006 9:57:22 AM PST by TankerKC (When I think about me, I touch myself.)
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To: 31R1O
They may have been hurting after 2005 but I understand they reaped windfall profits after a relatively quiet 2006.

From the article: In this year's third quarter, Allstate posted a $1.16 billion profit, helped by an unexpected lack of major storms, compared with a year-earlier $1.55 billion loss.

It always help to read the article.

165 posted on 12/08/2006 10:06:28 AM PST by TankerKC (When I think about me, I touch myself.)
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To: laotzu
I suppose we can be ungrateful and thankless, but; they certainly do not deserve such vitriol.

Ungrateful and thankless? That's a good one!

The bank does not loan me money to do me a good turn; they loan money to collect interest and make a profit, its their business. If I default on a secured loan, they take my property.

Thank goodness they do so anyway.

There is no thank goodness about it. Its their freely chosen business to do so. Its a profit making endevor and they do their level best to minimize (or transfer) risk.

Many business analysts jumped on the bandwagon and supported the claim that the only way to prevent the economy from coming to a standstill was for the federal government to get into the reinsurance business. Insurance executives told Congress that the government needed to act before December 31, 2001, when about 70% of U.S. commercial policies containing terrorism insurance clauses were set to expire.1 They claimed that lenders and insurance companies would renew terrorism clauses in insurance contracts, preventing an economic crisis, if and only if they knew that the government would step in when necessary.

Kind of sounds like blackmail - subsidize our risk or suffer an economic crisis. Some free market.

166 posted on 12/08/2006 10:13:02 AM PST by lucysmom
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To: Howlin

Because I don't believe that just because people live in
New Jersey they have "mob mentality."

I feel that every single state has their share of takers...."hey, how can I profit from this?" They are everywhere ....in every state. Just look at how many frivolous lawsuits there are, from drinking hot coffee at McDonalds to blaming some innocent Duke guys for rape. The accuser is trying to profit financially. Look at the guys suing Michael Richards..... it's all about money. The immoral people will try to collect no matter where they live.

I just don't like someone saying that there is a "mob mentality" in NJ. If you read the article I posted, you'll see it isan't all about NJ.


167 posted on 12/08/2006 10:19:31 AM PST by toldyou
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To: longtermmemmory
It is not a choice if you have a mortgage

You have to wear shoes in a restaurant.

Going barefoot is still a choice you have.

Having a mortgage is a choice.

168 posted on 12/08/2006 10:31:40 AM PST by laotzu
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To: lucysmom
If I default on a secured loan, they take my property

Not your property...theirs. They paid for it, not you.

How prototypically liberal to think of something that someone else paid for as "my property".

But, I get your drift; Americans suck..bankers suck, insurors suck, lawyers suck, yeah..yeah..yeah. They owe you a house, and a life free of responsibility.

169 posted on 12/08/2006 10:49:36 AM PST by laotzu
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To: ZULU
Does New Jersey have a right to retaliate against them? Of course it does. But it won't.

NO! For what? Chosing not to enter a high-risk business should be NO BUSINESS of the Govt and certainly should not result in retaliation.

What a crappy statist idea that is! Let's punish companies using the crushing power of the state when they don't offer services we want.

170 posted on 12/08/2006 10:53:17 AM PST by Jack Black
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To: lucysmom

Kind of sounds like blackmail - subsidize our risk or suffer an economic crisis. Some free market.




The risk was too great for the insurance companies to handle.

And no, there is no such thing as a 100% free market in an industrialized society.


171 posted on 12/08/2006 10:57:11 AM PST by durasell (!)
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To: lucysmom

Kind of sounds like blackmail - subsidize our risk or suffer an economic crisis. Some free market.




The risk was too great for the insurance companies to handle.

And no, there is no such thing as a 100% free market in an industrialized society.


172 posted on 12/08/2006 10:57:16 AM PST by durasell (!)
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To: laotzu

Tried to explain that to the police officer who pulled you over recently? I don't know where you live, but liability insurance is mandatory in Texas. Even as a homeowner, I'm required to carry "slip and fall". I could legally (although my lender wouldn't allow it) forgoe property coverage, but insurance isn't limited to property coverage.


173 posted on 12/08/2006 10:59:06 AM PST by Melas (Offending stupid people since 1963)
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To: laotzu

Tried to explain that to the police officer who pulled you over recently? I don't know where you live, but liability insurance is mandatory in Texas. Even as a homeowner, I'm required to carry "slip and fall". I could legally (although my lender wouldn't allow it) forgoe property coverage, but insurance isn't limited to property coverage.


174 posted on 12/08/2006 10:59:15 AM PST by Melas (Offending stupid people since 1963)
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To: driftdiver

Ohio might rank up there if they rated beaches made of busted up cinder-block.

Not many of the top NFL teams are in Ohio either.

Sheesh, how can I be so optimistic?


175 posted on 12/08/2006 11:27:32 AM PST by mmichaels1970
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To: toldyou

I lived my information. I don't need a worthless news story. Take your google and stick it. It tells you nothing about what I know.


176 posted on 12/08/2006 11:27:54 AM PST by bmwcyle (The snake is loose in the garden and Eve just bit the apple.)
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To: Hydroshock

I don't know about 5 years, but we have to start thinking about other business models for insurance. The original idea of insurance is to pool money and provide for those when they have a loss. Unfortunately, insurance companies see all that money as their own and refuse to pay valid claims, often engaging in bad faith practices. They rely on state courts not enforcing bad faith laws, like here in Texas where the Supreme Court virtually refuses to nail insurance companies when they don't pay valid claims.

All this business about tort reforms and frivilous suits. What people don't understand is that when you have a claim the insurance company doesn't want to pay, they'll hire a law firm to write a coverage opinion for the sole purpose of getting out of that claim. Its hard to find your own attorney for first party insurance litigation, so you may be left high and dry.


177 posted on 12/08/2006 11:29:23 AM PST by 1L
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To: 1L

I live around Houston, you are preaching to the choir.


178 posted on 12/08/2006 11:33:34 AM PST by Hydroshock ( (Proverbs 22:7). The rich ruleth over the poor, and the borrower is servant to the lender.)
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To: Hydroshock
Wow, talk about being cautious. When I think of hurricanes I do not think of NJ. Why can they not write policies without hurricane coverage. I wonder if this is a start of a trend.
179 posted on 12/08/2006 12:56:34 PM PST by Uncle Hal
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets

I seem to remember, but I may be wrong, that various companies asked for rate hikes when they lost big time in the real estate market some years back.


180 posted on 12/08/2006 1:59:10 PM PST by A Strict Constructionist
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To: The South Texan

"Try telling your mortgage company you are not buying insurance."

If you don't want to buy homeowners' insurance, don't borrow money to buy your house; i.e., don't give someone else an insurable interest in your property.


181 posted on 12/08/2006 2:04:45 PM PST by riverdawg
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To: FreedomPoster
My nom de freep might offer a clue. Also, as far as I know there is only one Statehouse.
182 posted on 12/08/2006 2:06:31 PM PST by Lonesome in Massachussets (The hallmark of a crackpot conspiracy theory is that it expands to include countervailing evidence.)
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To: CindyDawg
We (in other states) need to help them fight this. If they can cherry pick in NJ, the next step will probably be Florida and the Gulf States.

Sounds like a red lining practice to me.

By the way I agree with red lining. (The term "redlining" comes from the practice of marking red lines on a map, which banks would do in order to delineate areas they did not want to lend to.) - tom

183 posted on 12/08/2006 2:19:10 PM PST by Capt. Tom (Don't confuse the Bushies with the dumb Republicans - Capt. Tom)
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To: TankerKC

You're going to take the side of the insurance companies? Good luck with that.


184 posted on 12/08/2006 3:04:18 PM PST by fleagle
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To: Hydroshock
I suspect this might have something to do with NJ's crooked lawyer reputation.

Go after insurance fraud--

185 posted on 12/08/2006 3:05:38 PM PST by Mamzelle
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To: Mo1

Allstate did this to me years ago in NY due to floods along the Mississippi River. I don't quite understand it because although I lived within a 1/2 mile of the Ocean, I was about 100 feet above Sea Level. FWIW, Allstate lost all of my other business because of this, and I haven't gone back since.


186 posted on 12/08/2006 3:16:26 PM PST by Woodman ("One of the most striking differences between a cat and a lie is that a cat has only nine lives." PW)
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To: fleagle
I remember in Texas how the people I worked with would wait until a good hailstorm passed by to get their old roofs replaced--with a little help from their homeowner's insurance.

These were pillars of the community--and I started to understand how my premiums went to support "soft fraud" like this. If they'd gotten a little visit from the State Atty Gen Insurance Fraud Committee they'd have learned a good lesson. But they all got away with it, and even seemed to feel entitled to get away with it.

Homeowners Insurance companies write policies to exclude floodwater damage--then we hear squawking that, yes, they do exclude coverage for floodwater damage. Entitlement mentality again. Because a great tragedy has come about, the business should be a sacrificial lamb.

187 posted on 12/08/2006 3:18:23 PM PST by Mamzelle
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To: Howlin

There was a newspaper article a few years ago as follows about many of the largest insurers in Florida established separate companies that pay Florida losses only with Florida premiums. If they have a big loss they can dissolve the Florida company without damaging the parent company. There's an article that was in the Wall Street Journal 9-7-2004. If you would like the website url please let me know.


188 posted on 12/08/2006 3:25:48 PM PST by jrcats (Fed up & looking for answers.)
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To: Hydroshock

Well, imagine if they had another Hurricane Gloria.


189 posted on 12/08/2006 3:27:23 PM PST by nickcarraway
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To: CindyDawg

Why would we want to help fight it? I don't want to be in a pool where my rates are higher so people can live in high-risk areas.


190 posted on 12/08/2006 3:45:27 PM PST by jammer
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To: Vaquero
after the 2005 season they must be hurting.

Actually events like Katrina are windfalls for insurance companies. They get to raise their rates and dump high risk policy-holders, make back their losses(usually quite small due to re-insurance) in a couple years, and enjoy the increased premiums and lower risk profiles for eternity.

191 posted on 12/08/2006 3:46:26 PM PST by hinckley buzzard
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To: lucysmom

Out here in California they haven't been able to build becuase of regulatory hoops and hurdles.


192 posted on 12/08/2006 3:54:29 PM PST by ARA
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To: ZULU
There is also nothing wrong with a state telling an insurance company that if it wants to limit its share of the market, it should take its business elsewhere.

All that would do is further reduce the number of insurance companies in the state, driving up rates still more.

193 posted on 12/08/2006 4:01:02 PM PST by Young Scholar
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To: Melas
I don't know where you live, but (auto) liability insurance is mandatory in Texas

As (bad)luck would have it, I live in Texas.

Although I have chosen to return to electrical engineering; I, proudly, spent fifteen years as an underwriter for Lloyds of London. There are many very smart people here at FreeRepublic; some of which possess insurance knowledge that I would bow to. I would welcome any of their correction.

By any measure, I am intimately familiar with P&C insurance...its workings, and its requirements. Confess your ignorance, & be forgiven.

Auto liabilty insurance is not mandatory in Texas. It is not mandatory for personal auto libility, or even commercial.

Texas, like every state, requires evidence of financial liability/responsibility(on autos). The Texas Department of Insurance clearly spells out three different ways this requirement can be satisfied....a current insurance policy is but one of them.

Even as a homeowner, I'm required to carry "slip and fall"

"Slip & fall", knowlingly referred to as liability(casualty) coverage, is not a requirement of homeowners by Texas law. Casualty, and property, coverage is something that any responsible person would carry, whether required to or not.

Thankfully, there are a great many subjects of which I remain ignorant. Because of that, tomorrow holds great promise, and interest for me. P&C insurance is not one of those subjects.

Anything of which you are ignorant, you should be modest when discussing. Do not substitute arrogance for opportunity.

194 posted on 12/08/2006 5:06:26 PM PST by laotzu
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To: riverdawg
If you don't want to buy homeowners' insurance, don't borrow money to buy your house; i.e., don't give someone else an insurable interest in your property

Thank you.

It is always a pleasure to encounter someone who actually knows what they are talking about.

Thank you.

195 posted on 12/08/2006 5:09:33 PM PST by laotzu
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To: laotzu

Anything of which you are ignorant, you should be modest when discussing...






But I like mouthing off on sujects about which I know little or nothing. After a few beers I even understand string theory.


196 posted on 12/08/2006 5:09:33 PM PST by durasell (!)
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To: durasell
God bless you my friend.

I'm a rum drinker myself, and cannot shake my passion for argument.

197 posted on 12/08/2006 5:14:14 PM PST by laotzu
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To: ZULU
New Jersey also has a very high rate of insurance fraud. This could be an underlying reason. Corruption is rampant for auto fraud and may be for homeowners as well. I work for an insurance company and write homeowners policies in Florida daily. People fail to understand the massive cost and impact that one major catastrophe can have on the industry.

State Farm nearly went belly-up when Andrew hit Miami. There recovery was stifled by the recent storms of the last couple of bad years. One major storm can wipe out an insurance companies reserves (or catastrophe funds). Many state laws require insurance companies to retain massive funds tucked away to meet claim demands.

When the states in turn refuse to allow companies to raise rates -- the alternative is a refusal to insure. If you owned a private businees insuring homes or automobiles, would you want to do business in places where statistics show you will lose money?

198 posted on 12/08/2006 5:22:35 PM PST by evangmlw ("God Is Definitely Conservative")
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To: television is just wrong

Insurance companies do not insure homes for earthquake in California. Earthquake insurance is provided by the California Earthquake Association -- state funded. Major concern in California are fires.


199 posted on 12/08/2006 5:29:28 PM PST by evangmlw ("God Is Definitely Conservative")
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To: CharlesWayneCT

Right, only problem with your answer is we live in a nation of folk who can't add the numbers and want everything to be free.


200 posted on 12/08/2006 5:35:58 PM PST by evangmlw ("God Is Definitely Conservative")
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